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Tunneling/Camping question from a new player
Hey guys! So look, full disclosure. I'm new. Like, started playing when that tome level one thing went live new. I actually completed the whole level one thing, pardon my brief self promotion but I'm proud of myself because again, newb. =D I really don't know what's what yet or anything, still learning (like someone told me Nightmare was trash but he seems decent with some practice *shrug*) I even posted about that in the QNA like hey I'm told Nightmare is bad and stuff do y'all rework heroes? Again, totally understand I was misinformed, been using and enjoying very much the Nightmare. He's fun, seems decent once I learn maps and stuff. I'm sure this will be down-voted to craziness too btw, it seems to be a hot-button issue with veterans of DBD but for what it's worth I don't have a position on the issue, legit just trying to have a discussion. Trying to inform myself, learn and get better at DBD. So all that said, here we go.
Tunneling as I understand it, is tunnel vision. Like hard focusing on someone to get the kill despite the other survivors whom are likely making generator progress while you dance around and poke and stuff and then when that survivor is pulled you ignore one, get survivor one back on a hook. Camping, well I'm new to DBD but my parents aren't brother and sister, I know what camping is. I've played a bit of both sides and I've kind of noticed some things. Again, newb, tell me where and how I am wrong here please. And that's not sarcasm, seriously, help me understand what I don't understand.
Example one here. I played Michael earlier. We were on the map with the cornfield. I ended up killing all four only because right before survivor 4 escaped I had this like, kill the last survivor thing and I downed him and killed him. Between the beginning-end of match, the second person I killed I "tunneled" but it wasn't intentional. What happened was I had one person dead (no idea why they didn't unhook, I wasn't camping on her) I found survivor two, had level three of Michael's stalk thing, so I stabbed him in the back, hooked him. I went off to check another generator, but half way to it I heard that explosion, and I knew okay well I just hooked someone, probably two people over there. I turn around, I see both. Before I could establish a chase, the Asian girl like dipped out into the corn and I didn't know where she went because there was no red things, but the person I had hooked was still visible to me, so I literally chased the person I saw. Wasn't personal, wasn't like oh it's him let's git em' cleetus! I just... that's who I found. So I stab him, hook him, he dies. Post-match I get this long, profanity driven message about how I am a f* this and that, and tunneling is for f*s and kill myself and blah blah. So where's the line? And again, these are honest questions from a new player. Am I supposed to ignore someone because I just hooked them? That seems kind of counter-productive to my role as MM? I mean it wasn't a thing it's just who this newb saw, the other survivor lost me. Was I in the wrong, what exactly is the etiquette here? I can't let someone escape and get less points because I'm new and I mostly suck (but getting better hopefully) for now and one person lost me while the other is leaving blood behind.
The other thing I wanted to discuss, and this is really what I really want to hear from the community on, is I played a couple games of survivor too. I joined queue, and these randoms invited me to a party. I was like okay, I'm always friendly (my nickname is literally "Happy") I like team work, I'll join this party for this match. So we're playing I am repairing a generator, and (coincidentally) MM scares the everything out of me by grabbing me suddenly. Didn't even hear music or anything but the party explained why. I get hooked, get freed, escape, game carries on. My party tells me as one of them goes down "crouch in front of Michael" I'm like what why? They told me it's a thing, it makes it so he can't walk or hang her and stuff. I'm like that sounds kinda sh**y I don't want to do that. Well they kicked me from the party for that lol, but I'm not an exploit guy and that sounds like some stanky bs? Is that like a thing, or is it genuinely some stanky bs? Because again, def seems the latter. A little later in the match MM was chasing me and we were on the map with the busted up bus. So I'm running and I get a vault prompt by the bus so I vault and I wait a sec to see what MM does. He walks around, and then I just vaulted back and ran. So I'm running, I have played enough games to know I should loop and dip when possible so I do that, I get away again. He killed like one of us, the rest of us myself included survived. Another match, the Samurai place, looped the hillbilly for days before he finally nabbed me because too new to the map to know where to dip out. But that brings me to question two:
I watched the Q and A, and I've seen all the posts on forums in the last couple days since I signed up. People really hate camping and tunneling for understandable reasons. I totally get it and while not defending it I see kind of a one sided discussion here. In my admittedly brief experience playing DBD it seems there's two sides to this coin, am I wrong? What I mean is it sucks to be focused or camped, had both more than once in learning to play. But like, it sucks to be looped too.
