Which killer perks need to be nerfed, in your opinion?
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Ladies and gentlemen! Hailing from Montreal, Canada and weighing in at 0 skill please join me in welcoming Infectious "Play The Game For Me" Fright!
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Starstruck has my current hate, especially with Distressing and smaller and smaller maps. I don't even hear the TR and still get exposed.
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This is a good point. Aside from BBQ not being worth running except for the BP, it does encourages killers not to camp.
lolwut
IF is a terrible perk for most builds. Sometimes I'll run a Myers build that's basically Knockout/Nurse's/Infectious Fright/Deerstalker + Fragrant/Memorial/Jigsaw offering, and then just slug everyone, but that's really the only thing it's good for, and then only because Gideon has two floors. (I do try not to let people bleed out once everyone is down, but I'll get 4 DCs when I do this more often than not.)
What do people use IF for that's not a meme or slugging build?
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Oni, Billy, to a lesser extent Nurse. If you think its a meme perk wewlad you must be new here.
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I had no idea that there was a cult-of-sluzzy meeting today and now I'm way late for it.
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I am new here. That is why I asked. I do not use Oni, Billy, or Nurse. Nemesis is the first non-M1 killer that I've really played. I started with Trapper until I decided I liked the game enough to buy Michael, and now I'm learning Ghostface on the side. I'm planning to learn Nemesis and maybe Nurse.
For some reason, I thought that IF was M1-only. Apparently, it's not, but I still think it'd be a waste of a perk slot in most cases unless you're trying to slug.
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The only reason why NOED is any good is due to the fact it automatically punishes you for playing solo queue. You have no communication from the other survivors, meaning you have no idea how many totems are cleansed unless you physically see each and everyone of them destroyed. The same applies to every other survivor, each and everyone of them will need to physically see the destroyed totems to know when NOED is deactivated. At that point, you and your team wasted so much time that any mediocre killer and up would've won the game a long time ago. The worst part is that killer might not be running NOED and still get equal value from the perk simply existing in the perk pool.
So, whenever people complain about NOED, just remember it's probably because they are in solo queue. Any counter-argument you may have doesn't work, but if think you have one that I haven't hear of — give it to me and we'll discuss.
By the way, I hate NOED, obviously, but I don't want it nerfed by any means. It just needs to not be a solo queue destroyer, so rework it to not be a solo queue destroyer and I could careless on what it does.
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but it also stops the killer from patrolling around the first person since they are usually away within seconds counteracting the amount of pressure they would have gained camping / proxy camping one person and shifting into a more acceptable pressure that survivors are ok with unlike camping which is just chasing another survivor
restated in that format do you still think it should be nerfed
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It is incredibly strong on killers like Oni. Pretty easy to snowball the game off of one use of his power with Infectious Fright. Billy is very strong with it as well and to a lesser extent Nurse. I don't know if I would ever consider running it on M1 killers except for maybe Myers to make a play with EW3.
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That's why i don't NOED should be nerfed but totem counter should be implemented. Also the perk existing in the pool itself giving value applies to a lot of survivor perks. Soul guard, Unbreakable, DS, Power Struggle. I have to play like everyone has those at all times.
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This is gonna come as a surprise to a lot of people but my vote is on Rancor. It needs a full rework. It's not strong or anything; it's actually quite bad. It's just that fundamentally its design is terrible. The entire Perk and the way it interactions with the obsession is literally "screw that person in particular."
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NOED and Rancor.
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Some much Ruin and BBQ hate... so basic.
Many people use bbq for the blood points. It has 3 counters, 2 of which are not perk related. On top of that it encourages good game play- get the killer away from the hook and after someone else. As survivors we want that!!! It is the last perk that needs a nerf.
Hex perks already have a big counter and a number of perks to help delete them. Noed does not need a nerf. Saying it rewards bad killers is a cop-out. Survivors have a ton of second chance perks that let them bounce back from mistakes. Entity forbid the killer has one... (that can be destroyed... by cleansing totems).
Killer perks are pretty well balanced imo. If I had to pick it would either be Tinkerer with its two effects or Pop. I personality don't have issues with these perks BUT on the right killers they can be very overwhelming.
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Sorry for the book, I'm very passionate about NOED being a solo queue destroyer. Understandable if you don't read, I don't blame you. ❤
That's why i don't NOED should be nerfed but totem counter should be implementedI agree and while we're at it, make NOED even stronger since SWF or not, you have no excuse to not have totems done.
