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So... DS actually encourages tunneling doesnt it?
Just my thought about it.
You hook a survivor.
You chase another survivor and hook them
You find the first survivor again next
You get hit by a 45+ second DS
Thats the scenario okay?
So what does a killer think now?
- They could all have DS because theres no way to know
- Huh that wasnt really tunneling
- I will lose this game if that happens again
- Well this survivor doesnt have DS anymore, guess it will be the best play to tunnel him now so i can win this game
I know its kinda complicated, but there are two kinds of killers
- Does tunnel and camp often.
- tries to play fair as much as possible.
So Without DS you will get farmed by the tunnely killers
But with DS you make the fair playing killers tunnel you because it seemed unfair to them to get DSed.
So my conclusion is:
DS can be used as an anti tunnel perk BUT also can encourage tunneling.
Note: I know the Devs said its not seen as an anti tunnel perk, i said it can be used as one.
Some Thinking for the end:
- There is a scenario when no one has DS that there may be no obsession. This is kinda bad in the DS meta. People will get punished for not having DS equipped.
- On the other hand killers with an obsession perk have to play around the survivors like theres always 4 DS in game.
What to do about that? what are your thoughts?
Thats not a DS OP thread, but every perk and killer could use some tweaks to be better (nerfs and buffs)
Comments
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I definitely tunnel people who DS me from full health like 50 seconds later after I chase them off a gen
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I think there should always be an obsession in a game no matter what perks are brought by either side. There is a big difference in my survivor matches when there isn't one and it usually involves the match being much less enjoyable especially when you are playing solo. I understand some survivors may abuse ds but the majority just bring it to avoid having their matches cut short and feeling powerless to do anything about it if the killer decides to hard tunnel them. Also in all honesty I don't use ds every match but when I do it's the only perk I ever bring that I'm more than happy to never have to use in a match.
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Well I dont think thats true. I mean In my world a 45+ second DS after the killer hooked somebody else is too strong. But I have never met a survivor that didnt use it even with only one second left on it.
I know the devs just made it 60 seconds, but either every survivor abuses it in some way or no survivor does. The perk is just designed in a way it should be abusable. Its just complicated...
I mean how can you call something abusable if its used the way like its programmed to be?^^'
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It does work for preventing tunnels very well.
It's just...it does MORE than that, a LOT more. Which is the problem. The whole game you have to play like it exists even if no one was it- so you can have the perk without even having it in your loadout.
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Given the amount of people that have defended tunneling out a survivors DS and just saying "whoops, should've had it" to survivors that got straight-up tunneled, yes.
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What I mean by being happy to not use isn't that I purposely miss it I mean that I have gone somewhere healed and got back into the match and the timers already ran out.
I think most people think though that if you're jumping in lockers or going for the unhooked person in front of the killer etc to force a grab then that's pretty abusable which is why a lot of people agree certain actions should take away ds, myself included who plays survivor more than killer aswell.
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I've never understood the term "fair killer". I will allways tunnel and camp when i think it will give me the best chances to win. Usually camping is terrible as they just do gens and tunneling is also bad because you know they might have ds, so it does discourage tunnelling in most cases. Even if i get hit by ds it might not allways be a good idea to tunnel that guy if you have better targets.
I would say that for killers like me that just want to win the game DS is very healthy for the game and it really discourages me from tunneling people.
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The counter I see thrown around a lot is to just eat the DS early. So test someone for DS to either eliminate it or confirm they don't have it.
This results in people not running DS getting tunnelled, and they're the real losers here as they end up getting 2nd hooked when they maybe would not have. The ones who do have DS will no longer have it, so pose less risk in the late game.
But it's a shame that the counterplay for the anti tunnel perk is to just tunnel them anyway.
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This, to me, should be the mindset regarding DS. If I don't wanna get slapped, I can just go after someone else, probably get another down, and by the time I find the first survivor again, DS is gone. The times I've been DS'd were mostly bad timing on my part, or like, mixing up two survivors who looked the same.
As a survivor, I think my DS has actually reminded killers that they need to be a little more thoughtful if they don't wanna keep getting stunned. I've had some who got real sweaty for a kill, followed me right off second hook, and if I hadn't had it, that would've been game over for me. Instead, I got to skedaddle, heal, and play on for a while. Only twice I think has DS turned me dying into me escaping, but it also required the help of my teammates for that to work.
And honestly, I didn't think I would run it. But after so many games getting tunneled because I had no way of preventing it, because in red ranks everyone just expects you to have it and tells you you should've had it if you don't, I gave in. Everyone I hit with it from now on can thank all the killers who told me if I didn't wanna be tunneled, I should've had Decisive Strike. There are other perks I'd much rather use, but I got tired of being bullied in and out of match for not having it. Same thing went for Unbreakable.
1 -
No. Hop in a lobby without an obsession and see how without DS tunneling goes.
You don't tunnel someone who DS'd you because of DS, but because they don't have it anymore.
1 -
DS could be nerfed to 45 seconds and deactivate upon touching a gen and it would still save you in these situations. No one had a problem with DS as a deterrence to real tunnelling. It's just annoying when used as a free escape guarantee or used by a survivor who is clearly aggro'ing a Killer with the intent to use it.
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it does since i want to get rid of ds in the early game so it doesnt happen egc
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Well, yeah. I don't go into a match wanting to use it. I have it for the killers who just want to get fast hooks by taking me out when I'm already vulnerable. But personally, I don't have an issue with the 60 seconds. Like I said, I don't get hit with it very often, and if someone baits me into downing them just to use it on me, I then no longer feel particularly bad about hitting them again. Usually though, I go for unhookers, not the person just unhooked, so unless they were just unhooked themselves, I'm in the clear.
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I guess I'm the definition of a fair killer.
I purposely use ebony Mori's for two reasons - to keep track of who is on final hook; and/or if they were really rude/trolls to actually use the Mori as intended.
I don't care about my ranking or whatever it's called now; I just want a fun game. My definition of a fun game is just normal gameplay ( looping me, me hooking and hitting WITHOUT tunneling or camping ).
To me I just think about if I were in their shoes playing survivor and they're actually a good group of players that aren't super sweats - how I would feel about losing; so I enjoy making others feel happy. Getting brutal/ruthless is fine with me, it's just how they act that makes me feel like I shouldn't be the "fair" killer anymore.
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I felt this as a new player with no Meta perks in purple to red ranks lol
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If you get a game with no obsession and you tunnel/camp that's when you know you're a bad killer
1 -
If I see an obsession and an opportunity arises I'm tunneling and getting DS out of the way early for a survivor. Worst case scenario they don't have it and I get a free hook out of it. Granted I don't go out of my way to do so.
Nah - If it's convenient then take the easy route and get someone on deathhook or out of the game early. You're the killer you're not supposed to give handouts to the other team. I could give a ######### less if I tunnel someone and hurt their feelings I guarantee you they won't return the favor.
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