New players should absolutely NOT be matched with Vets. New player base will be kill..
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I never once said anything about old ruin. This is to keep old players from deranking and beating the hell out of new players by dc'ing enough until you get full potatoes every match. I'm glad they introduced MMR. Maybe it'll keep me from getting potatoes who UE around the map at Rank 1 who don't do gens. It'll be better in the long run but no one wants to wait. It's like the chapter updates and everyone rushes to complain within 39 seconds. Chill out and wait.
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Well, blame the devs for all things that you don't like like everyone else then. I love the new MMR. I'm starting to get actual matches around my level. You don't like what I have to say then there is nothing else for me to say. It was great talking to you. You take care.
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So now your perk loadout determines whether you're skilled or not. Brilliant idea, you're a real genius!
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to get multiple purple perks they have obviously played more than the brown rank would suggest. congrats you learned you are just average like most humans, and thats ok
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the one person had at least 3 survivors over the rank 35..... think about that for one second....
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Im just sitting here like, now everybody sees what xbox was dealing with
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lol that other post said you were shilling for the devs, I'd have to agree.
They stated '10 games' its been more than 10 games.
Also I know you never said anything about old ruin. But I'm suspecting that you come under that 'willful ignorance' I mentioned.
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Your loadout has nothing to do with your skill and the perks that were used in that screenshot can be unlocked in a few hours of playtime.
Playing the game (and therefore "having perks") doesn't necessarily equals "being skilled". I see people with several hundred hours of playtime and most perks unlocked that play like potatoes that never even managed to reach Rank 10 on any role. Then I see players with 15 hours of playtime that already reached Rank 1 with no perks whatsoever.
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Yeah. I'd say you seem to want to try and pick a fight and accuse people of stupid stuff because you disagree with them. I'm sorry that I won't get in a fight with you. You take care of your own thoughts. I'm free to make my own opinions and thoughts of things but you don't see me accusing you of this and that. I make a point and go on it. I don't suck up to anyone, especially you. Take care.
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Not entirely.
Survivors share their MMR. Meaning you won't get easier killer if you play a survivor for the first time. This is because Survivors are basically only skins.
Killers will have each their own MMR but as far as I understood, you will put against easier survivor (lower MMR) if you play a killer for the first time or not playing that killer often. But easier doesn't automatically mean you get close to lowest possible MMR. Let's say someone having 1k hours in the game as solely playing killer (and doing pretty good at it) and a new killer is coming out which the person jumps on trying. That person will get easier opponents - but not newbies. That makes no sense and it's nowhere stated as far as I read. It only says easier. Let's use the ranks for an easy example: Playing Huntress on a Rank 1 level but never played Nurse. With Nurse you have now Rank 8-10 opponents the first match.
The paragraph where they mentioned that can be misleading but I don't read anywhere that they say that they will put newbies against someone when they playing a killer for the first time (if the killer has a high MMR on any other killer). I mean it wouldn't make sense to begin with as there is the factor basic gameknowledge to take into consideration. Noone playing at high skill level would play at newbie lv with a killer the never tried before. They still would do pretty decent even if they play the new killer without their power and only as a m1-killer, because they know how to loop, how to apply pressure, etc.
There is one instance where you would get legitimately matched with a rank 20 and that would be if someone was at a high MMR and then stopped playing. Their rank would go down, the MMR not though.
This said, the system is nowhere close to have enough knowledge thus far, that's why unfair matchmaking is happening. This should resolve itself the next weeks IF they got a decently programmed MMR-System.
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What it feels like to me is the game is finding it hard to match me with people of my level or there isnt enough space and the game just throws me to the rank 20's just to give me a match lol I'd rather wait for a match then play with yellow ranks, just unfair.
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That reach.
I don't see a voice of reason fyi.
I see a biased take that looks to reinforce their own belief system.
But yea, lets call it starting a fight.
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Well that's easy to identify.
How are queue times before relative to now?
My queue times were fine before, with no noticeable difference now to before. The only difference is that my games have gone to trash.
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That's the beauty of discussions. You can form whatever opinion you want, whether it be right or wrong. I'm far from biased. I've met biased people. You can't reason with them no matter what. I've talked to a few killers and survivors who I've agreed with and disagreed with. You are welcome to think whatever you like but when you insinuate, that causes conflict and I stay out of it.
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You said you'd stay out of it last time.
Stop shilling for the devs.