Also the perk existing in the pool itself giving value applies to a lot of survivor perks. Soul guard, Unbreakable, DS, Power Struggle. I have to play like everyone has those at all times.Soul Guard, Unbreakable, Power Struggle [paired with Flip-Flop] is countered by simply not slugging. That takes only 3 seconds to do after recovering from a successful attack by pressing Pick Up. Let's say you need to slug, you have exactly 32 seconds [23.70 secs with Unbreakable] to do whatever you need to do and get back for the pick up. If you're in a situation where you're slugging multiple survivors, I don't think them recovering would even matter if you have such a tremendous amount of pressure. It would only matter in edge cases, but those are apparently the only ones killers seem to bring up when they talk about Unbreakable. However, they never talk about the other games where they didn't slug and made any survivor who were using the perk, have essentially 3 perks for the game.
As for DS, there's many conditions and a timer attached to it. Therefore, for you to get hit by DS:
- You gambled on them not having DS by picking them up
- Survivor's DS is active by meeting all requirements and the timer hasn't expired
It's very difficult to get hit by DS whereas NOED, it's almost impossible to avoid it unless you and your team throw the game. Solo queue really does make killer perks seem more powerful than they really are, but it's even worse for killer perks designed to destroy solo queue.
Anyways, as for combining perks such as DS and Unbreakable, that's all countered by not tunnelling then slugging unhooked survivors. You're essentially removing 2 perks for any survivor running this combo, which is very nice. Granted it removes your ability to slug / tunnel, it doesn't matter since they aren't required to win unless you're playing a low tier killer. However, at that point, our attention should be placed on making low tier killers better since killers shouldn't need to slug / tunnel to win. Key word, need.
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So survivors have no excuse not get all totems but killers can let all gens go and get rewarded at end game? Seems logical .
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Well, yeah, if you have a totem counter letting each and every survivor know how many totems are left, then you have no excuse to not have NOED deactivated by the last generator.
Before, without a totem counter, each and every survivor can use the solo queue excuse because they have no communication to know where they stand on totems.
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I don't disagree with anything you said. It's just once you get to a high enough level, playing nice as a killer is going to lose you games. You have 3 tactics you can pick, and it's tunneling, camping, or slugging. I tend towards slugging when possible. If i play like everyone has unbreakable all the time and i can't slug it basically screws me
Also for power struggle i meant more so for taking longer to hook someone or putting them on a hook i dont want them on because i don't want to carry them through a pallet and risk it.
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None of them do.
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I don't disagree with anything you said. It's just once you get to a high enough level, playing nice as a killer is going to lose you games. You have 3 tactics you can pick, and it's tunneling, camping, or slugging. I tend towards slugging when possible. If i play like everyone has unbreakable all the time and i can't slug it basically screws me.Yeah, I definitely agree with you, playing nice isn't always possible against a skilled team of survivors.
That's just how the game is designed and it's not changing anytime soon based on the developer's actions.
The only solution to solve this is pretty simple, but I don't want to derail this thread. I'll be making a thread on this later on why the game can never be balanced properly until they make certain changes.
Also for power struggle i meant more so for taking longer to hook someone or putting them on a hook i dont want them on because i don't want to carry them through a pallet and risk it.Usually I take the risk and if for some reason I suspect PS [sweat with friends], I'll only cross pallets when I know their wiggle meter is in the safe zone [below 25% progression].
If I suspect PS and can't cross a pallet safely, a few seconds shouldn't cost me the game unless it's against a skilled team of survivors or sweat with friends. By the way, sweat with friends and survive with friends are two completely different things just to clear things up.
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As it was said above. None of the killers perks are so broken, that they deserve a nerf.
- NOED doesn't reward bad killers. It punishes lazy survivors.
- ruin regression is half the repair time of a single survivor (uhh so OP)
- Devour hope requires killers to get away from the hook to get stacks. I guess that's bad, when killers don't camp...
- BBQ gives killers an incentive to leave the hook. Again, bad I guess.
You complain about Bubba and Wraith mains. Because they camp. But want perks that reduce camping nerfed.
Please make up your mind.
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I don't think any killer perks are overpowered. Some have very strong synergy with certain killers' abilities and can feel very oppressive but that has more to do with the massive gulf in power between different killers than anything else.
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Monstrous shrine. So op. My loooord.
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BBQ is def OP and killers are absolutely using it for aura reading. It’s a total lie that killers only use it for bp. When I run it as killer I use it for auras as well as the bp. Killers, be honest about this perk. They keep saying they only use it for bp so it won’t ever get nerfed. Lies! When I play survivor, 75% of killers are running it and using it to find targets, because the counters don’t really work most of the time unless you are getting in the locker or are close enough to the hook. And then you are wasting a lot of time countering this perk. What they should do to this perk is only allow the auras to be seen the first time a survivor is hooked- max 4 times per match and in-line with the stacks for the bonus bp.