It seems like both sides have their "annoying" but not exploitative thing they lean on. I've seen killers focus and camp, and I've seen survivors loop, and heal, and flashlight, and toolbox, and that stab you in the face thing I got on Lori Strode, and teabag (don't be that person), and like not leave through the gates even though they open because they want to troll, and what I still think should be removed, the crouch thing that's dumb. I won't do it and I guess if that makes me bad, I'm bad because again, seems sh**y y'all and not going to. So it seems to this very new, very not-good-at-this-game new player like killers are being throttled for tunneling and camping but everyone seems to ignore all the rest. I guess what do the devs say about focusing on one person and camping? It's all gameplay right? So and AGAIN just asking honestly, I really do want the answer/discussion, what makes camping focusing on one different than me looping someone for 40 seconds and then getting away because the school bus is so big they can't see over it and as long as I don't run it's just "K bye"?
Looping right, is a part of the game, it's intended, you should do it, I should do it, like we should all do it. So why is there this outrage for this strategy to kill one person so that's one less person fixing generators or available to rescue, but only the killers seem to get stones thrown their way on the forums. I don't focus intentionally because I was told it's a no-no, and I like to be nice. I don't troll or grief, again "Happy" but again and again it seems like there is this annoying thing on both sides but only one makes people freak out and get all ragey?
So inform upon this new player please?
Comments
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I do not think someone is going to read this.
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I read about half then gave up, you are right tunneling is when you tunnel vision that only survivor.
Camping is when the killer is on the same map as the survivors.
Jokes aside, ignore any hateful comments that people do to you, you play to win and have fun, but yeah you will get hateful comments if you tunnel and camp, what I do is hook someone, then someone else and if the first survivor that was hooked comes towards the save I just slug right away.
And welcome to the DBD community, see you in the fog.
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For starters, there are no downvotes on this forum, so everyone's opinion gets heard equally (as long as they can express it civilly) 😊 Also, this is going to be long, but judging by your OP I'm guessing you don't mind long posts!
Tunnelling
First, definitions. Tunnelling does come from the expression "tunnel-vision". You will find people with many different definitions of it, but as far as I'm concerned, tunnelling is going after the survivor who has just been unhooked, period. In my experience, most people who say that X is tunnelling but Y isn't because of the circumstances say that because they associate the word with unsportsmanlike behaviour, and wish to distance themselves from that connotation by using "tunnelling" as a term to distinguish between behaviour they consider acceptable and behaviour they don't. (For example, "it's only tunnelling if there are other survivors around and you choose to do it anyway" or "it's not tunnelling if it's the end of the game", or even "tunnelling is a word survivors made up to shame killers".) The conclusion I have come to is that definitionally, chasing a survivor off hook is always tunnelling regardless of circumstances, some forms of tunnelling are simply more widely acceptable than others.
Which brings me to the next point, "where is the line"? The answer is everyone has a different line, so practically speaking, there isn't one. Dead by Daylight doesn't really have anything which is universally agreed-upon enough to be considered an honour code. Some survivors won't have a problem with you tunnelling regardless of circumstances (though they will likely appreciate a bit of mercy if you care to offer it), some will only be okay with it if it's during endgame or if there was no one else around (as in your case), and some will genuinely expect you to pretend they're not there if they've just been unhooked, no matter what.
