Solution to the "Holding W" Problem
Personally, i feel that the best way to fix this issue is making sure all killers have some form of alternative power, like freddy, or general power element, like spirit or legion, based on movement. In my opinion all killers should have at least two elements to their powers to increase skill cap and make gameplay more interesting. So having a good chase power and a smaller power that helps with movement or a good movement ability and a smaller power to help in chases or another aspect of the game seems like the correct way to balance killers.
Killers seem to get unbalanced when they lack any mobility, clown or trapper, have a underwhelming movement ability with almost nothing else, wraith, or have a power that gives them great mobility with no draw back in chase, spirit.
Map size/layout issues that do not allow killers to properly cut-off survivors also need to be addressed, looking at Midwitch primarily.
Also, personally I do not have much of an issue with "Holding W" but when you get a swf with great coordination, and potentially OoO it does make the game unfun, due to lack of actual looping and mind games, and extremely unbalanced, same as tunneling.
Comments
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Michael needs his movie teleport confirmed. He can tp as long as hes not seen lol. Just smack a survivor they go behind something and suddenly hes infront of them and smacks them down.
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Outside of Mother's Dwelling, Midwich, and maybe Haddonfield... the "Holding W" problem isn't one. Most killers have Mobility, Range, or Stealth to mitigate it... or are a territorial Killer who shouldn't be following any Survivor who does it. Also there's a decent number of Killer Perks who can further mitigate it.
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Oni and Billy exist?
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Too difficult.
Chases should just have a different trigger mechanic, so that it wouldn't take ages to close the gap between you can survivor if you're following right after them but too far away to trigger chase&initiate bloodlust.
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There is no 'holding W' problem, it's all in your head.
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just play blight. Blight go vrooom ima nascar
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Have you tried holding W?
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I have. It works vs Killers who don't know how to counter it. When I'm on Killer I usually have very few issues with it.
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It would be easier to change big maps or maps with no way of catching up like Haddonfield.
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Gitting gud is out of the list?.
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The solution to holding W lol. Basically a certain DBD player made a video where in a specific circumstance while going after only person they gain a lot of distance. So somehow people now think this is OP? Laughable
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Your Survivors must be very bad at holding W then.
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More like I purposefully have a playstyle or build that makes holding W nearly impossible or significantly less strong most of the time. When Tier 1 Myers abruptly steps around the corner 1 meter away from you, you barely have enough time to not get Gen Grabbed much less hold W and unless the Survivor does something dumb, I don't continue the chase post hit. My Legion build has M&A and Trail of Torment in it for a reason. I run Sloppy on a lot of Killers so switching targets post M1 is much more viable.
The only way holding W is a problem is if the Killer lets it be one... except for a few badly designed maps that are still in the game.
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Sounds to me like you have Survivors who lack situational awareness. The strategies you're describing can be W keyed by just, you know, having eyes and ears. And if that fails, run Spine Chill.
Also, Sloppy is garbage. Just saying. Even ignoring the fact that Survivors have enough healing Perks to give any DBD player a shortcut through medical school, Sloppy barely adds any time to healing at all.
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...
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@ManWithALemon How many times you gonna move the goalpost? If you can't catch a 'Hold W' survivor, that's on you bud. Sure, some maps that still need a rework make it a challenge sometimes but not enough to make it a problem.
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Holding W is difficult when you don't know you need to do it. Which is literally the entire point of the Undetectable Status and using bits of level geometry to break Line of Sight. The only time it doesn't work is if the gen is out in the open or they have Spine Chill, and Spine Chill is actually not super common.
Sloppy buys you 6.4 seconds per injury outside of survivor healing perks or medkits which isn't too bad. Also it gives me 20% longer to spot and ambush them when they do heal with Nurses Calling. Then... downing someone mid heal can buy me more time than a single instance of Pop. Despite what you seem to be implying, I do know what I'm doing... and it has been working for me.
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"Which is literally the entire point of the Undetectable Status and using bits of level geometry to break Line of Sight. The only time it doesn't work is if the gen is out in the open or they have Spine Chill, and Spine Chill is actually not super common."
"The only time it doesn't work is if the gen is out in the open"
Even if the gen isn't out the open, Survivors' wide, third person camera allows them to peek around all kinds of corners. They can survey a huge portion of their surroundings even despite walls. And it's not even that hard to do. Just look around you as you're on a gen.
"Spine Chill is actually not super common."
What rank 20 matches are you getting that people don't run Spine Chill? I see it every single game.
"Sloppy buys you 6.4 seconds per injury outside of survivor healing perks or medkits which isn't too bad."
Where the hell did you get these numbers from? That's not true at all.
Sloppy reduces healing by 20%. It changes the speed at which you are healed at base from 1 charge per second to 0.8. Healing requires 16 charges. 16 / 0.8 = 20. It adds 4 seconds. Or at least, it's supposed to. I heard from somewhere that it's actually bugged and only adds 3 seconds of healing time. Even if it's not bugged, though, 4 seconds is barely nothing. Even if you injure all 4 Survivors, that's 16 extra seconds, less than one-fifth of a generator. It's garbo.
"Then... downing someone mid heal can buy me more time than a single instance of Pop."
I don't even know how you made this absurd deduction.
"Despite what you seem to be implying, I do know what I'm doing... and it has been working for me."
I really highly doubt you do if you don't even know the numbers behind the Perk you rate so highly.
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If a W key Survivor gets caught against the majority of Killers, that's on them*
ftfy
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It's been stated for a long time that large maps are problematic for multiple reasons. This is just one more. Smaller maps would alleviate the issue without requiring new mechanics or changed mechanics.