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Shilling? Eh, who cares. I think I'm better off just blocking you.
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And btw just because you experienced all that ######### doesn't make it acceptable, that just highlights the reoccurring problem.
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Ebony mori, tunneled off hook, rank 20 survivors, and noed just in case because i'm bad.
I don't blame them.
At least play a killer with good mori, not the worst one.
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Please do, because your generic talking points mean nothing.
'Good people should be rewarded, bad people should be punished'
Well yes ofc but
- Who decides who is good/bad?
- Who decides what the rewards/punishments should be?
It's easy to make the above statement, just like it easy to toe the line 'because the devs said so'.
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Sorry I may have misunderstood and you may be right but I seen this in the new matchmaking description:
"The next phase that you will notice goes live with the upcoming mid-chapter update: We are no longer allowing Killers to switch their character while searching for a match, or once in a lobby (excluding Custom Matches). This will allow the new Matchmaking System to track player skill with each killer individually and match them against more appropriately skilled opponents based on their killer selection."
That is where my confusion is maybe because with each MMR being based on each individual killer and not the overall player then wouldn't a lets say Rank 1 killer main trying a new killer get the lowest MMR rating for the individual killer and get placed in a pool possibly with new survivors?
I mean I totally agree with everything you say but if we are ignore ranks now and only going based on MMR then for example lets say I dominate and always 4k with Hag and Myers and legion. I play for maybe 400 hours give or take and now I change killers to Trapper. The MMR system might say wow he has no knowledge of this killer and yes give me easier opponents but they could also pair me with newbies who just started survivor because the system is looking at just the Trappers MMR and not the overall knowledge as a killer.
I agree though it is still to early to tell but I am hoping for the best.
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As I continually say, welcome to the testers programs, we are all lab mice.
These updates are large scale beta tests and we are the testers,.... systems like this cannot be tested on 100 people in the studio, they need real world trials as part of the testing and this is how its done.
The moment you understand that you wont be triggered by these crazy patches dumped on you disturbing your daily game play.
Can we get "Im a beta tester" stickers?
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Killers might as well get used to tough games..
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I honestly feel like the values in this MMR system is reversed. Experienced killers shouldn't be matched against beginners and vice versa.
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Yes, each individual killer will have their own MMR. I do hope though that they will take e.g. your highest MMR of all killer into consideration when you try out a new one and just lower that by some rating. Or maybe an average rating over your most often played killer.
In an optimal instance, someone who is skilled with a specific killer has a MMR related to that. Currently it seems to be ######### up because the playerbase need to land at their destined MMR. It was said they collected enough data beforehand but with so many threads related to this subject and me watching streamer to get not matched with equally skilled opponents/teammates (consistently - not just ~10 Matches) it is kinda hard to believe.
I guess all we can do is wait for the system to learn.
Additionally it was said in the Q&A that they will change the matching algorithm so 4000h player won't be matched with 20h player, as it's happening a lot apparenlty atm.
All in all they should have been a little bit more informative about this MMR system beforehand as people are not satisfied right now - which is totally understandable. The system might be good but it feels like they should have collected more data beforehand as it doesn't seem it was sufficient.
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This is after 20 to 30 games since the new system and still getting Rank 1 killers just sweeping games. My last 3 games all have been less than 5 minutes because the killer just eats these new players.
I do know that it is still early but Rank 1 people normally are rank 1 because they not only are good buy play enough to stay Ranked. I really hope they put into account the killers highest MMR on their most used killer or else this could be the new norm. The Rank 1 killer picks a killer they never used like Pig and then get matched with players like this because their MMR with Pig is the lowest and the do not look at the higher MMR of the other characters. I keep looking at the article and even what you said and you both are right they Rank your MMR PER killer and it looks like they do not look at your overall MMR so getting high ranked players using a new killer down here with us little people.
I am gonna continue to try and give it time but so far after my many many games I am still getting matched with killers who clear the game or when I play killer survivors who make me the prey. lol
I really hope you are right but at the moment I may switch to another game while these higher rank players finally get placed where they belong because I am tired of trying to both save newbs and do gens against killers even I can't handle.
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rip new players.
i hope it starts working right because when your play killer and you feel bad for winning something wrong
same with survivor if you get out with your 3 other teammate and then feel bad something wrong.
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Oh I know that feeling. I hate when we are all at the gate and I can tell the killer is new and I may have made them hate playing killer now. I have let a few kill me just for the feeling they did good.
