Facecamping Isn't Toxic
Facecamping insn't toxic. I am a believer that Killers in general are unable to be toxic. If the Killer is Facecamping, leave them to it and go do gens.
Survivors are much more able to be toxic than Killers as everything a Killer does can be countered by competent Survivors.
Feel free to change my mind, but doubt you could.
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It is. Cause you are taking the game hostage both for you and him. And btw im nor sure the other three wish to play press the skillcheck.
so yea you can do it, its not bannable, but it is toxic
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For what you say about "killers being unable to be toxic" what about letting the last survivor bleed out on the ground when there's no tactical reason to do so (no DS possible, plenty of hooks nearby so even an unlikely flip-flop play can't happen and so on)? That seems like a completely pointless action with no purpose other than annoying someone to me.
But then again that same intent-based definition of toxicity applies to facecamping for me as well. If someone does it at endgame or something it can be a perfectly sound decision, if someone does it specifically to annoy people I don't see the point as I find the whole "playing for salt" thing incredibly childish no matter who does it.
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What isn't toxic about literally telling someone that they cannot play the game just because you don't feel like playing? How is it OK to just ruin someone's experience and potentially make them quit because you are a terrible person? Before you make a stupid post saying something like this, add some damn reasoning.
I was literally facecamped out of my first game in Dead by Daylight and my first thought was "Why did I buy this game again?" because of it. If that is what you want, then please keep ruining the game for people and sacrificing your rank in the process.
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Isn't taking the game hostage at all, other Survivors can do gens and leave, nothing is stopping them from not getting killed because they are running around Killer and trying to get Survivor off hook. Not taking hostage at all. Game can still progress.
Toxic? Insidious is there for a reason, "facecamping"... Perks are not toxic.
Bleeing out has a timer, so you can't be toxic with it. Game continues, Survivor eventually dies. DS is used by pretty much every Survivor, a Killer leaving a Survivor to bleed out can be argued as a tactic rather than being toxic. Besides, I let Survivors bleed out sometimes - guess what they deserve it.
Gen-rushing isn't a thing... completing gens is the objective. Completing them on purpose is NOT toxic. NOT completing them on purpose IS toxic.
Well, guess I'm right then...
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Probably from the same Survivor who used Adrenaline, Borrowed and DS and calls NOED toxic. We all get "facecamped", again Insidious is a perk and there to be used. PErks can not be toxic, there is a counter to everything.
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aight, I imagine waiting to get into phase 2 and then spam spacebar until the game is over doesnt count as being hostage and thats how the game was supposed to be played
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B-but what about camping, tunneling, stridor, noed, mori spirit )-: Had that yesterday, was epic.
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Never. Only ran DS to actually stop being tunnelled. And I don't call NoED toxic, I call it a badly designed perk and have highlighted how. This isn't even about perks, though. This is about people using the scummiest tactic in the game to get easy kills because they can't be bothered to put in half an effort.
And if you MUST know, here's the 3 perk builds I've been bouncing between since the Stranger Things chapter. I did start the later two after Cursed Legacy, but I played the first one before that.
Claudette - Self-Care, Bond, Spine Chill, Sprint Burst
Yui - Self-Care, Botany Knowledge, Balanced Landing, Decisive Strike
Kate - Lithe, Dance with Me, Quick and Quiet, Self-Care
Don't just assume anything about anyone. I play both sides, I know what I'm doing and I hate one-use only perks.
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Neither is teabagging or flashlights
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If you want to consider it a tactic, sure. But I don't see why you'd ever select it unless picking them up carries any form of risk, as it gives you less emblem score, points and takes longer (especially ever since the last survivor always insta-dies on the hook). Outside of certain situation (possible DS, lack of hooks nearby) it just seems like a very poor tactic.
Doing something "annoying" in an attempt to win is one thing. Doing it when it can only make the end result worse emblem and point-wise doesn't make it seem like a very good tactic to me.
Unless it's done with the explicit intent to annoy, of course. But that's the very definition of in-match toxicity to me (besides straight up cheating or otherwise breaking rules), having "making people mad" as a primary motivation.
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Its not Toxic and its definitly not holding game hostage. If you are hooked, you will die sooner or later.
I agree that facecampers/campers are boring and i hate them, but its not really toxic since it can be a strat.
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So how do you gens if you get face camped?
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Facecamping the first guy you down its not a strat, and no sane killer would ever do that.
also theres difference in dying after having played the game and dying cause you are being taken hostage.
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Actually, there is a reason. And this happens to me a lot. I hook random person and i turn around, 3 ppl hiding behind crap ready to rescue. I strike at one of them and spook them away, start to leave and then they run in before.im.gone to save like WAT
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how is it taking the game hostage?
killer is doing it's objective?
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Stopped reading at "killers cant be toxic" that's litrally the most bias and incorrect thing i have heard. 14 posts btw obviois bait account is obvious
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First two sentence confirmed your opinion is invalid.
