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Don't Nerf Spirit! Nerf Stridor Instead!
Talking about interaction with Iron Will.
Just make Iron Will completely negate Stridor, as it was intended from the beginning. Why should one perk completely counter another?
Boom! Easy solution, no?
As i said. Spirit is fine, but her interaction with Stridor isn't.
Comments
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Nerf "Stridor" and buff "Iron Will".
Because " Iron Will" is a trash perk and "Stridor" is super op. /s
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Only spirit benefits of stridor so why nerf it?
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Yeah dude just make survivor perks completely trump killer perks even when there are 16 of them in a match as opposed to 4 on killer side
Seems balanced to me, especially when Iron Will is already a significantly better perk than Stridor outside of synergy with a single killer
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No
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Why nerf a trash perk?
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Spirits rely too much on Stridor nowdays. It became a Crutch perk at this point.
I've yet to see Spirit that do not use Stridor.
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This, I mean when was the last time you saw someone run stridor on anyone else? I used to see it on nurse a bit and maybe people still do but since I run into like one nurse a week I wouldn’t know
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Cause Spirit benefits from it too much.
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Or we could suggest a rework for spirit to be more engaging and fun to play as, and keep stridor the same so killers still have a useable perk because it's good on every killer if you use it? It's a win for everyone.
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That's not true. If you say that survs have 16 perks and the killer 4, you should say too that a surv perk only applied to 1/4 of whole survs. Because PGTW or B&C applies to 4 survs, but DS only apply to the surv that use it.
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No, just rework the spirit as her concept is stupid and unhealthy for the game.
She pretty much breaks any skill involved for the survivors with her gambling "mindgames".
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They already "reworked" her. So don't expect her to be changed in near future.
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Only 1 character out of 20 benefits from this perk,
seriously,Get gud noob
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I don't get the spirit hate when a good spirit and nurse are the only 2 that can handle a swf death squad because of their control of chases. If nurse and spirit got touched then there would be no answer to a 4 man sweatsquad.
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I had an idea of rework, to utilize her passive phasing. Make an ability around it, to mindgame, to instantly become invisible for 1+ seconds on demand and mindgame around loops and pallets and so on.
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Because you can’t run her around a loop three times before dropping a pallet, running to the next loop while killer breaks it, rinse repeat...
That formula is what a lot of survivors call “good looping,” and it wastes enough time to be true. That’s why spirit, nurse and sometimes Freddy/slinger/pyramid are called unfun or boring. They’re hoping for a nerf to anyone that ignores the normal looping routine.
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The problem with spirit is that you have no counterplay against semi-good players.
Against chainsaws you can hop into the window to buy you some time, or eat an m1 attack.
Against M1 killers you can utilize pallets.
Against nurse you can break line of sight (nurse is still unfair)
What can you do against spirit? All i see is "GIT GUD" or "Stealth" or "Don't try to loop her"
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Honestly, instead of nerfing a perk which isn't really worth taking on any other killer, I'd rather Spirit get a rework. I dropped her around I'm estimating 200 hours with her due to every chase playing out identically and just not getting any satisfaction out of her playstyle.
I'd be fine with Spirit being just as strong as she is now if they just added some sort of actual interaction between her and the survivor.
The devs go on and on about "meaningful interaction" between survivors and killer, yet the only interaction you get with the spirit is the second she pops out of her phase and hits you.
I'd like to add that the counter arguament is always 'you're just mad you can't loop" yet there are other strong killers that have non-looping counterplay to their kit. Hag can be countered by taking things slower and crouching across high traffic loops and safe pallets to not give her map/chase pressure/ with the trade off of giving her more time by slowing the game down, Nurse becomes pure guess work with no LOS with the tradeoff of bypassing pallets and vaults, Chainsaw users become gods of death if the survivor runs into a dead zone or misjudges distance on a longer loop, with the tradeoff of being hard countered by windows.
Most if not all other killers add some new form of counter-play when they take away an existing one, Spirit doesn't.
I adore design, lore, everything about her really. But as time has gone on I become less and less enthused about playing against her knowing I'm dead because I dared to not bring meta perks. And I often skip right over her in killer rotations now.
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No, because 1 perk shouldn't counter the killers entire ability.
