More people need to play Billy
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Now it's tinkerer. Can't do a gen without him being IMMEDIATELY on you. He's far from bad.
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He's bad compared to how he used to be. Zozzy explains it well.
Old Billy was super easy to use and had flicking. New Billy is a lot clumsier with less visibility and overheats. He's a lot more punishing than old Billy.
Also BBQ is more oppressive than Tinkerer.
Tinkerer only goes off at 70%. BBQ goes off the moment he hooks someone. So he is able to chain instadowns in seconds. That's why BBQ Billy can end matches in 2 minutes. If the survivor team wasn't very good it would be a massacre. Everyone needs to know how to loop and avoid Billy or match ends very quickly.
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"They pushed his camera forward to create a massive blind spot in front of him."
Like all killers have? Billy had a tiny blindspot, could(and still can) use his ability to check inside lockers and has an instadown. If anyone needs a blindspot up close, its Billy.
"they reduced his fov."
No, all killers have the same FOV. It might seem smaller, but that's most likely due to different placement.
"they added janky movement."
His movement was always janky, his camera now follows it a bit, there isnt really an issue other than taste tho.
"they nerfed his radius at the start of the chainsaw sprint to a 90 degree cap, where as you could 360 with the sprint before the nerf."
You mean they nerfed something that couldnt be countered? Shocking. I mean, they absolutely murdered survivors, remember when survivors could infinite through 1 single window? Now killers can counter it, absolutely unplayable as survivor now.
"they gave him a stupid roar that grates on my nerves to help rank 20 survivors without thinking about the good players."
Bubba has a sound that gives away when he starts sawing instead of revving. Billy needed that too. Whether the roar sounds nice is just a matter of taste.
"They removed all good addons and destroyed his diversity."
They removed all the broken addons, he still has diversity
"they nerfed his nerfed addons and made the only good one iridescent so you never have it."
Not really, his green and yellow ones are still viable against optimal SWF.
"It wasn't just the overheat mechanic that nerfed him. They did way more and made it unpleasant to play him."
I mean, again, thats opinion, not fact.
"I also think they made him slower, but that could just be the reduced fov."
different angles make speed seem different, again, both his FOV and MS have not been changed.
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He's too add on dependent it's takes so much time to actually hit a survivor you can be right on their back and miss because you're too high. It's frustrating. I wish the developers would stop nerfing perks and killers and add ons. Survivors mains will never be happy or satisfied until all killers are care bears. If they nerf freddy or spirit or Michael im done with this game.
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Wait our complaints were heard? Didn't even know they knew about it lmao. That's a good start at least. Suppose I can get used to the dumb roar if the camera and animations get fixed.
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Honestly i play both survivor and killer and im a billy main who plays 99% of my killer games as billy,i will be brutally honest on this one. Strong billies with alot of play times like myself with the best addons and perks could end solo games in 2-3 mins,the thing is that against strong swf he was very balanced. Billy is the kiler that requires the most skills and isnt as strong as nurse for example so the nerf shouldnt be that HUGE to begin with because it takes all the fun and the diversity to one of the most iconic dbd killers. The 4.5.0 hillbilly is the 2 times nerfed billy,and im not only talking about the overheat but they nerfed much more to the point where he is unplayable for almost everyone and thats why nobody plays him. Even alot of dbd streamers like ohtofu truetalent otz coconutrts etc dont like nowadays hillbilly because of those nerfs. What the devs accomplished is seeing alot more nurses huntresses freddies hags and seeing 1/60 games a billy. If they love this game even a little bit they should reconsider those nerfs and make him at least like the first nerf to be playable.
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Hes 100% addon dependent. Without add ons hes unplayable,without exaggeration.
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I liked to play Billy a bunch in 2018/2019, but like the others have said, the lowered FOV, camera placement and the constant wabbling up and down throws me off way too much lol
Overheat isn´t so bad, it´s all the stuff that makes him very clunky to play and the new addons range from "nah" to "meh" so I totally understand why people don´t play him anymore sadge
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Can survivors get a cool down on m1 spam? they press it so often and carelessly that it deserves at minimum a 20 second cooldown between presses.
