Nerfing killer doesn't make survivor more fun
I can easily consistently escape in SWF, and have pretty damn good odds in solos which is actually what i prefer for just playing for "fun" in the game if that makes sense. So they nerfed Pop and thanta because people started using it after the ruin nerf. This does nothing for me as a survivor BUT the buffs to demos weak perks are at least a little interesting because the meta around killer is a lot more flexible. Nothing is THAT strong so those perks might be useful because you can really bring anything you want.
For survivor however i bring the same ######### 90% of games no matter what survivor im playing. DS, BT, Deadhard and then spinechill. Even the perks i normally substitute in aren't diverse (Maybe i'll throw in Adrenalin instead of spinechill or Sprit Burst instead of dead hard) and i know im not the only one obviously. The problem with this is that these perks are so strong that theres no reason to run weaker perks, and NO reason to run perks that just weaker version of other perks (Weird they buffed Demo's perks but not Steve's, maybe he's a lost cause) Why would i run buffed slippery meat instead of Deliverance? The others are just not strong enough to compare to meta perks, maybe by any means can be helpful or fun but will it be more helpful than DS? DH? Even spinechill?
They talk a lot about niche builds but the fact of the matter is any build that isnt meta is niche. There are meta builds on killer too but there is so much more diversity in perk builds that aren't niche even among the same killer. If you nerf something you do it so the other side is having more fun, but right now there is no killer perk that can be nerfed that would improve my experience, but there are a handful that everyone is aware of that would make the game more fun for killers AND survivors even though many people won't be able to see that.
Oh the exception being WGTLF, that was long over due. I dont think its possible to make a survivor perk designed as well as BBQ but it at least makes it worth taking along as opposed to the old WGLF
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Is there a thought here you were trying to convey besides “Scoff, I escape all the time and I only play with meta perks”? I don’t get it.
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The point is no one was complaining about pop, but they nerfed it for the benefit for survivor, which is non existent. Even if someone was complaining about pop or Thant they aren't going to be happy with the changes. It has no change to the enjoyment of survivor and probably a little more frustration to killer
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Literally every single one of Ace's perks needs a rework, there is no reason to level up Ace other than liking the character. As for Spine Chill and Decisive being must-picks, I agree with you, high ranks solo queue is unplayable without them, just like no one would play a killer like Wraith in high ranks because Spirit and Nurse are so good, no one will play a game without Spine Chill and Decisive on high ranks because there's no reason not to, and honestly it's not health for the game at all. No matter how many new DLC's come out, they're not gonna shake up the meta until Spine Chill and DS receive changes to put them at a point where you can play a match without them. Shorten the range of Spine Chill OR remove the speed increase from it.
As for Decisive, this is a slightly more elaborate idea to change it.
Timer: 40 seconds across all tiers
If you are in a chase or downed, the timer slows down to the point where it will last a maximum of 60 seconds.
If the timer is still up, your recovery speed is increased by 5/10/20%.
I think this works out to be a somewhat healthier perk, it still functions as an anti-tunneling perk and you get the same strength as the old Decisive if you are tunneled immediately off the hook, however, if you are not in a chase, you only have 40 seconds to do whatever, which is the main issue as to why it is a must-pick, you can literally finish 3/4 of a generator in the time it takes for current Decisive to wear off. With this newer version, you won't have as much time to mess around,and if you are healed up, you will more than likely not go down fast enough to stun the killer. If you are downed and slugged to avoid DS, then you can recover faster and be ready for a teammate to help.
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Thana looks like a buff to me. Thana is pointless as is. If 4 were injured, 16% x 80 = 12.8 = 92.8 seconds. A whopping 12.8 seconds to gen time. Healing: 16% x 16 (being healed by 1 survivor) = 18.56. A whopping 2.56 sec extra. Self care? 16% x 32 = a whopping 5.12 seconds. If anything, this will be a buff to thana.
For Pop, they cut the time to 45 sec and kept % the same. The perk is going to continue to be used. If they said “we’re cutting Pop from 25% to 15%” then you might have something. And spare me the whataboutism about DS please
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As for killer's have a wider variety of perks to choose from. I think that stems from the fact each killer is different. Therefore perks that are bad on one killer might be great on another. BBQ is good all around but it's better on Billy, Oni, Spirit. Corrupt might not be very good for them but it's great for trapper and hag. Survivors are literally all the same. They all do the same thing just as well as everyone else. So their perks are narrow by comparison.
I agree it's boring to run the same 3-4 perks every game. Every time I try a meme build it feels like I get a face camping killer and I'm like "I should have brought DS". Course that also happens when I play killer too.
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Excuse me what?
Pop/corrupt/bbq/ x
ruin/undying/tinkerer/x
You get to choose between 2 builds based on killer and have to fill in the x with a perk.
Besides, if you run meta perks on survivors you basically just overkill it because you don't even need perks to escape, unlike killer.