My advice to you is this: you can't please everyone, so play how you want to play. Tunnelling is a valid and usually quite effective strategy, but it can feel pretty crappy for the survivor on the receiving end. If you want to employ it for strategic reasons regardless, go for it. If you would rather avoid it out of kindness, that's okay as well. The important thing to remember, in either case, is that it's completely up to you. If you sacrifice a strategic advantage to be nice, that's your decision, and if you choose to capitalise on that advantage instead, no one should make you feel bad about it because there's nothing wrong with playing optimally as long as you stay within the official rules. If someone does cross the line into outright verbal abuse, as happened in your example above, feel free to report them for it. This is not only my perspective, but the official one held by the developers from everything I've seen and heard (as you yourself will have seen in the most recent stream when they discussed camping).
Exploits
What you're describing certainly sounds like an illegal exploit, but there are some things in the game that are technically "exploits", in the sense that they work by taking full advantage of a particular mechanic, but aren't against the rules because they have been officially endorsed. Looping, which exploits the survivors' smaller collision box to maximise chase length, is one such example. 'Window tech', which exploits the killer's limited FOV and collision mechanics while vaulting, is another. In order to determine which one this is, you might need to give us a bit more information. When your team asked you to crouch in front of the killer, was this while he was carrying or hooking the survivor, or while she was still on the ground? If the latter, were you asked to crouch on top of her? What position was she and/or the killer in (e.g. in a corner, on a hill)?
Annnoying Tactics
You are completely right about annoying tactics existing on both sides, and in general the ire around them is due to a lack of empathy. This is true both in the sense that people who only main one side sometimes don't understand why things like camping, tunnelling, looping, blinding etc. can often be necessary for strategic reasons, and also in the sense that often something looks or feels very different from your opponent's perspective than it does from yours. For example, as you pointed out earlier, a survivor may feel like they're being singled out when in reality, the killer simply couldn't find anyone else to chase.
In my experience, the idea that killers get more stones thrown at them boils down to two things: firstly, it's not very true in general, especially on the forums, but it may feel that way to someone who identifies more with the killer side due to cognitive bias; and second, to the extent that it is true, the reason would be that overall there are more survivor mains in the community at large than killer mains, given the game's 4:1 ratio and the fact that survivor is the only role you can play with friends in a public match.
As far as I'm personally concerned, as I've said, everything is acceptable as long as it's not against the rules. However, there are a couple of reasons why people who do believe that camping and tunnelling are less justified than looping feel that way, outside of simple entitlement.
Firstly, scoring: a survivor who gets camped or tunnelled to death will likely depip with very few bloodpoints earned, while a killer who gets looped all match will probably come out not well, but better, particularly since killers tend to earn more bloodpoints than survivors overall.
Secondly, responsibility: if a killer is so determined to get a particular survivor out of the match that they will camp and tunnel them to death, there's not a whole lot that survivor can do about it beyond delaying the inevitable, unless they're unusually skillful. Chases as killer tend to be a lot more about outplaying your opponent, so if a killer gets looped all game, it has a lot more to do with their relative lack of skill than being facecamped does for a survivor.
Thirdly, necessity. A good killer can win games consistently without needing to use tactics like camping and tunnelling to do it. Looping, on the other hand, is an absolute necessity for survivors, because survivor gameplay at its essence is about wasting enough of the killer's time that the generators can get repaired and the gates opened before everyone dies, and looping is not only the most effective, but close to the only way to do that.
I hope I covered everything - let me know if you have any more questions, and good luck in your future games!
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You can't please anyone in dbd, so just play the game, have fun, ignore the hate and report it if necessary. :)
If you weren't tunneling intentionally, they're just gonna accuse you of it anyway.
If you kick a gen that's nearby the hook they're on, you're gonna get called a camper.
Now if you go out of your way to tunnel and camp, then it's a negative reflection on your skill. But if you didn't, you didn't and it's their problem. Their teammate should've stuck around for a protection hit or used Borrowed Time.
