It’s a 1v4 game
Lots of survs forget that the killer is a player too, not an npc. I play both sides and 100% agree that both roles should have fun. I don’t want to sound like a crybaby, but Jesus Christ. Killers just seem to have the most unnecessary nerfs/changes. Hoarder for example, got a nerf when the perk wasn’t good to begin with. To think that there’s players who genuinely thought hoarder needs a nerf blows my mind. I’m not saying killers need constant buffs and survs need constant nerfs. I like to think I’m a reasonable player. I just wish the killer had some love, and instead of messing with their perks, addons, or power, maybe fix the maps? I also have a love-hate relationship with new players. I want them to obviously enjoy the game and learn to be good, but play the game before asking the devs to hold your hand. I feel like most changes both surv and killer are influenced a lot from new players. The devs are kinda pissing me off too, they take one step, and go two steps back. Thanks for taking the time to read this, lemme know what you think, new player or not.
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I started playing this game after last rank reset. I have both killer and survivor in red ranks. Killer is easier, hands down, than survivor. No idea what people complain about when it comes to killer. Sweaty SWF groups are so rare it’s insane. Usually it’s uncoordinated solos who get absolutely dumpstered on.
the real 1v4 is when you play solo survivor haha
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This "This is a 1v4"-argument is always flawed, because while it is true, you cannot just ignore the 1v1. The 1v1-aspect is important as well.
And honestly, with the quality of Survivors, some games feel like a 1v3 or 3v2 sometimes.
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That last part I can definitely relate to lol
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I’m not trying to ignore the 1v1, I just hate seeing changes that are unnecessary is all. Still can’t get over hoarder, simple yet infuriating asf
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The developers think the perfect game would have 2 escapes and 2 kills (as the average) which is barely better than Nurse across all levels. I think we're lucky we still have strong killers at all with how they want their game balanced. I also find that interesting because the killers objective is to kill and yet the devs don't appear to see it that way. I think they are trying to head in the right direction with some of the nerfs and buffs happening soonish, but it still feels off.
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A killer shouldn't be able to 4k every single game
Just as survivors should not escape every single game.
Idk how long you been playing but survivors have been hit super hard my guy. Like super hard. They recently just started with the killers.
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Yeah for sure. Killer hasn’t been that fun for the longest time. And for me personally it’s not the swf or fast gens or anything like that. I just want to see the one player going against four other players be stronger. And also nothing has been really added gameplay wise since the “end collapse update”. I want to see new mechanics, not new bandaid perks
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This does not mean that every game should be aimed to have 2 Kills and 2 Escapes, if you take all the games played, it should even out somewhat between that value. Currently, this is not the case, currently most likely Killers get a little bit more than a 2K on average, but thats about it.
From what I see the most results are either 4 man escapes or 4Ks, anything in between is more unusual, since DBD is a game of snowballing - is the Killer able to apply pressure, it will be a 4K. If not, it will most likely be a 4 man Escape.
The "2 Kills/2 Escapes"-ratio should just make sure that there is no Killer who 4Ks every game and there is no Survivor who escapes every game.
But it does not mean that the ideal game would be 50% of the Survivors escaping, if this is the general number, it is good.
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If you’re doing swf with good players it’s easy. But I’ve always played solo. And yes I agree it’s hard to play solo. Not because of the killer, but the teammates 95% of the time.
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Lots of killers seem to be obsessed with 4ks, not my style. Just want to have fun as killer, and not have anything fun for killer striped away. If it’s genuinely overpowered, yes remove it. But if you can counter it, keep it.
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I also play solo and yes I agree. But I was speaking of terms of the op talking about the perk change.
Killers biggest nerf was ruin, other than that there have been some here and there, oh and also mori's, the two biggest nerfs for killers, when survivors have had handfuls of nerfs.
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I started playing at the tail end of November and have 423 hours in the game, according to Steam. My Survivor rank is 8 or 9 (not sure if I de-piped or not, my last couple of Survivor games were harsh) while my Killer rank is 13 (I know I de-piped from my last game).
I play more Killer than I do Survivor.
As Killer I run into constant three or four person hard-core sweaty SWF squads that are all Red Ranks that I stand no chance against, both before and after the new MMR was put into place.
As Survivor I solo and more often than not will have team-mates who kill themself on first hook or actively do nothing all game. At the same time I'll be up against Red Rank Killers who don't give any [bad word]s about my fun and will tunnel and slug f or their precious four-sac.
