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Please help me understand how gen rushing is different than tunneling.
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Gen rush =/= Tunneling
Please reread my message, I said gen rushing doesn't *really* exist, atleast the type that most people use. What actual gen rushing is something like Marths depip squad. Just because a team has 4 good toolboxes does not mean its impossible to beat with a low/medium tier killer, just very hard and RNG dependant.
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Once again Gen rush =/= Tunneling. Tunneling is when a killer repeatedly and purposely goes after one survivor and ignores the rest, atleast thats my definition of it. Gen rushing is something like marths depip squad, basically a group of survivors who will ONLY focus on generators and will purposely leave each other to die on hook in order to pump out more gens.
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I didn't say that gen rushing doesn't exist, just that most people use the term incorrectly, just like tunneling. My definition of tunneling is when a killer will repeatedly and purposely only go after one survivor and ignore the other survivors, even when doing so will lose them the game.
Newer players are an exception to the whole tunneling thing since they're new and don't really understand the mechanics of DBD fully.
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Alright? I sorta feel like you've gotten my post mixed up with someone else's.
My point was that I dont consider them different because tunneling is largely used the same way you described genrushing. While in ideal conditions they have a meaning, it rarely surfaces and is usually just something shouted to distract from one's on failures. Common usage versus intended meaning and all that.
However I did feel that recognizing new players was important because this forum can frequently argue that its somehow good for a brand new killer to get absolutely crushed, but I can see how I could have structured the paragraph better to not imply that is what you meant.
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Genrushing is doing the gens as fast and efficiently as possible
A strategy to do the objective in as little as time as you can. Whether that strategy works or not is irrelivant. Marth depip squad did it effeciently. A solo survivor team that also attemts to genrush but then all dies cause they left themself injured still tried to genrush.
Tunneling is trying to kill a survivor asap so that it's easier to apply pressure to the remaining survivors.
Genrush it's weakness is that the killer can snowball massivly cause you ignore healing unhooking etc
Tunneling can backfire if you can't kill the survivor in the time it takes for the other 3 to do the gens
Both are all or nothing tacktics where you ignore side objectives and try to blitzkrieg the opposition and imo very simular to eachother.
That's how i see it anyway
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How can you honestly argue it’s the same thing? Unless of course there’s 4 toolboxes and bnp’s then you can’t compare.
If a killer properly tunnels a survivor and isn’t terrible at the game, the survivor can’t do anything at all apart from try to run and die.
If all survivors are on gens then all you have to do is find 1 person and you still get to play the game and it starts from there. If you can’t down them then that’s your fault for being bad. Whereas a survivor isn’t bad for being tunnelled cos the game is designed for the killer to always catch up.
Thats a huge difference.
For a survivor being tunnelled is completely out of their hands. A killer can do something about gens being done.
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The thing is, that pretty much like camping, with tunneling you are not allowing someone to play the game. While you aren't letting them do ANYTHING at all, while camping, with tunneling you just allow them to get some chase points and then get them, eventually, because killers are favored by Bloodlust. Which means that, sooner or later, no matter how good of a looper that player might be, you'll get to him. With "gen rushing", it all comes down to how the killer decides to move. If you keep chasing the same guy forever, and two or three gens pop meanwhile, you can't really blame survivors. If they all bring BNPs (which aren't really so much of a thing anymore), now that's another story.
So, to make a resume: while disliking being tunneled is linked to the killer not letting you be until he gets to you, gen rushing depends on the killer not putting too much pressure where he should. Sometimes you should be dropping chases to apply pressure. Even when you down someone you still haven't hooked, hooking them instantly is not always the best choice. Can't tell you how many times I downed someone close to a gen and scared off the survivors on that gen first, or started chasing to down them and have the first survivor being revived. Which meant that 3 people were not doing gens.
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Yeah? Then you are slugging, and everyone knows slugging is toxic. People who are slugged are not being allowed to play the game.