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that nice but this needs a fix or something or were never get new player to stay.
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Good question. I believe having total hours in game as all killers, both survivor & killer and player level should carry a weight as well. The only time when a rank 20-17 survivor should be going against a killer with a collective 250+ total in-game hours or more is if the are playing with a swf team.
I'm a huge fan of killers having individual mmr's but there are other things that need to be initially taken into account. While 'hours played' is not an indicator of skill it 'should' bring along with it an inherent understanding of fundamental gameplay mechanics that those lesser ranks have not grasped yet.
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I believe they're doing a change with something in mind to help newer players now.
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Oh I 100% agree! I mean I am a old player and am taking a break now from the game because I am hoping the high skilled high ranked players rank themselves out of my matches. I know they say rank doesnt matter but it does because it shows the person plays a lot in the very least and has basic knowledge or at least more knowledge then the rank 20 possibly.
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Let's be honest. If the excessive grind and the devs outright refusal to remedy it doesn't scare new players away, nothing will.
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This surely sucks a lot. If I take in consideration how much I play the game, 20-30 matches would take me probably 2 weeks. In case of survivor probably 2 month LOL as I barely play survivor at all.
With those results it is pretty hard to believe that they collected data for some time. All those threads where people complain about consistent failed matching which are stomps. All those streamer who are mostly matched with people who have close to no playtime. It feels like we hit a hard rank reset where every player starts anew.
I definitely feel so sorry about new players. Started to play recently with my sister (really only a few matches), but with the current MMR system I don't want to even ask her if she wants to play because she struggles with the game already enough as it is. She is not a person who is calm about unfairness and if we happen to get a high rank killer, she would instantly stop playing - not that I would blame her.
I really hope they will improve the system ASAP because as the feedback currently stands it is not working as intended...
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What I want to know is, why, before Tuesday, I was consistently matching against people who seemed to be of relatively similar skill to me, and since then, every single game has looked like this or worse.
I have a grand total of 25 hours logged on this game, and the bulk of that is on Survivor because I have friends who got me into the game. I have probably less than ten killer games in total. And, frankly, I'm probably done with it until something gets adjusted, because not a single killer match has actually been particularly fun since the matchmaking changes went live.
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What if the person doesn't HAVE people to practice in KYF with? I can say from experience, the new player experience in this game is grueling as #########. I started over 3 years ago and there were so many times I wanted to quit, esp as I was playing completely solo back then. I stuck around, but I can completely understand if a new player didn't want to, DBD is a baby player stomping ground. Playing with and against people with hundred if no thousands of experience to your tens of hours, not the mention the flaming you get for not knowing what the hell to do, it's hella unfun.
The in-game tutorial could honestly use a LOT of work, esp if a person has to rely on youtube to learn basic mechanics of the game. Where's the in-game flashlight tutorial? The tutorial about survivor and killer add-ons (not what they do, but how to equip them, as stupid as it sounds that does stump a LOT of new players), about equipping offerings? The tutorial on how to equip perks??? How about where to FIND the Shrine? There's nothing I can see in the tutorial about killers who don't have a terror radius (aka Tier 1 Mikey), or about how certain perks can take AWAY or lower terror radius or the red stain? What about Doctor and his Clones? Madness? How THAT can affect the terror radius and stain? What about how when the doc shocks you you can't drop pallets or vault windows, and that that's NOT a bug but an intended feature? Like there's SO much that can frustrate and stump new players that's just not covered, that they may think is a bug or someone hacking, when it's really just a feature of the game.
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I'm getting sick of being matched against sweaty red ranks as killer. It's really ruining my fun. I don't want to go up against people who just constantly gen rush or go around slamming pallets because they have no ability to do anything else.
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Ah, that's a better way to explain the situation. I'm so used to those that I honestly forgot that new players probably don't know about them. They should update the tutorial and just give basic versions of different powers so they understand.
I learned flashlights, loops, tiles and builds from YouTube videos. It's my go-to when I want to learn something on a game. It's how I get guides for achievements and such. I know the starting of DBD is harsh. I've explained this already. I had to endure it to get better when I started. I've been through a lot, learning the game and how to survive longer.
It's not always fun. For either side. There was streamers who would make content based upon deranking and bullying new players. Yes, it's not easy for new players but the playerbase is a bit different than awhile back. I would assume that YouTubers and Twitch Streamers don't make content on Rank 15s-20s anymore. They're more helpful and try to allow them a chance to live.
