Its getting boring facing survivors using the same meta perks all the time
ds,dead hard,borrowed time,adrenaline,sprint burst,unbreakable
There is no diversity,99% of all survivors run the same perks all the time,its getting boring.Slug for ds,dont chase the unhooked survivor because borrowed time,wait for dead hard before hitting in a chase,when slugging dont go too far in case of unbreakable,sprint burst,simple and easy escape perk,adrenaline,literally every swf I faced runs this,to make sure after they genrush they all escape.I dont think I had a single match where a survivor didn't have at least 2 of these perks in combination,other notable perks but not nearly as used are,balanced landing,iron will,lithe.Its just not fun winning a chase and the survivor to just patch it up near a pallet with dead hard,leave the hooked survivor for 10 seconds,someone with borrowed time will deny you any down and if unlucky with the position you wont even hit the survivor that camed for the save then commit into chasing him to avoid ds,no wonder so many killers hook near a generator cluster and instead they just facecamp.Dealing with 1 survivor that runs these perks is fine but when all of them do especially in swf do,all you can do is try and hope for the best,get a few hits and pray one of them makes a mistake hopefully resulting in getting a kill.Being a killer in red ranks is just painful,there is no room for fun or mistakes if you want to at least not derank.Killers have some really good perks too but the big difference is a killer is alone and cant abuse meta perks by being able to stack them 4 times together..Maybe do something like survivors to not be able to run the same perks at the same time or at least limit them to 2 copies per game.This will not only bring diversity but also make the matches more fun for everyone,for survivors with experience there is no challenge anymore when using these perks.
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I personally don't use many META perks unless I'm doing a very certain build (DS in a locker build, Dead Hard in a vaulting build, etc.) But I completely understand why people don't want to shift from the META, the other perks that they are given are awful, the devs have given them so many restrictions in order to avoid abuse when the perk would have already been situational. Even then, that's not to mention the perks that are simply just useless, most red rank survivors wouldn't really find something like This Is Not Happening or Technician very useful would they? If people want survivors to shift from the current META, the devs need to do a serious overhaul of perks because frankly, a lot of them have been useless on release.
Post edited by indieeden7 on11 -
The same goes for killers that have a lot of not so useful perks too but the difference is there is much more diversity depending on what killer you play and what kind of power he has.Some perks are really good on a killer but really bad on another,for survivor its all the same,same perks are just as good on any survivor.
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It's getting boring playing against the same killers using the same meta perks over and over again.
One side can't complain about the other when both sides do the same thing, constantly.
Both sides use the same perks, both sides are equally as toxic, both sides play scummy.
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I think killer perks have a wider range and dont rely on the same 6 perks every game if you ask me.Not to mention it matters a lot what killer you play since not every perk work just as well on any.
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Honestly I've seen more variety in killer perks since the ruin nerf. BBQ is still everywhere obviously but there's a good reason to use it outside of its in-game effect.
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It’s getting boring with every killer using sloppy thana and pop, it’s also geting boring playing slug simulator, the hit boxes are also boring would you like the list to continue?
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every killer,are you sure about that?
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@Dzeikor oh I do apologise majority of killers
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The simple reason survivors run those perks, is because the grand majority of the other survivor perks ard too weak to justify using.
The meta perks of DS, BT, and "insert exhaustion perk" are simply because whats the point of gimping yourself running other perks. Most perks survivors have have effects that either do something unnecessary (alert, technician, buckle up etc.), where the effect is barely useful even when it works
Then theres perks that barely add an effect. (Premonition, This is not happening, breakdown etc.), where you see almost no benefit from running the perk. Then theres perks that are good but require other perks to make useful in conjunction with others due to how niche they are (dance with me, detectives hunch, tenacity etc.)
And then theres aura reading perks, that have alot of overlap so you only need to run 1 of them, and even then notmal game sense or being in a group of friends means alot of these don't see competitive use (bond, empathy, better together, aftercare etc.)
When you think about it, survivors have a fair amount of perks they do use, its just alot accomplish the same goals, and the 2 most powerful perks (DS/BT) are the ones that are used the most.
In my own matches as killer i see alot of Quick and Quiet, Self care, Inner Strength, For the People, Iron Will, Spine Chill, Adrenaline, Lithe/Balanced Landing/Sprint Burst/Dead Hard, Head on, Urban Evasion, We'll Make It, Deliverance, Object of Obsession, and im even seeing a surge of players using Calm Spirit and Off the Record (maybe a streamers influenced people)
You can't compare survivors running perks to killers running perks, as the fact multiple killer powers interact differently with perks means that of course build diversity is much higher on killer than survivor, but that dont mean theres no perk diversity on survivor.
