Freddy Rework
Here are some ideas that could make Freddy a force to be reckoned with. I do have a lot of them, and I may actually miss a few ideas. This idea is to make the Physical World (PW) and the Dream World (DW) even more separate from each other.
New Dream World: The PW and the DW become further separated from each other that have differing effects on the other. Nearly everything that happens in the PW will affect the DW. The DW "updates" whenever someone falls asleep providing new information and limitations. Things in the PW that affect the DW: completed generators, opened exit gates, hook sabotage, etc. Things in the DW that affect the PW: injury and death of asleep survivors. The DW becomes a bit brighter than it currently is to allow all players to see easier, but still have the "falling ash" effect to show it is the DW. Players in the DW can see survivors in the PW, but cannot interact with them (except for Freddy putting them to sleep).
Dream Transition: Instead of having survivors sleep walking, they simply fall to the ground as if in the dying state (the Knock Out effect, no scream, notification, or aura will be shown to awake survivors regardless of range). Their vision will become more and more blurred as they transition, and they will remain where they fell asleep until they are awakened. They will have the Dream VFX, but their portrait will still reflect their status in the game regardless if they are in the DW or the PW. When awakened, they will resume control of their character from where they fell asleep, regardless of what their condition was in the DW. If they were woken up while healthy in the DW, they will stay healthy. If they were injured, dying, being carried, or hooked in the DW, they will wake up injured. Asleep survivors cannot be healed in the PW until they are woken up.
Waking Up: An awake survivor must find the body of an asleep survivor to wake them up (making Bond or Empathy a must against Freddy). The process to wake up will take twice as long, and when waking them up, the survivor in the DW will not be able to move while someone is waking them up. A survivor killed or sacrificed in the DW will have no prompt to wake them up. Waking yourself up will change to a token-based system requiring failed skill checks to gain tokens. It will require at least 2 tokens to wake yourself up (can be increased with add-ons).
Items and Chests: Items and Chests in the DW will have a separate purpose than in the PW. Items brought into the match and found in chests in the PW can ONLY be used in the PW. When falling asleep, the survivor will not have access to their items. While alive, they will still be holding their items, so they don't have to worry about awake survivors stealing their items, but when they die, their item can be taken by another survivor. They can search chests in the DW, and will only provide Med-Kits or Flashlights (no maps, keys, or toolboxes). Survivors holding an item in the DW while being woken up will leave that item in the DW wherever they were before they were woken up.
Unhooking Survivors: Hooking a survivor no longer wakes them up. When a survivor is hooked, they are only hooked in the DW, as their body has not moved since they fell asleep. There are two ways to unhook them: a survivor in the DW must unhook them normally, or a survivor in the PW must wake them up. This will prevent awake survivors from body blocking Freddy, as only asleep survivors can body block him now.
Progression: Generators cannot progress in the DW, because they exist in the PW. They can be "worked on" in the DW in order to fail skill checks, but they are only there to provide skill checks. Failing a generator skill check in the DW will not affect the generator in the PW. Exit Gates opened in the PW will not affect the DW until someone falls asleep after they have been opened. Exit Gates opened in the DW will not cause the PW Exit Gates to become open when someone wakes. Totems in the PW and the DW will be separate (meaning there will be 10 totems when facing Freddy), and Hex Totems will only exist in the DW. Cleansing a totem in the PW will not cleanse the DW counterpart.
Please let me know what you think of these changes, and see what you would like changed.
Comments
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Freddy's add-on adjustments:
Sheep Block (Common) +1 second to wake asleep survivors.
Green Dress (Uncommon) -1 second to wake asleep survivors.
Cat Block (Uncommon) +3 seconds to wake up asleep survivors. +1 token to wake yourself up.
Unicorn Block (Rare) +3 seconds to wake up asleep survivors. +1 token to wake yourself up.
Pill Bottle (Very Rare) When a survivor is awakened, their location is revealed.
Class Photo (Very Rare) +4 seconds to wake up asleep survivors. -1 token to wake yourself up. Get notified when an awake survivor begins to wake up an asleep survivor.
