SWF is Fine
I don’t know why killer mains want SWF nerfed so badly. You’re literally just having fun with your friends. Not every SWF is a “bully squad” as killers call them, most just want to talk and have fun sometimes even meme. I get I get it, some perks are broken with SWF and comms take over specific perks but if you take away SWF you’ll probably be winning 99% of your killer matches.
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I just want the devs to balance the game around SWF, buff solos, and buff killers as well.
You shouldn't be punished for playing with friends, most killers like to use SWF as a scape goat, because they didn't play well.
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Yeah, solo is a pain to play 85% of the time. Not everyone has friends to play with on Dead By Daylight. And yes you shouldn’t be punished for playing with friends I definitely agree on that.
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No one have problem with you playing with your friends. The problem is the massive advantage that you got by using comm's, with no drawback whatsoever
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Here's a bag of jelly beans. Not all of them are poisoned. Enjoy!
SWF isn't the problem. It's that, unlike in other games, there is no offset to compensate for the increased coordination and information coms provides, nor is the game balanced around it.
Beyond this, BHVR went out of their way to remove the old protections to stop high ranked SWF groups from deliberately queueing into lowbie killers to stomp them, and removed killer matchmaking protections entirely.
SWF needs a kicking.
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I got a poisoned jelly bean.
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The last thing I want is for me and my friends to be punished because a killer didn't get their precious 4K :(.
This game isn't competitive, nor will it ever be, people should stop trying to make it that way.
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Thing is - neither should killers.
Right now, the dominant thought seems to be that killers should expect to give up having fun to ensure that survivors have more fun.
The main issue, to my mind is that BHVR went out of their way to remove the protections that stopped lowbie killers running into groups like this essentially half of their matches. This is what SWF is to me: A coordinated group of 3 players queuing up with a deranked account(s) to crush new players.
Why?
Because at rank 13, this is at least half of the games I play.
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Not all SWF are like that, most of us are casuals who want to have fun and stay at our own ranks, those sweaty smurf groups make swf look bad, and we shouldn't be punished because of that.
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Ideally? Sure.
In reality? This would only work if survivors agreed to it too.
It's very easy to tell killers 'oh don't worry, it's not a big deal that you got skunked by an SWF smurf group who refused to end the match, this is not a competitive game' - but that's putting the onus on the killer, when the problem is these poisonous SWF groups.
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wHaT dId YoU sAy? EnTiTlEd SuRvIvOr MaIn RiGhT hErE fOlKs!!!!!
On a real note its not your playing with your friends it the fact that you get a advantage that wasn't intended and isn't balanced around
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Again - here's a bag of jelly beans. Most of them aren't poisoned. Still want one?
Nobody is asking for you to be punished. All we are asking for is for things to be a bit more fair.
Tell you what - if more survivors would make threads about how BHVR needs to bring back the anti-smurf protections and give killers back their matchmaking protections, you'd see far less complaint threads about SWF.
But you don't. You backfill, and make these 'yeah, SWF is fine because my group (according to me) isn't like that'.
Most people are generally benign and don't do heinous crap. We still have police.
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@StarLost How would you change SWF, out of curiosity?
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You say this, but you're prolly guilty of running meta perks at some point. As am I, as is a ton of people. The game has become competitive, if it hasn't then people would cry out when something is "broken" or OP. You wouldn't see people talking about Gen speeds, SWF, Mori, Key's etc. the player base has made it competitive. There is Ranks, there is MMR now. Players asked for this, it becomes more a competitive game all the time.
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Yeah,but that's not really a problem about SWF but rather one about garbage matchmaking and smurfs.
They are currently working on the MMR system so there is that but the problem with smurf accounts is that you woun't be able to stop them at all,unfortunately
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+1 👍
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I mean they were stopped until bhvr removed the protections
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Amen.
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You blew my cover! ): I’m definitely a KILLER MAIN. Lol but I get what you’re saying.
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Which protections?
I only know the one that you aren't able to de-rank past rank 16.
And even then you could easily create a new account (super easy to do on ps4) to bypass that.
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I think it was in a swf you would be matched with killers of the highest rank in the group
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Quite simple.
- SWF groups will (once again) face a killer at a minimum rank equal to the highest ranked survivor in the party. This immediately crushes the majority of SWF smurfcomps and means that if they want to smurf, they all have to derank.
- SWF groups will have their matchmaking rating inflated artificially, proportional to the number of players grouped together (to counterbalance the coordination/communication advantage). Heroes of the Storm did this, and it worked pretty well.
Then why did they remove the protections against smurfing and the protections lowbie killers had against it? (Well, I know the answer - these same smurf groups started complaining about queue times and how they couldn't 'teach their lowbie friends the game, just ignore all those perks they have').
Why is deliberate killer deranking bannable, but survivor deranking isn't?
Note: survivors still have those protections. Survivors at a certain rank (I think it's yellow and below) will always be matched against a killer lower or equal to that rank. This is how the current smurfcomp works.
Again - if they were working on fixing this, why would they remove the fixes they had made - with no announcement, chance for discussion or ETA on a replacement?
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I agree OP.
The reason why many solo survivors are bad isn't because they are solo. They are just bad.
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Which would mean playing perkless.
The old protection ensured that three red ranked survivors couldn't queue with a deranked friend to endlessly crush and troll new killers - they would always face a killer of a similar rank to the higher ranked survivors.
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Does it not work like that anymore?(Meaning a SWF with three rank 20 and one rank 1 player should always get a rank 1 killer)
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No they removed it
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Yeah, SWF isn't the core problem, it just really helps facilitate it. Removing SWF would just make unwinnable trials rarer, not eliminate them.