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Because Killers play different from each other. Like, you can use Enduring on M1-Killers, but someone like Spirit or Hag will not benefit from it, but those two will benefit from Nurses Calling, which will less effective on a Trapper for example. A Billy can use Infectious Fright, while it does not make much sense to use Stridor on him, while it is a great Perk for Spirit, but Infectious Fright would be useless on her.
Surely you see more diversity in Killer Perks (BBQ aside, people are using it just for the BPs, even if the Aura Read is not that useful on some Killers)
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What to expect? There are not many good Survivor Perks and the ones released are not worth running at all. You are basically fine with the Basegame and the Halloween-DLC. Nerfing Balanced Landing is something that forces a Meta even more, if one of the few, really good Perks for Survivor, is nerfed, surely more people are running the same Perks.
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At the moment i use Spine chill, Urban invasion and iron will and sprintburst. I like playing sneaky, but also use a perk with which i can get away fast enough if the killer finds me.
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Complaining about survivor perks as killer is quite hilarious, cause killers force most of these perks onto survivors by playing like douchebags. As survivors if you dont play DS, BT, unbrekable its most of the time the worst games possible. Some chapters ago I tried playing fun builds as survivor and gave up after some days. If killer will just make this game miserable to everybody else, those perks are the only resort to this bs.
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I run self care on survivor all the time because I dont care for some of them players out there that want to tell us not to use it, I brought the game you don't tell me how I'm going to play 😂 and because I dont trust randoms to help me. I don't run second chance perks because then it just makes playing survivor easier then it already is, the only exhaustion perk I use sometimes is head on, not always, I just like to have fun with it now and then. I like spine chill because I'm an idiot when it comes to pay attention to stealth killers, and I like that couple seconds head start to make it run for it because I'm a pu**y 😂 my other two perk slots, basically just what I feel like using at that time of playing. I try to make things abit more challenging for myself otherwise the game just easy and becomes boring. I have been telling myself to stop using spine chill and try something else, but you know the devs creat a ton of rubbish perks that even the most useless player wouldnt even use lol
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Yeah, like self care
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Oh yeah I know, but I'm getting bored of that now 😂 my main reason for it was protest against bossy survivors, I was going to try out that Jane healing perk, but I never see anyone using it, so I'm like is bad?
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I rarely play Meta Perks. When I am in a SWF, everyone keeps complaining, that I am not using Adrenaline (Which I started to use sometimes, cause I almost always get hunted down when the last gen pops), Borrowed time, etc.
What I am using often is Calm Spirit for example, everyone says that it's a bad perk, and that can be true, depending on how you play. I personally prefer to play passive, trying to not get caught by the killer, etc. So I don't use CS, cause i know I need it, I use it preventive, so in the case of the killer having a perk or anything that makes me scream, I won't do that (and to be honest, of 100 rounds, I scream at least in 45). I also switch other perks, depending on what I like to use in this round. I don't play strategically, but as long as the killer is not smurfing, tunnelling or camping, I have fun
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I run no exhaustion perks and no DS on my most common survivor build. I have yet to feel as though even the majority of games would have been significantly better had I ran those. In red ranks, btw, so not in baby killer zones. The few times you do get scumbags in those ranks stand out as being unusual, not the norm.
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There are plenty of strong survivor perks, they just have restrictions. Same thing as killer perks, there are plenty of killer perks that are needlessly over balanced
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exactly, still mostly killers perks are getting heavy nerfs, survivors perks got little changes that actually made (some of ) them even better, DS is the example, dead hard is still the same but now due dedicated servers is not that impressive as used to be still for distance is insanely good.
then Unbrekable is situational i never had a problem with it, adrenalien used to be stronger as far as i know and is kind of fine at the moment and finally BT wich imo should get changed because today is being used to hook bomb/farm survivor not even allowing the killer to leave imo there should be another requirements or conditions like camping for certain amount of time or so to avoid literally getting hook bombed in your face even if in most cases (unless 2 or even 3 survivors body blocking the area) would be punished hardly sometimes u cant even do that because they didnt even allow you to leave, is kind of OP and should get some changes, because actual BT just got buffed is even stronger than used to be, and thats the case with most survivors perks they were barely touched or they actually got buffed, the last big big change/nerf to survivors was exhaustion status and pretty much because of the simple fact that survivors were able to recharge their sprint burst while running also using Vigil, was hilarious and needed a change (took a lot of time to get adressed tho) not talking about objects/items like insta heals because they should have never existed to begin with same goes with toolboxes cuting survivor repair time by half (another problem that took 4 years to get adressed).... also those are items not perks and exhaustion status afected perks massively.
in exchange for killers perks wich got massively nerfed as for example Ruin without giving any kind of compensation at all. now our best bet is Corrupt wich is good but requires more skill as killer to use properly and the game is way harder than used to be for killers now, is fairer yes (still unbalanced) but harder in the highest ranks were you get rushed in 5 minutes casue you made 1 mistake. is hilarious.
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Cause most other perks downright suck.
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Tbf I dislike running the meta too, as you said, because it's really boring for me. But Holy... Since the event startet I have to run them, because killers would facecamp me and tunnel me as soon as I have a crown. So until the event is over Im gonna run the meta perks.
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There isn’t just one amazing build every killer main can run though. A build for a GF would differ greatly from a good Myers build. I don’t have a problem with survivors running the meta but don’t pretend like the killers don’t have much more diverse builds.
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Honestly there isn't as much diversity for killers as you might think. Simply because 95% of perks for both killers and survivors are VERY niche. So people are just using the most efficient perks due to poor game design.
I don't mean to say the "niche perks" are bad, but BHVR wants variety and they're making perks that don't serve that purpose. Since there's no point using these niche perks outside of you have nothing better to do.
This goes for both killers and survivors. If you want people to use more of the perks available they need to have an impact on the game or how it's played, not just a select few that apply every match and others that may be useful 20-30% of the time.
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I completely disagree. I love running off meta builds, and I hate this attitude that "anything that does not give me a fixed +1 hit is trash."
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The diversity for killers mostly comes from the fact killer powers are so wildly different, so each killer uses many different perks. Like for example, on wraith i use nurses calling, sloppy butcher and save the best for last, which are all good perks. However there is almost no point running those perks on plague or hillbilly, simply because their powers are so different
I do agree though, killers do have universally good perk that crop up alot, such as BBQ, PGTW, hex: NOED, spirit fury/enduring etc. but alot of the time you see builds more suited to the killers using them. Survivors dont have that forced diversity, since ultimately they're just skins. The perks that are good on Jake are just as good on Meg or Tapp, Cheryl, Yui or whoever
Finally, its also dangerous for Behaviour to add perks that are just super good im every match, making them meta off the bat. Best example for that was Mettle of Man, as everyone can agree that was the single most busted perk they added and had to rightly nerf. In the past few releases, there hasn't actually been any diabolically bad perks (besides one Cruel Limits and Mindbreaker, they are worse than just bad), which i think is a good thing. Perks like Dead mans switch, Soul guard and Off the Record are niche, but no useless and very good when they're pulled off correctly. They just suffer from not being Borrowed Time or NOED
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You're not entirely wrong but there's a better reason for killers than survivors.
Only certain killers are capable of putting up a fight against the current meta, and only a few select killer perks are good in general and even fewer that are good on all killers. Killers get much more diversity due to the nature of being way more unique than survivors.
Survivors aren't unique and the all benefit the same from perks no matter what. Something I'd like to see is maybe only 1 of that perk per match. No more x4 DH, BT, SB, DS, etc. Only 1 person gets that perk. Force diversity up in this #########.
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The people I play with and I are all in agreement, we are tired of running those perks but guess what they are absolutely necessary! I have played too many matches were there is no Obsession and the killer has free reign to insta tunnel. The killer decides to slug everyone and no one has Unbreakable? Yeah that's going to be fun. Unfortunately these perks are prerequisites, perhaps if Killers change their play style people could be more diverse with their perk builds.
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Once you have a survivor build you’re happy with, there isn’t much reason to change it. All survivors play exactly the same and the build you settle on is usually one that helps in most matches. Until there are more viable perks, this will never change.
At least with killer you have different perks to synergise with your power. Survivors don’t have that diversity though.
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The problem here is more survivor perks are situational than killer perks.
- S = Situational
- M = Meta
- U = Useless
- N/A = No personal experience to base this off.
- C = Can be useful
- K = Kinda Meta Anyways
Below is a list of all survivor perks with my ratings using the legend above (I couldn't figure out how to get this into a spoiler sorry)
- Ace in the Hole = (S) Only useful if you plan on searching chests (Most survivors I know don't really rely on items)
- Adrenaline = (S/K) Only useful if you make it to end game
- Aftercare = (C) Sorta useful, but is condition of being lost when hook make bond a better choice in general
- Alert = (C) Sorta useful if you really need to know where the killer is, but perks like OoO are better suited for this
- Any Means Necessary = (S) Basically requires you having it available (has a long cooldown) and not being in chase and the killer not breaking the pallet
- Autodidact = (S) You are relying on getting skill checks to build stacks and that you are the one healing people. Some games you get 5 stacks early on thanks to stuff like thana and Sloppy, but many games you can end with 2-3 stacks making it actually more hurtful to run than useful
- Babysitter = (N/A) The perk just sounds stupid to run. If the killer runs back to hook its a good chance he saw you both anyhow, if they don't you just heal under hook... Not sure what this perk is meant to do, but I would classify it as useless.
- Balanced Landing = (K) Use to be meta, with the nerf its more situational but still a good perk.
- Better Together = (C/U) This perk is tough, its kinda okay if you are solo, but in general there are much better perks to run compared to this one.
- Blood Pact = (N/A) I would place this somewhere with Aftercare, the haste effect might be nice if you combined this perk with something like We're Gonna Make It. But if the killer isn't running back to hooks, I would still suggest bond as this effect would be kinda useless otherwise.
- Boil Over = (S) Basically hooks spawn way to close for this perk to be extremely useful. I think in all my time playing killer two people have used this perk to wiggle free
- Bond = (K) Just all around great map awareness for survivors.
- Borrowed Time = (M) This perk will see use each game.
- Botany Knowledge = (C/K) This is actually a great perk, The problem is that it is simply outclassed by other perks that though its run, its not run as often. Perks like We're gonna make it, see's more use.
- Breakdown = (U/S) Lots of hooks and it only takes 2 minutes for this specific one to work, it requires a SWF Sabo team to be useful.
- Breakout = (S) Requires you being close enough at pick up and their being no hooks with range. I've seen this perk work more times than Boil Over, but honestly haven't seen it in a while. It really doesn't do enough to make it a Meta style perk.
- Buckle Up = (U/S) Honestly aren't all of Ash's Perks? This perk requires the killer to slug.
- Calm Spirit = (C/U/S) Many killers ignore the crows in the first place relying on other methods of tracking. However its great against Doc. If this effect applied to more killers such as Plague it might see more use, but being mostly useful against one killer makes it situational.
- Camaraderie = (S) This is really only useful in clutch plays for the BT save at the end of the game. Other than that, BT is just a better perk to run in general.
- Dance With Me = (C/S) I feel like this perk requires Lithe to be useful. Without some distraction or speed boost, the killer can still easily track you. This changes based on the loops you have available to you after your window vault.
- Dark Sense = (C/U) Basically unless you have a need to see the killers aura, the heart beat is a perfect method already.
- Dead Hard = (M) Its a super strong perk useful in every match against every killer
- Decisive Strike = (M) Its a super strong perk useful in every match against every killer
- Deja Vu = (U) Literally walk around the map and you get the same information this perk gives you.
- Deliverance = (S) Most killers just tunnel you if you do this, as most survivors like to do this before the killer can even get 30 feet away. Its also situational because it requires you saving someone before being hooked.
- Detective's Hunch = (U) It's a perk that can be outclassed by brining a map
- Distortion = (S) Its a perk that can be done by getting into a locker. It's limited uses also makes it fairly useless in the late game where it would actually be needed. It is also depending on the killers perks. Also if the killer has not aura perks, its useless.
- Pebble (or Diversion if you have no class) = (C) This perk can actually be useful, I would say the only reason its not Meta is simple because its not strong against all killers. Stealth based killers basically make it extremely hard to build a stack. Then you have to hope you use it at the right time. This perk can be useful, but requires a higher skill level to do so.
- Empathy = (K) Its a super strong perk useful in every match against every killer
- Fixated = (U) Lets be honest seeing scratch makes was cool for a game or two. The speed boost only applying while un-injured just makes Urban the better choice here every time.
- Flip-Flop = (S/U) Hey another ash perk that basically does nothing. Unless you combined this with Boil Over and some good team work along with the killer slugging you this perk never see's use.
- For the People = (C) To be fair, this perk is really strong and great in a clutch. I've see it used against me quite a few times. I think its downside often outweighs what it brings to the table so many don't run it.
- Head On = (K) It's a strong perk that a well timed Solo or SWF player can use almost every match.
- Hope = (S/C) This is a good perk, but Adrenaline giving a free health state just outweighs it
- Inner Strength = (C/S) This perk requires that you find and cleanse totems. Its a very strong perk, but can be completely useful in games where you are unable to find a uncleansed totem
- Iron Will = (M) Its a super strong perk useful in every match against every killer
- Kindred = (M) Its a super strong perk useful in every match against every killer (excluding Triangle Head's Cages)
- Leader = (C) This is actually a good perk, it relies on co-op actions or being near other survivors. I see this perk from time to time, but not often. I suspect its benefits are just not enough to replace a meta perk.
- Left Behind = (S) Have to be the last person a alive and hopefully the killer doesn't already know where hatch is.
- Lightweight = (U) I get fading scratch marks is a good thing, but if you have the skill to run the killer this isn't really all that useful.
- Lithe = (K/S) The only reason I added situational to this is because of tile generation. This perk relies on tile generation to favor ones with windows to be useful. I do want to clarify that this perk is more useful than situational
- Lucky Break = (U) Honestly I don't ever remember hearing a survivor complain about blood trails to the point they wanted them hidden. That with the fact this perk is based of 3 minutes of being injured (Does this perk still count time if you are in the dying state?).
- Mettle of Man = (S) The conditions for getting stacks is to high to make it useful every match
- No Mither = (S/U) Would be great if people knew not to slug you.
- No One Left Behind = (S/U) It's conditions are two specific to be useful every match, along with the fact We're Gonna Live Forever does BP bonus better this perk is both situational and useless
- Object of Obsession = (K) This perk requires you to be good at running the killer, but has a good trade off of the killers location that makes it s a strong perk, even more so when combined with SWF.
- Off the Record = (NA/S/U) 1 requires the perk to have an aura reading ability and two Iron Will already does this for the entire game, not a limited time.
- Open Handed = (C) This perk can be useful when combined in SWF with larger aura reading abilities but in general is not every strong or useful in most matches
- Pharmacy = (S) This is really only useful if you are wanting to find medkits. It also requires that you open chest and not anyone else.
- Plunderer's Instinct = (S) It requires that you open chest not anyone else.
- Poised = I actually don't know how to rate this perk. I can see where it could be extremely useful, but I just don't think its strong enough to out class any of the (Kinda) Meta perks out there. I want to rate it as "Can be Useful" but I feel like it is stronger than that.
- Premonition = (C) If you are playing against stealth killers, this in combination with spine chill are extremely strong. This perk alone is still good, but given the heart beat system we have its not entirely useful or strong enough to be meta or kinda meta.
- Prove Thyself = (K) This perk is really strong, though can be situational depending on how you play. If you are someone who just hopes on a gen and doesn't look for co-op gens than this perk is also situational.
- Quick & Quite = (C/K) I think the thing that holds this perk back is the users inability to trigger it. Often times you accidently trigger it via the wrong thing and kinda waste it.
- Red Herring = I legit have no idea how to rank this perk, pretty sure its a meme perk and I don't have a ranking system for that.
- Repressed Alliance = (C) The time requirement to earn this perk plus it being a shorter time than Pop, means it can be useful when played right. However it takes 80% of a gen to earn the ability to use it once makes it rather a weak counter to Pop. Also if the killer doesn't have Pop this perk really has no purpose.
- Saboteur = (S) This perk requires you being near the downed person and going to the hook, to be honest though even when someone managed to do this correctly, I've still be able to hook people.
- Second Wind = (S) At most can be used twice per game. However I don't think its strong enough or useful enough that it will get run a lot. Most cases its just better to let someone heal you at the hook or at a safe location away from hook.
- Self-Care = (M) Strong perk, will see use every game.
- Slippery Meat = (S/U) First a huge part of this perk relies on your killer being trapper, as for the escape, who tries that honestly? Totally forgot this was even a perk to be honest.
- Small Game = (S) This perk relies on the killer either having traps or hex's. If the killer has neither of those things this perk is useless. (Combined with Inner Strength this perk adds the "Can be useful" but is still situational because it requires others not cleansing totems).
- Sole Survivor = (S) Relies on killer having aura reading perks. Assuming they have BBQ, you could also just hope in a locker.
- Solidarity = (C) This perk can be useful, though I do think it has a bug, as when I combined it with autodidact it would always be at half health and would sometimes be at 0. Not sure if this is a bug or intended effect. I actually enjoy this perk, but its just not a very strong perk or not strong enough to outclass other healing related perks.
- Soul Guard = (S) Requires the killer to slug.
- Spine Chill = (M) This perk is super strong and will see use every match
- Sprint Burst = (M) This perk is super strong and will see use every match
- Stack Out = (C/S) This perk can be useful, but once you get better at the games, its pretty easy to hit great skill checks (even more so that my HUD is stupid large compared to before).
- Streetwise = (U) With the recent update to items you would have thought this perk would become stronger, but I actually see it less now.
- This is not happening = (C/S) This perk can be useful, but once you get better at the games, its pretty easy to hit great skill checks (even more so that my HUD is stupid large compared to before).
- Technician = (S) This perk is great for starters, pretty much useless once you learn to hit skill checks. Against perks like overcharge this perk might grow in strength, but few run that perk to start off with.
- Tenacity = (S) This perk requires the killer to slug. It might be useful with SWF where you could quickly get to a pallet or flashlight save distance, but both of those conditions are random depending on where you get downed and if someone is near you.
- Up the Ante = (NA/U) I literally have no idea what Luck does in this game.
- Unbreakable = (M/S) I believe this is the only situational perk that is also Meta. It's situational, because it relies on the killer slugging, but if they do slug you this is a crazy strong perk.
- Urban Evasion = (K) This perk lets you move fast and not leave scratch marks, making it a strong perk found in lots of builds. It's problem is it requires a specific playstyle to be useful that not everyone uses.
- Vigil = (S) Basically you have to lose the killer and than you get to shave 8 seconds of your exhaustion timer. This can happen, but rarely.
- Wake Up = (S) This is only useful against remember me, gates take roughly 16 seconds to open up. This perk downs that to 13.6 seconds... It's secondary effect is kinda useful assuming people didn't pay attention to exit gates locations, which actually happens a lot.
- We'll Make It = (S/C) This perk requires you to be the person saving someone off hook, if you manage to do this a lot this perk can be strong and useful in most games. It's condition for activation demotes it from Kinda Meta to Can be Useful.
- We're Gonna Live Forever = This perk is interesting, its like the crap version of BBQ for survivors. This perk isn't run to help survivors in any way, its instead run for extra BP. The conditions for activating this perk can make some players actually throw games at times (at least from my personal experience). Not sure how to rate this perk I would say it is (S) because it relies on the survivor giving up a useful perk for BP.
- Windows of Opportunity = (S/C) This perk is great in a chase for new survivors who don't know tile layouts and generations, once you become familiar with the game, there are better perks to run.
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There could be an additional game mode, offering greater rewards, but focusing on non-SWF and always randomized perks and add-ons, based on what you have already earnt. Keep the ranks for the current game format so people can still play, and add another game mode where people can try for shards, bp, cosmetics or cells by competing in randomized events.
I agree, metas are dull and uninspired, but people have reason for them, depending on what they want out of the game. There's no point in "punishing" them for meta builds or (in survivor case) SWF, but there should be an incentive for those willing to to test themselves.
There would be argument for then one gameplay taking over the other - killers moving to the randomized game-mode, resulting in extensive waiting times for SWF, but there is a way through this: by adding a new currency and side-objective in the original mode:
This currency can be gathered throughout the map. Maybe a ticket or a coin. Once gathered, you cannot lose it, even if sacrificed or mori'd or 0k'd. This currency could be used a bit like slots into the old arcade machines, allowing you to compete in the higher-reward games. They could even be purchaseable (although this may lead to limits in how many you can hold). But that may there are incentives and extras for both modes.
Sorry I've gone off topic a little, but this may make things more interesting.
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If you need meta perks to win, you probably suck at the game. Just saying.
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Killer main using all meta killer perks complaining about survivors using meta perks. What is life.
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What do you expect? the last meta perk survivors got was Dead Hard and thats from chapter 5, after it Inner Strength and Deliverance are the only decent perks, anything else is just memes or situational or awful.
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