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I love when a killer facecamps for no reason and then get sh***ed on at the end and gets no kills. They feel stupid, mad, and embarrassed and DC. It’s their fault for taking a chase they know they can’t win. It is toxic in my opinion especially when they beat someone on the hook.
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Taking the game hostage is when the game can no longer progress due to a player. Camping does NOT hold the game hostage as the other players can finish gens and the hooked player can kill them selves on hook.
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Gen-rushing...or, completing the sole objective of the game. I expect gens to be completed as a Killer...It's actually the only thing I expect from the game. Gen-rushing is not a thing.
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Let me just take what someone with the word toxic in their name takes on board and dismiss it completely. Nice try, move along.
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This game isn't a 1v1.
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Well, technically, only survivors can progress the game. The killer can only slow it down. Killers can't take the game hostage, because they cannot control the speed of the game.
I don't know why you would facecamp, as it does nothing for you as a killer, but saying it is taking the game hostage is a lie.
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So... they disagree with you, so you decide their opinion is worthless? That's a great way to debate people...
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I would disagree that gen rush is toxic because of the sheer speed at which they can get done (especially coordinated teams, 5 in 4 minutes is ludicrous)... but working on the objective by default is not toxic.
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What would you do if you got facecamped at the start of the game? Would you have fun? I bet you would have fun just being on the hook and then spamming a button for a minute then dying and getting no points for 10min of waiting for a lobby
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It is toxic my dude, but it's easily counterable. Same thing with SWF flashlighters., sure they spam it but they are so easily baited out it's a free hit.
Just because you can counter it doesn't mean it isn't toxic.
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I'm sorry but only survivors have the ability to take the game " hostage" what a stupid made up term. Just like tunneling. But if you wanna use terms made up by you guys ill bite
You can die and exit the game whenever u want but when u tbag killers at exit gates or wait the entire time until a kill comes to the exit gate so u can mock him. Or even worse at a hatch... this is where I see " hostage" applying. Killer has no way to get out then.
You act like survivor is the only one who can have fun. At the expense of 1 survivor there are still 3 of you.
My professor used to say "A sure formula for failure is to try and please everyone."
Killers and survivors both have ways to be annoying and you can't really balance them all.
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Actually both sides can take the game hostage by hiding all game or trapping someone in a corner while the hatch is open since the egc won't take effect. Hostage situations only arise when the game will not end due to what one side is doing.
The act of face camping you are correct is not taking it hostage though but it can be considered toxic if done as soon as you down someone as it doesn't let a player take part in the game.
Survivors waiting at the gates or the hatch isn't taking it hostage as they can be forced out. It can be considered toxic much like face camping.
The issue with you 1 v 3 analogy is not everyone is in a 4 man group. When that one survivor is caught within 30s and face camped what happens with the others has no relevance to them as that person's game is ruined as they did not get to do actively play the match.
Anything which is a design part of the game or strats that are allowed is fair play though so in reality it should be accepted and the players on both sides just need to move on and let it go. It's just a game afterall.
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Except a survivor teabagging you at the exit gate has given you an ENTIRE MATCH to play to get points/pips. And cannot possibly 'hold you hostage' because EGC exists and nullified that from even being a possibility. You can also force them out as Killer by literally walking up the exit gate hallway. We all know people who teabag at the gate are pussies and will run right out.
A killer face camping the first person they catch out of the game ruins their entire match. They get no points. They will depip. Their entire time waiting in lobby and getting into that match was a waste. And they had no control over it.
So a survivor's definition of fun (according to you) is being annoying and mild inconvenience, meanwhile a killer's definition of fun is robbing someone of their game, their points, and their rank. Hmmmm, I hope you see the disparity there.
Its also not at the expense of 1 person. It ruins the match for everyone. It literally sucks the fun out of the game to watch someone hang there, unable to play because some ######### wants a little e-power trip to sooth their ego. It's pathetic. And when I get 3-4 of these in a row, I just go play something else because the game ceases to be enjoyable. And it doesn't matter if it happened to me directly or not. I'm one of those weird people who actually gives a ######### about others and their enjoyment of a game I love too. 🙄
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Honestly You don't find that survivors have more ways to ruin the killers fun. I mean camping wouldn't be a thing if gens didn't go so fast, or the fact that it works so well sometimes since survivors all come like moths
What I noticed when I play solo is even tho I run kindred I still see multiple survivors running for the save. This aside I wanna point out my own opinion and experience
When I got dbd I wanted to main killer but what I noticed and this may be just me... I have a lot more fun playing survivor due to how many stressful games I have had as a killer. Especially early on when you have no perks you almost instinctively camp... not to mention this atrocious matchmaking that doesn't help anyone or let new players fully learn a killer.
Now at high ranks with perks I still find killer to be stressful. I find myself decent at it and im good with mind games but it still doesn't mean I'm not worrying every match
As I play I notice that as a killer im really not given leeway to any kind of mistakes. If I ######### up it could cost me the game or 3 gens popping.
