The "camping/tunneling takes no skill" myth needs to be put to rest.
We've all seen it, the killer camps, the survivors complain after the game it takes no skill and it's a cheap way to win etc.
Consider this however, when you watch tournaments camping and tunneling plays a huge part. Some of the very best players in this game resort to camp & tunnel, and recently watching Otz go for his 50 wins streak as Clown I've been surprised by how quickly he resorts to this tactic.
The reason I say this is because I'm seeing it consistently with rank 1 players now....they just hold W. There's no skill involved, there's nothing complex to it, you just hold W as much as possible to try and get the killer walking all across the map.
When survivors play like this, this low effort, high time-wasting way it's really damn powerful. It's essentially the equivalent of camping. When survivors play like this and try to pull you to the far edges of the map while their friends hammer the gens - something we saw the pro teams do in hexy's tournament last year, sometimes you have to pull out all the stops yourself and if you get a basement hook and a central gen you gotta make use of your strong position ya know?
I get why nobody likes it but it's sometimes an essential tactic given the state of balance in the game. Again don't take my word for it, just look at all the 5000+ hour pro players doing it.
To that effect it's interesting how killers are punished for it via points. I wonder how survivors would feel if them holding W for too long, or looping a god window 3 times gave a punishment.
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You explained how holding w takes no skill but you still haven't explained yet how camping and tunneling takes skill.
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Skill aside, is it just now valid because pro players use it? Lol
I do love a good Otz video, but I don't see him nor the others as end all be alls of DbD techniques
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If a killer camps they are literally being rewarded for sitting still with your hands off the keyboard. No game should reward players for a lack of gameplay.
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It literally takes no skill but okay.
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In my opinion camping takes no skill. Like seriously what is skillful about staying in one place for a long time to get 1 kill because you protected the hook? And most it's effective because survivors make it effective I survivors weren't too altruistic then it would not work well.
Tunneling I could maybe see taking skill because it's chase oriented, but camping no I don't see it.
To me holding w and camping are comparable because they both take no skill to do and is effective when done.
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Okay so tunneling/camping is part of high-level play...
How have you proven that it takes skill to do? If anything this is a testament to how absolutely, indisputably boring high MMR matches will be if the system ends up pitting actually skillful players against one another.
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Camping is not an efficient way to win the battle I agree it does not take skill and I tend not to do it.
If survuviurs weren't so fast at trying to be alaristic and unhooking straight away and looping near the hook the camping would probably slow down.
I still don't see whaly killers camp because if all the survivours split up on gens then he losses the game with a 1k
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It's sad how "professional" players endorse toxic behaviour
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That's how tournaments are played though.
It's literally the unfun zone in terms of gameplay for both
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Yeah I guess that makes sense - play to win no matter what it takes. I've just seen so many videos of popular streamers being super toxic and I can easily see how people would think it's cool and fun to copy
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I feel like saying "camping is toxic" like saying "it's toxic for survivors to do generators while injured". They both have pros and cons but neither one of them is done purely to make the otherside miserable. If the player thinks it's advantageous to stick around a hook, then they can do that but losing generators comes with it. Just like an injured survivor sitting on gens risk getting hooked faster....except they have perks that let them do that coughExhaustionPerkscough while killers have.... uh .. i don't know, I guess a stacked devour totem right next to the hook.
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U mean the Japanese tourmant? Which they used the Pig in the final? Lmao.
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Camping isn’t fun, & usually not the intention of the killer (unless they are tilted from the last game), but getting 3 hooks, & 7-9k blood points isn’t fun either.
Higher level survivors, are Gen efficient, no question. A match where all 4 survivors split up, and each get on a Gen = 3 Gens complete before a killer gets the first hook, unless the first survivor he found makes a mistake, & gets downed quickly. During the rotation, 1 survivor goes for the hook, the other 2 locate, & start doing 1 of the 4 remaining Gens. The killer has a choice here, patrol the hook, & have a high probability of getting hands on the rescuer, or patrol the Gens leaving the hooked survivor to be quickly rescued, & join the Gen party.
This scenario may vary, but is usually the case when not playing a high mobility killer. Another option is to secure a 3 Gen scenario, but that runs a huge risk of ending with a key escape. So the killer doesn’t have a huge amount of choices other than finding the weakest survivor, & counting on the other survivors to come to the rescue. Not super fun, but until more objectives are brought into the game, that’s the world we live in.
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Skill is the wrong word to use
Playing "Smart" is the right word to use.
I'm getting tired of people pretending this game actualy requires skill beyond mind games and common sense - something most people lack.
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camping takes no skill that is true but m1 holding doesn't take much skill either. When a survivor holds m1 they can argue that they are efficient but when I say I downed someone, hook him and see nobody through BBQ (either they are near or hide in a locker) and decide to not leave the area I get called a baby killer and that I'm bad at the game. Yeah I'm bad because I play the most efficient way.
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6/10 bait post. Got people talking.
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I guess I didn't put my point across well enough.
People say if you camp you have no skill, you're a bad player etc etc but all of the highest level players use these tactics because you have to. The game is unbalanced everyone knows that and at the high level you need to use every kind of strategy to win.
I'm fed up of survivors dictating what takes skill in this game. Camping 1 hook and you're terrible, meanwhile they hold W in every chase.
I played spirit with stridor because as expected it was a swf with 4 iron will. Apparently I'm terrible at the game, ok but these people all needed a perk thats nothing but "press E for another chance"? and they had iron will, think about that its just a perk that turns off sounds so killers can't hear you. These are common builds too and somehow one side has twisted the narrative so that having extra chance perks and disabling all sounds is high skill but anything on the killer side is bad? I won btw, which is funny because everyone says you're bad but they lose so what does that say.
Sometimes you need to play to your characters strengths. Imagine you're playing Bubba and you have a survivor in the basement in the Myers house and some other survivor starts tbagging, wanting you to chase them through the house of pain. Why on Earth would you take that bait? why should you put yourself in a situation that is a great advantage for the other side and throw away the great hand you have?
I'm just going to play as dirty as I want to be honest. Funny how it always ends up in disconnects though. I guess thats what happens when the developer coddles you for 4 years.
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Face camping is just for tilted killers IMO. Proxy camping when a survivor is on last hook and you know the survivors are altruistic (particularly for SWF) is often a valid tactic. "A bird in the hand is better than two in the bush". I've purposely avoided proxy camping against my better judgment in the past and it nearly always comes back to bite you.
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Ok so your saying your tired of survivor hypocrisy of them pointing out strategies that take no skill without looking at their own no skill strategies.
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I'm saying playing in simple strong ways doesn't take much skill from either side so everyone needs to stop being a hypocrite. Also using camp as a tactic doesn't automatically make you a no skill killer.
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I mean you can play how you want, BHVR ain't stopping you. As long as you're having fun with the way you play.
I don't really get why you're upset that people told you camping/tunneling takes zero skill. But yeah I agree camping and tunneling are necessary at times.
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Both of the things your brought up with camping/tunneling as well as holding forward neither of which take skill, just Saiyan.
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I mean, if you pick a bubba, get one down, and just sit on them with a chainsaw....yeah that takes no skill. Sorry.
If you tunnel someone, if you are good enough you can ream them out of a game REALLY quick by out playing them sure- but I mean all you did is bully one person so they couldn't do anything else, so I guess you outplayed one person in a game that is designed to ideally let you get them eventually....sure......
However if you are playing normally, and there are times when a target messes up and you capitalize on it even if it is tunneling them, or you have someone who is like 6 seconds from second state on hook near a gen and you camp them into the next state before leaving, like sure, that's just optimal gameplay even if the other side doesn't like it, that's just the best move generally at the time.
However if a killer beats you without taking the optimal path, you better respect it at least; most people don't and trash on clean killers who are going out of their way to give the other side some breathing room; and that's just going to make there be less and less people playing the way you want them to, and more about efficiency if you keep doing that.
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