Why were item addons changed?
I play both sides at Red, so don't bother calling me a survivor main
When you escape with an item now, you lose the addons, how does this make any sense?
- If you escape, you shouldn't be punished, its pretty much that simple. Now, you can say killer's lose their addons, buuut...
- Item Addons =/= Killer Addons. An item does not change how survivors fundamentally play. They still have to do 5 gens and escape or get hatch, killer addons can completely change their entire playstyle, T1 Myers build vs. Tombstone for example.
- Survivors have WAY, WAY more things to invest BP into. Perks, Items, Addons, and Offerings. Making them disappear now just feels bad for player experience. The toolbox change was fine as they were an issue, but who really wanted addons to be nerfed across the board?
Comments
-
I am pretty sure that this was only to cater to Killers. "Look, here is a Survivor Nerf". Nothing more.
If you put a few seconds of thought into it you should realize that it is a bad idea. So I have to assume that the Devs did not put any thought into it. It does not make any sense why the side with less BPs and three times the number of Items and Add Ons will also lose the Add Ons now.
But I doubt that we will ever get an answer. You cannot really explain something when you did not think about it earlier.
10 -
It makes sense. You use the add-ons up in the trial. Also while survivors have WAY WAY more things to invest BP In, you only need to get all perks on ONE survivor because they all play the same. Whereas if you play more than one killer, you have to spread that BP among different killers.
6 -
i mean, some very specific addons might change killers playstyle. just that is just the same with survivors. and even with these addons the essential goal of the game is the same, kill or survive.
and to fully max out a survivor compared to a killer your barely looking at 10 or so levels difference. so theres not really much of a change there.
essentially it just puts survivors in line with killers regarding addons and its a change for the better imo.
1 -
Can we then also adjust the BP Income? Killers should get less income then. Like, make it harder to get Stacks for BBQ, because the Survivor Counterpart is way more difficult to get Stacks (and does not provide another Benefit). And lets not forget that Killers would need like 30 more Add Ons which they actually dont want anyway. Just, if we want to bring things in line.
Let alone that Survivors dont have any Add On (anymore) which can change the game.
2 -
Survivors earn vastly less BP which makes sense as its 4v1, but when you have to level each survivor for teachables on top of levelling whoever you want normally, going through easily a couple million BP just to level 1 survivor.
WGLF is way more difficult to max out, and even when you get 4 stacks, the gains are nowhere comparable to BBQ.
Survivors have a Brown, Yellow, Green, Purple and sometimes Red rarity for most items. They also have a Brown, Yellow, Green, Purple and sometimes Red rarity addon for each item. They also have to get all their perks and offerings, making the grind way longer, taking addons and making them disappear now just makes it worse.
And all of this isn't taking prestiging into consideration
3 -
I'm all for making it easier to get stacks for WGLF. But it's not like you can't just play killer to get BP to level up survivors.
1 -
BBQ has already had several nerfs since its introduction, and yes it has an additional function because essentially as killers only get 4 perks and survivors have a collective of 16 in total, to make it worth a slot it should do more than the benefit of just bloodpoints. Don't think of a 1v1 ratio in all instances when in many it is a 1v4. and i dont understand why you think reducing bloodpoints on the killer side is necessary??
Not necessarily, survivors can find items in game that killers cant through chests. even increasing the rarity and getting addons through perks such as plunderers instinct and ace in the hole. and those 20ish items and 40ish addons, it should be mentioned that it is a repeat of the same items albeit at different rarities: toolbox, firstaid kit, flashlight, key (and map but who really uses them). so its not as many as you really make it out to be.
you say the gains are no where near to BBQ, i dont understand this as they both increase the bp by 100% when fully maxed?
and killers prestige as well so that isnt really important. and as for the rarities of items how often is it someone takes a brown toolbox into a trail, or a green key? the top end of those items being the green and purple are the only ones of real significane, and even then if you escape you still get to keep the item itself so you dont need to waste bloodpoints on it. Essentially, you would just need to spend bp on the addons which, once again, put you in line with the killer
0 -
Well I mean you could ask the same questions for killers:
Should a killer be punished when they meet the kill/survive ratio the devs are aiming for? In other words should a killer be punished if they sacrificed 2 survivors? Or maybe end up 4k’ing, it’s open for discussion but you get the point.
Does the fact that a killers playstyle changes depending on the add ons really matter? Besides, you could also argue that depending on the item a survivor is carrying they would change their playstyle accordingly. If you got a toolbox, you would rather sit on gens. If you got a flashlight, you wouldn’t mind a chase etc.
As for the bigger variety of add ons and items compared to killers, you could argue that killers have a lot more different add ons than survivors have considering there’s an awful lot of different killers.