We need to make survivors think about when they should let go of a gen so only the most skilled survivors can rank up.
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So oh tofu is ######### with hillbilly? He and many billy mains voiced issue with the fov and turn changes. Many avoid the killer now. You cant claim that there is no fire when theres smoke pouring out of the house. Even behavior acknowledged there making fov and animation changes for billies saw.
Consider researching and backing up your points instead of shooting off from the hip.
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When i was finally getting good with Billy they nerfed him and I haven't touched him since then. Feels horrible to play as.
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Nobody asked for a Billy nerf though.
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Nah I'm fine with the variety we have right now. Back in the day you'd get Billies 80% of your matches and they would always run the exact same builds. I'd roll my eyes everytime I heard a chainsaw at the start of the match.
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The POV kills billy for me now.. like he's night and day alright, but not because he got much deserved nerfs, they killed his base..I can see him being played now-a-daysnfor fun, but how many High rank billies are there even left? I stopped maining him before the changes anyway, but coming back to him wasn't exactly the fit of an old glove I thought it would be....more like the fit if a well worn glove.
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i truly believe due to the low sales of leatherface who is also a chainsaw killer,they nerfed intentionally hillbilly and buffed bubba so alot of billy mains and other new players will buy leatherface. I hope now that leatherface sales are better they will reverse some billy nerfs because its a real shame what they did to the funniest killer to play on dbd and a massive disrespect and a bellow the belt hit to the ones that spend alot of time and money to billy
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They nerfed Billy much more than necessary because these amazing devs don't want you to play him anymore; they want people to drop Billy and go buy some DLCs.
It's no wonder no one wants to play a high skill killer with janky animations, the shittiest add-ons in the game, an intrusive cooldown mechanic and an annoying roar designed for rank 20 survivors.
Prepare for Huntress to get massive nerfs to the add-ons and probably some kind of cooldown to her base kit.
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Kid, who the hell are you talking about? Even some of the top Billy players from 2017 say the nerf was unnecessary. You probably haven't ever mained hillbilly, how are you going to tell people who got rank 1 with him exclusively that he wasn't changed?
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I just want other people to play other killers in general. I am so tired of seeing Leatherface, Leatherface, Leatherface, Freddy, Leatherface, Freddy, Freddy, Doctor, Doctor, Leatherface, Doctor. Every. Single. Game.
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TbF, when they nerfed billy they absolutely did a great job buffing LF, he's super fun to play AS now.
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Survivors pressing m1 doesnt zone a killer. But nice try. The actual comparison would be survivors being able to use dead hard multiple times in a chase in a pallet heavy map, which, they cant.
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If there was any FOV reduction, it was to make all FOV's the same. Which was my point. Billy's FOV isnt smaller compared to any other killer. And Tofu isnt ######### with Billy, there were many issues that have been RESOLVED since. People still avoid the killer because of the issues back then. Same reason why people avoided Nurse for the longest time, because the issues that came right after her nerf were issues that were actually problematic(recovery rates were too slow to compensate for larger maps, they were even too slow to work on maps like The Game). Those issues have been resolved.
Yes, there used to be a fire, but now people find the ashes of the original fire after the house has been refurbished and claim there must still be a fire.
Billy works exactly the same as he used to on high level play. He simply is punished for overusing his rev's. So yes, perhaps you should research the actual patchnotes on changes that have been made, and perhaps actually pick up Billy instead of claiming me to be wrong because Billy during the PTB and early release being bad. That's like saying Twins sucks because she sucked on the PTB(spoiler alert, she doesnt suck).
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Oh, you mean players like me, who have been playing since 2016? Billy from 2017 is unhealthy to the current state of the game. Maps have been made smaller, pallets have been made unsafe, windows have been blocked off, genspeeds have been slower(used to be 70 seconds per gen), toolboxes have been nerfed, genspread has been buffed, hookspawns have been buffed. Billy still being able to infinitely zone people with his power even though there are only a handful of safe pallets per game, was too overpowered for the current game. Billy can still zone people long enough to guarantee hits, or even guarantee instadowns.
Or do you want more safe pallets again?
And I have played killers like Myers, Trapper, Piggy, Demogorgon, Clown, all the way from rank 20 to rank 1. I have played killers who are considered to be weaker than current Billy. Yes, Billy needed a nerf.
You know why? You could play Billy with 0 perks and 0 addons against a full SWF team, and still win. That's like survivors running 0 perks, 0 items and still get a 4 man escape. Did you want survivors to be buffed to be able to run 0 perks and items while still getting a 4 man escape? I doubt you wanted that, so Billy needed a nerf. Same applies to old Nurse, old Nurse was able to get 4k's running 0 perks and addons. That is simply unhealthy.
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He literally has all the problems I mentioned earlier. They have not fixed him. He is horrible to play.
I have been playing survivor since the the previous update thanks to quick queue times and did not see a single Billy player.
I literally saw every other killer at least once so there must be a reason for that don't you think?
Fixing his animations will help but he is still artificially held back by the 90 degree turn limit, his STUPID roar that seriously needs to go and the pushed forward camera that is worse than any other killer.
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They overbuffed LF tho. All LF needed was either 1 more stack on his power OR a quicker speedup+higher max speed. Having 3 full stacks with higher speed AND quicker speed up is too much. I could pretty much guarantee a down within 20 seconds. 20 seconds guaranteed is not a chase. They literally removed the chasing aspect of LF. Let alone that his region of hitting walls had been reduced too, meaning its even easier to manouvre around. Bubba used to be: find a structure or be #########. Now he is simply: hope the bubba makes a mistake, or you're #########. That's not healthy design.
Back in the day, you simply needed to get closer to guarantee a down or m1 a survivor. People refusing to m1 as billy or bubba are people who I tend to call entitled killers. Because its people like that who caused Bubba to be overbuffed. IMO, all he needs is removing 1 stack, or slowing down his speedup so that people can actually make it to the window of the basement if there is a BT triggered. Right now, its impossible for you to even hop through the window if he catches you halfway through the stairs to the basement, which is simply too powerful.
If being fun to play as requires chases to be removed entirely, then you're playing the wrong game.
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People are calling nurse moving, blink spam so.. I would say it is a good comparison.
If a Billy chainsaw "spams" you then that is beneficial to you since the distance you gain each cool down is enough to avoid the next saw or reach safety every time.
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Billy just feels gross to play as.
Your camera is constantly bobbing and getting jerked around, your power is mostly dependent on tile RNG (Not that it ever wasn't without addons), weird pushed-in FoV, annoying sound cues...
Not surprising that Billies are either 2000 hour curve gods or fresh meat.
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Back in the day, yes, Nurse had a blink spam. Now she doesnt.
As for a Billy, no, it was literally impossible considering Billy had 360 degrees turnability while revving while also being able to ride along walls. Essentially: The only playstyle against revving Billies was the playstyle you have against T1 Myers, except that Billies could ride along a wall and hit you before you were able to drop a pallet.
Old Billy was a reason to add more safe pallets to maps. Effectively harming all other killers. Billy didnt need a nerf in his power, which he didnt get, you can still instadown people. Billy needed a nerf in his zoning. Which he did get.
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Oh boohoo, being forced to use addons in a game that constantly supplies you with addons. Seriously, why do people think using a killer addonless is the way to go? Addons are part of killer builds, they empower aspects of your ability or add functions your basekit doesnt have access to. Your basekit should not be powerful enough to work on its own against a strong survivor team. A strong survivor team uses items, addons and perks. Having any killer being able to match up with that without having to use any addons or perks is a killer that is the definition of unbalanced.
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Funny that you say that because that's my point:
They removed Billy's good addons. He now is always relegated to certain tiles, curve Billy is a thing of the past when you're not up against a sack of potatoes.