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I'm ok with making Iron Will override Stridor since that's how you would think it would work, but that's not really a Stridor nerf as much as an Iron Will buff.
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Spirit is op boring to play against and annoyng
everyone just bait with her and you dont know if he is batting or phasing
please nerf
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Oh finally, the Spirit can reach the same efficiency as the nurse, I hope soon they will put their fatigue after going out of phase and missing hits after going out of phase, extra fatigue.
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I guess I'm the only one then?
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The main flaw in your argument is that one perk shouldn't be able to cancel out the other. That's hilarious coming from a survivor perspective because they have hordes of perks that are completely uncounterable by a killer and also straight up over-ride some killer perks, and killers have only a few perks which nullify select survivor perks which you can just play around like 90% of the time.
I agree that it shouldn't become a meta about nullifying the other players perks but when you have a 16 v 4 loadout, the 4 perks should be able to nullify some of the other teams perks.
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Otz ran it on Trapper last week to meme. That's what the perk is lol
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I don’t use it, the times I’ve tried it’s actually thrown my timing off
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I read this as: "Why should a Perk counter another?" and then "Let Iron Will negate Stridor."
which is a Counter to a Perk. This whole suggestion doesn't make any sense.
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I wouldn't call it a meme perk, it's designed to help killers who lack any amount of tracking or their play style makes tracking substantially harder (Nurse fatigue, Spirit losing survivor vision during power)
If they ever release more killers with those tracking downsides I'm sure we'll see it on more than just Spirit and the blue moon Nurse.
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like most thread on this forum.
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But Stridor counters Iron Will to begin with. So why should one perk completely counter another?
What comes first.
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Small Game, Slippery Meat, Spine Chill, Object of Obsession, Dead Hard and Sprint Burst all counter whole killer abilities, and some of them AREN'T Trapper!
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All they have to do is make it so that the survivor in the TR can hear a quiet phasing sound unless you're near a generator that is running (either completed, being worked on, or fully regressed from a kick or ruin).
This preserves her ability to get grabs off of gens while still allowing survivors to know if she is faking a phase in a loop. It doesn't remove the guessing game of which direction she went or if she is standing still while phased
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Theres people that think Pig is OP. Think about that for a second. If you took a Spirit with Stridor to an indoor map, brought spine chill, Iron will, which against stridor still reduces your sounds by 50% of their normal value, then that spirit is not going to know what the heck is going on. Spirit is not OP, statistics even show that. Mori's, Noed, all the charts say them things actually kinda suck.
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You complain about 1 perk partially negating another perk and then suggest that the other perk should COMPLETELY negate the first one...
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Stridor is extremely powerful on spirit, it completely negates IW, her only real counter.
Are you guys so naive that you think Perks have a static power level??? Certain perks are awful on most killers and then really powerful on others. Stridor, STBFL, PWYF, M&A...
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The OP: Why should one perk completely override another
Also the OP: Make Iron will override Stridor
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so make another survivor perk completely uncounterable? lol
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If anything Stridor needs buffs, it used to be a lot better. Now its only purpose to be worth running is on Spirit.
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Nerfing Stridor wouldn't do anything, players with there 250 dll headphones will still hear you.
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No these changes are just stupid.
Stridor doesn't need a nerf. It is Spirit who needs a nerf.
Its not the Spirit has no counterplay, Nurse also doesn't have any. But Nurse doesn't need a nerf even tho she isn't balanced. Spirit does need a nerf tho.
That's because of following reason:
Nurse is by far the strongest killer in the game and the only killer that can destroy a really strong swf, not even Spirit can do that. But she doesn't need changes because she is by far the hardest killer in the game to learn. Its easy to juke her and you need a lot of time practicing to learn the blink ranges exactly and to counter the jukes. So by learning such a hard killer you should also get rewarded and nurse HAS TO BE the strongest killer. You will not face many god nurses while playing. Really few ppl play her, most players quit playing her since her rework because she is just a buggy mess now. There are almost no god nurse's like me left that still main her and play her really active.