The survivor ques are sooo long due to how unfun killer is. Survivors abuse a ton of crap I feel like killers just had to adapt.
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Facecamping is toxic for the fact that it takes the game hostage, whilst after the survivor dies and you can go on to keep playing, that survivor has no way to play and their opportunity to play the match is forcibly taken from them (despite them already having long queue times).
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toxicity is a mindset.
just because i play killer doesnt mean i wouldnt be able to be toxic.
and if you wanna facecamp, do that.
is it toxic? thats debatable. (i think so, as the only goal you can get from it is to ruin someone elses fun)
is it optimal gameplay? its very, VERY far from that.
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sometimes i feel like its the right move. I once had 2 people hooked in the basement like 2 mins in with 5 gens up. Why wouldn't i just wait around the basement if its gonna be a free win for me and before anyone says well its toxic or bm i couldn't give a damn 80% of games i play survivors bm with t bag, emote, flashlights before i do anything like tunneling, camping etc etc, especially in post chat "Youre a trash killer" "only won cause of noed" "must be bad to play doc" "hacker cheater". I aint gonna go out of my way to make survivors happy when they act like ######### to killer for unwarranted reasons.
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It's not bannable and should never be bannable. But I definitely think it's toxic, the survivor being face camped will spend the next 2 min bored and end with 3k bloodpoints and a depip.
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For starters, no. Camping has been and always will be a thing unless it's addressed by Devs. It doesn't matter what we do to gen speeds. Killer's don't camp because of gen speeds. Killer's camp because miserable people feel better about themselves by making other people feel #########. Especially if they just came out of a match where survivors made them feel like crap. Outside of an end-game situation - this is just lazy, entitled Killers doing what lazy entitled Killers do.
And as a red rank survivor main, I don't disagree with you - plenty of survivors who SHOULD know not to approach a face camping, insta-down Killer when someone is running Kindred, do. But I understand that reaction. It feels terrible to watch someone die first hook. It robs all the other survivors of their altruism objective, which is a key source of BP and Rank. Another reason why, no, it is not at the expense of only 1 person. So, I get the empathetic and potentially strategic reasons for trying, even if it's ill advised.
As a survivor main, I do the exact same thing. I play Killer when I need a "break" from survivor, because it's honestly less stressful IMO. In general, I think this sense of relief comes from the fact that you don't care as vehemently about the progress or regression of your alt as you do your main. So, I think that explains some of the stress relief of playing the other side.
Both Killers and Survivors are punished for ######### up in different ways...or advantaged in different ways. Survivors can use exhaustion perks like DH. Killers don't even need perks...the longer you get looped the more BL you gain to bridge the gap.
I don't have issues with my survivor queues in red rank as a solo. Maybe SWFs do. As a solo, I just don't experience huge wait times. Killer's inconsiderate, toxic play style literally means I have to bring one specific meta build as a solo just to make sure I have some semblance of a chance to escape. I would love to bring a fun build and try different plays...but without being able to depend on a team, that's an impossibility because every lazy killer wants to camp/tunnel/mori. Lather, rinse, repeat.
To circle this discussion back around to the original point, camping is toxic AF. There is no question about it.
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This.
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Sometimes "facecamping" is all you got going for you late game. You can't be expected to have 1 or 2 people hook and have the gens all completed and gate open, or be near the last few gens and not hang around.
If you're hooked and the gate is open, I am not going to walk the opposite side of the map just because 4 Survivors in the end game chat want to yell "baby killer" to make themselves feel better. It makes more sense to stay with the person hooked and up to the Survivors to make their choice as it were. Get hooked themselves or leave...They can leave, end of match, everyone moves on. It's not toxic, it can be sometimes all the Killer has.
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If Facecamping isn't toxic, then neither is Teabagging. Or running into a killer with DS, and jumping in a locker. Just strategy.
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going by your reasoning even the killer can exit the game by alt f4.
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so whats the strategy when you're the last guy remaining and you start tea bagging 1 inch from the exit
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Just celebrating bro.
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It's all good fun, not toxic, I do it when I player Survivor, and I hate Survivor.
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so not strategy its just them being a dick
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It's not game hostage.... And the (professional?) camper isn't a very smart guy, he will probably finish the match with 1 kill (unless the surv escape from the natural born camper) with -1 pip.
I think you have a wrong idea what is toxic and what isnt. Facecamping isnt toxic, gen rush its not toxic.
It's how the game works.
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" I am a believer that Killers in general are unable to be toxic
Survivors are much more able to be toxic than Killers as everything a Killer does can be countered by competent Survivors.
Feel free to change my mind, but doubt you could."
you are clearly 12 and just want attention through baiting lol
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Good effort, you go back to school in September or earlier? Your reply is the most childish thing I have seen on this forum - which is impressive. Thank you for summing up all of my points though. Appreciate it. Stay salty.
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The game being taken hostage means it can’t progress and the only way to get out is d/c’ing if you can ######### on the hook you’re not being held hostage even if the timer is slow.
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