Survivors are to lazy to do Totems & this is the reason why they complain about Noed
The Devs already said they aren´t touching Noed, because they want to encurage survivors to do an alternate objective.
First survivors complain about more to do in maps. Than we have so many Killer´s with onehit options. Abilitys, Add ons and stuff like that. Than survivors complain about totems are to easy to find. They have map offerings, Detectives Perk and so on......
The reason why survivors complain so much about Noed is because they are to lazy to do bones ! So stop asking for Nerfs or reworks. I can remember Noed wasn´t a totemperk ect. Its absl. absurd and i can´t understand why survivors still complain about a Hexperk.....
I told you again, the Devs never touching it yet, because this perk is perfect balanced atm and i don´t care what wannaby pros or Streamer are saying. Everyone can have his own oppinion thats np for me and i accept it. If they wanna rush only gens np they can do, but than accept or liv with the consequences.
this is the perfect answer from community Manager Not_Queen
"As it was mentioned in the thread by different people, NOED isn't rewarding poor gameplay from Killers:
- Killer has to play the trial with only 3 perks before the doors are activated.
- The perk can be fully deactivated by survivors
- If the killer has no luck in hooking many survivors before the doors are activated, then the survivors should have been able to cleanse totems without feeling pressure, thus, not giving the NOED edge to the killer. It's on them if it activates.
- If survivors allow the killer to get a 4K with NOED in the end game, I would argue that survivors made mistakes during their end game plays or didn't prepare for the potential NOED activation.
Finally, if you don't want to play NOED, it's your prerogative. In my opinion, building a build that is strong in end game isn't rewarding failure, it is using perks for their intended purposes. The purpose of NOED is to give a killer a burst of strength in end game. Since it's effectively strong, survivors have the power to deactivate it, if they focus secondary objectives.
The killer players choosing to play NOED are banking on a burst of strength at the end for the downside of playing with 3 perks the rest of the game and having a chance to have their perk deactivated. It's a high risk, high reward scenario."
There is nothing more to say
Deal with it
greetings
Comments
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/clap
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LOL @ "Deal with it". The high horse is high AF today. 🤣
But NOED is fine. I agree, super counterable.
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But killers can hit survivors and are mean to me ;_;
Edit: Sarcasm cause you cant tell the difference in type.
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dude you dont understand it right ?, do finally bones or do it not. Its your decision but pls ....you can believe me the devs don´t touching it cause this perk is perfect balanced atm and can be full deactivate by survivors. Look at my topic the key word is LAZY. It´s not hard to do totems for some seconds.
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I mean look what they have done with Hexruin ..... what do you think if they touching noed ? RIP
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Yes because Not_Queen, who I've never seen play past rank 10, is the authority on game balance and design.
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Dude that can be said about anything killers are too lazy not to tunnel so they complain about ds. If something on one side is changed something on the other side should change as well. If bt is changed make it so something is done about camping.if ds is changed something needs to be done about tunneling.you can't change one thing on one side and not do anything to the other. Otherwise there is no balance on either side.
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Ds is fine because killers are too lazy to apply pressure instead of tunneling
Stop being bias and admit that just like ds noed is op
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I just can't believe survivors chose to make their stand against such a weak and almost entirely useless perk.
If killers couldn't get multiple kills off of noed, you'd see it used a lot less. When you know the killer has noed, just escape and give the killer the kill. This simple solution would see Noed basically killed.
I'm not even going to say do totems, just don't be greedy.
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I run IS so very much in my interest to do totems and I run detective's hunch to find them better. I have dropped through the hole in the ceiling in the game to find the gen there done and the totem still standing meaning someone or more than someone did a gen and left the totem sitting right next to the gen. But to be fair some totems are put in some pretty bad spots. Once one was in a bag and the open end facing a wall. Another was in a tiny alcove tucked into a wall. The ones at Dead Dawg are nearly impossible to find....so it isn't just being lazy in many cases.
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NoED is fine but don’t act like RNG doesn’t play a factor in it. Certain maps will spawn ######### totem spots and god totem spots. Leary’s is a nightmare for totems. All those blue crates make looking for them a COMPLETE pain in the ass and all survivors have to do is miss one. Same thing for Haddonfield.