Personally I didn’t mind the change whenever I play survivor but honestly I didn’t care too much about the situation before the changes whenever I played killer either so yeah.
2 -
You were talking about bringing things in line. And I guess we should bring all those things in line. Like, a good Survivor game is a mediocre Killer game. When I play Killer, I rarely get below 25k BPs, this is a more than solid Survivor game. Now with BBQ this is 50k BPs. This is around a P3-50 Bloodweb.
And those are sooo much easier on Killers. Like, my latest Trapper Bloodweb: 3 Stitched Bag, one Trapper Bag, 1 Trapper Sack. The best Add Ons for Trapper, five of them. Also 2 Tar Bottles, 1 Honing Stone and an Ebony Mori. Pretty solid for one Bloodweb, I would say.
And now compare that to Low Amp Filaments or Self Adherent Wraps - I get like 1 of each every 3 Bloodwebs. So we should change that as well - you know, to bring things in line.
I am totally fine with Killers getting more BPs. Because they lose their Add Ons every game, and this was the common answer when someone asked why Survivors get less BPs. But this is gone now.
An escape is basically not worth anything. Hell, if you use a White Ward it is even better to die than to escape, because you will lose your Add Ons when escaping. I did not care about escaping anyway, but now it does not feel like anything special, because I might lose my Add-Ons which I maybe did not even use during the game.
This is an overall stupid change which was not thought about.
Also:
"you say the gains are no where near to BBQ, i dont understand this as they both increase the bp by 100% when fully maxed?"
Getting 4 Stacks for WGLF is more difficult than getting 4 Stacks for BBQ. For BBQ-Stacks you literally only have to play the game, for WGLF-Stacks you have to go out of your way and either get many Unhooks (something you compete with other Survivors with) or tank Protection Hits which are not necessary most of the time.
1 -
Survivors earn on average much less BP per game, and they have to buy their items and addons, hope to have the right items and addons, which they can lose if they don't escape, or get rotten items without addons in the chests, or use two perks to increase the chance to have something acceptable (and one to keep the addons if escaping!). And items and addons undergo nerf after nerf.
I found the solution: I no longer bring items and addons. I open a chest if I find one. (In truth, I don't play anymore, except to do Archives, games in which I only focus on challenges.)
0 -
I dunno.
I don't really care about add-ons when I play Survivor though. I usually don't even take an item because he feels kind of mean.
1 -
you know what? y'all rant all you want but if they apply these add on changes maybe its time they add another set of items. new chapter new killer new map new power and NEW SURV ITEM. A one time use 'scroll' that when used, will summon a dummy survivor that looks like you and runs at a different direction. A 'connecting cable' that when the exit gates are powered, can be used to connect the gate to synchronize their opening progress and more each chapter. y'all like that. Also give killers 16 perk slots so that they can use all of the perks they want
1 -
"Survivors have WAY, WAY more things to invest BP into"
Lol, you mean only items? That's not that much more. It's slightly more, but not "way,way" more.
2 -
addons of each quality for each item of each quality on top of everything else
so it is alot more
0 -
I do agree the change was weird and unnecessary. I do disagree with a couple of your points:
2) There are very few add-ons that completely change how you play a Killer. Absolutely minimal. The vast majority of add-ons just enhance the Killer's default playstyle.
Not to mention, add-ons may not change the way you play massively, but they enhance the thing that does; items. Imagine if you have a medkit. You dont have to dedicate a perk slot to it, you dont have to look for someone to heal you, you dont have to rely on RNG. That means; you can commit to an objective easier, you can rescue others with less worries, you can stealth a lot easier. Follow the same line of thought with sabo toolboxes, flashlights and maybe maps.
3) Survivors dont have WAY WAY more stuff to invest BP on. They may have a bigger pool of stuff they CAN spend BP on, but that doesnt mean you have to or much less will use them all. How many Broken Keys have you used? Or toolboxes with (current) Instructions? Its a similar case with Killers. How many times have you used Speed Limiter on Billy/LF? Or tablet add-ons on Plague? Blocks on Freddy?
You could argue you cant run your favourite item + add-on every game. Well, guess what, same deal with your favourite add-ons on Killer. We also dont even have to go over the difference of Survivors being just skins, while players who like multiple Killers cant invest all BP on a specific Killer only. And also the fact that items (which are the stronger feature compared to their own add-ons) are free from looting chests.
1 -
Personally I think they should go the route of DBD Mobile. Make items come from a store and you select what ones you want and buy them with bloodpoints.
0 -
Common sense..it is more fair..and before you say something about survivors having more items etc etc, One survivor maxed is all you need..compare that to all the killers and then..you see overall killers have a WAAAAYY bigger bp investment required to keep multiple killers with addons, plus killers sans addons lose most of their potential, meanwhile I only bring items for challanges as they can be farmed in game for free, arnt even necessary, and are reusable even if the addons arnt..
