Does the pip system feel broken?
Look, I know this isn't a new complaint. I also know some of you don't give a flip about pips and more power to you guys. This post is for people who do care about pipping though.
I'm putting this in feedback because I cannot tell if some of these issues are bugs or if the system really is this bad, but for the last 2 or 3 weeks it has felt like it is extremely hard to double pip at all, killer and survivor? Here's a list of issues, feel free to add more:
Killer pipping problems:
- Fairly sure this is a bug, but 9+ hook games often result in bronze or silver Devout scores. I played a full 12 hook game, scored Iridescent in every category except Devout. From my understanding, this shouldn't be possible, but I haven't gotten above silver devout in a game for days now.
Killer pipping suggestions:
The proximity to hook penalty is questionable at best. Sometimes I play games where I feel like I am being a little bit facecampy and don't get penalized at all, sometimes I try to get away from hooks as fast as possible and get to the endscreen with "-10 proximity to hook". As a high ranked player of both survivor and killer, I'd like to see no penalty for proximity when in a chase and a harsher penalty for proximity not in a chase. Hook camping is just unfun for survivors, but it's also not fun as a killer to get penalized when people are forcing chases when they try to unhook under your nose. This is mostly a matter of consistency, but also with making sure the survivors are allowed to actually play the game and get unhooks/get unhooked (both of which contribute to entire badge categories for survivors).
Survivor pipping problems:
- It should not be possible to pop 3 gens by yourself and score silver Lightbringer. This happens to me and people I know/play with constantly. Maybe this is also a bug? I'm not sure, but it's really annoying to spend the whole game dutifully working on gens to see silver Lightbringer at the end.
- Evader does not work very well at all. I've played games where I have run the killer around for literally 4-5 gens, several minutes at a time, and received silver evader. Virtually the only time me or anyone I play with gets Iri evader is against lower rank players when matchmaking does a poor job, or when we have a killer who is sandbagging for fun. I have depipped in games where I spent the entire time being chased. I get that players need to touch gens and stuff, but sometimes killers just will not give up. It should not be a punishing experience to play extremely well in chases.
Survivor pipping suggestions:
- Being face camped should be factored in as "killer distraction" and being facecamped to death on first hook, if you struggle the entire time, should be enough for Iri Lightbringer (maybe 1 point per 2-3 seconds, something like that). It's unlikely to be enough for a pip, but hard depipping because some toxic guy wants to stand there and stare at you is really unfun. Plus, with a decent team, is distracts the killer long enough to pop 3 gens and get cracking on a 4th and 5th. I'd say that's Lightbringer worthy.
- Whiffing should count for points in Evader. We know the game knows when there is a whiff because of "Near Miss" points on killers like Deathslinger, as well as achievements like "Whiffing to Success". I think players should be rewarded a bit for being good enough to 360 or bait out lunges.
- It shouldn't be possible to depip after escaping. This one is maybe controversial, because some teammates do nothing but hide and wait for hatch, but hear me out. It seems like every so often either matchmaking puts me against a rank 17-20 or I end up with an AFK killer. In these cases, it is virtually impossible for the whole team to pip unless you cheese the hell out of the game, and if it's an AFK Wraith (running NOED, of course) it's not even possible to farm. We've played games where we literally popped 4 gens, 99-ed the last 3, cleansed every totem, opened both gates, and had a majority of us depip or barely safety pip. It's impossible to get more than Bronze in benevolent and it can be extremely hard to get any points in Evader. With new or unseasoned killers, it almost feels tedious or toxic to spend the whole game running them around and intentionally taking 1 hit and then running off to heal for points. It's a waste of everyone's time but you have to do it because if you don't you risk losing a pip for an easy game.
I'm sure the "no depip after escaping" one won't be super popular, because key escapes and hiding teammates and such. I'm not really interested in making it easier to pip as survivor, just making it harder to depip. Dying 3 minutes in after a 10 minute queue is already unfun, then you add the guaranteed depip and it just makes it worse. It's obvious many killer mains think camping is a path to victory, and winning is their goal as this is a competitive game, but forcing the survivor to depip is not their goal so it seems fair to me the survivor isn't punished twice for the strategy. Depipping should be a matter of getting outplayed and I would not say AFK killers and being camped for 2 hook states is exactly Grade A gameplay from the killer.
In general, obviously both sides pip systems have to be somewhat reliant on counterplay, but it definitely feels right now like survivor pipping is too reliant on good killer counterplay. It is very hard to get above silver lightbringer if the killer doesn't have ruin or kick gens if you aren't doing a majority of the gens yourself while your team sandbags. It's impossible to get above bronze Benevolent if the killer doesn't get enough hits. Evader is just inconsistent in general and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. Like the others, Evader seems to require often absurd amounts chase to even get silver or gold. You have to get in multiple extended chase and escape a majority of them without being hit to even stand a chance of Gold/Iri. Stealth exists but it's even more inconsistent.
Sorry I don't have more thoughts for killer pips, I just don't seem to struggle very badly with killer badges excepting the likely bug with Devout. If anyone has any thoughts, similar experiences, or criticisms, I'd love to hear them. I can't imagine I'm the only one who sometimes gets to the end screen and goes "Really? How?".
Comments
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As for killer, the proximity camping penalty is pretty much nonsense. They added it to quiet people who have a problem with camping. I say this because, the people who are committed to camping, don't care about pipping. In my opinion, it only serves to negatively affect killers that are either passing by a hooked survivor, or are damaging a generator that's within 16 meters of a survivor they've just hooked. It's a bad system, and doesn't prevent camping, imo. As a side note, regarding the devout emblem, I got a merciless victory multiple times yesterday, so I don't know if there's a bug, or not. But, it's working at least on PS4.
As for survivor, and the lightbringer emblem. Most of the time when I finish one generator, and spend the rest of the time cleansing totems or being chased, I tend to get iridescent. The only times I don't is when I am chased throughout most of the match.
Overall, I think killers have been camping more because the game just seems relentelessly in favor of survivors. I have mostly abandoned the survivor rulebook as killer, and don't try so hard to avoid camping or tunneling anymore. I mean, i still do, but I don't try nearly as hard to avoid it as I used to. I've grown resentful towards the game due to the number of killer bugs that still exist, and how much attention is given to issues affecting survivors. Every time theres a bug, it seems to affect killer in the negative, and sometimes it stays for years. Survivor bugs are changed quickly for the most part. So, the devs are already looking out for survivors, I don't think as a killer main I need to anymore.
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Interesting. I wonder if these issues are PC only? I certainly know 1 gen + 5 dull totems and some chase isnt enough for Iridescent on PC. You really have to work for it and pretty much have to have the killer kicking gens to get the score up.
Camping is a weird one because sometimes it's fine, like in the endgame. But getting camped with 3k points is just unfun and BM. Maybe a blood point penalty and a hidden timer that only implements the penalty for the first 3 gens or something? Interesting thought, anyways.
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Yes.
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I have a lot of games that look like this that didnt double pip.
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