Breakdown isn't that bad... In fact...
Hold your pitch forks and torches for a second and let me explain. (But you won't. I know who rules these forums.)
With the "bug" of having Breakdown destroy hooks for the remainder of the match, I personally think we should work with that. Make it so that Breakdown only activates once per match. But make the hooks stay gone.
Ever since the devs added extra hooks to try and combat old Saboteur, they never reverted the change even after Saboteur was nerfed into what we have today. There's an absurd amount of hooks in the maps. And the hook offerings are useless to both sides and make no visible difference. Hooks will always spawn within 20ft or less of each other.
With this change, at MOST, only 4 hooks can be destroyed per match. That's more than easy to deal with.
No one used Breakdown before (unless going for adept) because it wasn't worth using. This change won't make it meta, but I'm sure it will at least get more use.
Unused perks on both sides need changes to actually incite people to use them. This could be a step in the right direction.
Comments
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In before the people who complain about this are the same one's who complain about survivors being able to run away. "W gamers"
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I mean, people like to slug anyway.
And if people ever complain that No Mither is OP, you know they've gone off the deep end.
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I just had this on Aazarov's.
Fix the ######### perk. I do not ever want to have a UB, SG Breakdown and Prove Thyself ever again.
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It's okay, you still have like 40 more hooks.
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I literally had zero hooks on that side of the map.
Even with Iron Grasp and Agitation I wouldn't have made it to any.
I wonder if you'd want Wake Up to be a permanent 15% action speed bonus too.
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(X) Doubt
And while Wake Up does need a change. That wouldn't be it. We already have 2 perks that do that. We need perk diversity.
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There was a bug with Wake Up that caused it to give a 15% speed bonus to every action. Vaulting, healing, gate opening and repairing.
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"risky strategy"
No thats not really a risky strategy that just sounds unfun like old sabotage was unfun, permanently destroyed hook effects being stacked can easliy wipe out hooks in most maps making it impossible for the killer to hook without basement or just bleeding out survivors who can pick themselves up infinitely
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It doesn't sound like the absolute worst as long as it's only 1 per game. Would still be annoying if stacked multiple times, but at least it might see some use then.
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I was around during the old sabo days. We should never bring this back into the game unless you want killers to gain the ability to disable gens. I mean, you can always hatch out right?
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Hooks are way too inconsistent for something like this to be brought back, hooks not being permanently broken except by sacrifice was a design choice made to spare people from being subject to frequent bad map design and generations a perfect example of maps where this just straight up wouldn't be fair are swamp maps, those maps have 2 hooks on the map that are actually accessible and the rest in the corners and edges, if someone even brokedown one of the two hooks major portions of the maps become safe as most of the time your only option for a hook was whatever the nearest one that generated was or no hook at all, unless you want widespread hook increases to compensate for the potentially game breaking buff they shouldn't make a change like this
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I have a better buff to it:
Breakdown: Each time you're unhooked or unhook yourself the Hook breaks and the killer's aura is revealed to you for 4/5/6 seconds
And each time you unhook another survivor the hook breaks for 100 seconds
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As someone who plays both sides I love this idea!
I'm really hoping BHVR keeps improving perks that see little to no use on both sides. There are so many perks that could use buffing or reworking tbh
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There is a reason sabo isn't buffed. you are literally taking away the killers objective. It would be the same if a killer could permanently disable generators and trap you in game until you can use the hatch.
Stop trying to buff perks that destroy the game for killers.
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No thanks, after that sweaty Blight game against a 4-man Mither Soul Guard Breakout Breakdown team that kept running into a dead zone with no hooks for an immunity shield? This is literally just old Saboteur that can only be used once, and you have no idea how broken that'll be.
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you get that there can be 1 hook in an entire portion of the map right?
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Im going to stick with my gut feeling on this one, its not fair permanent sabotage has been in the game before and it wasn't fair then, and it certainly won't be fair now that survivors have perks to round out making it even stronger
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Let's bring old mori's back
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Its currently "fair" because not everyone knows it exists or is attempting to abuse its outer limits which is most likely the first thing that would happen if it was announced that it was an actual change instead of a bug.
