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Complete power overhaul
Any killers you would completly change/rework their power? I'm just bored and curious to see what people come up with
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Hag, to make her actually enjoyable to play against and fun to play as well.
Freddy, so that my cat cannot 4K with him on a regular basis.
But for complete overhaul, Legion, so that they maybe can become a decent Killer (vaulting Pallets or Windows needs to go away for that).
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Nurse, Hag, Legion, Clown. Nurse just breaks the game. The teleporting is cool but just ignores everything... Hag is just "proxy camp: the killer". Legion is just so boring, a half-baked idea because the original one was scrapped. Clown is boring as well.. just throws bottles awkwardly and they just slow down.
Pig and Wraith are also boring, they could use a touch-up, not a complete rework though.
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No killer I've seen if they play normally no unnecessary hard camping or tunneling I don't really know a killer even the annoying ones bother me. I play both sides. So I don't know I'd take some reworks for the low tier killers.
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IMO:
Nurse is fine just because she's hard as hell. maybe needs to rework her addons, but otherwise she's fine.
Hag is only proxy camp: the killer because by nature she's territorial. Same with trapper. You don't like territorial killers, that's fine. Not everyone is gonna be fun for everyone.
Legion is so fun on both sides, I just wish they weren't gutted and were actually fluid and rewarding to play.
Clown is just a bad idea all over. Too weak, but too oppressive, too fun, but too boring.
Pig and Wraith are arguably the most fun killers to verse, but Pig is a bit lack-luster to play.
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Clown, mr. Thiccums himself has needed an overhaul ever since the meta started shifting towards the time crunch we have now.
Imagine if he could trap lockers with the gas, this second ability could be called Jack in the box.
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I appreciate your opinion but I can't say that they line up with the consensus. There's a huge gap between Hag and Trapper - the main difference being that bear traps don't down unless you've got that certain addon. If they did, then you'd hear a lot more complaints about him.
I've only heard complaints about playing against Legion as matches can go on very long.
I get what you mean by the nurse - but I don't think that makes for good game design. Push it a little further and say you had a killer that had a laser rifle that went through walls, but could only headshot, and the camera swayed back and forth so it was very hard to hit, 20m range. In experienced hands, you can just snipe everyone without any counterplay at all. And a newbie will do absolutely nothing all game. Sure it takes skill to get there, but once you're there.. it's OP, so what's the point?
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fair, fair, but I personally believe that if something is super difficult and requires hundreds of hours to get even close to mastering, then it kind of deserves to be OP in the right hands, yeah? Like, if you are good, and the task you're good at is very difficult, then it should be OP, right? It's not like Widowmaker in OW where it's hard but not insanely hard while she is also the best DPS in the game. I think Nurse is that special kind of OP that it's kind of OK, maybe make her a bit harder to play to get the same value I guess.
Edit: Also, Trapper's traps can also injured from across the map, while Hag's can't. Trapper is also a 4.6 killer, while Hag is 4.4. Hag gets to teleport, but Trapper has to walk to his traps. Trapper is RNG based, but Hag's is consistent. There's really no way of comparing the two except for the fact they are both trap killers and are both territorial. The details of their respective traps are kind of irrelevant in comparing the two, you know?
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I've got two I'd personally rework (well, it's more of an unrework but you know what I mean)
First, Freddy. A really cool concept that was completely thrown out of the window because it was too weak. They could've just buffed him, maybe giving him an amped-up version of Dream Projection for mobility. The concept of putting everyone to sleep was the core idea of Freddy and shouldn't have been removed. The best Freddy mains could pull off some crazy mindgames during the Dream Transition. Now, we have a very strong, but arguably boring killer. I'd rather have a slightly weak, but fun killer than a boring and strong one. It feels like The Nightmare's had all of what made him feel like Freddy removed.
Secondly, Legion. Their pre-rework power was a pretty cool idea, but you could exploit it to make it an absolute pain to deal with. Proxychasing and Frank's Mixtape were an absolute nightmare to deal with and had practically no counterplay, so those should've been addressed, but did you really need to rework the entire killer? Maybe make it so that missing an Feral Frenzy attack cancelled your power with an extended cooldown (longer than the one we have now) to add some ability to juke the Legion into missing their swing. I don't know, I just think it'd be cool to reintroduce some downing capability to Feral Frenzy again.
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Nurse and Deathslinger. I don't think that killers being difficult is justification for having no real counterplay, and I'm sick and tired of everyone using mediocre Nurses as an excuse to not change her. Especially since Deathslinger is even harder and simultaneously weaker and I see two threads about him every day.
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Clown. What I would change to make clown better:
Reloading now has a charge base system. Each bottle is 3 charges and you reload at 3c/s up to a max of 4 bottles. This would allow clown to reload bottles individually, and not waste 5 seconds trying to get one bottle back (which you should never do, but my point still stands; reloading is a dated mechanic.)
Improved gas effects. Make the gas actually act like gas instead of having 6 gas clouds that spread out. Hitting a bottle at a high place causes the gas to cover a larger area, but at the cost of some duration. It’s frustrating to have a gas cloud narrowly miss a survivor because it spread out too far.
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Legion. Their power is beyond basic and it makes it unintuitive, ultimately uninteresting, and a ######### to balance.
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100% Legion. Has literally nothing of value, pathetically simple and horrendously boring on both sides. I really don't see what some people see in Legion. Do they like being edgy teenagers with knives? Do they like having no power in a chase and getting the first hit for free all the time? Because that's all they have going for them.
They need a full rework. Hag is another one but I'd rather legion become something actually unique and competent than see hag get a full rework, because I see Legion way more than hag and I'm sick of this killer.