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I agree NOED is fine, but I disagree with the blanket statement that survivors are all lazy and have no right to complain about something they find unfair. I personally think the biggest problem with NOED is that it encourages camping when in my opinion it should encourage keeping the survivors on edge right up until the last survivor goes out the gates.
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Also if noed is fine ds is fine, just learn the counters for the perks lol
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Will you continue to buy cosmetics if you can't find a game? Cause keep pushing in this direction and there won't be any killers left. How long do you think your que times will be then?
Actually I think the killers make the money in this game. The survivors are the majority but we all know the licensed killers are what draws people to this game. You think people saw Nancy+Steve and said "Omg I wanna play as Nancy" No they saw freddy, bubba, demi and said i wanna play as him! Then they cried when they realized how broken the game is and they switched to the survivor side.
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did you not see the /s?
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I don't even know what that means so im gonna say no. Id rather we just have a font for sarcasm.
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Or they are just bad and can't buy themselfs time to do anything else than gens.
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That's an awfully big blanket statement, and those don't tend to help anyone.
Yes, sometimes people just don't bother cleansing the totems in spite of the match going very well and then get hit by NOED. That's not all matches, though. There are times when the match is really close and they simply don't have time to go look for all the totems. Especially when you've got someone using a strong killer with 3 slowdown/regression perks on a map with very well hidden totems, stopping to go find all five totems is easier said than done and would probably do more harm than good.
To dismiss them all as lazy is a pretty lazy excuse.
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Oh yes, from the creators of "just mindgame the Spirit", the conitnuation to the critically acclaimed series "there's no problem with the design, it's the players that have been playing for literal years that don't know how to deal with this thing that has been around for just as long".
Yep DS is fine too, just don't tunnel xD. SWF is fine, just apply more pressure. Keys are fine, just kill the survivors before they find the hatch.
The devs aren't gonna come out and say "so guys, that design was garbage, so we'll change it". It's not a good look for them. They said for years that gen speed was fine, they said in the past that infinites were fine because they took skill, they seem to think DS is in a good place, they even said Legion was in an okay spot. So unless you're willing to accept all those things as true, stop appealing to authority and acting like the devs always know what's best. They're humans just like us.
Maybe think a bit about why people are complaining instead of just assuming they're all wrong and you're right. What tilts the everliving frick outta me is the lack of nuance in every single "just do the bones xD" post. No consideration as to how much different information works when concerning solos vs SWF is the main offender of this. Until there's a clear feedback so that all survivors know how many dull totems have been cleansed, it's not a secondary objective, and it's not fair nor balanced that solos have to do all totems to make sure they're done while SWF just gets that information for free.
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I didn't come to this game to play killer licensed or otherwise. Only reason I play killer at all is to do some easy Daily or Rift challenges to get basically free BP to spend on my survivors. And I started as Feng and still my main and I have spent a few $ on cosmetics. But I do think Behaviour is being very irresponsible. I have to spend auric cells to get Feng or Yuri a mask with a pandemic going on?
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Totally agree. I have found totems that without detective's hunch I'd never have seen it. One was literally inside a bush and had to go around it three times with the perk just to find it. Another was inside a bag with the only open side facing a wall, the ones at Dead Dawn are nearly invisible.
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They don't have to do all 5 totems when the match is close. They can simply bring in a map or replace one of their perks with Small Game and Detectives Hunch and look for the glowing totem when the generators are completed. I agree that not all Survivors are lazy, but the ones asking for a nerf to NoEd or for a totem counter are.
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This is pretty nuanced and well written. I 100% agree, and I'm also pretty disappointed that so many people are ignoring the fact that the NOED "conflict" represents the community's opinion of the swf-solo gap and that when the community agrees that NOED is fine they are agreeing that the swf-solo gap is fine.
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I think the problem is that the game just doesn't force survivors to learn it. You don't need to understand the intricacies of pathing, anti gen patrol, looping, or with the recent ruin nerf, even finding totems because totem perks are so weak. The only thing you really need to learn how to do as a survivor is hit skill checks and be able to approach a hook and unhook someone. You're given plenty of perks to mitigate any problems you have with looping the killer or being chased by the killer. The fact that the majority of totems spawn in quite plain sight also exacerbates this, so when survivors feel forced to learn where totems are, they can just rely on how common it is for a totem to spawn near a gen and use the gens as markers.
So while it isn't explicitly laziness, it's more of a lack of real challenge the game gives survivors so they feel like they don't have to do totems, they can just slam gens and reliably survive just basically doing that.