When I started, there was none of that. You got caught, face camped and that was it. No rescue was possible. Yes, the game has changed a lot since then but acting like new players are fragile and will quit after being killed is silly. I got mad back then because I waited 30 minutes to an hour for a match just to be face camped for a minute and 30 seconds as soon as I was seen. THAT wasn't fun.
I don't think the current playerbase (majority) will bully and just obliterate new players if they act clueless. I can guarantee not everyone will do that. That's my issue. Yes, you will die a lot as a new survivor and your chance of being face camped as a new survivor by a new killer is super high. That's how people play when they're new.
At least people are not deranking to obliterate newbies for content. MMR is definitely not accurate right now. Something is wrong with it. Seems to be backwards. Your mains get newbies and the killers you rarely play gets the ranks that you should be getting. I've noticed this today. It seems to be reversed.
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lol I would not blame her for quitting as well. Also it was not easy playing that many matches but I did it hoping it would help but still having horrible matches to the point instead of getting mad I will just take a break. I am hoping in time the high rank players will once again rank enough to get themselves to the spot where they are once again playing against people their level.
I also overlooked the fact they said they have been collecting data prior to this release. I guess not much data if this is still an issue after several games.
I hope you are your sister have better luck than I am having because I was almost rank 9 but lost so many ranks trying to save new players and getting killed on my first hook. I know rank doesnt matter but in the end it does because it in the very least tells us this person has played the game and has more knowledge than this other player.
Goodluck to you and your sister and I hope when she does play with you that you both get killers that are more her level. =)
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I do not blame you and I am doing the same. I am taking a long break until the system either works and move these high rank players where they belong or they just go back to the basic rank system. I never had this much trouble with the normal rank system as I am with this new horrible system. Good luck to you and I hope in your future games you have better luck. =)
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Thanks! I really hope it will work out :)
I am amazed you pulled through the matches to be honest. I probably would have given up (or went on killer). But I am not enjoying survivor really unless I have someone to talk to while playing.
Guess your patience also was there because you haven't read about the data collection beforehand.
Good luck to you too that it will be better for you after a break!
Btw it is nice to see such friendly posts on the forum :D
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Thank you for the kind words and I am a really patient person but the only problem is even I have my limits. I decided to try a couple games today figuring maybe I was overreacting and I only snapped a pic of one but this is how it has been going for 3 games in a row:
I do not get how someone can be Rank 1 even now meaning they have played more than others and still so "NEW" to a killer they think their skill level is on par with us grays. I mean I am shocked we got 3 gens done but that is more about the map being big then our skill.
I hope they fix this soon. I honestly think they may just delete the ranks we see now so we cannot complain and think its us instead of bad pairing. I mean if they delete the fact I could see Rank 1 I would not be able to prove this was a mismatch. lol
Also I have to say right back at you about it being refreshing to meet such a nice person. I hope things get better and I am happy to hear about siblings playing games together. My husbands plays with me but not this game. His reflexes are not the best so he just like watching me play. lol
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I genuinely think this MMR system was designed without any context for DbD. Like they had someone with zero knowledge of DbD design this. Two rank 20s and two rank 2s may very well be an ideal match from an MMR standpoint, but that's absolutely horrendous for an actual game of DbD. This isn't fun. The games are horrible.
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i don't play like i use to i play other games,i almost just play for the daily then i'm done.
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That sucks, that the games were not improving for you.
Removing to see the rank might be an option, but in the end people can still ask in endgamechat which rank they were. Additional to that they could check the playtime if profile is not set to private or playtime is hidden (I think this is possible on other platforms than steam too but it's only a guess). But you are right, that seeing the rank in endscreen can set people off with no effort. And to be fair, in 99% of the cases I would guess that a Rank 1 won't be a good match with Rank 12-20. One exception would be my bf for exampe who played on a high skill lv on both sides and hasn't touched the game in ages (aka deranked)..if he were to pick it up again he probably would have no problem to play again at that level. But I doubt there are too many of such cases.
I actually am only concerned about the killer rank 1 achievement in the future as I collected quite some recently and thought I wanna go for that as well finally. If they remove the emblemsystem it might be unachievable. I might have to start the grind now. I play killer normally quite casually as I am not playing too much. Anyway, this is only a selfish thought I had while reading ^^
Back to topic, I really do hope that they will fix this too. Far too many people are not getting matched properly. I read also some posts were the system seems to work, but they seem to be more rare than mismatching. One could say that those who are getting matched properly have no reason to come to the forum and complain, but well...doesn't really excuse that many mismatches either way.