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Monstrous shrine. How is such an op and oppressive perk still allowed in the game? Just had a match against basement trapper and he was carried so hard by monstrous shrine it was disgusting. Free win because he brought that perk. When will brainless killers learn not to crutch on this unfun perk?
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Noed and tinkerer. Also BBQ should not show auras of survs in the dying state. If you want to slug, then at least find them later
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For blood points.
Imo there's really only one killer perk that should be nerfed and it's tinkerer, which is the most oppressive part of Ruin+Undying+Tinkerer, as you can cleanse ruin and undying, but tinkerer allows the killer to always pressure the gen with no skill requirement.
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Most killer perks are fairly mediocre honestly. You can stack 4 of them for solid builds but most on their own aren't very good. I think survivor perks need more nerfs than killer perks. DH is a free extra health state every 40s, unbreakable is literally a game changer, a match goes from LOST to winning which is nuts (no I don't think UB needs a nerf, just showing how stupidly strong it is) I think Prove Thyself is extremely powerful, shaving off like 8s per gen with people stacked? That's a lot of time saved, almost a full gen in fact. Killers might have strong powers and or add ons but their perks are meh other than maybe like 10 of them.
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I mean if you have ever used it half the time you wont see more than one person . Bbq is fine by all means and if the killer walks accros the whole map and manages to get snowball something is very wrong
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Tinkerer should have a small cooldown, as much weaker perks have cooldowns. NOED needs a complete rework.
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BBQ would still be used without the BP bonus. And in my opinion the BP bonus is what should be removed from the perk. I don't think BP gain should be tied to perks.
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I want tinkerer and noed nerfed. They are really unfun and bad for the state of the game.
Noed could do with some rework, and tinkerer oh boy. If a strong killer with mobility uses it to protect a good 3 gen setup during the game, unless you have a really top soloq suvivor team, you are out of luck.
Problem is, tinkerer is kind of a bandaid, most reworked maps got a lot worse for killers, i think that there are many balance issues currently, at least if you don't play a top tier killer. I think they need to rework a lot of things (perks, killer powers. maps) altogether to put the game in a good spot.
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NOED would be the only one that really needs changing. I generally dislike the idea of a perk being able to heavily reward a killer for failing to defend generators. You can easily tell when someone has been carried to high ranks by it.
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Tinkerer only bothers me when it's a blight
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Sorry to burst your bubbles, but there is already s totem counter.
The fact that you don't want to run small fame is entirely up to you, if you want to a totem counter then just run that perk.
When i play as survivor I only play solo and on a rare occasion noed activates, and even then it is pretty easy to get rid off in most cases.
Right now there is zero excuse to talk about wanting a totem counter , because there is 1 but you refuse to run it.
And for the record, no i don't run it either.
But then again, i even run without perks and items and still get out trough the exit gates.
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You’re a killer main, don’t you?
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NOED-->Rework it to something else which rewards the Killer only if they did well during the game. Like, something extra for a Killer who played well, but did not do good enough. Not for someone who got 2 Hooks and then has a big Speedboost and Instadown, for basically nothing.
Ideas I liked:
- OhTofu-->Remove Hex-Status, NOED grants 1 Token for each Hook, each Token gives 0,5% Movement Speed once Gates are powered, after a certain amount of Tokens, it gains the Instadown as well.
- Otzdarva-->NOED grants a Token for every fresh Hook (up to a maximum of 4 at Tier 3), Survivors hit after all Gens are done are exposed, after downing a Survivor you lose 1 Token. All Tokens lost when the Hex is cleansed.
Both ideas are good, because they reward the Killer instead of giving them something for free. It also removes the big benefit for Campers, it just sucks that a camping Killer can get 1 guaranteed Kill because of the camping and will get another Kill due to NOED, because there is no time to do all Gens AND all Totems.
Tofus idea also removes the Hex-Status, which is great, because cleansing Dull Totems for a Perk the Killer might not even have is nonsense.
Insidious-->I dont know what, but just rework it into something else. I dont care if it is weak or strong afterwards, for me, it can be even weaker than Monstrous Shrine afterwards. It is already a very weak Perk, but just encourages a very unhealthy gamestyle, so it should really be changed.
Infectious Fright-->Either Basic Attack Requirement or something else. This Perk is a prime example of a badly designed Perk - it is almost useless on most of the Killers but can be too strong on some of them, mainly Nurse, Billy or (especially) Oni.. I dont really get why Perks like Surge or Knockout have Basic Attack Requirements, but Infectious Fright, which is way stronger, does not have this restriction. Like, it should not be possible that I play Billy and have 3 people slugged at the start of the game. They are not even able to get much distance, because the Terror Radius is still 32 meters and especially the high mobility Killers have no problem catching up.
