SURGE...
I use surge on my Nurse (saves so much time, considering that half the game you go "aaaaaahhh" for 3-4s) but the Cooldown is such a BS, It already have a "downing with M1" condition, and the CD is too damn high... At least lower it guys.
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Imo it's fine, I use it on trapper all the time. Would you want to remove it or just lower it to a smaller cool down?
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Just lower to a smaller CD. No cd would be bad too (GF and Meyers could abuse it, as well as nurse, since most of the time you're getting downs really quick). OR, if the CD is kept, make the regression be a little bit higher? 10% ? 15 maybe?
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TBH it really doesn't need a cooldown given that regressing generators are immune to surge.
Aka Surged generators are immune to being surged again until a survivor begins to fix them again.
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There's that too, thinking on it, you wouldn't even try to abuse it 'cause if you proc it 2 times in a row it would just waste the perk.
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I'd be ok with it being like 12% with the same cd, either that or you could increase the radius by 8-12m and I think it would make it more powerful.
If there was no cd I think it'd be too strong. There are killers who can take advantage of it being no cd and could regress gens excessively if someone is actually sitting on a gen nearby.
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Here's a better question:
If 2 people have gone down against lets just say an extended tier 3 Michael within range of surge and someone is still on the gen then I'd have to ask what's the bigger issue there?:
The 16-24 percent gen regression(Less then one pop or equal to it in an average case)
Or
The near guaranteed 3rd down.
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It needs to lose the cooldown and basic attack requirement. These two things are holding the perk back so much.
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Yeah, surge basically sees no play at all. It definitely needs a buff, and a 20 second cooldown I feel is the best way to balance it. Maybe also a slightly bigger range.
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Meyers is probably the worst example of this you could give. Ghostface is a probable for fast repeatability. Plague, and legion as well could do this. The point is that the cd is there so you can't just walk from gen area to gen area killing their progress. It's a time saver, which in regards to the ability vs pop comes out to still less in most cases, but if you can chase another person immediately while it's regressing it is better.
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I use it and the only thing I'd change is to decrease the cool down just by a tiny bit. TINY though.
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You clearly don't play killer a lot if you think Purge is used as a time saver as HEX: Ruin is strictly better then it as a time saver(Trust me I have tried both on legion and plague ruin is better for both as a time saver even if cleansed halfway through a match).
It also doesn't help that ruin is also a better regression perk.
Surge's point is to spread out regression across multiple generators including ones being worked on and its cooldown is far too restrictive to allow that.
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Considering Pop exists and the requirement is basically the same but more lenient, I would remove the cooldown and increase the range a bit (maybe let it apply on all attacks, but idk). If Pop is singular gen regression, Surge could be a multi gen regression with less impact on each gen.
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Surge with a "three nearest gens" condition and a 20 seconds CD would be neat!
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Telling someone that has over 3k hours and is rank 1 on both sides that they don't play killer much is just insulting. We weren't even discussing ruin, I mentioned time save as a comparison to pop, but please continue adding new comparisons and not addressing what I actually said.
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Thats a great point. What is the CD really for then?
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Reduce the damage it causes to 1/2/3% but remove the cooldown? You're often not using it for the actual damage it deals, rather that it starts regression on nearby generators.
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I just wish they'd get rid of the basic attack requirement. A lot of killers could make great use of it that can't, while we have strong killers like nurse, hag, and Spirit that can make perfect use of it. The devs claim to put the basic attack requirement a perk to prevent them from becoming OP. I will keep laughing my ass off at that statement while these killers can still make use of those perks.
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I always wanted Surge to more or less be the reverse Pop Goes The Weasel where instead of big regression on one Generator it instead applied a small regression on multiple Generators.
So something like:
• Remove the Basic Attack requirement.
• Reduce the Cooldown from 60/50/40 to 40/35/30 seconds.
• Change it from Generators within 32 meters of the downed Survivor to the closest 3 Generators of the downed Survivor that are able to be regressed. (doesn't work on currently regressing generators, completed generators, or blocked generators.)
So best case scenario 3 Generators get regressed for 8% (6.4 seconds) for a total of 24% (19.2 seconds).
But nah, keep Surge in its overly picky requirement state and i'll just keep running Pop for a guaranteed regression that is reliable.
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Honestly, its hard to abuse even with no cooldown. Because Surge doesn’t apply to generators that are already regressing so it would only hit a generator multiple times if someone was working on a gen within 32m and continued working on it when another person went down
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Then that would be just a worse ruin.
The whole argument about it being used to begin regression kinda falls flat once you realize ruin is objectively better at doing that then surge is.
I honestly want to know where this idea that its a "Time Saver" perk even came from given how many people say it despite it having no basis in reality. Aka which youtuber/streamer called it that?
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Also I want gens affected by Surge to regress at double speed like ruin, and now that we are in the subject, I want Brutal Strenght to apply the same effect
Also, Surge should apply Overcharge if you have it, like come on
You need to actually down people and gens that aren’t currently regressing
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As a few other people said all surge needs is to ditch the stupid basic attack requirement, infectious fright used to have it and it was a garbage perk because of it. Make Surge work on any attack and it might be a nice alternative to pop.
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It is a time saver in that I do not have to walk over to the gen to regress it, especially in situations that I would rather start another chase, than have to pop a gen.
Ruin does its job better in a perfect situation, but in the scenario of ruin being cleansed and there being only 2 gens left I would rather protect the gens with surge than have to walk up to each individually.
In plain terms, ruin does not last all game vs a semi competent team, so I would rather not rely on it vs something I can control.
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A couple of things.
- The survivors have control over Surge not the killer as survivors choose where the chase ultimately ends or at.least the general area. However Ruin is under the killer's control as it starts the regression on the generator you chased them off of aka the ones your trying to protect.
- Ruin is just flat out better with more overall up time even if cleansed half way through a match. Ruin's regression starts at the beginning of a chase and not the end making it have a SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER up time when compared to Surge.
The total regression in games where I have Surge vs Ruin even counting the upfront regression surge has the uptime ruin has since its at the beginning of the chase means it got well more then double if not triple the total regression even in games where it lasted only 5 out of the 10 mins the game had lasted.
Finally being honest: From the way you talk about Surge you clearly haven't played with it at all and/or not played with Ruin enough to get a proper contrast.
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If they power through gens ruin does nothing, you need to be a high pressure killer to get use out of it. With surge you can cause gens you weren't able to pressure to be regressed.
Seriously, ruin is an ok perk that doesn't last nearly as long in most games as you give it credit.
I play all killers and ruin is best on killers that induce pressure, while surge is better on set up killers.
We're going to disagree here because honestly you can't have a conversation without trying to discredit the other side.
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Yes and you state things that simply aren't true.
I'll agree to end it here though.
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The suggestion I like for Surge is to allow it to apply its 8% penalty to any gen regardless of whether or not it's already regressing. Gens that aren't currently regressing would also start regressing as well as usual. This way at least you'd be getting a little more value out of it when you down people.
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