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Legion. They suck. They aren't satisfying to play since the Frenzy movement speed nerf or the single hit miss stun. They can't down. A good survivor will loop you forever and decent teams aren't slowed by lack of healing. They're extroardinarily boring to play against.
I'd like them to go back and reconsider the power from the ground up.
Spirit. I'd like her to be reworked to take a little more skill thanks to her strength. A one sided dice roll isn't particularly satisfying when you get the hit, and you it doesn't feel satisfying when you "outplay" her because you didn't, they played poorly, you didn't outplay them. I also think a one sided dice roll is bad for the game. When I hear her phasing near game start it kills my motivation to continue playing survivor for that day. Despite what some people believe giving her counterplay would raise her skill ceiling further.
I will admit she's a joy to play thanks to the momentum when using her power but I've stopped playing her as much since I've been playing AGAINST her more as I realise how miserable she is to play.
Deathslinger. I'd like a rework/buff to give him more map presence at the trade off of him being less overbearing in a chase. Right now his lack of real counterplay in a chase encourages gen rushing which is a boring playstyle for both sides. I think Slinger is another killer who can be fun to play as but not against.
Clown. I've always quite liked Clown's area denial playstyle. Herding the survivors if fun. But the low bottle count, not significant slow, lack of real map pressure and of course the need to reload after every chase massively hurt him. I would rather he have a Leatherface passive regen token system for his bottles. The reload is one of the main culprits for his weakness. Also remove Redheads pinky finger! That add on should have been reworked after the slow on throwing bottles was removed.
Freddy. Not really a rework. I just think he was overbuffed slightly. I don't think survivors should passively fall asleep as it rewards Freddy for doing literally nothing. I stopped playing him months ago as it just felt like free wins and I got bored.
Either allow survivors to wake up at any alarm clock and stay awake for NINETY seconds or remove passive sleeping. Make him actually work for his map wide pressure. Also, I think the teammate wake up action doubling each time was a silly decision. There's no incentive to let a teammate wake you up after your first 1 or 2. It takes too long and only wakes for 30 seconds. You're better off just brute forcing a gen together.
Right now theres no incentive to go for the alarm clock as its a lose/lose. By the time you're back to your gen you'll be half asleep again and will have gained nothing.
I also think his additional slowdown add ons should be removed outright. Freddy is overwhelmingly strong with Corrupt/Pop or Undying/Ruin. Add that with the add ons and thats a 4K against even a decent Solo team every time.
Also Trapper. Give him the brown or yellow bag as base kit. Against a smart team, Trapper has to imemdiately pick his area and lock it down to conserve his late game. If a trap spawns far enough away you essentailly have to write it off as leaving your nest can mean certain failure.
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Definitely Clown. I always get the spammy boys who throw 3 or 4 bottles and the screen effect nearly makes me vomit. I don't know what I would change it to but yeah.
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To be fair, “she’s not fun for everyone” is an understatement. She’s literally made for camping. Every Hag game goes the same, she catches 1 survivor and from that moment on she doesn’t leave the hook until the match ends.
Yes, she’s designed that way, but that’s precisely the issue.
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Didn't they confirm Clown was getting a rework? (or something along those lines)
In my personal opinion, I would love for Legion to get a power overhaul.
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Her anti-loop is by far her biggest strength when played properly. All they need to do is put a 6-8 meter minumum distance from hooks.
Problem is not many play her and bad Hags are encouraged to do this and wait nearby as its so strong against low ranks.
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And SWF honestly. Being altruistic feeds her everything she needs. And let’s face it, there’s good Hags. Players who play Hag a lot, and they’re actually good at it, so they’re efficient at being campers.
it’s such a scummy and boring way to play frankly.
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Hag! If you get hooked in the basement then your game is over and you will spend the next 5 minutes watching a cutscene of your character dying and altruistic teamates dying as well because its impossible to save you if the hag comes back while your trying to crouch or you set off traps.
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Legion. Then maybe afterwards, they can consider touching Legion up.
Oh, and Hag.
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legion and clown
imo, their current powers can never truly be balanced- they'll always either be too oppressive or too weak no matter what the devs do
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Definitely Trapper b/c to use his power basically means you give up 2-3 gens early for proper setup. Taking away the ability for survivors to sabo his traps helped him but the fact that he needs to traverse the map to find his traps is pretty ridiculous.
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People hating on hag here, her power is great, its unique and offers plenty of jump scare potential, fun to play and play against.
Trapper refilling traps from lockers maybe but traps are powerful and you can do just fine without any addons with him so maybe he doesn't need much of a rework other than the trapper sack being base for default two traps.
Personally I think Blight, pong/pinball is really ridiculous.
Maybe Legion as deep wounds is not really much of a threat or slowdown.
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I don’t think we need complete reworks that throw away the concepts and make something totally different. There will be people that miss the original power (See OG Freddy).
but some powers def need tweaks/QoL/something.
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I'm confused because you say you can't compare Hag and Trapper.. after directly comparing them. Just because they're not the same doesn't mean that they're not similar. The details of their traps are vital for comparing them- if you are a trapper and start trapping a hooked survivor, they can be saved even if someone runs right into your trap. They save themselves and then go unhook, the only way to stop that is to walk back to your hook. A hag can teleport and hit the survivor going for the save, and then down the savior. If the trapper's purple add-on was basekit, you'd see a lot more complaints (see this thread). So back to my original comment, this just makes her a proxy camper by the very nature of her power. And I think that's kinda boring.
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to each their own.
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So, what? People who value strategy over running at someone with a weapon can just go ######### themselves? IMO Hag is good for the game. She's one of TWO killers who are less about chasing and more about outsmarting and predicting survivors before a chase even starts. I love that.
Besides, there IS counterplay to her. Flashies, crouching, etc. It's not like as soon as she traps a hook that player is as good as dead. I really don't understand the issue here.
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