Its been bugged in the game for ~2.5 weeks and has barely even been recognized of course if you see it once in a blue moon as killer or are the only one on a solo queue team with Randoms abusing it, it might seem balanced but that is quickly not going to be the case if the haphazard change is made
I can see the big picture and basing off the grand scheme and past changes to sabotage I'm going to just say no, its not fair and both shouldn't remain and shouldn't be made into an easily abusable perk unless hook quantity increased in maps especially maps like swamp
and while this is all theoretical unless it is tested on something like a ptb im going to stick with my guns and stay with my mindset that its a bad change
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######### no.
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4 hooks is plenty enough to permanently take the game hostage.
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Kinda like old sabo.
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That sounds like the worst case scenario and even less fair im just going to drop this since you can't make any actual good points other than it would be funny to troll with in swf instead of actually good for the game and balance
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Is it easier? technically yes. The only difference is we went from run the infinite and sabo all hooks, to run the loop and hold m1.
The goals of both sides are not balanced when you consider the time required to complete them. It isn't just the time to catch a survivor, but also the time to traverse the map.
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Permanent sabotage was in the game from 1.0.0 to 2.3.0 entire metas of perks coming out around it making it more powerful,
it wasn't fun then it won't be fun now
also show me some proof of being against high skill groups, stuff like a profile with hours on it or a view of your ingame inventory of offerings and addons would suffice my curiosity
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If the survivors permanent destroy all the hooks in one corner they can just sit there with No Mither/Unbreakable/Soul Guard, all huddled in a group, all completely unhookable and bleeding out so slowly it's gonna take over an hour for the game to end.
I know, I've had jackasses do this on Swamp with hook offerrings and a single corner sacrifice. I'm just glad I haven't run into anyone using 4 breakdowns yet.
I'm actually intrigued by the idea of breakdown permanently disabling hooks. Problem is, hooks are so damn inconsistent across maps, and there's offerrings that affect the number of hooks on a map, and the distance between them, and the pathing on maps is so inconsistent, that having permanently broken hooks in DbD's current state is kind of... well, broken. Even with sacrifices.
Yes, I know that some hooks are genuinely OP. Yes, I know breaking hooks is in theory a good thing. But the consistentcy of hooks between maps is just nonexistent. It's too easy for people to create these hook deadzones and run to them, either to force a bleed-out or to to take the game hostage. Neither of those is fair. It's like thkse positions where people can't get picke duo from and you have some lovely, fun person constantly running to them when they're about to go down.
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Speaking for myself its not,
now onto more interesting matters
I would like some of that proof against high level squads and also some proof of your inventory as killer since you seem to play nothing but wraith with the same build and use the same nine month old map offering every match that you have a suspicious amount of I would love to see what your killer inventory and hours look like
because for me your existence seems a bit questionable, a person popping up out of nowhere on the forums with 300 posts in 48 hours and videos only dated back 12 days and all the same killer build and map offering is really suspicious
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And the worst take of the day goes to...
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That's a long winded way of saying "just camp"
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It's not okay to even be potentially able to make trials take forever. That is considered holding the game hostage and is a reportable offence. So why would you make it easier?
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Actually it does matter if one side isn't even trying to do their objective. For example, there's this situation we are discussing, the hiding situation, a 3-gen with Doctor or Legion and a convenient Ruin, etc.
All of these are situations with potential ends but are nevertheless holding the game hostage. Either that, or the mods and Devs need to get their stories straight.
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I had a few times that hooks spawn so few, mostly in Auto heaven.
(X) for hook. Downed a survivor at gate, cant make it to hook. There should be a hook right next to Gates as default.
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I mean, yeah. Holding w is a problem. It takes no skill and if you hold w, use no pallets and just take 2 hits, you can waste like 50 seconds of a killers time. You should only be able to do that if you are looping, using windows and pallets. Holding w, is the survivor equivalent of a spirit or deathslinger who can just do nothing and make survivors waste distance.
But no, then what we would have is a corner of the map where it becomes impossible to hook a survivor. If that were the case, all the survivors would just immediately run there as soon as they encounter the killer, making it impossible to hook them after the first one.
This would make SWF bully squads worse, but not actually do anything to help average solo survivors who wouldn't be able to coordinate this effort.
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I thought about it, but the problem is that if four adjacent hooks get broken, it could create a dead zone where the killer can't get a hook in.
