SWF keep ruining my killer matches, we need a way to identify them in lobby
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it would killers dodge way more than they already do. but the reason why killers do that should get adressed, dont you think?.
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If it bothers you that much you shouldn't play killer. There are a load of reasons why choosing not to face swf teams/knowing when your about to face swf teams is a bad idea.
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It's not a SWF problem. The game gives you no indication in the lobby about playstyle intent. There's a huge difference between casual players and competitive players of the same rank, but the game makes no distinction. And because the drop-off between good killers/perks and the rest of the killers/perks is so massive, you can lose a game from the loadout screen.
I can and have 2k-4k'd some of the best teams in the world, but I knew I was about to face them in a competitive setting. I have the skills, but if I'm locked in a lobby as Clown against a 10k hr competitive 4 man I haven't seen before and I don't take a super meta build, I will 100% lose before I even load in. That goes for any player.
I get why labeling SWFs is a terrible idea and I wouldn't want that. But you need to give players SOME indicator as to what they're walking into if you're going to have 75% of your killer roster be meme-tier against the best players while also locking people into killer choice in the lobby.
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I doubt it will ever happen - killers aren't supposed to know if they have a team or not, the same as survivors don't get to know which killer they are up against - there has to be some surprises afterall.
I've had killer rounds where it's been a team out to be toxic or deliberately difficult - had one today actually. Just because they want to try and mess you around doesn't mean you have to play their way. I took a doctor with lightborn - lots of fun when the cheeky Laurie tried to blind me. This was after she tried to sell out her teamates repeatedly. There was a Claudette who was determined to pull me off the others/gens by continually vaulting or slamming lockers but she confined herself to one area and I went the first time and saw what she was up to, I walked off and patrolled the gens, hitting whoever I found and ignored the noise she made. I also took NOED just for fun and it was very satisfying to find they didn't bother to do bones and I downed two in end game - two that had been particularly annoying (one of them the Laurie). Today I went in prepared for trouble and dished out as much as I was given.
Sadly, it will happen but for all the crappy SWF out there, there are way more teams that play fair and go to have fun.
My advice would be to pick perks that prevent or lessen the effects of the behaviour's you experienced. If you have someone who is a particular pain, either take them down quick and camp them out of existance (one of the few times I would say camping was okay as I don't like the tactic when playing either side), or ignore them. If survivors run to a pallent and teabag, walk away and patrol gens. Deny them chases if they want to run you; learning when to break off is important - you can get locked in a chase and not realise several gens have been done while you focus on one survivor. If the match is that bad, get what points you can and open the door for them when they pop the last gen - just let them go and move on.
I hope things improve for you.
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I don't understand how these 4-man SWFs have fun trying to get the gens done in 3 minutes flat and escape. I was playing Clown yesterday against a team that was acting like it was the championship round of Major League Gaming. 3 gens popped before I even had the first guy down. One more hook, and one more gen popped. I just tunneled the last guy unhooked to try to get one kill. I had to wait out their DS/Unbreakable/Soul Guard (three people were running this exact build) but then I was able to parlay that into a 4k because they all rushed right at me to try to save them from death. I can't believe teams this sweaty exist
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I wish I had your rosy view of things, but from my experience SWFs are...awful. It inevitably seems to be two red ranks queuing with a rank 20 smurf to roflstomp low/mid ranks.
They are also amazingly BM.
SWFs would be okay if they did what they used to do and match SWF groups with a killer at least of an equal rank to the highest ranked SWF player. No idea why they changed it.
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I'd be fine with SWF if the devs did the sensible thing and tweaked matchmaking to ensure that SWF depip squads aren't a thing at lower ranks.
Blizzard had a pretty elegant solution in Heroes, where grouping up as a premade inflated your MMR (the more members the higher) to compensate for the additional coordination.
No idea why the devs are stonewalling any sort of killer matchmaking, let alone a commonsense solution like this.
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I just wish there was a sensible idea to fairly level the playing field for killer, SWF, and solo - while also increasing the social aspect of the game and making it more fun by adding a whole new level of depth and strategy.
