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Why DS shouldn't work with lockers.
I agree with the fact that DS should discourage tunneling as it is an anti tunnel perk.
And before anyone quotes the guy who said otherwise, he was talking about old DS with no requirement of getting hooked.
The reason DS shouldn't work in lockers is simply that it doesn't have effective couterplay, yes you should leave them alone, but by leaving them alone you are letting them go off and do whatever and they is physically nothing you can do yo stop them other than eating the DS and chasing. You can try to bait them to leave but a smart survivor would know that they don't need to leave since if the killer doesn't want to eat the DS they basically have invincibility for the next 60 seconds.
And that's the problem also the problem that eating DS wouldn't be as bad if the time wasn't still set so high because of enduring. They made it 5 seconds because enduring used to cut it in half. So if it was any lower enduring basicallu fully countered it, but now that enduring doesn't effect the stun it has no reason to be that high.
The easiest change to the perk would be to make it a true anti tunnel perk. The best idea I saw was to have the timer be reduced to 30 maybe even 15 seconds, but have the timer pause in chase and while on the ground. If you are being tunneled you obviously get into chase so it would truly counter tunneling. And it would do it even better because if you run the killer for 3 min and get downed they still get the DS because they tunneled.
But that is just my opinion, a DbD opinion.
Comments
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i want bugs and hitboxes fixed before i can trust bhvr to make balance changes
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While I don't think that DS should work on grabs on any kind as you shouldn't be getting grabbed during its duration and if you do the killer deserves the hook.
That being said DS being infinite while on the ground would mean killers could be put in situations where the last survivor on the ground has DS so for the killer to have a 100% chance of a 4k they'd leave the survivor to bleedout for the whole duration as picking them up would result in DS going off a potentially losing a kill for no reason.
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If someone with "We'll Make It" saves someone from a hook, they often will heal them immediately. If you then turn around and try to tunnel them, they should still have the opportunity to DS you.
Additionally, if you are basement camping and someone comes and saves someone else, you should be able to DS to unhook another survivor. It's not the survivor's fault you decided to try and basement camp.
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I don't understand you problem with DS, it does only work 60 seconds, after the person is unhooked, that means that you need to tunnel the person pretty bad, if you get to eat the DS, because most of the time, if you don't camp you will not down the person within the next 60 seconds after he was unhooked, becuase he will probably start to run, after he is unhooked. If you have such a big problem with DS just go for the person who unhooked the hooked Person, he does not have DS activated normally.
And Lockers are pretty much the only thing that survivors can do against being sluged because the killer is afraid of eating DS.
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I think you underestimate the ability of killers to get downs. There have been literal countless situations where I have gone after the person who unhooked, hooked them, then found the guy who was unhooked, downed them and still gotten DSed. I didn't tunnel and still got punished. That shouldnt happen. Or the situation of the person unhooking in front of the killer without borrowed time. Of course im gonna down the dude who just got unhooked, but im gonna leave them there and chase their friend to create more pressure.
Also, survivors should rely on their teammates to help them when slugged. I don't think slugging is really a problem. Its actually the same reason why I think camping isn't a problem. Usually the only reason people get camped is they either pissed off the killer or their team is too close to them so the killer has no reason to leave, so in that situation camping is the correct play to make.
With slugging, you might see an opportunity to down a person, then chase their friend. Slugging is supposed to be the counterplay to DS. If the survivors make a dumb unhook, you down the guy the correct play to make is to leave him there and chase the other guy. The survivor jumping into the locker removes any counter play to the perk and literally makes the survivor invincible until the timer fades. And as stated before, the stun time on DS is about a second longer than it should be because of old Enduring.
When the survivor jumps into the locker they aren't avoiding being tunneled, they are using DS as a weapon against the killer. If they were actually being tunneled the killer would pick them up even if they downed them normally. Them jumping into the locker is them knowing that if they don't the killer wont pick them up, and if that is the case... are they really being tunneled? If the killer leaves then someone can go pick them up and they weren't tunneled, if the killer just stands there and waits out the timer, well same reason as camping, either they pissed off the killer or its the correct play to make.
TL DR: Jumping in a locker is the survivor realizing that they aren't being tunneled but they want to use DS anyway, which isn't what the perk is meant to do and doesn't fit thematically or design wise.