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Im not saying the nerfs are a problem im saying they're stupid. No survivor main asked for a pop nerf so who is benefitting? The thanta IS a nerf because its used solely to slow down heal speed, the nerf might be a direct response to Forever Freddy which is what it is. Still isn't moris or even NOED.
But if BT, DS, and Spinechill weren't so good at what they do there would be more diversity in builds because a lot of perks do the same thing in different ways. I dont know if you edited or what but I missed the last part of your comment that is exactly how the devs must think lol.
"Spare me your complaining about DS and Moris, this nerf was to Pop! You idiot, why can't you understand THIS balancing is about slippery meat NOT the things people actually want changed."
I feel like i should spell out that its choice for the devs to change random things no one wants changed vs the things people have been desperately complaining about. Like your comment would make sense if they used a magic 8 ball to pick what they do but unless you got some insider info "Whataboutism" is literally the name of the game when it comes to changes lol
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That second build is 1. Brand new and 2. made almost solely for Blight and Billy.
The first build is just an overkill build because why would you use POP and corrupt, its like bringing NOED or BW you must go in with the mind set of failing. I get the feeling you're struggling as killer, and no shade, but maybe don't just listen to a youtube video for directions, the thing about killer is there is a lot of room for creativity both in builds and gameplay. Those cookie cuter builds might make you climb ranks but you might not be learning anything.
Also for the record as a killer main turned survivor main, I would rather run a perkless killer than perkless survivor lol
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They didn't even nerf Thana. They made the gen slowdown even better. The Thana+Sloppy combo is better in some cases now.
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Green ranks? lmao
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It's still 15 seconds more than it originally was, 90% of the time people immediately use Pop, if you needed the extra 15 seconds, somethings going wrong.
People will complain about literally anything
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Actually currently brown rank killer because im going to get my rift fragments one way or another lol.
But I play at red and purple normally, I think you really have to try not to get to purple ranks, when i first started playing i was in green ranks almost instantly and hit purple by the time i bought Myers. After that I chose to stay green because my first games in purple were against the most toxic sweaty SFW possible, but in the long run i dont think it actually mattered. Rank doesn't correspond to difficulty as killer because survivor can just do gens and pip up. Im currently like rank 5 as survivor and i have basically THROWN games trying to do the last of my rift challenges and i swear no matter what bullshit I pull I black pip. Red rank and even rank 1 really just means you play a lot.
Oh and in those red ranks I have never ever EVER played either of those exact builds AND I have Adapted every killer in the game. Perks on survivor can carry you even if you suck, not so with killer. Knowing how to loop and predicting the survivors are stronger than any perk, just like looping is stronger on survivor than
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OR maybe you're a short sighted survivor main celebrating a nerf that you literally just explained why its pointless. Yet you're going to go off and complain about NOED and Moris and ask why the devs aren't doing anything. Its because they're nerfing Pop and buffing Slippery Meat.
I forget how people are on this forum, I need to use really neutral language or people just read far enough to know if its in favor of the side they exclusively play and then leave an insult and remark how X side are a bunch of crybabies
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The only time you "immediately" use pop is if you down someone right next to a highly progressed generator (or you're just trying to get rid of pop) which means you're playing against potatoes. Once the survivors know you've got pop, they should be leading you to dead zones or less progressed gens when in chases.
The ones who needed the extra 15 seconds were slower killers. High mobility killers won't care one bit, but someone sticking their guns to Clown or Trapper or whatever are going to really feel the sting. It's just a direct nerf to killers with less map control, which are who you want to buff right now for greater killer variety.
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The slight nerf was to prevent constant chains of PGTW, which I can understand.
Typically there’s no urgency to use PGTW so you can chase a survivor and down them in that 60s. Then proceed to use your previous PGTW, hook the survivor and then use PGTW again. That’s like 50% gen regression within the space of 10-20s.
Yes, survivors should be punished for their mistakes but that’s a little too punishing. In some cases if the killer has good momentum the match literally becomes unwinnable for solo survivors.
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Actually if a Gen is on 90%. 2 times PGTW will be 39% regressing total. Not 50%.
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Um that's not how it works, if they just tap it and stop the regression that is only 25 percent for each, so its 50
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“Why would I run Slippery Meat instead of Deliverance?!”
In case YOU are the first one hooked and couldn’t secure a save first. And to have the option of healing to healthy sooner.
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The point is that right now, SWF has put killers in a rough spot where even tip-top killers struggle to do much against SWFs at a similar level, without endless supplies of top tier addons and a few killers - that survivors are also trying to get nerfed.
When last did you see a survivor main suggesting a weaker killer get buffed?
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I'd like to see a teired perk system where you can have a combination of the following:
- 1 top tier perk that takes up 4 perk slots
- 2 upper mid tier perks that take up 4 slots
- 3 mid tier perks that take up 4 slots
- 4 lower tier perks that take up 4 slots
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So you go in expecting to be the first one hooked so you take a perk that MAY make it so you can unhook yourself and heal right afterwards because....