Oh wait, there is! I just made the mistake of making the idea longer than one sentence. Whoops 😁
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As I mentioned above - it exists. The devs just decided to poopcan it for some reason.
Having SWF groups always face a killer of an equal or higher rank to the highest rank person in the premade meant that smurfcomps were not a thing, and freed up more evenly matched killers for solo games.
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no, because then no one can play with friends since you will just dodge lobbies with anyone queued together
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I already do, if it's a 3 or 4 stack - unless I'm running a killer I'm very confident with. It's quite obvious once you are in lobby and see 4 crossplay people pop in together.
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I will give you a hint:
If someone have a map definetely SWF that wanna rush you as hell.
If you see 2 or more toolboxes suspect of SWF 2-3 members.
3 medkits suspect
Suspect of all of em.
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Since SWF is in essence, a buff to survivors I think it's only logical to implement a system that boosts the killer's stats per person. 2 SWFs=2% speed boost, 5% gen regression per kick etc. 3 SWFs=4% speed boost, 10% gen regression per kick etc. 4 SWFs=6% speed boost, 15% gen regression perk kick etc.
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But don't you know? A streamer said it so it must be true!
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but why tho your literally just turning down the challenge of playing killer, thats a pretty shithead move
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Shrug. I really don't care at this point. They can get a new killer to roll. I've run into so many BM SWF premades that are obviously abusing grouping with a lower ranked person to destroy new players that I'm not going to bother anymore.
Give killers matchmaking back and reimplement the old SWF system where you would be matched against a killer of an equal rank to the highest ranked person in the SWF. Then we can talk.
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I think you're right that people overestimate how many SWF groups they're going against, and that we can't always know for sure. But there are times you can tell, and it's especially easy to tell when they're being toxic, because they swarm you as a group for the whole entire match, in a way that solo players would never do.
Honestly, I think the more toxic and aggressive the SWF is, the easier it is to know for sure that they're SWF, and that might be part of the reason SWF has such a bad reputation. If we could see who was SWF and who wasn't, it might reveal that there are lots of SWF we never knew about who play a normal game.
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Toxic survivor apologist.
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That's straight cap swf lobbies a good majority of the time is sweat asf and you get bullied if your not ready for it so having a small indicator would be nice i don't play a lot but recently i have been and I've been getting trolled and bullied in most of my swf lobbies, im not the best and i don't got the perks and "get better" aint that simple when you "suck" and continue to get placed in with rank 12345 swf ect running toxic #########. Sometimes you get punished for mistakes and get rolled and smoked thats okay but when it's a really good majority of your games it's pretty frustrating and demotivating
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Umbra speaks the truth tbh. SWF is the "I did bad, but don't want to admit my mistakes" argument. I haven't seen a real sweaty 4 man swf who all run DS+ unbreakable in a while, and most of the swf I see are just having fun, using dumb builds like breakout and MoM.
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Run no one escapes death and if they win and they don't know where the ruin is they will usually bail. Saves heaps of time at the where they try to save their buddy...
I try to find the least skilled player and tunnel them slowly kill em one by one, if they are not elite players, usually they all split and do gens then can't do much about that, then hide in lockers when you come past, should be an entity block for spamming lockers though both fast and slow opening of lockers for survivors more generous than window vaults but having a game where 1 or more players do this is kinda annoying. Especially in midwich... Although I did have a glitch once in midwich where a guy kept using them and visually he was outside (had him with his arms crossed and floating next to it) of the locker, but probably for him it looked normal, could him and kill him lul...
If they might have DS I'll slug em down and wait. Also slugging usually is a good indicator of SWF same as hooking, just observe how cocky they are. Face camp usually gets em fired up and salty but how is that different from crouching next/near the hook for Dat instant save? If they might have borrowed time hit the person who saved em.
End of the match if I slugged and hooked I'll wait for the hooked people to be sacrificed so that ds and/or unbreakable doesn't save the game. Yes toxic but I do it for the endgame chat (grabs popcorn) especially if they end up wasting my time during the game. Eye for an eye.
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Here is a 'depip' squad. They (3) queued up together with a friend on a fresh 20 to terrorize and derank lower ranks. Had it out in postgame with them, they weren't even shy about it.
