When will we see the next HORROR ICON ?
Pennywise, Candyman, Pinhead, Xenomorph, Predator, Jason, The Thing, Chucky, this is undoubtedly the big lineup of "Horror from the Decades".
And I know somebody might say "yeah they're cool, but if you put them in all at once then there won't be anything "huge" left from that time to look forward to, so better to stretch them out!"
Which is the idea I seek to address with this discussion.
I hear that, but let me remind: that we haven't seen one of these big Horror from the Decades chapters in a LONG time already. We're already well past the point of "stretching out" and we're well overdue to see another of these figures by now. Pyramid Head & Nemesis arguably don't count because they're video game characters, but even beyond that the first appearance of Pyramid Head was just after the start of the new Millennium, Silent Hill 2 released in 2001. Though it's true RE3 came out a year before the new millennium in 1999 (does that even really count), the version we see is obviously tailored to look basically identical to the one from Resident Evil 3 Remake released in 2020. Tracing further back, Stranger Things takes place in the 80s but it is undoubtedly a modern show, whose first season was released in 2016, and the show itself is ongoing, with season 4 expected around October this year 2021.
The last true chapter we saw that came from this reputable hall of fame of popular characters was Chapter 12's Ghostface. We're already going onto Chapter 21 now, which we could very well be an original chapter so that means the next licensed chapter might be chapter 22 or 23. Ten entire chapters between the last and what could only potentially be the next horror icon, chapter 12 was released June 18th of 2019 it's been a little over two years.
And again, the devs try to do some four chapters every year, two of them licensed and two of them original. Even if the devs did nothing but go down that list of characters, it'd still take 4 full years to get through them all. I don't mean to cast shadows of doubt- but will the game still even be supported in 4 years? Will you, reading this post- still be playing in 4 years? (I mean maybe, I've already been here for 5 lolrip).
It's time for Dead By Daylight to "return to form" and breathe new life back into these beloved characters. With renewed vigor and urgency.
Comments
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They had crossed the line when they released the DLC for Leatherface, Nightmare on Elm Street and Saw, Really for me in an inner part I dislike how we are progressing at the moment, we are moving away from the Slasher theme and entering the world of video games with collaborations, It could be FNAF or Evil Within the next chapter, but the truth does not feel like it was before, I hope we see a slasher icon be it Candyman, Chucky, Pumpkinhead, among many. Although I would like you to be able to obtain licenses for lesser known killers but well known by the Slasher community, such as Matt Cordell from Maniac Cop, Harry Warden from My Bloody San Valentine, Three Finger from Wrong Turn, among many candidates, so it would lengthen much more the licenses for 5 more years.
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Bro, at this rate, in 4 years merely launching the game will bluescreen your PC, fridge, TV, while shutting down the electricity grid of your entire neighbourhood five seconds later. More Killers that shaped the horror genre would be great, but god damn we need a chapter or two dedicated to the game's health.
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It's Candyman without a doubt
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I approve this message. 👍🏻
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Just had an idea if they did Hellraiser. They could use the 4 main Cenobites, like Legion but different obviously.
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Evil bong , for dbd
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I too hope the next licensed chapters return to slasher roots. Pinhead, Chucky, Jason, Pennywise, Candyman, Jack Torrence etc.
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Just silently waits for the nonexistent future Slender chapter.
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Candyman is coming. Mark my words.
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As someone who really likes both the lore of dbd and complex killers if they saved the next license until next year I wouldn't be bothered.
All the license killers save Executioner and Demogorgon (the more modern licenses) have really simple powers that really boring.
Myers-Stabby one shots
Bubba-Chainsaw one shots
Freddy-Was interesting but got reworked into blood puddle in loops to win.
Pig-Ambush doesn't really function well. Head traps are cool but your forced into the same add-ons every game to make them work.
Nemesis-Tentacle man that give survivors an extra health state.
Ghost Face-Myers/Pig variation.
I know they're icons but from a gameplay perspective they're extremely limiting in what they can do. I'd take a twins or a Plague that have complex powers that can only come from building from the ground up for a video game than copy and pasting yet another slasher any day.
