Spirit... Why is she in this game?
So. I don't even know where to begin when talking about what is wrong with spirit. I play this game at rank 1 killer and survivor and in the past 4 games, I have gone against rank 1 spirits who were all running stridor. It makes the game just purely unfun.
Spirit has absolutely zero counterplay. Her power allows the chase to become 100% killer-sided. The survivors have no clue where she is coming from while she is phasing, she can move nearly twice as fast as a running survivor, and she can reappear and attack within a second, giving the survivor zero chance to respond.
Not to mention that she can hear all noises and see scratch marks while being able to phase. This means that the only good counterplay to a spirit is to begin walking. If you are injured, however, walking is almost pointless. A walking survivor moves at a speed of 2.26m/s while a phasing spirit moves at a speed of 7.04m/s. This speed difference limits the distance a survivor can move before the spirit catches up, giving the spirit a greater advantage in the chase. Bringing back if the survivor were to be injured, the spirit just simply has to listen to where the grunts of pain are coming from (which are directional) and pinpoint where the survivor is.
Sure, you may suggest that the survivor bring the perk iron will. While this may be a good option, most Spirit players bring the perk stridor, countering iron will and making it a waste of a perk slot. Also, why should survivors be pressured into bringing a perk to counter a single killer of the 24? Statistically, if the absolute killer pick rates are evenly distributed (which it is not) that Spirit will be played just above 4% of the time. And if we say that only 50% of Spirit players bring stridor (which is probably higher) that bringing the perk iron will, will only be completely worth it 2% of the time. For something to be that statistically rare, it is unreasonable to be able to conclude that bringing the perk iron will is a reasonable counter to spirit.
In addition to all of this, Spirit, as of 2020 had one of the highest pick rates and kill rates of the 21 killers that were out at the time Dead by Daylight released this information. I am sure that if you looked at the pick rates and kill rates of red rank killers, Spirit's position would have no doubt either increased or stayed the same. With this information, I don't understand how a killer that has been in this game for nearly 3 years has rarely been touched. Sure, she was nerfed when she first came out but ever since then I don't recall a time when the spirit was nerfed or changed.
Using the information that Dead by Daylight released to the public back in 2020 about the pick rates and kill rates of all killers at red ranks (Huntress, Blight, Nurse, Spirit, Deathslinger) Spirit had the highest kill rate. Not to mention that to play the spirit only requires the ability to have ears, which is a much lower "skill needed" to play when compared to the other 4 killers listed. This is yet another reason why so many people, including me, don't support Spirit players nor find it fun to play against them (not to mention any of her addons because that is a whole other issue).
Comments
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Oh my, I do see your point even though this is your first discussion. Coming in with a warzone!
I've had many experiences with Spirit especially with friends and it's blatantly obv that she has NO real counterplay whatsoever. 50/50 mind games when she's standing still is not a counter fyi to any readers. Also It's annoying when ppl tell me to bring Iron will... sure bc it's not like stridor counters it. Speaking of Stridor, goodness I cannot with Spirit + stridor smh
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My only problem with Spirit is how she can instantly attack when coming out of the spirit travel thing. Its nearly impossible to make pallet plays against a phasing spirit, or just about any plays at that. Wrath has to take time to come out of his phasing travel form before he can M1. Spirit should have something similar.
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stealth, breaking line of sight and being unpredictable work decently for me but I don't see her as often as I used to.
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idk i feel like she should have half a second or so before she can attack or atleast give some telling if shes phasing like a shadow on the ground or the old bug
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Spirit is there because, sadly, every game will (at some point) incorporate an easy pick. And that is exactly what the Spirit is, an easy, effortless pick that all those who want an easy game will go for. Her only "counterplay" is walking, right, or backtracking onto your own scratchmarks, but those are things that will only ever work if you are not injured OR if you have Iron Will and the Spirit doesn't have Stridor, which is a chance so abysmally small that it isn't even worth mentioning. Be warned, you will find people defending her and going for the typical catchphrase "sure, why would survivors use a meta perk as Iron Will". Or they will tell you that she isn't easy, because they are trying to convince themselves of it more than what they want to convice you... She's such a stupid killer
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If Spirit has no Counter play why is her Killrate so Low that's its not even 10% better than your average Killer? (5% at best)
I have no problem with Spirits, I use Stealth against her, ask yourself. How do the best playing Survivors do vs. Spirits?
Here is an example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ou8eqghyNik
These players do a lot of things that Trick the Spirit, and ofc they play well themselves.
Could be that Spirit is just really good at capitalizing on poor teammates instead.
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Because.. because BHVR, man. I don't know how better to explain it.
Billy gets destroyed but Spirit doesn't get touched.
This timeline's pretty goddamn dim.
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If nUrSe IS sO strOnG WHy iS HeR KiLLraTe tHe LOwesT
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Imagine using outdated stats as an argument.
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Spirit goes wahhhhh!
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Nerf Pig?
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Assuming the Data isn't relevant anymore. 😂 OK
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Imagine using stats as an arguement in this game full stop. Too many things that could be altered (map, survivor perks and items, killer perks and add ons).
The stats are too general in this game unless we are given them extremely in depth.
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Spirit is the divine reconing for tbagging and bad mannering red rank survivors who think that they can bully rank 20-8 killers.