Wishs, but wont happen:
Tinkerer-->It became a braindead Perk since its buff. But, I dont know what exactly should be done, because the Perk in itself is not too strong IMO. Also not high priority, certainly lower than the others I mentioned above.
BBQ-->Just something which requires the Killer to spread Hooks to get their Stacks. Something like they can only gain Stacks as long as all Survivors are alive, but then there should be something which prevents the Survivor from suiciding to deny Stacks. IMO it is really annoying that players can tunnel out a single Survivor at 5 Gens and still get a massive amount of BPs just due to BBQ. Especially since the BP-gain for Killers is already much higher than for Survivors.
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I don't understand people that want a bbq nerf. First of all, it has several counters (beeing inside 40m, hiding in a locker, hiding your aura behind a gen). It rewards the killer for going on chases and hooking all 4 different survivors (a slugging killer won't benefit from it, you only get your stacks of bonus bp if you go for different survivors). It encourages the killer to leave the hook and go chase someone else if he sees a aura.
Like, i can't for the love of god understand why people want bbq nerfed. Like kindred it is a extremely healthy perk for the game. In case of bbq, the killer has to earn it through hooks. The killer gets encouraged to not camp, but to leave the hook and go chase someone else that is at least 40m away, so someone can come and unhook the guy. What else do you want? If all killer used bbq and left the hook to chase another guy (no camping/slugging), the survivor would enjoy the game a lot more too, seriously .....
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Nope sorry mate,i play both side.
So to disappoint you.
The only killer perk i have a problem with is noed, the rest of the perks are fine and people are just whining about it because they want the killer to be their b itch and that they control what is happening during thale match
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"It rewards the killer for going on chases and hooking all 4 different survivors (a slugging killer won't benefit from it, you only get your stacks of bonus bp if you go for different survivors). It encourages the killer to leave the hook and go chase someone else if he sees a aura."
Not if the Killer does
- only go for one Survivor until they are dead
- never leaves the Hook, regardless of the Auras
They still get their Bonus-BPs.
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But if the killer does that, he will not get a advantage of the aura reading some people say should get nerfed. So in this case he wastes a perk slot for perk that gives some bonus bp, which doesn't affect the survivor at all.
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Absolutely not. I don't use either, but these perks are almost necessary on low tier killers. Nerfing them would mean widening the gap between the high tiers and low tiers even more.
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Ruin is 100%/150%/200%
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Adrenaline should be also removed, it rewards survivors for not healing.
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I don't blame some survivors with little hours that think some perks like pop are op. They have no killer experience.
Think about it. How long does a chase last, then you need to pick up the survivor and carry the guy to a hook. Then you need to run and find a gen with a lot of progress and pop it. Do you understand how many seconds it takes ?
A pop sets back the generator for only 20 seconds of normal repair progress, even if you don't count the time the chase took the killer, carrying the survivor and hooking him, then running to a gen and popping it takes more then 20 seconds.
Again, i can understand, if you have very bad survivors in your team, that go down very fast and feed the killer nonstop pop, the perk may feel very strong, but in reality it isnt.
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Rancor:
it should be a token increasing perk, so the Obsession can choose between risk build it or no.
example, every time the Obsession stuns/blind the killer, the killer win a token.
- token, the obsession gets an audio notification.
- tokens, the obsession can't be changed by perks until the first one is dead.
- tokens, while chasing the obsession vault/pallet/wall breaking speed is increased by 10%.
- tokens, while chasing the obsession bloodlust stays after breaking pallets.
- tokens, the obsession can be moried.
Adrenaline:
Should heal only survivors downed/hooked.
Survivors working on a gen don't deserve a free heal, just the speed boost to reach the door faster.
Survivor in chase wins enought distance from the killer with the speed boost, need hit him twice is an abuse, then peple cry about noed wich i don't like to use.
Prove thyself:
Should affect the user only.
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I have many times had 2 or 3 gens pop before I get a single hook. Gens are really fast
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Thats actually a really poor idea most of the time. If your spending time hunting a survivor who is 32 meters away your wasting a lot of time. This dosent matter at the low medium end of dbd play but vetran player will whup you. That being said. Bbq is a staple for 100% bp. If you moved it on to discordance, thrilling tremours I 100% prefer it over the rather limited aura reading effect.
Killers starting new chases with other survivors should be encouraged. If a killer is starting a cjase with someone else 32 meters away that is a lot of time to prepare.
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Can confirm. Often enough, I forget to even look.
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There really isn't a Killer Perk that I think needs a nerf.
Not that there aren't good Killer Perks, but I think they've done a good job at making balanced Killer Perks.
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Hello new player, none. They need buffs. Have a good day.
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