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I am aware of Survivor's 3rd person camera. I'm wondering what kind of camera you've got if you think you can see most of what's going on around you when you're on a generator that's inside a Jungle Gym.
I'm in red ranks. Most people up there are much more scared of tunneling, slugging, and camping than what I do. Because of that, I don't see much in the way of Spine Chill or Healing perks. It's not unheard of mind you... but lobbies with zero spine chill is FAR more common than lobbies with four spine chill. 4 DS is way more common.
Then Sloppy is even better. 32 * 0.2 is what I did. Yes a survivor healing another takes 16 seconds, but that requires 2 Survivors to stay put. That means that total amount of time the Survivor team loses by healing is 16 * 2 or 32 seconds. If dbd is calculating things your way, then a 2 person heal takes 20 seconds for a total of 40 seconds of lost Survivor time.
The heal progress bar disappears into the ether if you down a Survivor before it completes. If 2 survivors are 15 seconds through their 20 second heal and I stab the person with the heal bar before it completes... well they can kiss that 30 seconds of time goodbye. That's 10 more seconds than Pop will buy you. Its from a different source and can end up being less than Pop's 20 seconds but it still works quite well. That doesn't even count all the time you save if they haven't even started running before you stabbed them. Closing the distance when the Survivor isn't moving is so much easier.
As for the numbers... well... its dbd. They do math weird and I forgot that when I wrote that.
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The solution to the problem is to stop holding on to literally every word a streamer says.
Also, who thinks killer needs more options on midwich it's already a killer sided map, while I agree the design of that map is terrible and actually is an example where holding W is boring and a problem, if you just gave the killer MORE options on that map you would literally render it nearly unwinnable for survivors.
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As for the numbers... well... its dbd. They do math weird and I forgot that when I wrote that.
They do not, no. You're just confusing speed and time. If interaction speed (measured in charges per second) is decreased by 20%, then why are you multiplying the time (measured in seconds) by 20%?
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The fact that you know the difference between speed and time gives me hope for the future (of this forum).
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"I am aware of Survivor's 3rd person camera. I'm wondering what kind of camera you've got if you think you can see most of what's going on around you when you're on a generator that's inside a Jungle Gym."
I have a camera. That I USE. To LOOK AROUND.
And if that fails, I also have EARS. That I USE. To LISTEN to my surroundings.
You can go on about Trail or Monitor or Tinkerer all you want. Unless your Killer is a stealth Killer, they're going to have a Terror Radius for 99% of the game, so even if you're playing against the resurrected corpse of Louis Braille, they're gonna know you're coming.
"'m in red ranks. Most people up there are much more scared of tunneling, slugging, and camping than what I do. Because of that, I don't see much in the way of Spine Chill or Healing perks. It's not unheard of mind you... but lobbies with zero spine chill is FAR more common than lobbies with four spine chill. 4 DS is way more common."
I see Spine Chill pretty much every game. Matches where it's in groups of two or even 3+ are not uncommon. Probably because it's one of the best non-second chance Perks in the game.
"Then Sloppy is even better. 32 * 0.2 is what I did. Yes a survivor healing another takes 16 seconds, but that requires 2 Survivors to stay put. That means that total amount of time the Survivor team loses by healing is 16 * 2 or 32 seconds. If dbd is calculating things your way, then a 2 person heal takes 20 seconds for a total of 40 seconds of lost Survivor time."
40 seconds of lost Survivor time... condensed down into 20.
And then 20 seconds later, they're back on a gen. That's assuming they even heal, which they might not because if they have Spine Chill, Sprint Burst, E key, coms, or EYES AND EARS, they're probably not going to be that scared of the Killer sneaking up on them.
"The heal progress bar disappears into the ether if you down a Survivor before it completes. If 2 survivors are 15 seconds through their 20 second heal and I stab the person with the heal bar before it completes... well they can kiss that 30 seconds of time goodbye. That's 10 more seconds than Pop will buy you. Its from a different source and can end up being less than Pop's 20 seconds but it still works quite well."
You say this like Sloppy healing takes literally any time. At all. It doesn't. If they want to heal, they'll be healed before you get there. And if you slug, you better stay on top of that slug because if you don't, they'll be healed before you come back.
And all this math you're doing also does not take into account things like medkits or Inner Strength or the absolute MYRIAD of other healing items Survivors can bring that make healing take like 2 microseconds. So that's even less time wasted and even less time to get that down.
"Closing the distance when the Survivor isn't moving is so much easier."
Sure, it's easy to get close when they're standing completely still. And when they're running away? You move a measly 15% faster than they do. That's why W key is a problem. Because if the Survivor starts running when you're more than an atom's width away from them, Killers who don't have powerful mobility or good range (which is a lot of Killers) catch up so pathetically slowly it's unreal. And given the amount of tools Survivors have to up their situational awareness, from a giant FoV to Spine Chill to SWF comms, they're more than likely going to know you're coming before you do.
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Pretty much, no one that I saw complained about it on the forums and now suddenly I've seen numerous posts in one day lol.
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Look at the OP's name, seems a little similar to something don't it? lol
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Ah yes didn't catch that lol. Another sheep echoing their master.
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Wow this post got a lot of comments. And lol I barely watch TruTalent, though I have seen his video, mostly just to see what everyone was talking about. I made this in response to all the posts talking about the "hold W problem". As I said it isn't even problematic most of the time and is rarely an issue.
My main point is that all killers should have some kind of secondary ability to increase skill cap and some aspect of their power should help with movement. This would reduce the overall rng of the game by making even big maps less awful and allow for more overall balance between killers.
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True, idk what is he talking about. If a survivor manages to escape a killer by just holding W then he needs more practice.
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