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Slugging for pressure stops them playing for like 30secs until someone picks them up or they get hooked. The rest of the game they can play. Tunnelling they can’t play at all.
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Each side is entitled to their own opinion and beliefs but there's one talking point that's a fact. Survivors objective is faster than Killers objective.
1 Generator is equivalent to 20% of the Survivor's objective and 1 Hook is equivalent to 8.33% of the Killer's objective.
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That's a big no no. If either of you do that your going to end up with really low BP and it's a waste of a game.
If survivors come in and then gen rush. It's honestly a wasted game for them. They are going to get such low BP it would have been easier not to go in that game and gen rush.
For the killer getting low BP is not a big deal as you'll be in a game in less than 5 minutes usually compared to survivor which can be sometimes 15+ minutes.
There is no reason to actually gen rush other than to try and get 5,000 points for escaping.
If I'm in a game and they gen rush, the first person that I get on the hook is faced camped to death. I'm not going to go into a lobby where they want to gen rush and score low BP. I really don't have the time for it.
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I’m being sarcastic. The fact is gens can be done in 4-5 minutes. Only ruin or pop solves that problem on low mobility killers.
The “killer” isn’t out there to make sure the survivors have a good time. Being violently murdered is part of the game.
You think I’m going into a game as Micheal Myers, who literally murders every single person he crosses paths with, and being like “Oh I can’t tunnel this injured guy! He needs to go heal and get on a generator before I can do that!”
The reality is you will go play nice and STILL get DSd by full health survivors working on gens after hooking someone else entirely because that’s the pace the game needs to be played at with no slowdown perks.
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Gen rush is the equal to tunnelling.
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Nothing like downing someone quickly and once you hook them 3 gens pop....
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It’s part of the game and you can play it how you want, and yes there’s bullshit stuff on both sides.
But that’s besides the point of this thread.
This thread claims tunnelling and doing gens quick is the same and has the same effect on the other person. It clearly doesn’t and whoever thinks it does should just stop thinking completely because you might wear out your brain cells.
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@ProfGameAndTalk Genrushing is like tunneling (and facecamping): awful for the opposite side. Low mobility killers are not viable against full red teams, I know it. But there is a difference: killers have dozens of perks to slow gens down, many of them say they are band aids, but some defense exists! Against tunneling there is only DS, which becomes compulsory if you hope to have a little fun.
I suggested some global changes to contrast camping, tunneling and genrushing and to reduce the gap between solos and teams: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/195904/the-final-reform-to-buff-solos-and-killers-accordingly
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The games are literally a few minutes long at red ranks, if you think the killer should feel bad about killing someone in 3 minutes in a 6 minute game just lol
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Because according to survivor mains rushing the gens are their only objective like totems don't exist. But if a killer tunnels then theyre a toxic baby killer who doesn't understand the game. Both things are the same boring thing just that its easier for players to justify gen rushing.
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Killers are strong. Stomps happen when there is a mismatch in player skill for all parties.
Also I'm lucky I don't live in your region because matches for me are longer than the queue times.
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It is note-worthy that many killers, I mean MANY think they are being gen-rushed just as survivors think they are being tunneled. When in fact that safe pallet you refused to break... cost you. That heal you decided to perform right underneath the hook because you thought the killer was going to find someone else but didn’t... cost you.
So with that in mind, they might share similarities, but for me tunneling at it’s core is purposely (regardless of what outcome you want in your match) is targeting one person specifically completely ignoring the others throughout the match. Gen-rushing on the other hand, does not become that unless you came prepared for that. I mean every survivor stacking Prove Thyself, all loaded on BNPs, letting teammates die due to ignoring a heal that was much needed. In other words you can’t claim either if none of those two took place.