What I am saying here is that everyone has different experiences based on when they play. Your experiences as Killer have been better than mine.
But your Killer play style is also probably different than mine. I make sure not to face camp (unless someone has been really toxic to me) and very rarely proxy-camp and make sure not to go after people who just got unhooked (unless I can't find the one who unhooked them, that's on their team work for not sticking together and even then I'll normally slug instead of re-hook even without DS in play) and try not to sac anyone at all. This very rarely ever gets me a single and I'm often lucky to safety pip. Because of my "fair" play style I get run over by the SWF squads that I do play against.
I want everyone to have fun playing the game, but it seems to me a lot of Survivor Mains don't care about the Killer having fun at all.
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A lot of survs complain about being tunneled and camped. It does suck. Luckily it doesn’t appear to happen on red ranks much. And yeah, killer needs fun too. Can’t play as surv if there’s no killer and vice versa. I think the devs need to kinda change how the game plays overall. Just seems to be outdated and repetitive
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As Survivor, because I do play Survivor, I get face camped, slugged, and tunneled all the time. It is super Not Fun so when I play as Killer I make sure not to do that on purpose. But there have been lots of times I'll forget who just got unhooked, come across two injured Survivors who are healing so I down and hook one and, whoops, I just 'tunnled' the person who came off the hook because that David ran me around for a minute and a half and I've already forgotten who got unhooked sixty-two seconds ago.
I've had games where I went really out of my way to make sure to hook everyone twice and never hook someone twice in a row while doing that and get a third hook on someone because they made a stupid play (like repairing a gen while with Deep Wounds) or was toxic to me and get accused of BOTH camping and tunneling and it's just, wha? How did I camp if I second hooked everyone and how did I tunnel if I made sure never to hook the same person twice in a row?
Some people are just always going to complain because they see things how they want to see them, not how they actually are.
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The game has a lot of problems. It's trying to give new players an easier time, but it's neglecting some things that would really help like a comprehensive tutorial.
I feel I should point out, no one thought Hoarder needed a nerf. Hoarder is a case of ambitions exceeding capabilities. The perk broke their code and they were forced to scrap part of it, at least for now. They're working on a fix for the perk.
Gearhead and Coup de Grâce are examples of two killer perks that got nerfed on release even though the majority of players thought the perks needed buffs.
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All the survivor nerfs they've done were needed. Survivors use to have op BNP instaheals and no entity blocks on windows. Survivors never got hit super hard because they just got rid of the busted stuff survivors can use
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Solo Q specially at night time feels like a 1v4, me against the killer and my own team mates, that happen to always be rank 15-20 when I'm in reds.
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that's because most survivors are either bad or average,a mixture of good and bad decisions and average mechanical skill and you were filling a void during the shortage. as well as many of those survivors effectively experiencing boosting from some of the bad matchups which had been worse than usual for a while now if not most of the time since you started playing. It's also possible you were playing against a lot of newer players too. older players might have known to take a break until queues got better while waiting to see which patch would be worth coming back to.
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Exactly. Yesterday I had a game against Pyramid Head that felt like a 2v3. My friend and I were paired with two Solos (I assume they were Solo, one Meg on PC, one Meg on Console).
PC-Meg got hooked, Console-Meg farmed her without BT, both were downed due to Punishment of the Damned. Console-Meg got hooked, PC-Meg crawled under the Hook. The PH was really nice, because he went away, he could have just camped there (legit, if that one Meg thinks it is smart to crawl under the Hook) and basically won the game (I would have done it).
But those are games were I am kinda happy that BHVR is not ignoring the 1v1 aspect, because those two Megs did not really feel like teammates, lol.
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I play Legion. Not exactly a face camping kinda killer. I 4k’d a team at red ranks with a level 1 trapper yesterday for a daily. My man, sometimes people are just better at games. Don’t downplay me because you’ve spent 400 hours depiping. This game doesn’t seem hard, to me. Doesn’t mean it isn’t for others.
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Or, hear me out, it’s the simpler solution. All of this complaining is unnecessary. Killer is significantly easier than solo survivor. like I said above, the game is easier for me than other people (it seems). I’m not saying other people haven’t worked hard for their rank, but this complaining is insane. Rank is not hard to get. It shouldn’t be the metric.
sweaty 4swf is annoying, 1v3v1 as a solo survivor is annoying. It’s all a part of the game
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"Needed" ? Questionable. I mean how often was that stuff actually used. I know tons of people that don't ever take items in lol. I know I don't which is why I have over 200 flashlights just on my claudy.