A full SWF stack. Note my rank. Managed to get 2 kills by camping and trapping enough to cover an XL pizza with cheese. They were BM as hell.
It's very clear when people are running an SWF. They have uncanny coordination and information sharing and either split between gens perfectly, using a lookout to keep track of me and then stealthing away the second I approach or constantly collapsing on me immediately the second I'm about to hook someone.
When 4 players plop into your lobby simultaneously with names like 'toxicsurv1' 'toxicer' lolsotoxic' and 'toxictoxictoxic' it doesn't take a genius to work out what's going on.
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If you think the majority of SWF's are "Straight sweat", you're just terrible at killer.
Any seasoned and experienced killer main will tell you this.
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No need to insult the op I run into teams of swf all the time some are good and some deserve what they get as I always say what comes around goes around. You treat me with respect ill gave you a great game reguardless of the outcome. If your a toxic player I'll punish you. If your a toxic group I've got ways to ensure you pay for that too. At the end of the day I don't care rank means nothing to me I've been red ranked on killer and survivor so much its meaningless at this point. I'm just here to play and have some fun. Maybe even learn a thing or two from a good group but how I play is dictated by the players.
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I would actually love this to be in the game. This is mostly why I stay away from playing Killer, You get those SWF groups who like to taunt and ruin your fun.
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If this is true then why is it "easy" to beat solo players but causal and bad swf are hard to win against?
Information is king in this game. This is the reason survivors raged about compound 21 because it actually makes blight viable.
Any information shared between 4 people destroys killers. Simple things like the totem is at x location, or he is not chasing me and heading to x area. or full on BT, DS synergy with gates open....
There is no defense for 4 people on coms.
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I completely agree. Most people commenting against this play SFW I would imagine. I think we should be given the option because if we care about both sides having fun then the killer is not having fun. I am pretty good as a killer but when your chatting and coordinating its definitely not fair to the killer. Then the popping 3/4 gens in under two mins when your chasing their goat. Sometimes I destroy them because i know they are sfw that will come rescue and troll but sometimes they troll me and escape. It's frustrating and I hate playing killer because it never feels like I'm gonna get a normal match. They should change something that allows you to opt out of going against teams or limit number allowed. I was thinking seperate lobbies for like two player teams because alot of killers don't wanna deal with that and wanna have fun and some killers love playing against teams.
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They should limit the numbers, but this will never happen as 4 man has been in the game for to long and it generates to much moneys.
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If a casual/bad SWF is "hard to win against"...again, this is a matter of you needing to get better. Sometimes you need to take responsibility for your own #########. Nobody is saying that SWF sweat squads don't exist, but every game? Every SWF a sweat squad? Get better at the game.
Even a good solo team with a little bit of common sense will mop the floor with you if that's what you think. You strike me as the type to blame a loss on an SWF with no proof that they were actually SWF.
Most of what you're experiencing is you having an inability to admit your mistakes.
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If SWF isn't OP, you guys wouldn't be so scared to balance the game around SWF lol
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I hear this excuse about SWF all the time, "the majority of SWF are just friends talking to each other" and that's fine, but don't tell me these groups don't also say things like "oh he's chasing me now beside xyz" and things of that nature while they're chatting because of course they are. I'm not saying get rid of SWF all I'm saying is this excuse of "mostly it's just friends chatting" is a poor excuse
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Bingo. Even if the skill of the survivors is equal to that of the killer, SWF gives an incredible bonus regarding information and tactics. It's way harder to get someone to make a mistake when everyone knows exactly where you are at all times. And don't even get me started on OoO groups.
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Y’all remember that they got rid of showing you other players ranks because people would just leave right? They’re not going to try and give you a reason to leave the lobby. Just something we have to deal with.
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Voice-communication RUINS this ######### game.
I just got back into DBD recently after quitting for a little under a year (oh, hey, because of voice-coms last time too) and I'm already getting burned out again by this nonsense. It fundamentally destroys the killer experience and spreads like a poison throughout the rest of this game & the community in ways that breed toxicity, resentment, & bullying that ultimately corrodes the experience of solo survivors as well.