Plus, most SWF's are just friends playing DbD. It's only the ultra-sweaty 3-4 person squads with all the fun toys that people really complain about, not the two geniuses with flashlights trying to save each other to death.
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Really,at what point did they do that?
When they were testing the MMR,maybe?
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Never noticed that they removed that.
Very odd decision on their part then
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Idk but they removed it because of players playing with their newbie friends but now its abused by smurfs
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pretty much this for the most part it fine.
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So it's back again were it used to be three rank 1 players and one rank 20 SWFs getting rank 20 killers?
How unfortunate.They should have stayed with the system that tried to get a killer that is in between their ranks.
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See: and survivors complained sufficiently about this to get it removed. I haven't seen a single thread from a survivor about smurfcomps, nor do I expect to. It's all 'SWF is fine'.
Do you see why people have an issue with SWF, now? And why they are getting ornery?
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The people playing with their 'newbie' friends - who all had full meta perks and 300 hours minimum on their accounts if I recall.
Dammit, I need to find that thread again.
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Then why did i not see a single thread that talks about the unfairness of that change?
But i think those complaints about SWFs are lesser from newer killers getting stomped from high rank sweat squads.
I assume that most killers that complain about SWFs versed SWFs that were relatively close to their own rank.
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You haven't? It was a while back. If I recall (I'd have to hunt for that thread - it may even be a Discord discussion).
I still have the one where the devs admitted they had quietly removed killer matchmaking protections somewhere - because it was my thread.
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It might be that i just forgot that.
Me and my friends only play in high rank and i play killer in those ranks aswell so i wouldn't be effected by this at all.
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SWF is the only time this game is any kind of challenge as killer, people really need to grow a pair and actually accept the challenge, because you don't have many games in DbD that are actually hard. Yeah you're not expected to win against a tournament squad who picked an Ormond offering but if you know that team, there now exists an offering to negate all other map offerings. And you can usually get 1 or 2 kills depending on the killer you chose anyway.
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I agree... not much else to say
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arent you when you play 4 man winning around 90% of your matches? double standards?.
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basically there is nothing you could of done you were doomed from the start right? and you need to accept it, find the ilogical problem there.
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Playing in a SWF isn't an automatic win button so no that's not the case for the majority of SWFs.
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No, it wasn't complaints of survivors that got it changed. (in fact, the average one bugged so that it only gave survivor groups low ranked killers) It was changed so that it would only go by the highest rank player's rank, (as a band-aid fix, rather than actually fixing the average rank system) however it's been bugged for a long time with no official change to this rule.
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increases it greatly... getting many aura reading perks for free (Empathy, Kindred, bond, alert, even OoO without drawbacks) meanwhile the killer gets nothing, litearlly nothing, well you get something, stress. because they have so much information that even if they are bad there are no seconds wasted, so their efficiency can break the game, the point of the game is the imersion, the no info discord kills that, and the balance of the game, there is a reason why there is not a voice chat in settings... and people use third party software. SWF is fine VOICE CHAT is not fine, not in this game.
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Yes,voice chat makes the games easier for survivors but it won't win them.
The majority of them are still beatable
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they do win games, i tried play with friends is so damn easy, you win everytime is not even fun... i dont know what you are talking about. voice chat is been winning games since 2016 and will still win games till the last days of this game. "the majority of them are beatable" only if u are way better than them as killer, and it takes a lot of hours to do so, if they are kinda decent at the game, you are doomed from the start you need to be way or at least considerably better than them if u are only equal or slighty to moderately better than that group you are gonna lose, that is a fact, please i bet you have a decent amount of hours in this game dont force me to explain what you already know wasting my time, this is obvious, stop playing the non sense game, defending voice chat is idiotic. Survivors have the upper hand with voice chat, making so damn well coordianted plays that are impossible to pull of with solos since you dont know wich perks are they using, you can allow to do reckless plays that solos cant not afford to.
Voice chat is something that should be adressed somehow because we cant just pretend it doesnt exist, especially at red ranks since as a steam player i always get paired with 2 to 4 man SWF wich 99.99999999999999% of the time use voice chat for obvious reasons, since there is no reason to not to. wich of course breaks the balance of the game to pieces. as everyone here knows, defending the opposite is tbh not very smart, and obviously is a biass towards the role you like more wich is understanadable but from a balance perspective and health of the game is not... is hard to adress voice chat because is impossible b ut killer should get rewarded when the game detects people playing with friends with some stuff to balance that stuff out because for obvious reasons if u play with friends you play with chat, and no one is gonna convince me of the opposite, there might be 1 exception every 500 matches that they 4 of them play with no mic? may happen still is not the rule.-
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Yep. This entirely.
Also, laughing at survivors thinking their opinions on a system that entirely benefits them are valid.
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Play with your friends, nobody would say a word. Just don't use comms to get unfair advantage =)
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See, now you are just strawmanning.
Nobody said they are 'unbeatable'. We are saying that they have a significant advantage with no offset. I'd compare it to a wallhack or similar.
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it doesn't matter how you personally play swf, being in one by itself is an advantage because it allows coordination and efficiency. a simple hey i'll save you lets everyone else know to stay on gens. it also allows for busted coordination were you play like its a E sports event eith the best perks and gen rush as you perfectly coordinate it all.
again it doesn't matter how you play it whats important and the reason its busted is because it still provides strong communication and coordination.
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It is competitive though, survivors try escaping by using over powered perks, while most killers can't do jack #########. Almost everytime I play by the time I find someone and start chasing them 2 gens pop. I just started using Ruin and Undying but even then the gens still pop way too quickly.
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