Don't get me wrong, Billy is still a decent killer but my point stands that he simply isn't fun anymore.
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Like all killers should. No killer should be able to get 3k's without addons vs strong survivors. You literally gain more addons than you can ever use in this game. There is no reason for a killer to never use addons.
Now, that doesnt mean all addons are useful. I have a stack of 186 addons on Myers that I will likely never use. But if I were to use Myers "addonless", I would use those addons.
I mean, let me put it like this: that's like facing a 4 man squad SWF running 0 perks and still getting a 4 man escape. Do you want people to get 4 escapes without using any perks or items? Because survivor is unplayable without any perks against a killer of equal skill that does run perks.
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Hay the extremely homogeneous killer pool you see is from survivors crying for endless killer nerfs.
(Being hypothetical for sake of example) If only 3 killers are worth playing you'll only see 3 killers.
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I mean, I agree that some of his addons need to be more fun, but I am also certain that a lot of addons are currently ignored by players because they dont seem fun, even though there is going to be a build that will absolutely make some of those addons OP.
Remember Renjiro's Bloody Glove being the hilariously terrible addon that no one used, untill Monto came in, looked at it in a different aspect and came up with a build that made it absolutely godlike?
I used to be a survivor main, there are a lot of addons I use that pure killer mains think are trash, because they never played survivor, they have no clue how much power those addons could have. I play killer much more often now due to queue times, but there are still a lot of addons that I dont think are weak, they either lack a single perk, or a single effect that seperates it from being decent to being godlike. Take Myer's movementspeed increase while stalking. The only issue I have is that its not really useful due to it applying flatly onto both speeds. However, his movementspeed when stalking normally(without seeing any survivor) makes him almost as fast as Windstorm Wraith without needing to uncloak. Add in PWYF and you can reach near Spirit levels of speed. I prefer Jewelry Box over Boyfriend's Memo on closed maps, because the movementspeed increase is much better than that slight increase in lunge. The only alteration I would have there, is adding a tremendous MS increase to stalking normal survivors on both addons.
Addons needing slight alteration to make a killer fun again and having a balanced killer are 2 seperate issues.
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It shows you dont know how billy is now,the ptb billy is the nowadays billy. He is the 2 times nerfed billy that we have now,after the ptb he was on a good state but they nerfed him AGAIN and now we have an underperforming hillbilly that isnt fun to play due to the extremely fast overheat. His addons are crap and useless because even the double engravings cant be used due to the fast overheat. If billy needed a nerf it SHOULDNT be that big because its the only killer that have been nerfed 2 times in this game,he is the the current 2 times nerfed champion of killers
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For me is impossible win against good billys sometimes looks my teammates and me forget how to play against him because is rare see a good one, but yes is sad see a lot of freddys because Freddy is easy to use and billy needs practice and the nerf gave him a bad name but I'm main Billy I still notice his strong, it hurts that many see him weaker
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Firstly fov wise billy needs more visibility his saw has huge issues connecting mid range vs competent survivors and visibility and correction become nightmarishly difficult post changes. This creates a lot of the curving issues billy mains have been stressing. Not only that but add on changes have massively reduced his turning capabilities with absolutly awful replacements like mother helpers. He is not in a good state and as is referenced in this forum the devs have gone on record saying they have plans to improve his fov as they do not suit his gameplay.
No every killer fov shouldnt all be the same fov wise it will need vary depending on how the killer plays. Making a power clunky to balance it is horrible game design. No dev worth there salt makes something feel clunky because that kind of game design creates frustration. Tofu payed bily post ptb very recently i will link it below and his opinion hasnt changed. Also the twins being good isnt the issue people have with them. Its that her gameplay has one playstyle that is infuriating and prone to long cooldowns due to massove distance lost when using victor. This killer has not gotten a good reputation as fun to play or enjpyable insisting there good dosent track with the wider opinion from the killer community.