"Z" Block (Very Rate) +4 seconds to wake up asleep survivors. +1 token to wake yourself up.
Red Paint Brush (Ultra Rare) +4 seconds to wake up asleep survivors. +2 tokens to wake yourself up.0 -
This is amazing! Why hasn't this been seen by every single dev at Behavior yet?
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See at least he actually has his own world like in the movies.... but from what I've read freddy's still that regular m1 boring killer... anything for the chase?0
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@Bravo0413 said:
See at least he actually has his own world like in the movies.... but from what I've read freddy's still that regular m1 boring killer... anything for the chase?Freddy should have more time to chase survivors, since it's harder for survivors to wake themselves up. The only things that would stop chases with this idea is if the survivor consistently loops him to allow more time for them to be woken up mid-chase. Some additional ideas for chases:
- 2 new Freddy add-ons akin to the Crescent Moon and New Moon Offerings that would darken the Dream World. Freddy would be able to perceive everything with white outlines (survivors, obstacles, props, walls, etc.), effectively removing all survivor stealth. Could also add tokens to wake self and add time to be woken.
- Freddy's Clawed Glove (M1) would be able to cause the Bleeding status effect as a base kit, and he would be able to perceive blood easier than other killers (I think the Wraith can do the same thing while cloaked), and would be a good combo with Bloodhound.
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@Bravo0413 Perhaps to make it a bit more interesting, for every 30 seconds a survivor is in the Dream World, it takes 3 extra second for another survivor to wake them up (up to 15 extra seconds), and 1 extra token for them to wake themselves (up to 3 extra tokens)
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This is genius, but if I may ask, you got any rework ideas for Freddy's perks?0
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@TheMadDoctor I don't have any experience with his perks, but I have seen them in action, so I can only recommend based on that.
FIRE UP:
The increased pressure of losing your preys fills you with anger and gives you unsuspected motivation. Each time the Survivors complete repairs on a Generator, Fire Up gains a token and grants a 3/4/5% speed bonus to pick up, drop, Pallet break, Generator break and vaults per token.REMEMBER ME:
You become obsessed with one Survivor. Each time you hit your Obsession, you increase the opening time of the Exit Gates and Hatch by 5 seconds up to a maximum of 20 additional/25 additional/30 additional seconds.
The Obsession is not affected by Remember Me.
Only one Obsession per trial.BLOOD WARDEN:
When the Exit Gates are powered, summon The Entity to block the exits for all Survivors for 60/90/120 seconds. Each time you hook a survivor after the Exit Gates are powered, The Entity blocks the exits for an additional 10/15/20 seconds (does not apply when The Entity has stopped blocking the exits). While Blood Warden is active, Auras of Survivors located within the Exit Gates are revealed to you.0 -
Logically speaking there are some solid ideas here. I do think that it could go very south for survivors though. For example, let's say I put survivor A asleep. I then pursue survivor A. While I'm actively pursuing survivor A, survivor B can go to survivor A's body and attempt to wake them up. The notion that survivor A would be rooted in place when survivor B is trying to wake him up is super broken. So now the running survivor is completely screwed by his buddy! Survivors farming other survivors is already bad enough in this game.
So now that survivor A is completely screwed over by survivor B, I carry survivor A to a hook near his body. Now I can camp survivor A's body while putting survivor B in a sleep state relatively close to Survivor A's body. So now I can camp survivor B's body while still camping survivor A. But it's cool cause by the time Survivor A dies, survivor B will have gotten himself out of the dream state, but since I'm located next to his physical body I can just put him right back to sleep and begin the process again. Basically, as long as Freddy remains near the physical body of a survivor that survivor can literally never get out of the dream state because as soon as they manage to fail TWO skill checks, he can just immediately put them to sleep again.
If Freddy ever catches as second survivor attempting to wake up a sleeping survivor he can put them to sleep right next to each other and camp multiple bodies. Freddy is already kind of cancer to play against because almost every Freddy just tunnels constantly, but this rework would cause survivors to constantly DC when Freddy is the killer. No one wants that.
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@Dreamnomad said:
Logically speaking there are some solid ideas here. I do think that it could go very south for survivors though. For example, let's say I put survivor A asleep. I then pursue survivor A. While I'm actively pursuing survivor A, survivor B can go to survivor A's body and attempt to wake them up. The notion that survivor A would be rooted in place when survivor B is trying to wake him up is super broken. So now the running survivor is completely screwed by his buddy! Survivors farming other survivors is already bad enough in this game.So now that survivor A is completely screwed over by survivor B, I carry survivor A to a hook near his body. Now I can camp survivor A's body while putting survivor B in a sleep state relatively close to Survivor A's body. So now I can camp survivor B's body while still camping survivor A. But it's cool cause by the time Survivor A dies, survivor B will have gotten himself out of the dream state, but since I'm located next to his physical body I can just put him right back to sleep and begin the process again. Basically, as long as Freddy remains near the physical body of a survivor that survivor can literally never get out of the dream state because as soon as they manage to fail TWO skill checks, he can just immediately put them to sleep again.
If Freddy ever catches as second survivor attempting to wake up a sleeping survivor he can put them to sleep right next to each other and camp multiple bodies. Freddy is already kind of cancer to play against because almost every Freddy just tunnels constantly, but this rework would cause survivors to constantly DC when Freddy is the killer. No one wants that.
Hmm, you bring up a good point. I can offer 2 additional ideas to counter this behavior. I had initially suggested where waking a survivor would "freeze" the asleep survivor was to avoid "breaking" the game by having an asleep survivor running in one area of the map, then suddenly, they are teleported to another area of the map while running (which depends on how it's coded). I do see a potential problem with waking a survivor in struggle mode, what would be done to prevent killing them instantly. The workaround I have for this is when the survivor is woken up, they experience a 2 second stun when they wake up to allow for the game and them time to adjust to their new surroundings.
For Freddy camping the bodies, what I can suggest is a cool down from when a survivor awakes to when Freddy can put them back asleep, so that way, they aren't constantly in the Dream World. The cool down could be 20-30 seconds (if 30 seconds is too long), that way, a survivor will have enough time to get away, and Freddy can't spam sleep them.
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The real fundamental problem is that it is too complicated. Every fix makes it even more complicated. Freddy's ability needs to be explainable inside a tool-tip. If you have to write an essay to explain all the inner workings of his abilities then it will be too complicated for DBD. Especially for newer players. New players already are confused by Freddy in his current state.
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While I agree making it too complicated is understandable. New people are actually confused by Freddy? Despite the fact, this is my opinion, I felt Freddy is very simple, yet his dreamworld idea feels like a handicap currently. To the point where a buff isn't good enough for him. This feels like it could make freddy a viable killer.Dreamnomad said:The real fundamental problem is that it is too complicated. Every fix makes it even more complicated. Freddy's ability needs to be explainable inside a tool-tip. If you have to write an essay to explain all the inner workings of his abilities then it will be too complicated for DBD. Especially for newer players. New players already are confused by Freddy in his current state.
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Ok. Heres an ingenious idea. Give Freddy his Robert England counterpart costume. Even just a color swap sweeter would be great.0
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I have a very similar idea typed out in my computer’s documents. I’m so glad I’m not the only one who thinks that survivors’ bodies should stay put after being put to sleep.
One of the things I’ve spent a considerable time thinking about was the way survivors interact with hooked survivors. I didn’t think it was very fair if a survivor could be woken up while on Freddy’s shoulder, and I’m sure being woken up into the real world while on a hook is going to make a mess of the coding. If what is suggested happens in some sense or another, my best guess for balance is for a survivor to be sent back to their body, awake after being hooked, completely skipping the first phase of the hook. It’s far more akin to having a scary nightmare than the current system. Additionally, this feature makes up for the fact that Freddy could lose a survivor at any moment while chasing them if someone finds their body. This only causes problems in the altruistic points section of the game, but I’m sure that can be fixed.
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