But just like you say that they NEEDED to be changed so did mori's, I prefer the old ruin to the new I didn't mind it much, but mori's just ruined everything, should have never been able to just hook one person then kill them, but if I remember correctly killers had built in noed so I mean?
Not to mention the always changing of pallets, ooh and the fact that the got rid of infinite loops yet killers STILL have bloodlust 😂😂😂 I mean the list goes on
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my third game back last year around when pyramidhead came out, after not playing since late 2016 as the time I'd been able to recollect, was one of the most annoying deliberately trolly swf groups I'd had to put up with before or since then and it was 3 red ranks with ahigh teens smurf abusing the smurf to get matched against me. But on average, if I played 3 to 4 matches at least a night on killer I came across at least one extremely sweaty group most nights and often a super trolly one out to waste my time and frustrate me. Like say I played 10 matches, 1 or 2 of those were almost certain to be super sweaty. sometimes add another 1 or 2 on top of that, but not all the time. But while that sounds like a low number (there were more swf, I was checking the public profiles) for the extremely annoying sorts those make the biggest impact to have to put up with. Eventually I would play until I came across that and then call it a night and only play the survivor the rest of the night. So I wouldn't get in more than 4 or 5 before it was all survivor again afterward.
I won't put up with that behavior, apparently enough others also won't that it hurt the queues again for a while without them even doing it in a coordinated effort, people just got burned out enough to decide to stop playing it on their own. Which says something about the state of the game in my opinion. Complaints are sometimes necessary in order to make a grievance clear and bring issues to light, sure it tends to be done in excess and not always when necessary in this game among some other games, but there are times when it does become necessary to bring attention to somehting or show just how many people are having issues.
The real problem always comes back with people that accuse or complain too much to a story I read as a very little kid called The Boy That Cried Wolf. The boy basically got himself killed the one time he was telling the truth because the village had gotten sick of him lying all the time and they ignored him when he cried for legitimate help. Chronic complaining turns out the same way, it gets shrugged off even once it's legitimate since it's a common thing in online games these days mainly done excessively in pvp games but understandable to a degree when it's competitive.
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A good majority of the complaints do seem to come from a 1v1 perspective ignoring the fact that there is a team even if those teammates prove useless. Player's salt also seems to shade perspective from being bested by a player to "the killer design has to much power"
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Yea i feel like the 2 and 2 part is wrong like if the killer is supposed to be the power role shouldn't it be 3k 1 escape like using that the point of hatch it's a back door escape for the last player even if they got obliterated of if it was very close like I feel like killers should be more on nurse level because it is a fair balance between knowing what can work on both sides survivor if I break los and do something unnessciary it could throw her off and killer if I predict where they are gonna be I can use my 2sd blink to get that hit
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Nope. If the game is balanced around 1 v1, killer will get absolutely squashed. The killer should have an advantage in the chase and it should be hard to stay on your feet. Part of playing on a team means that you have to accept that your teammates’ actions might take everyone out. The mentality of survivors should be pipping/ gaining points, not escaping every match. Even in a decent group, mistakes happen. It doesn’t mean survivors should be able to erase their mistakes.
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Wait till you play 1000 hours. Killer is easier in "red ranks" now play in the top 1% and see how different that statement is.
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I did not say that it should be balanced around 1v1, please read carefully. I said that the 1v1 aspect should not be ignored. Survivors should also be able to show their Skill in chases and their ability and experience should not be made worthless with a "this is a 4v1".
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People also need to consider that especially in solo queue it's not 1v4 in the regards that you're actually participating in cohesive and functional teamwork. In solo queue you are still playing for yourself, and when you are interaction with the killer it's 1v1. You have no idea what the others are thinking and can't strategise and plan with them so you have to play for yourself and follow your own strategies.
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What skill? Chasing is almost purely route memorization. There is very little skill involved.
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I mean, lets call it "Skill" for now, even tho we both know that DBD is not a game where you need much skill. But still, some Survivors are better than others and it should matter that those dont drop in a chase immediatly, just "because it is a 4v1". This "reasoning" is on the same level like "The Killer has a weapon".