Which wouldn't be so much of a problem if it could occur more organically, but this kind of change would be a buff to Swiffer bully squads more than anything else. And the game -really- doesn't need that.
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You have no idea just how bad hook RNG can be. On maps like gas heaven and red forest there can be literally only one hook in an entire half of the map, and if that hook is gone you can't hook the survivor no matter what you do.
And don't even get me started on grim pantry and Badham.
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Both things that massively altered normal gameplay and were nerfed for being completely busted.
We are not bringing old sabo back.
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For real though...
Make them 1 hook. Right now they are garbage. They don't need to be game winning by any means like old moris but moris actually are worse to use (get less BP, less contributions to Pip, waste more time where survivors get stuff done while you do it, and don't get the hook counted) than just doing hooks. They need some sort of benefit beyond they look neat but you lose in every other way
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Sorry but that's terrible idea, it literally permanently removes hooks, killer's main tool to kill survivors. There are already scenarions where passive sacrifices destroying even 1 hook can make part of a map no-hook zone forcing killer to slug or lose.
That's as equally broken as if bamboozle permanently blocked 4 windows chosen by the killer and then kept still blocking any next vaulted window. Or even worse, if perk like overcharge suddently regressed gen by 100% if you missed it.
This is more broken then old Wake up bug that gave 15% action speed to everything including gens and vaulting. It needs to get fixed immediately.
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"Holding w is a problem. It takes no skill and if you hold w, use no pallets and just take 2 hits, you can waste like 50 seconds of a killers time." Am I playing the same game as y'all? I'm not great at estimating time either but... like... what? What rank are you? My first couple games today, I wound up getting caught early at a really bad gen, out in the open, and I definitely exploited the OP survivor strategy of.. running.. away... FIFTY seconds? Are you actually serious? I need to take notes from whatever survivors you're playing against. I would love to actually get to have a decently long chase. ... It's sarcasm right?
These forums are fascinating.
Kudos to the OP for actually having a realistic mindset of adapting to the game in whatever state it's in. Not making a judgment on the change idea but seriously G*d bless you for just... dealing with it. You must be older than 25 or play fighting games or both or something. Imagine... just adapting to a constantly evolving (and therefore buggy) game.
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Great idea imo
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What world are you living in that you think hooks are everywhere. Often at most you might have two available at a given point in time that is if its not blocked by a breakable wall. Oh yes more time to waste.
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I hit a survivor at long wall with trixter and it took 25 seconds to catch up for the second hit just holding W.
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That's fine too. But has nothing to do with Breakdown
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Terrible idea, With the way the game goes right now it should take a conciderable effort/skill of the survivors to break someone out of the killers grasp while carrying. Losing a survivor at that point is the biggest momentum breaker a killer can get as they went through the entire chase and got nothing of it.
Having 4 hooks at a side of a map permanently broken means if coordinate survivors would have a safe corner to go to where they can go down without concequences. That should never be the case.
Even on the survivor side this would be horrible as the way you combat this as killer is to kill the survivors one by one so you don't have multiple broken hooks with all 4 survivors alive which means they have to tunnel. Either that or don't bother with hooking at all and let all survivors do nothing for 4 minutes.
making this bug a feature is just a terrible idea all around. hooks need to be accessible for the fun of both sides
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you know how sometimes killers sacrifice a couple a couple survivors and accidentally create a deadzone in a corner of the map?
meaning if you go down there he literally can't hook you?
and this happens on a normal game?
survivors breaking hooks permanently should never be added to the game. period.
in the example I gave, it's the killers fault for not paying attention.
but with breakout, it's BS.
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I haven't experienced breakdown new bug but I know that it shouldn't be in the game.
It won't be fun for killers and would be boring for survivors.
I Do think breakdown could get a buff but not like this, this will be detrimental to the game
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Anyone that has played killer or has a novel understanding of the game would instantly recognize that permanently removing up to 8 hooks per game / removing the primary means for both the killer to progress their goal and for survivors to gain easy altruism points is never going to happen.
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You think it's balanced ? If someone ran a no mither Sabo squad with the current breakdown and breakout together it would be so ######### for the killer you could just hold the game hostage for an hour or more if you did it right , especially on maps like dead dawg, badham , strode , red forest etc pretty much all the maps lol , if someone really wanted to be a dick that build is probably this biggest way possible with the current breakdown
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