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Here's the NOED scenario I see most often.
Killer finds someone, killer proxy camps,
What do killers tell survivors they should do to counter camping? You got it, do gens.
Survivors do gens and "rush" them.
Survivor dies after being camped and the killer then gets to pick themselves up another kill at the end after NOED procs because those lazy survivors tried to do the gens instead of throwing themselves at a camping killer.
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The same people that argue that solo should be brought up to the same level as SWF to buff killers are creating these empty, upvote bait discussions and it's hilarious and sad at the same time. People really don't like checking their own biases.
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You can argue the exact same thing for both sides. Truth is, the game does a poor job teaching people fundamentals - tiles, pathing, patrolling, when to give up chases, when it's safe to save or not. I don't blame the devs too much because those things are highly nuanced and subjective, but there are both survivors who rank up by playing immersed, doing gens and leaving without interacting with anyone else and killers who rank up by hard camping and tunnelling without learning how the game works from within. The core difference is that in these forums survivors are entitled and should "git gud" while killers are somehow victims of game design and shouldn't be held accountable for their own failures. As long as we have double standards like this being so widely accepted here, it's very hard to have productive discussions.
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But the underlying problem to your argument is that ultimately a good survivor group will have a very high survival rate against a good killer. The only balancing factor that survivors have is the weak link on their team because this game does a poor job putting people in a rank that they belong.
A survivor that knows how to play is very oppressive in their own right 1v1 vs a killer. Usually, if the other 2 survivors know how to hit skillchecks, if you are unfortunate enough to run into the 2 good survivors on a team, you have already wasted enough time for those two survivors to throw the game in their favor, even if you abandon the chases quickly.
The simple fact of the matter is that survivor is very laid back. There's a reason why most of the streamers for this game play survivor, because you can effectively be distracted and doing something else while also having an extremely easy time surviving even solo.
The only part of the game where killer is oppressive is in the lower ranks where survivors barely even know how to hit skillchecks.
I have tried to get friends to play this game but they cite the fact that this game is too heavily survivor sided and thus not fun as their reasons for not playing. This isn't even an opinion, there's a reason why killers get bloodlust, because the game is broken in the survivors' favor.
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Carrying as solo survivor only exists when broken setups exist. Unless the killer misplays horribly, there's no way a single survivor can last long enough to "1v1 comfortably" in newer maps without OP connected tiles.
I don't have the numbers on that but the streamer population proportion probably matches the general playerbase proportion. This game needs to be roughly 4 survivors to 1 killer in order to work. Besides, I've seen many killer streamers roflstomp survivors while playing attention to chat and stuff. It's because those people are obscenely good at the game when compared to the general player and nothing else. Of course the role where you interact with your opponent for 25 ish% of the match is gonna be more laid back, but that's, once again, a design thing not a balance thing.
And all of that goes out the window when talking about snowball killers. A killer can win a game just as quickly as they can lose it as most killers. If every single killer was at a power level of, let's say, Huntress and above, this game wouldn't be survivor sided anymore besides very few deathsquads, which are far too uncommon to have the game be balanced around them.
If you're facing an average red rank solo survivor squad you absolutely do not need a weak link in order to win. Then you can argue that some red rank survivors don't belong at red ranks, to which I respond that quite a few red rank killers don't belong at red ranks either, because the ranking system is awful.
One more thing: bloodlust was created primarily because of infinites and god loops. It belongs less and less in the game the more maps get updated.
"But the underlying problem to your argument is that ultimately a good survivor group will have a very high survival rate against a good killer." If the survivors are on comms, yes, but we all know information is too important in this game. If they're not, I'd be willing to bet a good player playing a good killer might have the edge.
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But there are perks that can help you locate them. The problem is that certain survivors don't want to adapt and give up perk slots to use them. And frankly, most are just to lazy to bother. It's far easier to ask for a nerf.
Many killer hated Ruin, and wasting a slot on a perk that likely wouldn't last long, but it was an adaption that they had to make due to the situation. Ruin got nerfed, and the game is faster on the survivors side, so the killers had to adapt again. Many don't want to use NOED, and some still don't, but many feel that it's the only option to balance things out.
The problem is that these survivors complaining about NOED are not willing to adapt, in any way. There are even other perks that more directly counter NOED, without having to find totems but, again, some survivors are unwilling to adapt and give up other perks in order to use them.