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You're just like the devs, just because you don't see it very often doesn't mean it should stay busted. I didn't see moris that often so according to your logic they shouldn't have been nerfed.
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It's funny cuz everyone keeps saying the game needs to be slowed down on both sides (survivors don't want to die 3 minutes into a match and killers don't want gens flying within the first down). The devs just make the game end faster on both sides.
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its not 1v4
It's: 1 V "1v1v1v1"
its only 1v4 when its a group of 4 and everyone is in it for the benefit of each other, not just themselves
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But you're not asking for the ability for survivor to show skill. That's possible even right now. You're asking for the ability for survivor's skill to have a much greater impact in the game regardless of situation (if every situation also has counterplay now). It's the survivor equivalent of nurse level of versatility and impact at Freddie's skill ceiling (current survivor gameplay doesn't allow for a higher skill ceiling). This is the biggest complaint ppl had when dbd first came out. Also, back when mains weren't so solidified.
Both survivor and killer have become increasingly railroaded to an average time to kill, due to the nature of the game. If either side isn't equally skilled to hit that railroaded time the game becomes a stomp for either side. Otherwise, 2k/ 2 escape, unless survivors decide to go for saves at egc. This is why some ppl are saying that Dbd is at its most balanced ever been.
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Its realy a 1+1+1+1 v 1.
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There was never intended to be a 1v1 aspect.
The Hatch was added so that the last survivor's only options were to give up or DC (the reasonable option), depriving thee killer of the chance to get a 4k if they deserved it.
So they added a way for the last survivor to have a reasonable chance to escape. It was still horribly flawed, relying more on luck than actual skill, but it was better than nothing.
The killer is supposed to be able to take on all 4 survivors at once if they had to. To compensate for their power, killers made extraordinarily stressful, so more people would play survivor. After all, in a 4v1 game, you need four survivors for every killer.
But none of this matters because the game is mechanically a 4v1 game. The killer has to deal with four different people, each with their own skills, experiences, and build.
The idea of dropping someone in to hunt down and win at absolute minimum three interactions (if all the survivors are literal potatoes) each with with four people with a much easier and faster objective, with the four of them equal in power to the one killer is absolute insanity.
Being a good survivor is helping out your team. If matchmaking worked, you would have teammates at your skill level that are willing to help.
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Don't see what very often?
Killers mori off first hook? If you play killer you won't. But it happened to me in red ranks every other game or every 2-3 games. It actually happens ALOT more than you think.
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Nah imo it's the players...they either dont like the way someone is playing or being tunneled or camped so they kill themselves
MOST I put that in caps because I'm not saying ALL but most killers only play to get that 4k and slug everyone with 4 gens left.
So I mean even if they did add more stuff the games gonna stay the same on side always has to be better or one side always have to have this or that. You can't please everyone. People are still going to play the way they are now, "killers lose points for camping" most again...MOST killers don't care about points. But again that's imo..
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I think its just because you play more survivor I assume so your going to see a lot of the problems with survivor in solo que but I for example play a lot of killer so I see it as pretty balanced. Except for the top tier or tryhard players that basically play to get ready for a tournament or want to bully a killer ,but there are so little games where I face these people its almost not an issue. I think why both sides see it this way where the other is op or it is easy to win is because most people who play this game aren't very good and can't admit that they are the ones who lost them the game and not because the killer had ruin undying or because the survivor had ds unbreakable. Yes these two things are op but they aren't unbeatable.
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Yes! I totally agree even tho I try to play both sides the same. All I was trying to point out to the op was yes a killer perk got changed, and so did ruin and mori's but alot has changed as survivor. Bnp (op af I know) flashlights (like a billion times) pallets (like a billion times) ALMOST all of the adddons for medkits. Slowed down gen speed when more than one person is on it, changed almost ALL of the toolboxes, changed borrowed time. Now I'm not saying that these changes weren't right for the game I'm just trying to point out how much survivors have lost compared to killers. And I'm not talking about at launch when you didn't get blocked from windows or when killers had built in noed. I mean when you look at it yes ds is annoying but counterable borrowed time same thing.
But being yanked off the hook to just be downed again and again just to be killed (doesn't matter for ds they want you dead you're dead) it gets annoying. I have 2k hours on pc alone, not to mention the probably at least 1k on ps4 and I've quit playing. It's not fun. Until they can change being tunneled and camped every game I won't touch it again.
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