You CANNOT have a game that's entirely balanced around the idea that players can't communicate still be viable when it's THE TOTAL OPPOSITE for any given match. And if you want to play at peek hours, you damn well better believe it's going to be *overwhelming unbalanced game* after *overwhelming unbalanced game*. But here if that's something you don't like it's often "well that's your problem" instead of being evidence of a system that's downright FUBAR.
Look, I LOVE this game when it plays how its designed. But it's ######### preposterous that I can't go into any given match knowing whether the game is playing as meant to be played (and balanced around,) or it's just a given that the other players have this obscene advantage compared to normal that largely opens up the means to break the game over their knee to whatever degree they see fit and feel appropriate. I don't care for that game much at all.... I really don't like being forced to put up with that game just so I MIGHT get a chance at playing the fun one.
Post edited by Ecstasy on3 -
II. The justifications used to excuse VC all fall apart on scrutiny.
"OH BUT SOME PLAYERS ARE JUST WEAK!" isn't an excuse. To measure change you hold the other factors constant. The relevant comparison is that any given match otherwise balanced under NORMAL circumstances is now inherently UNBALANCED with overwhelming adjustments. The fact you can still beat a SWF that you'd already have crushed anyway is immaterial. The fact any unbalanced matches exist according to the SKILL of those players doesn't validate the de-facto cheating a torrent of outside information breaks open under an umbrella of "if you (and, largely, as much as you) want" adjustments. For players, it only makes it even harder to tell where skill levels really begin or end. For developers, it makes it harder gauge actual factors and statistics they should be balancing around.
"OH BUT MOST ARE X-MAN TEAMS & BARELY TRYING!" isn't an excuse. That's just inline with what studies show about cheating anyway: people mostly only cheat "a little bit" for that edge. Something like "for the fun" helps excuse the advantage while they get to distance their standards from how much it distorts their performance compared to that match that would exist. It's negligible that only 50/75/100% of the other team are effectively cheating and how hard; the only material comparison is the game that would've existed WITHOUT THAT EDGE. That discretion is both the very problem while also the mechanism that lets players feel snug and safe in exploiting it. That choice is just as in-line with cheating as it exists everywhere; that's your CSGO player who's okay with aimbots, but thinks wall-hacks are too far.
"OH BUT IT'LL DESTORY THIS GAME!" isn't an excuse. It's not even true. You can't even begin to isolate what elements are solely due to being a bully simulator from all the game's other factors that pushed its popularity as it grow/changed over the years (ie, the reasons why some people keep playing DESPITE the incredibly toxic and destructive SWF experience). The big streaming stuff isn't exclusively death-squad communication sets over voice-coms... players only watch one of those four anyhow. The popular stuff isn't even just survivor-sided, if anything I image its the opposite w/r/t the bigger names. On top of that, voice-communication & SWF aren't even inherently inseparable. You can allow SWF, but make it clear where the lines exist & punish anyone dumb enough to uploading the evidence against themselves. And--EVEN IF they were inseparable--then that just means time to nut up and include VC as a given mechanic in the game normally & BALANCE AROUND IT PROPERLY. You cannot keep your escape cake and offer it up too.
"OH BUT YOU CAN'T ENFORCE IT!" isn't an excuse. That doesn't stop good developers from banning things like stream-snipping in their games when that's even less evidenced or enforceable. It's about setting a precedent of attitudes and behavior. Most people will at least attempt to float within that realms of acceptable conduct where SOME standards exist. Yet, this community is anything goes and paralyzed by developers who are--quite frankly--cowardly about either protecting their vision or adapting it to the other concessions they've made. It turns such an otherwise fun game (and brilliant idea) into a miserable slog.
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A new Killer Player i see :D
We could tell in the past that its SWF cuz they all joined together into a Lobby (so killer dodged em left and right ..i wonder why). So instead of fixing the Problem why Killers dont want to play vs SWF they changed the Lobby System so random Players will also join together into a lobby so killers no longer can tell the difference.