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But there are perks that can help you locate them. The problem is that certain survivors don't want to adapt and give up perk slots to use them. And frankly, most are just to lazy to bother. It's far easier to ask for a nerf.
Many killer hated Ruin, and wasting a slot on a perk that likely wouldn't last long, but it was an adaption that they had to make due to the situation. Ruin got nerfed, and the game is faster on the survivors side, so the killers had to adapt again. Many don't want to use NOED, and some still don't, but many feel that it's the only option to balance things out.
The problem is that these survivors complaining about NOED are not willing to adapt, in any way. There are even other perks that more directly counter NOED, without having to find totems but, again, some survivors are unwilling to adapt and give up other perks in order to use them.
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It is very easy to carry as a solo survivor.
If you think that having a small minority of the population being absolutely oppressive is fine, we just have different opinions on game philosophy.
I think this video needs to be constantly posted here because many problems with this game would be solved by it.
in fact, just between forum posts, i was able to run a killer for 3 gens with only using 2 pallets, and im not that good of a survivor player.
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Congratulations, you either faced a terrible killer or had an OP setup then. Your anecdotal evidence doesn't extrapolate to the general playerbase.
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And basing the game on the general playerbase is by far the worst thing you can do in game design, especially in a pvp game.
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I'm not even going to get into this discussion here. Just know that I'm perfectly familiar with this concept and I don't think DBD should adopt it while the game sucks at other basic balance things.
Until the SWF-Solo gap is smaller there's no point in following that.
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Add totem counter for solo survivors. If they will continue to ignore it, then its 100% their own fault.
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You should probably read that quote a little more critically.
If the best players in this game are good SWF players, then by the same logic applied by the quote means that the game would be based off of them. The same holds true for the killer side as well.
If this game was properly balanced, solo queue wouldn't be painful because you wouldn't have bad survivors in high ranks. The ranking system would solve itself. Bad players that have no concept of teamwork would be in the low ranks, and good players with a knowledge of the game and teamwork would be at the top.
This is the elegance of balancing the game around the best players, because then there's a definite point where the devs can go 'ok this [whatever] is being abused too much, we have to change it.'
You need to understand that the ranking system and the failure to implement a proper one is by far the most fundamental issue with this game, and most other issues this game has with balance could be ironed out with a proper ranking system.
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I'm pretty sure that the OP didn't mean "all survivors". I'm pretty sure that it was just directed at the ones here on the forums that are constantly calling for nerfs rather than adapting. Aslo, there are perks to help with finding totems. The problem is that they don't want to have to replace any of their meta perks.
You mention the killer running 3 regressions perks. They would have to sacrifice other meta perks to do that. Why? Because they are adapting to the fact that gen times are too quick. Certain survivors here don't want to make that same sacrifice. They want to keep their favorite perks and get rid of the need to cleanse totems. It's much easier to call for nerfs, than adapt.
The survivors that you refer to, that make calculated decisions to not cleanse totems, are likely not the ones on the forums calling for nerfs.
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The problem with your logic is that the ranking system is completely broken.
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And balancing the game around the best players would make strides in determining what a skilled player is and does. What their goals are, how they play.
"So what if a killer just tunnels a survivor out of the match?" - that killer won't be in high ranks
"so what's stopping this system from being abused?" - It doesn't, you have sealclubbing in every single truly skill based game, and it's no change from now either
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I love that you talk as if I'm not familiar with that concept when I've had talks like this with multiple people here before, and probably will have more in the future. I'm just not going in depth in a subject that has nothing to do with the original point of the thread.
You're not bringing any revolutionary ideas here with that, it's a very well known concept.
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What are your thoughts on the effects of Noed in a solo q match vs a swf match? One of the reasons I dislike Noed is that it punishes solo q players the most.
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so because this game has been balanced around the majority of the playerbase, where killer is oppressive, survivor becomes very oppressive at higher ranks and skill levels
So, survivor was made easier and killer was made harder. We come full circle. This is why i brought up this point.
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I don't think killers are receiving more nerfs than survivors lately, it appears to me that the devs take care in adressing issues with both sides and trying to appear impartial in their balancing decisions. Although, speaking truthfully, they probably don't care about balance that much and just want people to stay and keep buying DLC.
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