Could Everyone Chill Out on MMR
Seriously. If they don’t gather data, they can’t determine if the system will ever work and what needs changing. This game is far more complicated to matchmake than an FPS like COD or whatever. Anyone with half a brain knows that balancing this game is a massively difficult problem. 2 days of data won’t hurt anyone. Just saying.
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Just saying: feedback is something great to give. Not only data you get from the game is good to know, even if people complain, it's still feedback.
First test was amazing for me, this one is meh. I tell it, and I will keep telling it, because no one can guess how the community takes the new test if no one says how they feel about it.
For me, at least, it's only giving feedback, to help if there is something to improve.
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Exactly. Besides, I've had matches on both sides of the spectrum tonight. Facing potato survivors and facing sweaty SWF teams. Been slingshotting all over the damn place lol
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Funny enough I'm a killer main and have yet to touch the killer side. I played tonight with just one friend and tonight has been the opposite of our past 2 weeks of playing nightly. Neither of us escaped once. We went against a very good spirit, a couple huntress and deathslingers and probably the best nurse I've ever faced. Tonight was challenging and fun. Way better than our daily sessions of both escaping top scorers for 10+ games in a row every night for 2 weeks straight. So from survivor side it's been a lot of fun. I'd call it a success in that department.
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How exactly is someone saying "TERRIBLE SYSTEM JUST GO BACK AND STOP TRYING TO ADD MMR" good feedback? That is what is mostly echoed and its stupid advice.
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It’s been a sweaty night, that’s for sure. So far tonight I’ve only had two good teams in solo queue. That’s way down from normal.
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How exactly saying nothing is feedback? Not everything is good feedback, I agree, but if you read people, you see it seems to work for some and not to work for others.
It's already something we can take into consideration, when people said something like: "Trapper is my main and I'm matched againt new players while I never play Nurse but I'm against pretty good Survivors." It could be: OK, it seems there is a flaw right there, let's see it.
You see what I mean?
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Yeah in between being slingshotted to both ends I've had some fairly decently even matches sprinkled in between where it was mostly purple and reds all around the same level. Tonight has just been a very weird night killer side. Bright side though, I was able to finally hit 40 with Myers and unlock his perks. Now to never touch him again lol.
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Yall had sweaty matches?
The hell then.. All i had was Pure Rainbow Rank Hell. Literally 98% of it was a 4/5 gen lockdown instantly,
Sometimes they even get down to 1! and i had like 3-4 matches with ALL Red ranks. Including my main..
Edit: Forgot to mention that i did play for 7 hours yesterday..
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Forgetting the rank-side of things, the devs said they collected data prior to this being active. Is that data being used for the purpose of this test, or is it just starting everyone out from scratch?
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My only complaint is that this test has been worse than the last one. It's still loads better than the normal colored matchmaking but I genuinely feel like the last one was amazing and this is only alright.
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It won't work, this has been the least fun I have ever had with the game. In fact there was no fun to be had, fun was sucked out of the equation all together. Being waterboarded would have been more fun than suffering through this bullshit.
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We’re you playing survivor or killer? I played about 7-8 hrs yesterday, and I felt like survivor pairings were really bad. I had so many teammates that were just total new players that had no clue. It made it hard to tell how good the killer’s I was playing against were. When you are carrying the whole team all match long… I even had one killer that tried to force the last survivor to rescue me off hook because he hadn’t been able to hook me all match, but when he finally did, this other survivor couldn’t figure out what to do, and was so scared of the killer that I ended up one hooked. It was actually funny to watch the killer trying to herd that one survivor over to the hook for a save, 😂 he even brought the guy to the hook and dropped him and picked him up a few times, but I bled out before he got that done. I’m sure the guy would have just tried to run away again.
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I felt like I was paired reasonably well against killers, but the survivors I was with were so bad it was crazy.
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No. I can’t. I’m a paying customer who expects a working product. I’m not a software tester for behavior.
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Do you think any company on Earth has the resources to pay hundreds of thousands of people to test an MMR in a game they've likely never played before? Fact is, MMR can only be tested one way: live testing.
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Oh you poor slow child. It seems as though the killer as taunting you seeing that the other survivor was downed. He can't exactly save you in that state. Generally when they pick you up and drop you it's to increase the time it takes to bleed out. The dude was being toxic.
As for dying on the first hook. That's seems to be a trend, in my killer games and survivor games. That is not a good thing, something about this MMR test has broken the game.
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It failed the last time, it failed this time. In theory they are gathering all this data every game. They can test it on the PTB.
The game is effectively disabled for me during this test because I’m literally being matched with people playing their first game.
I’d be surprised if the rank 20 Dwight who didn’t know how to equip his 1 perk keeps playing after being matched with players who have thousands of hours repeatedly. They are just going to move to the next game because you are either hooked to a game in the first 20-30 minutes or you move to the next one.
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Im just using it as a good time to get adepts since I almost always get put with people far worse then me like on average over 10 ranks below me and a 10th of my playtime
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It failed the last time, it failed this time.
Works fine for me, just like last time. Besides, that's why it's being tested, because it needs tweaking. It's not a full and permanent implementation. That's what "testing" means.
In theory they are gathering all this data every game. They can test it on the PTB.
PTB does not get hundreds of thousands of players, and the ones who do go there are almost always not playing the way they would be if it were the live build. Data gathered on the PTB would be useless.
The game is effectively disabled for me during this test because I’m literally being matched with people playing their first game.
See my comment here:
They are just going to move to the next game because you are either hooked to a game in the first 20-30 minutes or you move to the next one.
I literally have ADHD and I give a game more than 30 minutes to grab my attention. That doesn't sound reasonable in the slightest unless you're used to games that are literally designed to be addictive, like mobile games.
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Then why all the ridiculous, clearly ridiculous matchups in this gatherings phase?
If they are starting from a base, assume everyone at similar rank is of the same skill then adjust from there accordingly.
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And here you are just talking about balancing the game. The fact is that it needs to be fun too. Nobody wants to play a balanced but unfun game after all.
As such this MMR test is a bit more complicated than people make it out.
Maybe they should not have told us that is was a "test" but should have said this is the "Entity on Madness"-event, coming to your DbD server once a year to give you an new and fresh experience and a chance to get your adept archivements.
I so far had a mixed bag of matches but I always found a match without a huge waiting time. Sometimes I would get better survivors, sometimes I would get stomped by Red Ranks. But at least now it is a mixed bag. Before this I rarely got a lobby with one or two survivors below my level. Only some above my level. Even while climbing up after the rank roulette made me rank 18.
So, I enjoy this test. Think of it as an event.
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A better mmr would be to just remove the safety pip :|
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I think a balanced game would be fun. Why do you assume they're not related?
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They can be, do not get me wrong please.
Something can be balanced and it can be fun. However fun is subjective. For some people balance is fun and others have fun with wonky things. As an example: The most fun with LoL for me was URF. URF is not very balanced but it is tons of fun for me. The normal game was more balanced but less fun for me.
As such depending on how you do it you can kill fun for the sake of balance and the other way around. The question is how to finde that balance. For a symetric game like LoL it is easier that for an asymetric game like DbD. MMR is a thing that requires much work to empathise both aspects. And I merely wanted to point that out.
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You don’t know what you are talking about. I’ve got enough time in this game. The killer was not being toxic. When you e played as much as I have, you can tell the difference.
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If I’m just guessing, the data sets are starting with a 0 value for each player and then trying to build from there. Could be wrong, but that would explain wild fluctuations in match-ups. I think everyone is assuming that the MMR is using an existing rank for each player, and I’m guessing it’s not.
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Good explanation fair point. But what I, and many others are seeing "aren't" variations. Just constant rank mis matches.
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Agreed. Give BHVR a chance to get it right. I give them grief constantly, but in this we need to be patient and not overreact like usual.
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This was all killer. as i have just 7k hours on it..
And i got paired with new survivors...
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Yeah, I got both mismatches both ways. That’s why I think the data set they are collecting is starting with a 0 value for each player, then I believe it is intentionally mismatching players in order to collect data on the skill gap between them.
For example, they want to see what the data looks like when a sweaty rank 1 plays against a brand new team of solo q rank 20’s. Once they know what the data for that looks like, they can adjust their matchmaking system to prevent that from occurring.
This is all theoretical surmising btw.
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Or you know.
they don't tell us how it works and leaves us in the dark bout it.
Cause we'd call em out on how it doesn't work no matter how many tries we do.
Or the fact Oni / billy is broken, AGAIN,
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You do realize that this is the THIRD test, right? Additionally, the MMR system has been gathering data in the background for nearly a year now, and the test still is the same crap shot as the previous two. I have yet to see a difference.
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I think this one is wildly different than the last two. There was mismatching in the last two, but this one has been substantially different in that regard.
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That's true, about feedback. But there is an overwhelming amount of complaining on this forum about every little detail on the game. That may be part of what OP is saying.
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I've read a post saying the dev reset the stats from the last test, that's might be why.
With 3 games as Bubba, a killer I played maybe 20-30 in the past 4months or so I got one match with 3green 1purple, 3purple 1red and 3red 1purple. Mind you I barely played after the last 2 reset and came back like a week ago so most of my match were against really bad survivor and about half of the match survivor could barely do 2 gen. The match I just got I still 4k but survivor were able to do 4 gen and I could see an increase in skill with the 3 match under this match making.
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How exactly saying nothing is feedback?Its not, stop implying I have said that when I have not.
Not everything is good feedback, I agree, but if you read people, you see it seems to work for some and not to work for others.Cool?
It's already something we can take into consideration, when people said something like: "Trapper is my main and I'm matched againt new players while I never play Nurse but I'm against pretty good Survivors." It could be: OK, it seems there is a flaw right there, let's see it.? Ok?
No one knows how it is implemented, I don't understand why people are assuming that past experience is took into account.
I also haven't said that the new MMR system is good or bad, I don't have enough information to make the decision considering its in test as said before.
You see what I mean?If you mean me thinking less of you, then yes I completely understand. If the goal wasn't that, then no I don't understand what you hoped to accomplish by saying this and I don't even understand the point you are trying to make.
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For me, MMR has been fine! Been put against a lot of red ranks and been doing pretty well. Sure, I displeased the Entity a couple of times, but also had Merciless Killer a few, so all in all I say it's doing a decent job from my perspective. Certainly better than the existing rank one.
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. However fun is subjective.Yes it is, we however ignore typically those opinions who think that less balance is fun because they directly conflict with the majority playerbase and promote illness in games.
IE: Pay to win mechanics, ect
This is like saying here "Well murder being bad is subjective", sure it is, but just because that is the case doesn't mean we shouldn't believe that it is wrong to murder.
This is why we include goals, so then we can set objectivity in place.
My goals would be very simple in this regard, how can we promote a environment in which both party's have fun, and can compete with each other fairly while also appeasing the most amount of player(s).
Of course I can make that more specific, but this is all I really need in place to then come to the objective idea that balance is better then not having as much or no balance at all.
For some people balance is fun and others have fun with wonky things. As an example: The most fun with LoL for me was URF. URF is not very balanced but it is tons of fun for me. The normal game was more balanced but less fun for me.Yes, someone absolutely has a blast cheating with aimbots in games, however the victims of that encounter do not. This is what leads to the second issue with lack of balance in a game, another environment where this is a issue, upsetting the player base. It can outright kill games when imbalance is prevalent to horrid degrees and makes players not want to play the game in question.
The question is how to finde that balance. For a symetric game like LoL it is easier that for an asymetric game like DbD. MMR is a thing that requires much work to empathise both aspects. And I merely wanted to point that out.As said before, we do not want imbalance in games if we are to come to the goal "how can we promote a environment in which both party's have fun, and can compete with each other fairly while also appeasing the most amount of player(s).".
Any unbalance in a game would be objectively bad, if we are to agree this is what we want as the goal.
We are humans however so to balance any game perfectly is impossible and would break logic as we know it if we could do it based on how insane of a feat that would be. So instead we look to what is acceptable for balance in a game, no doubt about it 4v1 is difficult to balance on a acceptable level, but it can be done.
So I don't understand what the point is of pointing things out seemingly for no reason.
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I mean. Coming from a new player. MMR has been 1 of the most iffy things. Some games it'll be a mostly balanced game where i can have fun having a decent skill based game where I have a decent chance at winning.
Other times its just better for me to focus solely one guy because theres no way for me to hook multiple red ranks. I literally just had a game of red ranks and im rank 18.
(Also i swear to god SWF teams are leeching off their 1 friend whos around my rank solely to annoy new players because 3 red ranks and 1 rank 15 who they all try and save happens a lot)
If the MMR was consistently teaming me with decent teams i could actually compete against it'd be so much better. (Or hey just give players a warning of the ranks of the players since I want a fun game and not a game where I get completely destroyed by 4 survivors.)
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