What I usually do to make it fair, is if someone is unhooked and I find them first, i just slug them and go look for someone else rather than hook them twice. However if they were t-bagging and constantly blinding with flashlight, being toxic etc... then I re-hook them. They'll just be a pest later. :)
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Tunneling is basically as you described it. Going after nobody else the whole game. Anyone who says otherwise is either salty or misinformed. Slugging (leaving them in dying after they got off the hook) isn't tunneling. Trying to secure a last kill by attacking the injured person isn't tunneling. Getting DS'ed does not necessarily mean you tunneled. Seeing someone who was just unhooked, nobody else. and attacking, is not tunneling.
Camping comes in 2 forms in this game because everyone has to complain about something. Face camping (standing in the hooked person's LOS and not going anywhere else purely to tunnel/ get someone else on hook) and proxycamping (patrolling nearby objectives and a hook when someone's hooked). In some situations it's ok to do these (I mean, it's ok to do them whenever, there's always gonna be someone angry they couldn't have escaped), mostly when you just want one last kill in the endgame or there's definitely someone nearby. Ignore any comments that come your way about you tunneling or camping because it's probably not true
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First and foremost I appreciate the civil discourse in all the responses. Much love. ✌🏼❣️
The exploit question. I threw some different phrases into Google/YT and pretty sure they were asking me to "hooktech". Definitely not my thing whether exploit or gameplay.
To the thing about how you tunnel or camp when they're toxic. I've definitely been tempted but manged to restrain myself. I'm just... That guy ya know? I try to always be friendly and helpful, civil and non-toxic. It's just me. But for *real* I'm tempted sometimes man. I've run into both really chill friendly players and quite the opposite which of course is to be expected in any community. But some of the more toxic folks it has definitely crossed my mind like no matter what happens you won't get to leave here lol.
I feel the play for fun thing too. I believe in live and let live, to each their own.
So again, appreciate the civil dialogue here. And thanks for the info/discussion.
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Yeah, hook tech is an exploit - I'm not sure you can get banned for it, but it certainly wasn't intended by the developers. I'm surprised though, because I was pretty sure it got patched out recently. I wasn't sure if you were talking about bodyblocking, which is a perfectly legitimate strategy that the killer can play around, similar to things like looping or camping.
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In no way did I mean "go out of your way to tunnel", I'm just saying if it's an extremely toxic person that just got unhooked and I coincidentally find them moments after, I won't hesitate if they're the only person in site to re-hook. Lol.
As a survivor main I'm definitely against camping and tunneling, as it just unfairly ruins someone's experience.
But if you coincidentally find the same person, it happens. Just knock em down and go find someone else. :)
It slows gen progression immensely because someone has to go help them, and you can find another person and slow the progression further by downing/hooking the new person, all without tunneling. 👍️
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lol I know man and I don't do it. But I for sure get tempted. Some survivors are so toxic it's really blood-warming. The online community, like the forums, everyone gives the impression this community is pretty solid. I choose to hold onto that thought. But I am so unlucky and get a good game here or there, but most of the time it's like if I don't kill all four, even three, the messages, the tb'ing, the standing by exit refusing to move. It's a salt shaker. =/
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Hey so your right so far about what your saying with tunneling and camping also it's fine if hes the only one around then go for it also let me give you a quick list of tunnel something I put together it will give you a good idea of tunneling so theres 3 types of tunneling in my opinion theres the no no tunneling which you shouldn't do that's when you ignore all other survivors and go after one for no reason then theres the one you did which is I kill what I see tunneling this is when you only see that one survivor when no one else is near so your clearly free to attack him since that's the game injured or not then theres the click click your dead tunneling this is when theres this one ahole on the team that constantly follows you and clicks a flash light to get your attention like your some kind of dog in that situation just focus them and kill them first since there clearly asking for your attention and being a dck plus better to show them you mean business than to let them continue to piss about behind you
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