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Sorry if this is too off-topic, but is there a horror icon from more recent times in movie-, serie- or videogame media that's REALLY iconic?
And not something that started long ago and still continues today, like the HALLOWEEN movies.
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Pennywise is a guarantee— The only reason why BHVR didn’t get te Pennywise license when they went for to (McCote admitted to it) was because they were working on IT 2, so they weren’t available to start an open discussion about it.
With the release of the New Candyman movie, I could see it both situations happening again. Either it’s an original vampire/werewolf chapter because they are working on the movie, or they use DBD as a platform to promote their new movie.
Alien or Predator are basically guaranteed too since they’ve spoken about it in the past, but if it isn’t already obvious, the reason why these horror icons aren’t in DBD yet is because they’re box office successes and much bigger franchises than the last video game ones we’ve been getting.
It should now be more than obvious why they’re going for video game licenses, but in no way should they continue to pursue them. I’d love to see the next big horror-movie-series icon in DBD.
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They already have the major slasher icons except Jason, which they can't get. All the rest aren't really "slasher" or "icons".
Seriously, there's really not that many recognisable horror characters. Freddy, Leatherface, Michael Myers, Ghostface, and Jason. Those are the ones that you can show a picture of to a random person in the street and at least have them say "oh, that's whatsisname from the dumb movie!"
And Ghostface is questionable to be on that list.
Edit: To clarify, this is a game built around the "slasher" concept, so those are the only lisences they're really obliged to try and go for.
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As long as we NEVER see Jeepers Creepers come into DBD then I'm fine with basically whatever else they pick for a licensed DLC. :)
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I would also actually appreciate The Miner from My Bloody Valentine, I love that you can easily categorize each chapter and the characters within them into a different subset of horror: The Hag and The Huntress are representatives of Folk Horror, The Blight would be Body Horror, The Doctor is Psychological Horror, you could arguably place Nemesis as a Sci Fi horror killer on account of being a scientific creation with the purpose of being a bio-weapon (but true sci-fi horror is something DBD lacks, and would probably best be welcomed in the form of the Xenomorph or Predator), though he's not a killer Ash Williams is a good representative for Comedy Horror, Bill Overbeck represents Zombie Horror which is apparently an entire sub genre on its own (although Nemesis does now have actual zombies so there is that) etc. so on and so forth all of them for the most part under the umbrella of slasher conventions and the slasher genre.
The Miner and My Bloody Valentine are another excellent representative of Holiday Horror, which exist in Dead By Daylight in the form of Michael Myers, and the Krampus legendary skin for Trapper.
But any additional characters that really fill the demand for other genres to be more greatly represented in Dead By Daylight (we've got a lot of "sort of" Sci Fi horror chapters but not really what I would call fully in that genre, nothing that I would really categorize as Gothic Horror [Think Dracula, the werewolf, or a killer with some romantic elements IE Miss Smithson cosmetic for Nurse], and obviously only a few representatives for Holiday Horror.
Bolstering up these genres with more chapters and characters that fit in their veins is an excellent way to diversify the kinds of stories within DBD. Long way of saying yeah, My Bloody Valentine would be cool.
But not as many people know about it so I didn't add it onto the list.
A topic for an entirely separate thread. The fact is that they're going to release new licensed characters anyway, and the community voices their opinions on what they want to see within the game.
As important as game health is it is just not relevant within the context of this thread, as its just not what this particular thread is about. I'd appreciate it if people would stay focused on the topic being discussed.
I'll never understand this line of logic because it's so reductive. It assumes that there is absolutely nothing wrong with the concepts and live balancing for original killers that they're more or less perfect on their own, and it goes a step further and undersells the unique aspects of the kits of various licensed killers.
Michael Myers was released in 2016 and was the very first killer to play around with the idea of a reduced terror radius and not a full blown stealth ability (though he would have access to this in Tier 1), a concept which many killers in the future would take note of: Huntress, