New killer wont have counterplay.
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I'm not complaining it's more speculation. Previous killers dont have it so now I'm scared of the future.
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I'd say its debatable with the ones stated but even if we just accept that, By your own admission other previous killers have counterplay, and you listed more in that category than the no counterplay category, So therefore would it not be more logical to assume their will be counterplay as theres more evidence for that than the contrary.
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Huntress: Hits injured survivor over pallet, injured survivor goes down.
Deathslinger: Hits injured survivor over pallet, has to then work his way around the loop he shot over, passing his chain through parts of the loop causing his chain to break, survivor runs away.
Now tell me how he's better, because there really isn't anything that can be said that the community won't laugh at.
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Good way to think but it's also a trend the last two killers have no counterplay it would only be logical to assume they would continue it thus the trend.
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Its debatable, deathsligner has a quickshkt you vant react to, a smaller hitbox to shoot over almost every loop and through holes in the wall. A disgusting zoning that can win you chases in a second. You see he has great abilities.
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Personally not faced many Pyramid Heads, nor have I played him at all myself, so I don't really have much input when it comes to counterplay on that front. But when it comes to Deathslinger I played against him a lot and played as him a great deal recently, and at least to me it seems theres many things you can do to counter him, ranging from stuff as basic and reliable as making distance and cutting off line of sight, to less reliable more risky plays to try to bait him into missing his shot.
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But is he better than huntress? How many people will agree that he is "Stronger" than a killer that has been up near the top of the list with Hillbilly and Nurse?
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I honestly think its debatable him and huntress suffer the same no mobility. It just comes down to the player for each.
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slinger can get more downs has no terror raduis and has better chase
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Just dodge, it's not as hard as you are making it out to be
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Let's 1v1 me slinger and you show me.
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You duck behind something or fake, it's not something that should need shown. If you are really asking to 1v1 over someone disagreeing, you may need to take a break from the game.
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Lol ok sure..total logic
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This ain't CoD kid.
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The only people who say this are bad survivors lol
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That isnt what the post is about. Nice whataboutism.
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It's still possible becaus eoni has counterplay even though he is better than deathslinger. Just like a good nurse while being strong had counterplay.
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There are 1v1 chase tournaments.
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I usually run reload perks on him, so i get 4-6/10 on spearing survivors twice in a row successfully, but I see a lot of people going with the reeling and TR addons on him
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Well bully for you son. You want to 1v1 random people because they disagree wit you. That is the most SINGLE sided thing I've ever heard of.
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No I want to 1v1 people so they can demonstrate the counterplay they claim. It's that simple if you can claim x killer has counterplay you should be able to demonstrate it.
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The people who think PH and DS are good for game design are the same ones who think Spirit is perfectly balanced
as to OP, i expect either a killer who is oppressive in 1v1 and weak to 1v4 as is the trend
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That's my exact thoughts just making the survivor gameplay more and more stale.
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Just block line of sight? How do you block line of sight against a 16 meter TR with M&A when he has an 18 meter chain? How do you counter ADS zoning? If the Deathslinger is good and you're not running Spine Chill, you can't. He is going to hit you no matter what unless you happen to be repairing a gen right next to a pallet.
Deathslinger is only worse than Huntress in that he can't pressure multiple people at once. He has one shot before he reloads, not five, and he has to spend time reeling people in rather than just readying another shot. In a 1v1 he's stronger than Huntress. Huntress has a 40m lullaby, so if you get caught out against her, that's on you. You don't get to pick your engagements in the same way against Deathslinger. Deathslinger can also ADS and quickscope in about a half second, while Huntress takes a second for an uncharged hatchet. She has to spend almost 3 seconds at 80% speed with the hatchet up before she can throw a projectile at the speed Deathslinger's chain travels.
Strong =/= low counterplay and vice versa. Legion is a prime example of this; they're relatively weak, but there is almost nothing you can do to avoid being deep wounded if they want you deep wounded. That, and the fact that deep wounds just sucks ass, is why Legion is my least favorite killer in the game. The lore doesn't help either, but I digress.