So your proposal will not go through :D
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I totally get where you're coming from, I'm slightly autistic, and I get really frustrated playing as killer sometimes. But 90% of the time I'm playing SWF with 1 or 2 friends. Like others have said, and like you've admitted yourself, the SWF deathsquads are pretty rare, and punishing survivors simply for wanting to play an online game with their friends is ludicrous. Every single online game I have ever played has players that are toxic little shits, the only way to avoid that is to not play online games at all. People suck mate, and people like you and me will always struggle to understand it. Try not to put pressure on yourself (easier said than done, I know), at the end of the day, you gotta focus on the fact it is just a game, and sometimes people are massive dicks for seemingly no reason.
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I would love to have a post game reveal of SWF just to find out about that. Surely might be that you miss some SWF you didn't expect but these are for sure not the ones everyone is complaining about, so not a problem. But your "know for sure" is exactly the problem. I got accused enough times for being SWF when I played solo just because of scenes like that. It is surely less likely that like Breakout/bodyblock teamplay is happening without SWF, but for example in a match I was catched the first time and knew that the other survivor had Breakout. So it is clear for me to join the body block when I get the chance. And we managed to get like 3 breakouts
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I agree. Killer queues are like 5-10 minutes right now. All morning I haven’t had a single game that hasnt comprised of some swf with a combination of BS map offerings, keys or object of obsession. I just wanted a normal game but this is a joke right now. Can’t even get hook grabs this game is so busted lmao I grab a survivor on a chest and my game freezes for like 10 seconds then its like “nope” unfreezes and the survivor runs off no damage taken.
I’ve had enough. Just gonna run stridor spirit and iri head huntress now with ebony moris. Might as well join the toxicity.
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? No? Killers have to sweat their balls off to win games while survivors have the ability to know what they need to do and when they need to do it because of a feature that wasn't even apart of the original game.
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Here we go again:
SWF was always planned for the game. Yes, it was not a part when the game first launched, but only because they only had time to include one mode - either SWF or KYF. They went for KYF. SWF was not introduced because DBD got reviewbombed or Survivors complained. It was planned from the beginning.
And, lets face it - a game where people play online together in a team without an option to play with friends? In 2016? Come on.
Also, disagree that Killers have to sweat their balls off. Mine are fine.
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Sry bro but thats dbd if you dont like it either dont play the game or just make a new account its really only the highranks i feel you homie im also killer main and if you come to a certain point its like losing 50/50 you dont need skill as a survivor just 3 friends, the game in its first state was not made to play with friends and even till this day its not, but devs done it because survivors were crying so they implented it was okay till they got the new ranking system and then everything got boring and bad, the community is trash and just ignore the problem, you can really only talk with people normally about the problem who where at one point killer main or are killer mains if not dont even try to talk with those people bcs they dont understand it and they are all idiots, the devs do litterally nothing about doin like okay ######### this ######### with all the ''we want to do a good game'' lets just make a store and hear what the miority says without brain because we like money.
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so literally no one can play with their friends because people just dodge swfs right, instead of the reasonal option of buff solo to swf and then buff killers accordingly
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Not really, you're comparing a literal physical interaction with real consequences to a fantasy interaction with little to no real consequence. The motivation may be similar, to ruin some else's day, but that doesn't mean its an equivalent analogy.
Given the rather consequence free environment of the internet, bad, childish, salty, trolling, abusive etc etc players can only really ruin your time if you let them. Yes they are crappy people, yes I'd rather not game with them, but the last thing I'd do is get upset about it, its a game. It was a crappy evening last night online and I though "well that's enough of that" and played boardgames instead.
I'm not saying toughen up or anything like that we all get ######### at things, and emotional pain is just as valid as physical pain, but sometimes you gotta put it in perspective, it's hardly akin to a punch in the face and really shouldn't be.
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this is the perfect summary of the hypocrisy in these forums.
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There is a simple solution to the swf problem:
Just stop playin fun / weaker Killers...
Learn Spirit / Hag / Nurse and play it every game :)
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Get killers buffed and then we will talk.
Otherwise, my queues are instant and I'll pick and choose my lobbies.
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yea well if this becomes a thing you can kiss queue times goodbye since you cant play swf and no one wants to play solo
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Shrug - in which case, BHVR might actually put the old SWF protections against smurfcomps to get people queueing again.
Why did they take those away?
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Agreed, the survivors should be able to switch characters either.
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