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That is a good point, maybe only a slight extension on the timer while on the ground, or heck maybe even just let it tick because if the killer is tunneling they wouldn't leave them on the ground to pick up later.
Another idea I herd is the perk instantly deactivates if interacting with anything like a gen, healing, unhooking, or stuff like that. Because if you have time to do that you aren't being tunneled.
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I don't agree coz liturally it does not madder what you do, you always piss of the killer. Like I get camped often, becuase I had a good chaise, or I was gen rushing to hard, or because I carrie a flashlight, there are soooooooo many reasons, why the people are camping me. What shall I do about that? Stand still so the killer can just kill me? Not touch any gens, chests or any other things in the game? Should I not use my flashlight, coz I don't want to piss him off? I liturally don't understand those players. And again DS are just 60 seconds that is not that much of a problem if you don't camp. When I ran DS I had pretty much never the oportunity to use it, becuase the killer just left me on the ground, so if something they should buff it, becuase it is just annoying if you get punished for your team mates dumb activites.
And slugging is a pretty big problem in my eyes, because it takes away this time for the survivors, to finish their action and go for the safe and those people near the slugged person are in danger, because they also do not have the time to get away or hide, or whatever because the killer is just gonna go for them after he downed the first Person. The other Problem with this is, even if you pick a person up, the killer does know where he left him usually and comes back to slug him again, in worst case he even sees the peron who just picked him up and followes this person, then there are two persons slugged. I liturally don't enjoy slugging rounds at all. I understand if you slug like at the end, because you don't want the last person to get the hatch or whatever, but if somebody slugs the whole match it is just annoying to play against and it makes no fun.
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Git gud and stop tunnel, simple
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So.......Adrenaline activating while the killer has NOED should automatically cancel DS.
Yeah..............................................
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If they go into the locker with DS active, what does it matter? Even if they were not in a locker they would still have the DS for you to eat.
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just want to write the same thing. Killers that complain about locker ds are just mad cause they cant tunnle and slug survivors off the hook.
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Well if the survivor goes in a locker just leave them and find someone else, even with your idea for ds u'll still have to eat it if u are chasing them. "theres no effective counterplay to it" yes there is, leave them alone and find another survivor at this point complaining about ds is just laughable if the survivor is in a locker they are not doing anything and are being useless, when they leave it u can find them and slug them, if they don't leave it thats 60 sec wasted for the team. Ds is annoying yes i know how u chase someone u hook them u go back down that person and still get ds'd cuz u "tunneled" but thats how it works and well maybe they'll change it some day but saying theres no counterplay to it is just wrong. And most killers who tunnel will just eat it and tunnel u no matter what so it doesn't rly work even as an anti tunnel atm but u want to make the stun even less as if 5 seconds isn't already low. Its a yet another 2nd chance perk that punishes scumbags that tunnel off hook and best way to avoid it is to just slug the unhooked person thats about it. Bigger issue is how it combos with other perks like unbreakable and now soul guard, these perks should be made so they don't work together (for example if soul guard only worked when someone else picks u up). But ds as a perk on its own is not a big thread the combo potential it has is a bigger problem for me
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Btw. I just played a match, with 3 DS's and all of them used it with the locker technic, but still it was by FAR one of the intensesest matches I played in a long time, it was just super fun, and even if it could change something, it just made it more exciting, coz it was not super easy becuase of that
I really don't want it to be changed
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I don't agree with this idea, based on how killer's can lose chase if they look away from the survivors for sometime. Just like with play with your food, killers can chase your blood trails and scratch marks without even looking towards you and not being in a chase. This is a big disadvantage and not helpful at all if the timer is set to 15/30 seconds. However if the timer is set to 60 second, then it can make it hard for the killer to do this look away tech. and also get rid of the locker ds tech.
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You've made Billy, Bubba, Oni, Trapper, Mikey, Ird. Head Huntress, RPF Clown, Ghost Face sad :(
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Nope, what if you have adrenaline and your teammate saves your ass and you run to the 99% gen to pop it so you can get out. Imagine if your whole team is being slugged, you 4% off the hook to heal your teammates. Imagine if the killer slugged everyone and now all your teammate are hooked and you 4% off the hook and run to save your teammates.
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