Huntress has a ton of possibilities for counterplay, but she also has a really high ceiling and can stomp even excellent teams on favorable maps. Deathslinger is a terrible, unfun killer in the 1v1 that has very limited counterplay as is. PH is similar to Deathslinger, but with a tad more counterplay. His ranged attack has a shorter max range, he gives you more warning with the standard TR (although all of the new TRs are ######### and make it really hard to gauge distance), and you can kind of dodge his attacks. If your ping is like 100-150+, though, good luck dodging. It's a full guessing game again.
I like when killers are unpredictable, but PH and Deathslinger are anything but. You know exactly how they're going to be played, but they're still not really counterable in a 1v1 if they have any idea what they're doing. They will rely heavily on zoning tactics, take their free hits when survivors are animation locked, take their free ranged hits if survivors don't dodge, take their free M1s if survivors do dodge.
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I just want them to un-cuck killers like Legion, who clearly got left in teh dust, I imagine, because the devs are afraid to go back and touch him now that he isn't completely useless, or completely broken. His stun duration after coming out of his dash is ridiculous for what the dash is. He can't down someone by stabbing them a second time, he can't reach other survivors he reveals if they are further away, his speed is okay, but compared to other killers, he seems slower, and if he misses even once with his ability, he goes into the stun. Literally no way to avoid it. He even has add-ons that are literally useless to him, because they've changed him and not updated or changed the add-ons. Compared to killers like Oni, he's trash. Oni gets his speed but with a hit of coke, and it's a one shot deal. He also can track people based on the blood orbs, and yes, people have found ways to literally spam his ability. It's a little bit harder to control, but what really is the difference between vaulting a pallet and insta-smashing it? At least with the later, the pallet is gone. Other killers like Bubba and Billy get the insta-downs, and while billy has to wait maybe for 3 seconds to spam his chainsaw and take a roadtrip across the map on top of it, Bubba now sprints at people, and if he hits them, all his charges instantly refresh.
I won't go too far into it, but he point is that killers like Legion need a complete overhaul, and the devs need to stop being so scared to actually do it. I too enjoy the aspect of new killers, but not at the risk of everyone else being left in the dust, because they pretty much add a new bar every time they release one. Each new killer seems to be wildly better than the rest. I'm not sure if it's a sales pitch or what, but it seems to be the case. Instant downs, teleports, instant hooks, built-in moris. And each new one seems to get 2 of the above. Pyramid Head's carve is still wildly broken (no, not OP, just bugged to hell and back). It loves to not show up in places, and I still get randomly afflicted when I'm 20 seconds into a generator, so he doesn't even have to use it to win the random lottery in afflicting someone. The game seems to just do it for him. Doctor has way too much going on with his snap ability, but no lack of speed to compensate. The only way to really counter him is to gen-rush, but that's a nono in the eyes of killer mains, where you'll clearly see forums demanding nerfs to survivor perks, increased time to complete gens, etc.
All I want is for them to step up and fix their game, but as I pointed out some time in the past, it appears that they've rushed so far ahead that touching any of the bugs that have been in the game since launch would actually break the entire game's code and we'd have nothing because the game wouldn't function anymore. So I feel like they're simply rushing to put out new shinies in hopes that it will shut people up about the bugs for a bit. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm so used to people prioritizing profits over actually making sure the product works, and it's usually goes well for them until players issue an ultimatum and force them to fix the issues. There's no reason why this far into the game that we have so many simple errors, like clipping, movement bugs, invisible walls, busted hills, etc. They should really forgo releasing new killers and adding more complexity into the game's coding and all, and fix the basic stuff first. They are pushing all these ambitious updates and things, but they still have basic bugs since launch.
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If you dodge, they walk up and M1 you. That's why people hate zoning. Huntress is the only ranged killer done right because she moves at ~80% speed while charging a hatchet. At that speed you can dodge without losing ground on her. That's how it should be. Meanwhile PH just keeps charging forward and DS's quick scope is so fast that he may as well not slow down at all.
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The killer interaction is the only fun part about survivor. If a good PH or Deathslinger get into a 1v1 situation with you then you cant really counter them and if you're across the map holding M1, is that really fun? Its not usually about winning the game, its about how fun the interaction is. This is also why people hate Legion and Spirit.
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You know it only goes straight ahead of him... right? You can strafe to avoid it or make him lose sight of you.
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If you strafe he gains distance rapidly and M1s you. If you hold W you'll at least make him shoot you in the back and have to reload before he can shoot you again, but you're also giving him free deep wounds, and it sucks to chase through those VFX if he doesn't drop chase.
His TR is 16m with M&A, his chain is 18m, and you're often not going to know which direction he's coming from when the TR starts up. It's even worse because his TR is one of the garbage new ones that sort of spins up slowly and it's hard to gauge distance from. What this means is that he's going to be starting chases from very close to you most of the time. Once he's close there's not much you can do to make him lose sight of you unless he's bad. If you dodge, he'll walk up and M1 you. If you don't dodge he'll shoot you, or try to bait a dodge by ADSing for a fraction of a second to gain distance.
Sure, if you're playing on Blood Lodge, by all means, just see him from 40m and hold W in the opposite direction and try to hide. That's not how it usually works though.
I would make him a 115% movement speed / 32m TR killer and slightly lengthen his chain. To compensate for the added movement speed / longer chain and to add counterplay I'd massively increase his ADS time and increase the recovery time from missed shots. I'd also remove the ability to deep wound healthy survivors who break free from the chain; that would only apply to injured survivors that break free. That would remove his ability to zone by quickly aiming down sight and it would force him to be a lot more strategic about when to shoot. Lengthening the chain would raise the skill cap for him too and allow for some crazy trick shots.
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I disagree on that. Huntress is better by FAR.
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Or both. Old legion proved it was possible
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All killers have counterplay
Also, deathslinger isn't a worse huntress, they're two completely different killers, literally the only thing they have in common is a ranged attack
Deathslinger has a slightly larger terror radius than huntress but doesn't have a telltale sign that it's him (huntress hums, which can be heard from quite a distance away), his ranged attack hits in a straight line, while the trajectory of the hatchets arc
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1v1 me and show me the counterplay to deathslinger.
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Almost no killers can just be looped repeatedly without any way to fight back. Wraith is great at getting the first hit and he zooms around while cloaked. There is no reason to spend like two minutes getting looped around every pallet on the map. Use stealth to get up close, take your easy first hit, keep chasing if they're in an unsafe area, recloak if they're going somewhere safe. If his strength is first hits, why not make as many hits as possible first hits and cut out a lot of the chasing? I love running Sloppy and Nurse's so that them healing is actually advantageous to you.
His movement speed while cloaked also makes him a great fit for PGTW, and he can be devastating in the late game with it if he's good about defending key gens early.
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Putting others that disagree with you down is a sure fire way to get them to agree with you! Go you!
I disagree with the thought that Deathslinger has no counterplay. You literally break line of sight, or dodge. It's not that hard. Are there players out there that have fantastic aim? Sure, but they're rare. This week alone, I've faced maybe two that landed nearly every shot. It's like Nurse. Takes awhile to get the skill needed, but those that stick with it, deserve it.
As for PH, sure, I wouldn't mind him having another way to rid Torment. Mending, for instance, or putting a time limit on it, wouldn't be too much to ask. But to claim he has no counterplay is just. . . weird. Throw pallets a little earlier, fake the vault, take the bluff. Quite a few options here.
The new killer hasn't even been shown, yet. At the very least, let three minutes of footage drop before jumping on the bandwagon. I don't see threads about more 'swf bully perks' yet, so, show some patience?
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Nah
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I never put him down he has heavily killer favored comments like I said. If you truly think they have counterplay add me let's play a kyf I'll be killer and show me.
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4 man optimalnswf is uncounterable but they are a minority a very very rare part of the community. You hardly go against them. Not saying they dotn exist but you cant say they appear much. Like I said whataboutism go away.
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If you cant prove the counterplay you claim it invalidates your arguement.
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'You are known for you heavily killer biased comments no one takesnylu seriously go away.'
That is putting somebody down. 'I don't like your opinion, so shut up.' Just becomes somebody favors one side of the other, should not negate their opinion on a forum.
Nor is your constant stream of 'Fight me!' doing any favors. Why you keep trying that is, again, weird.
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Why does OP act like this game is a 1v1?
The "counter play" to DS and PH is how long you can waste their time and what your TEAM is doing while you waste time.
If a killer can be easily looped it may be fun for you, but this doesn't stop survivors from doing generators.
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If we get killers without counterplay survs genrush and if they dont they stomp killers and genrush Killers are not the reason new killers are the response to it.
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I'm not hating on them for their opinions nor am I hating on them in general. I'm saying they dont look at things from a survivors perspective and only thinks of killers.
It's not me saying fight me it's me trying to get you guys to demonstrate all the counterplay which you claim the aforementioned killers to have.
You make it out as me acting childish and immature. If you cant prove the counterplay dont say they have it. If you cant prove it just say it.
You are also known to have very killer heavy views. Next time read my comments and stop trying to twist and put words in my mouth that I never said to prove your point it takes away your credibility and weakens your argument.
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The 1v1 is important because it is t h.c e most fun part of the game a chase. Holding m1 is boring. I also never said nor implied I want an easily looped killer. Looping nurses is fun she isnt easy.
That's a strawman argument. Also when a killer has a chase power such as slinger it only encourages genrushing because chases will be short. This also is a double edged sword because then killers will go on the forums and moan about gen speed and swf so what is it?
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You specifically said 'go away.' That isn't constructive, that isn't furthering conversation or debate, that's simply 'You see things from the other side, I don't like that, *go away*'
Yes, I favor killer more than survivor, it's the more fun of the two from my perspective, but I do play both sides. On a mostly survivor only run at the moment. So I like to think I have a more objective view. I can land shots as Deathslinger and PH, I can also dodge shots from both. I have good and bad games for both sides.
I, nor anybody else, NEEDS to prove to you their experience. That's theirs, mine, and yours alone. Generally, people understand where somebody is coming from. '1v1 me!,' again, comes off as weird in a 4v1 game. As somebody else said, that's CoD area, and other similar shooters/fighters.
Again, I admit I'm killer favored, but I do experience things on a survivor bases. Simply crying that somebody is 'sided' in one area or another should not negate their experience. I have read, and still read, your comments. I disagree with some, wary of others. Where you think I'm 'twisting/putting words in your mouth' isn't clicking in my head.
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Then we need a massive overhaul to the game where you can have your 1v1 and the generators are blocked for the duration of each chase.
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He really doesnt, play him at top tier and youll see how bad he truly is, what you are saying here is mostly your opinion. deathslinger has so much counter play its really not worth playing him competativly. Im confused on why you are complaining about a killer who hasnt been anounced yet lol
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Haven't played against PH yet but DS has counterplay
They can't deal with a predropped pallet other then breaking it so against them i would sometimes drop a pallet close to a gen i'm working on before they chase me
If you are shot midvault he can't down you most of the times anyway
Humans are also creatures of habbit so inexperienced DS will either always bluff or always shoot
If they bluff call the bluff if they always shoot dodge. If they mix it up then it's a case of mindgames
Ofcourse it depents on what you see as counterplay. If you mean a tactic that when used will always prevent you from going down then sorry but you shouldn't expect that in a 1v4 scenario
If you mean counterplay of being able to extend the chase or find a opening to lose the killer then yeah DS has counterplay
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I said go away because he is killer biased how many times do I have to say he does not view things from a survivor point only killers. It hinders him from viewing things objectively. I rather someone who doesnt look at both sides when discussing balance leave my discussion if you find anything wrong with that I find that weird.
I can respect that you play both sides and try to look at things objectively but that isnt the issue I'm having here.
I never wanted anybody to prove their experience never said it nor implied it I simply asked to show me the cojnterplay in a custom lobby and if you cant you invalidate your argument. Nothing more nothing less.
Funny enough the 1v1 in this 1v4 game is the most interactive part of the game. Its you vs the killer attempting to survive and buy your team time. When you have killer that makes the best part of the game unfun and you barely have a chance to even do anything because of their flawed power it's a turn off.
You fail to see that as like you said you are more killer favored thus you look at things as "well as long as a 4 man team can beat this killer its fair." Doing gens is boring when I cant even have a chase that's meaningful or fun I rather get off the game.
I'm ok with you favoring one side over another it's when you dont look at the other side. You like I said before make me seem like a child throwing a tantrum over losing in a video game when I'm looking for balance.
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I'm not saying that we need more killer like billy and buffed bubba *where the better player wins the chase* not deathslinger where you press m2 to zone.
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