0 -
Killers also... have a ... WAAAYY bigger... BP... Gain.
0 -
So by that logic at best it evens out
0 -
Ace in the hole
1 -
Walks into match as survivor.
Walks to chest.
Opens chest.
Finds purple medkit.
" BUT KULLURS DONT HAVR TO SPEND AS MUCH ON STUUUUFF"
Edit: Dangit sorry person i quoted the wrong guy and dont know how to fix it. Still might apply tho
1 -
Why not just have survs pool bloodpoints collectively? Then increase killer BP substantially to compensate?
0 -
Considering most survivors have 50+ of every addon at this point on their main, why is this a big deal? It gave Ace in the Hole a purpose beyond farming and even now you can just run a treasure hunting build for free addons if you escape, which in a worst case scenario is equivalent to 6000 to 9000 bps.
1 -
I agree. This time it wasn't even a nerf in gameplay performance, it was a straight up nerf to a QOL.
Big brain balance team.
0 -
Survivors dont really need items to compete in the current meta, killers need their addons.
Additionally survivors might plunder chest to gain a free item of random rarity each trial. If theyre running a perk, it also has up to two addons attached, of different rarities. You may find something worth 12k bloodpoints or higher in a chest.
0 -
I'm of the same opinion of Aven_Fallen, that's the only explanation that has some kind of sense.
0 -
If you play both sides then you wouldn't sound like a survivor main. Killers do not get to keep their addons if they kill a survivor, but survivors got to keep their addons if they escaped. How is that fair?
0 -
Playing both sides aswell, I think survivors addons being removed when escaping is ridiculous and was poorly implemented.
As others pointed out, survivors have different combination of items+addons to get through bloodwebs. So the chance for you to get a specific combination (say medkit+addons) is so low that you have to spend all your bps to find one.
Killers lose addons every game, but with the amount of bp they are earning + bbq use, honestly, it's rare to be short of useful addons, even moris (but that's another story). Playing trapper, I generally use Snitched/Trapper bag + Fastening tools, and I run low on these items once in a while, but I can make one game with another killer and i'm all set for the next game.
I think, overall the bloodweb and addons design is really bad and needs to be tweaked and instead of finding addons in the bloodweb, one could find different crafting materials so that they can make the addons they want or need.
As for the people pointing out that survivors can equip Ace in the Hole and can find items in chest. Well Right, but why should I use one perk (or two if using Plunderer) solely to find chests that may have already opened by other people, that is a waste of perk slot if you actively want to escape as a solo survivor (which most people are).
That is fair for every argument that others have pointed out.
0 -
Why do killers lose their add-ons despite 3k'ing or 4k'ing? So that they can't bring the strong stuff every match.
I guess the line of thought why survivors are now losing their add-ons is similar here. 🤷
And hey, if you want to keep the batteries on the purple flashlight, bring Ace in the Hole. It now allows you to keep add-ons after escaping.
0 -
Its quite easy to bring the strong Stuff as Killer on a regular basis. Maybe not the strongest Add Ons all the time, but there is no problem at all to use good Add Ons every game with the amount of BPs which Killers can gain.
0 -
It Is NOT hard to get stacks for WGLF. Just run BT or stop rushing unhooks.
0 -
But then they would have to play killer. Most people here cant, wont, or just refuse due to the side vs side bs.
Also then they couldnt call everyone a filthy killer main if they were also a killer.
0 -
Im sure it has already been pointed out to you, but you’re clearly incorrect.
BT and Synringe can change how a survivor plays. Or the hits they can take. Nothing changes the fact that killers need to kill. Or survivors need to escape.
I think It sucks you lose them but it aligns with the killers. And no addons change the main objective.
0 -
The issue now is it doesn't align with BP.
Its been pointed out above somewhere, but survivors earn around 18-22k most games, sometimes more or less depending on how the game went.
Killers earn 25-32k most games, depending on the match.
Now, this is to balance out 1v4, with killers earning more to compensate for losing their addons, something Survivors now have to deal with as well without the extra BP, and with each level 50 bloodweb being around a 50k investment,
btw im not a survivor main kek https://gyazo.com/dc160864c04f2300066090410f3f22d2
I'm not against Killers keeping their addons, this topic is just about how survivor addons were changed with seemingly no reasoning behind it. Killer addons being changed is fine imo, but it was always this way.
for those saying it, "just use ace in the whole 4head" is hardly a compelling argument as to why it was changed. Just use X perk can be applied to anything in this game.
0 -
The first reply pretty much nailed it. Just a face-saving nerf in order to have a "take" for the "give" (even though the whole idea of items being consumed because you didn't simply stop at 99% use was really silly and this should have just been a QOL change...).
0