Now lets talk about Spirit. Spirit is not as strong as nurse but she is the second strongest killer in the game. You don't need any skill at all. You maybe need like 2 - max 5 games and you should already be able to play her. And you just get a really strong killer with a lot of value for no skill at all. Everyone can just play her. You face really many spirits on high MMR and they are most of the time not even good. The only reason they get a high rank / MMR is because they win for no skill. Most spirits are completely garbage and rely on playing only that killer to be good. Many times you are losing not because the killer is better, but because the killer is a spirit. If Spirit would take more skill she would also be fine or just not need a nerf that bad. They have to nerf spirit. Some of her add-ons but mainly her basekit.
There are 80 survivor Perks and only one of them counters Spirit which is Iron Will (sorry if I'm wrong but Iron will is the only perk I can think of that is a counter, there might be some more perks).
There are 72 Killer Perks and only one of those counters ONE survivor perk that counters ONE killer. Stridor is totally not the problem a problem and it's also not a good perk and doesn't need changes.
Usually you can hear survivors good enough Stridor is only good for countering Iron Will. And if the survivors don't even have that perk its just a empty perk slot. It shouldn't get nerfed just because its strong on one single killer.
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if you’re so hellbent on countering a Spirits Stridor you can stack Iron Will and No Mither or other Sound reduction perks.
Stridor and Iron Will are in a good Place were they are and so is the Spirit.
One way of improving against the Spirit that alot of people neglect is to play as Spirit.
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Yeah but you specifically said "why should a Perk counter another" and then you suggest Iron Will to counter Stridor, which goes against your own Point.
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There's no way to nerf or rework Spirit without defeating the purpose of her! Giving some kind of indicator will defeat the purpose of her.
Not only that Spirit flips the script on survivor s and makes them feel the same way other killers do. Other killers have to mindgame and hope that the survivor makes a mistake, Spirit takes that information away survivors and makes survivors hope that what they did was the right call.
@Enlyne I hate to say this, there is nothing skilled based involved with survivor when your feeding of information to counter something
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And "Iron Will" is one of the best stealth AND one of the best looping perks in dbd. So why exactly would you like to remove the only IW counter exactly?
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Ideally it would be the killer perk because of the number of perk slots of survivors vs killer.
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Honestly, playing a Spirit doesn't really make a difference if A. You don't have Iron Will or B. They have Stridor. No amount of unpredictable play will overcome your breathing/injured noises compared to the strength of a Spirit with a pair of $5 headphones. Her design is flawed.
Heck, I think voice audio (keeping footsteps if they ever start working properly again) should be muted and blood pools should be visible. At least at that point you'd have the opportunity to juke a spirit that's on your trail with smart use of them.
As of right now you literally just hope they aren't using a duration extender and hop a window/drop a pallet at the right at the right time.
One sided RNG is bad game design.
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If there's no way to rework spirit without defeating the purpose of her, then rework her with the sole intention of defeating her initial purpose. I want spirit to be completely reworked, her design is horrifically boring and unbalanced, you're essentially playing a single player game. There's no challenge, it's just hold M2 and win every chase unless they have iron will, which in that case you also have to guess until you're near them and you hear their footsteps and grass moving. No interaction with the survivor whatsoever because you don't give a ######### about what they're doing. Where's the fun in that?
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Since you‘re against single player games you propably also against unmindgamemable loops, since there is nothing a Killer can do other than running in a cirlce am I right? if unmindgamemable loops are necessary, then so is Spirits abilitiy to phase.
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gotta love those whataboutisms amiright? I'll humour you anyway. Depends what you mean by that. Things like the Midwich god pallet, asylum windows should absolutely not be a thing because yes they're boring to play as survivor and killer, because you're both running in a circle and there's no thought there. The autohaven short loops are fine imo because they are just that: short. And have some mindgame potential if the survivor wants to play them. Both sides have a chance to outplay each other when the pallet gets dropped which takes maybe 7 or 8 seconds tops. And many killers don't care about these loops anyway, almost every killer has something that could help them at these loops with the exceptions being probably Myers, GhostFace, Plague and Legion.
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For starters you gotta get this 'boring' idealism out of your head because killers aren't responsible for your fun, when they are focusing and responsible for their own fun.
It's 1v4. The killer should feel unbalanced in a 1v1, and not hold your own weight in a 1v1. This is why I don't like talking about 1v1 because it proves that survivors will always have the advantage in a loop, but when a killer takes that advantage away everybody is "the killer is too powerful" because everyone looks at the 1v1 mindset and not the 4v1 mindset
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