Okay but on the serious side. You only think about competitveness and balance here. Think about the setting.
Spirit plays to a common horror fantasy: The ghost with a grude. You know this from, well, The Grude, The Ring and other classic movies. If you think about what all those ghosts have in common it is that they can suddenly appear behind you and make for good jump scares. Spirit embodies this fantasy and this is why she is in the game.
For all the need of nerfing her or changing her, please consider that this fantasy is the reason she was created and you should adjust your nerfs/change suggestions to this. A Killer is more than stats and balance, it is also about horror aestetics and fantasy.
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Has she been buffed since then or something?
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She exists because sweaty survivors do. That's pretty much it. She's there so there's a strong killer to compete with strong survivor stuff.
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She needs a fatigue
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Spirit is an interesting opponent. I like how she puts survivor ninja skills to the tests.
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Maybe her 2 trap add ons that are inflating her kill rate
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TL;DR but basically i can say, spirit is not so bad as you may think, and stop crying about killers. You can't play the same way you do always against all killers. Get better at game. I've never got any problems playing against spirits, and they are fun to play against. If you just "nerf" her about giving clue when she is in phase, then what is the point of her ability if you know where she is at?? There is no point asking for a stupid thing like that, she can't see you, only can hear your breathe/grunts or can see scratch marks -if she is not using the add-on that let her see blood pools- try to use this for your advantage on loops, you'll see that she is not so "broken". The only broken killer in this game is Freddy's Mr. Fantastic arms lunges. And spirit has counter play. If you've enough analyze skill and game knowledge. We as survivors has so many broken sides than killers, trust me. And stop crying about everything when other players made you outplayed.
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*we heard you!
- reduced max amount of traps to 2.
- increased trap timer by 600 seconds.
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Don’t give them ideas! Then again pig is A tier according to the devs
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Care to list said counters? And if you're so confident Scott Jund is always up for the challenge if you truly want to prove us all wrong.
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Not to say your argument has no merits.
But Oracle is a Comp level team. Dowsey plays with pubs.
There's no comparison.
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She exists like that because the fix for her won't be easy, and that's going to take about 6 months of work in BHVR time. And that won't get them any $... so they just ignore it like all the other glaring issues
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I’m going to hate myself for sticking up for the Spirit at any capacity but oh well... I’d be willing to say that a large portion of people that want nerfs etc for the Spirit haven’t actually played as her much or haven’t gone against decent to above average survivors.
Does the spirit have features that feel like complete bs? Absolutely, along with nearly every killer. Survivors have a fair share of bs that killers have to deal with too.. let’s be honest lol
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Absolutely. The Spirit's power is very overexaggerated. Even IF she has no counter (I don't completely agree with that, she has far fewer counters but not none) she can still only be in one place at a time, and there are four survivors.
If she was so unstoppable, far more people would play her. She's actually one of the rarest killers I end up going against. In the past week I've gone against more Twins and Tricksters than Spirits, and that's saying something.
I often find I win more games as the Doctor than I do as the Spirit, even though he's technically just a regular M1 killer with an info power.
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But isn't this a bit hypocritic?
The whole Spirit has no counter argument assumes that the Spirit plays perfect. Scott Jund as an example is a very good Spirit and plays the game for maybe thousands and thousands of hours. He plays her "perfect". Most Spirit players are avarage people like me who play her maybe a few hours a week. Also most players do not have the perfect headset that people like Scott or Dowsey have further downgrading them as Spirit players.
Now if we say she has "no counters" we always assume this "perfect Spirit". Then if somebody brings up Oracle we deny that argument because they are "too perfect". As such we are always comparing a "perfect Spirit" with "imperect survivors", creating a flawed argument.
Now I do not want to say that Spirit is "fun" (that is subjective) or has counterplay. I merely want to point this out. The "no counterplay" argument is after all only focused on the 1vs1 scenario and even Scott who complains a lot about Spirit always tells people that she is not OP but only unfun for him because for him only the chase is a fun moment in the game.
For me stealth is a fun moment of the game. And I do not think that many people will agree with that as it is subjective after all.
And just for the record: Yes, Spirit needs changes. However they need to change her in a way that does not remove her fantasy or just tone her down without giving her anything in return. Otherwise we would just be complaining that there is a strong Killer...
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I think red rank matter more than all rank.
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Given how killer design has been developing, the devs appear to favor killers in chase... They want killers to be threatening 1v1, but they want them to lose the 1v4. Sure, it's unfun for the survivor vsing the Spirit (or Slinger or PH or Victor or Trickster or Nemmy), but the other 3 are going to get gens done in no time.
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The devs build killers for red ranks, but overdo it. So on all other ranks, survivors are pretty much sitting ducks. Spirit is maybe the most broken killer in the game, but great for players looking for mindless and easy 4K games. Playing killer in this game doesn’t take much skill or development which people like. It’s not until red ranks that survivors start being able to compete, and then killers whine to get survivors, maps,perks, etc. nerfed.
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And Nurse is the worst killer in the game according to the statistics.
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Nope dude, only Spirit needs some nerfs.
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Spirit did get touched a couple of time even her vault action got changed. She used to appeared on the other side of the window
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