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Ah, I forgot I was on DbD forums for a moment, and felt like being rational. My mistake, you really cannot do things with logic when it comes to contradicting killers on these forums. But hey, I'll humor you. Nope, you are not preventing anyone by slugging. Not to mention, of course, that the way I described it is far different from the usual slugging, which is equivalent to leaving a survivor on the ground just because you are sweating for a 4k. And by allowing them to move freely, even being healed by others, I can't really see what your point is. Unless, of course, you were talking just for the sake of it.
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With tunneling, only 1 survivor is guaranteed to lose. The rest easily escape because of gen rush. So the killer loses but 3 of the survivors win, even though they're both rushing their objectives in an unfun way.
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One difference.
Survivors are rewarded with gen rush. There is no killer perk that punishes survivors for finishing the gen too quickly, except NOED which is a bad perk that can be removed far too easily.
Killers are punished for tunnelling. DS, BT punishes killers for doing their job efficiently.
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one of the eternal discussions, i wonder who will win
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There's 2 types of 'genrush', the one that isn't genrushing that happens when the killer simply doesn't apply enough pressure, and the actual genrush, where survivors throw the game to get gens done above all else, losing in the process
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That's when I DC
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I play both.
The reason that I would argue that it's not the same is that gen rushing is literally just doing the objective.
If the killer is halfway across the map and is taking a while in chase, there's literally no reason for me to not be on a gen. If I'm in a good team, I'm going to take advantage of that. Playing with awful teammates is so common as survivor, so I'm just going to enjoy having an optimal team that does gens.
Is there much that non-top-tier killers can do about it? Nope. There isn't. In a way, I feel bad going against a Pig, a Myers, a Clown, a Billy, a Bubba, or any killer that's not a mega chase/mobility/snowball killer that can't handle going against survivors who take advantage of lack of map pressure/slow and non-intimidating chases that the 5 top killers don't have.
As killer, the only time I will go out of my way to tunnel is when I am straight up losing and I have the opportunity to tunnel. Even then, if I'm losing, it's very likely a good team running meta. So, I'm probably still going to hold back from tunneling just because I don't want to get hit with BT, then have to slug with DS just to get someone out of the game.
Going for more chases as killer is fun. Same goes for survivor, except survivor has less choice over the matter because the killer dictates what chases happen a lot more than survivors do. Like I said, if a killer is all the way across the map chasing someone else, I'm not going to go search a chest and cleanse bones because I'd be a useless teammate that's not helping out in completing objectives.
In short, tunneling is something you have to go out of your way to do. Not fun to do, not fun to go against. "Genrushing" is NOT something you have to go out of your way for, it is literally just how the game is at the highest level. You're only doing what you're being asked to do - doing gens.
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Blight is a very good high mobility killer. It’s not exactly hard to apply pressure with him. The only killers than can be gen rushed effectively are low mobility killers with less than stellar powers. cough cough Clown
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That's a great level headed response to critique. I'm impressed. Not usually how people deal with criticism here.
As for the difference gameplay wise. Tunnelling (now true tunnelling) has zero interaction from the survivor. If somebody has unhooked you and you get the down before the survivor can get to any structure it is impossible to deal with.
The term 'gen rushing' used to be a term years ago when survivors used to spend a huge amount of time mucking around. The modern game meta now is to be efficient with your time doing the objective or buy time for the team (healing, chasing and taking hits). The difference here is you can interact with a survivor team doing gens if not being chased. You can go patrol the generator and get survivors off them. I'd suggest watching some youtube vids on how to macro manage a game as killer. There is great material from very mature killer players and you will learn how to improve gen defense instead of posting on the forums about gen rushing. It's a dated term and really doesn't exist anymore. In saying that I think it's fair to call a 4 man swf squad all bringing bnps and running prove thyself efficiently is pretty much impossible to defend.
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They're the same. Both are fine, both are words made up by the opposite side to cry about losing, and if you complain about one and not the other you are a hypocrit.
Side note... Gens pop way too quickly, but that's not the fault of survivors who "rush". Hate the game not the player.
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