Frustration in the context im talking about is a punishing elememt of a killers gameplay that results in a circumstance massively handicaping the player for a prolonged period of time ie terrible game design. Blight is a great example of a kiler being punished for failling or missing with there power without being aggravating to the point of putting a majority of players off playing him. His cds are short and is always gaining some distance.
Cooldowns are suppose to be used sparingly aggresively long cooldowns in short games like dbd makes the killer horrible to play and aggravating to learn. Saying git gud bear with the steep painful learning curve and suffer through prolonged cooldowns is bad game design. People's greatest joy with billy has always been the ability to saw accross the map drifting freely across the map additional obstructions in reworked maps worse turning and anxiety induced by his overheat mechanic robbed him of his main appeal.
3:16 this is his current viewpoint on billy. Unless there was some massive patch note changes the video should still be in date.
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You mean the overheat mechanic? Not really, essentially the nerf made the overheat mechanic practically useless as it was still too easy to zone. The problem with the overheat mechanic was the speed that it accumulated. Losing 5 charges per second was almost equal to losing 6.6 charges per second when it overheats. The other way to balance that was to lose 3 charges per second when its overheating(which, honestly, could work considering 2 addons of his only work when the chainsaw is overheating, and they can actually be good). The biggest issue PTB billy had was that he accumulated too many charges, and lost too little. They reduced the accumulation, perhaps not as much as they should, but Billy is in a balanced area. He is just not fun to play(which is a seperate issue, there are more killers that are balanced and not really fun to play). Essentially, this discussion from my point is whether he is balanced or not, and from your point seems to be more whether or not he is fun to play. Which, again, are different discussions.
Thats false, Legion has been nerfed twice, Doctor had been nerfed multiple times, Myers too. Unless you mean twice in the same patch? Then sure, but I mean, the patch was dedicated to reworking Bubba and Billy so it makes sense to work on them. Essentially, out of all original killers, Billy was practically left untouched. He was balanced on release, but the game has been changed a lot. Perks have been changed a lot. Maps have been changed a lot. It simply was not up for discussion that Billy needed a rework.
He is less fun to play, I agree. He is more clanky to use, I agree. Because of these reasons, Billy is underperforming even though he is mechanically balanced. But lets be honest, Billy has been in the spotlight for years. Even though it's sad right now, there are a lot of other killers that have not been 100% fun to play. Trapper is one of the least fun killers to play as, it's been like that for years. Pig, while sometimes fun to play, requires very specific perks and addons to be fun to play. I get that it sucks, but IMO, the focus should be more on making unfun killers more fun to play, over making old fun killers fun to play again.
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What about OhTofu? He has legacy and was a billy main, but he himself said he was so different and that he is finding it difficult to play him now.
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They would never add such a bad mechanic to survivors, but I can see them doing this to killers. /s
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Not really, his green and yellow ones are still viable against optimal SWF.
Do you have a source?
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Unfortunately due to the nerf to his radius at the start of the chainsaw sprint to a 90 degree cap, where as you could 360 with the sprint before the nerf playing billy is worst than playing nurse. It is the biggest problem for me with the fast over overheat mechanic. If they fix those two things people will play billy
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Deathslinger Doesn't need a nerf. He is weak on Map pressure 100% if against good survivors. Idc how good of a shot you are AS slinger, you will 100% ALWAYS lose against survivors with a actual brain, He's a 110% killer that is forced to walk across a map, in which half the maps are very bad for him,
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You must've been facing Potato's. ngl, If the survivors are Good enough... not getting a single chainsaw at all, Billy nerf shouldn't have happened Period,
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The nerf was not that huge but the number of Billys I see as survivor these days..Billy is almost non existant. That is not good and it can't be what they wanted.
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unfortunately the nerf is huge!!!!!! They destroyed billy. They fixed their mistakes with the hud and they sorted out a patch in not even a week to please survivor player,they should fix their mistakes for killers to we should be equal. It should be a fair game,but what we see is the devs only cares about survivors.Its like the players that play killer mode are the black sheeps!!!
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