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I do not blame you for having some selfish thoughts. I mean heck why not take advantage while the game is at its most broken point to get some of the killer achievements done. Do what you can while you can. =)
I also would like to say I did finally have one match that was a little more balanced but also made me super mad. This time they went the complete other way. They placed me with a entire team of players who no joke were throwing pallets down just because they could with no killer around. They could not do a gen to save our lives. I mean no joke they popped my gen so many times my 90% gen ended up back to half.
Then on my last gen a new survivor slowly crawls over to the gen jumps on it pops it 3 times then leaves ONLY as I leave. I think okay I will let the killer chase me so they can finish it. That was a joke because I lost the killer then go back to the gen and no one is there so I start working on it and out comes that same survivor. He was hiding in a locker the whole time. He comes out jumps on the gen and pops it 2 more times.
I had enough and alerted the killer I am her and let them kill me.
This has been how my matches have been going except that one RARE match the killer was rank 14 but then once again back to rank 1 killers. I guess out of almost 40 matches now I should be happy I got a average rank killer around my skill finally. lol
I do have hope but it is dieing slowly and that last game has broke me. I went back to Animal Crossing and Xenoblade Chronicles until this MMR system gets these high skilled players away from me. lol
Good luck on getting your achievements done while you can and heck I say take full advantage of it. =) Also I feel dumb because I assumed you were a guy but guessing you are a girl because you mentioned your b/f. lol YAY a girl player. =) I hope I am not offending you and I am wrong I mean I guess I mentioned my husband but I am not a girl so anything is possible rofl....Just did not think many girls play this game lol
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Thanks, I will definitely try! And nah, you have not offended me in any way. I am indeed female :) I actually know quite some females playing this game (with me being the only killermain though xD the other ones like the survivor role more).
With your game experience it really sucks. There is nothing more to say than it's just plain not playworthy that way :c Games shoudn't be that frustrating. Definitly will wait with playing with my sis again.
Have fun with Animal Crossing and Xenoblade! AC is not my game and haven't played Xenoblade by now but I really loved Xenoblade Chronicles 2. Really one of the better games on Switch. Wanted to maybe give the first one a try too. Sadly my time is pretty limited atm and I am playing Nioh 2 and also a Sekiro Challengerun currently. But it is definitely on my list to consider :D
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This is what happens when a popular narrative that get spread like "rank doesn't matter" becomes reality. I am not exactly sure where this narrative came from, but I assume it came from popular content creators such as ScottJund or Ohtofu or other false sources. A rank 1 is not the same as rank 20(a new player). If a survivor understands looping and plays really well, but he is rank 15, It is most likely that the player is a rank 1 who is purposely deranking and smurfing to avoid facing better players. Rank systems do not account for smurfing. The old matchmaking was way better.
MMR matchmaking can work, but you need to define skill in the game properly.
Killer skill can be define by 3 metrics:
1-How effectively you use her power(This is very difficult to measure due to various killer powers)
2-The ability to kill survivor of equal skill(Rank)
3-The ability for killer to acquire hits(Injuries) rapidly and generate momentium to acquire hook pressure/kill pressure. This is very important as it disincentives the killer from camping and encourages the killer to go for chases and win tiles.
Survivor skill can be broken up into 3 metrics
1- How fast they complete generators, If they fail, how close were they to winning?
2- Fewest possible hook states. Dying is obviously game-losing for survivor.
3- Ability to win chase(Current Chaser emblem).
DBD in my opinion never had a problem with matchmaking. The biggest problem it always had is defining skill and defining winning and losing. Ideally, the emblem system should reflect skill and than you can use rank for matchmaking purposes. A perfect match for survivor is when the survivor complete all generators, has zero hooks and win every chase and a perfect killer game is one where the killer uses their power to the best of their ability, kills all 4 survivors and acquires hits in rapid succession which eventually leads to hooks. Most games lead into the shades of grey and often they are not completely one sided. you can try to account for its gradation, but most games have clear defined goals called a win condition. For example, a popular DBD win-condition is that 1 kill is a loss for killer, 2 is draw and 3-4 is a win for killer. Personally I don't really believe in draws as most games either try to avoid or disallow draws, but a win condition can be anything at the end of the day.
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