Theres no reason. The devs know that thats why they talk about "Niche" builds because your thought process will lead you to use slippery meat maybe once or twice, and then stop using it or only use it in meme builds. The only way thats not the case is if its a ridiculously high chance, maybe you can even stack up that dumbass ace perk and offerings with a full SWF but thats literally memeing, you'd be replacing game changing broken perks with a perk that MIGHT let you kobe (may he rest in peace) and MIGHT be more useful than Deliverance IF you get the 1/4 chance of being the first person hooked, a statistic you can influence by just avoiding the killer until someone else is hooked mind you.
I hate it. Its so not fun that the meta for survivors in DBD is so clear cut. This perk, like a lot of perks, is really cute but they refuse to actually balance the game so what does it matter.
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This is an interesting idea, it would give you a reason to run those second hand perks if they cost less than the better counterpart. The problem would come from limiting builds and the fact that really theres a handful of perks that are game breaking, and then everything else. Also while perks like DS are legit game breaking i dont think they're worth taking up 4 spots. If that was the case the only one i would even consider running was spinechill and even then
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It’s not about expecting or predicting anything. It doesn’t matter how good you are at this game. Sometimes the opposing side causes things to occur that are out of your control.
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Nobody uses thana to slow healing. As you can see, it does a horrible job at that. Most red ranks don’t care to heal, wastes time. Just saying
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Exactly this. People think change only follows into “nerf/buff,” black/white thinking keeps people stuck
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I see a lot that argument of "Sloppy+Thana is still good". Even if it is, nobody was talking about the combination of those perks, but only about Thana. Why should a perk be dependant of another one? Makes no sence for me, it literally forces you to waste 2 slots of perks instead of 1 😕
The game's balance is horrible for both sides, and there's no way to deny it.
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One thing that doesn't help is that Survivors are all the same, except for the minor differences like their voices & appearances.
Once you find the best things for a Survivor, that's it: You found the best things for all Survivors.
While certain Killers are quite similar, and of course there are Perks that work just as well for one as it does for all, there's also Perks that are absolute ######### on one, but can make for really fun builds for others.
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Rank 20 survivor mains complain about it all the time, and the devs listen to those new players instead of the vets because they'll get more money that way.
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I assume this is the mentailty people who run mad grit have. But remember this convo, I dont want to see your ass running deliverance ever again, you a slippery meat main now! I dont care how many time you ######### on hook, its worth the risk
I dont know if thats true but i do think that they don't balance for higher ranks. Actually I guess a lot of newer perks do make sense if you were rank 20. Gotta run visionary every game. Also killer is actually the power role in the lowest ranks so maybe you're on to something
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True but I think the only real roles in survivor are healers and runners because everyone does gens. I feel like survivor is kind of flawed from designed so deeply rooted in the game that it might not be able to be fixed. But i am confident survivor gameplay could be made more diverse and interesting if they reworked the perks from the point of the meta. People will #########, but in the long run they can make the game so much more fun then using a perk that you just press one button to use
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Probably like the ruin nerf only new players complained about it lol i as a survivor had no issue with pop nor old ruin it was nice to hit those ruin skill checks and kept you on your toes but idk if the changes bring new players just mean new wallets lol
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So you want desicive to be unbreakable 2 ? Never had a problem as killer with DS. If they do gens just hit them !? Why the ######### should you watch them do gens and count down to DS !? Like if you watch youtubers, most of the killers are tunneling and then they cry DS op. But that's how you win in red ranks, tunnel, slug, proxy camp. So many players are crying that DS is op, so 90% of the community is tunneling ? That's kinda ######### up, you're ruining the game for everyone. Tunneling and camping is so bad in low ranks and dont even talk about the moris, almost every game. DS wont help here, because new player already have problems hitting the skill checks. I got 3 new player into the game, played duos few games and never returned to the game because it's not fun at all to them. We still play custom, but i guess ranked stays untouched. Got alittle offtopic, but whatever
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Man you just aint great cuz you new. If you weren't new you'd know how to use DS lol. See killer mains miss that because they know how strong DS is but not how simple to use it. Saying DS is an anti tunnel perk is like saying BT is an anti camping perk. Like yeah ig that was the concept but thats the rank 20 mindset man
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Yes it does. There's a reason why I like smurfing to face baby killers.
Its going to be even better to be able to bully high ranked killers on my main.
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the thing is using pop right away is not gaining you much time unless the gen is literary 1 second from a hook
i always try to go for a chase with pop, down the person then use pop and then get another one right away
walking full map to use pop actually isnt even worth it, you loose more time then you gain... being able to go for that chase or maybe few hits before you pop was the reason why pop was actually good, you could down someone or make them heal and then pop for a bit of extra time
now this is not possible
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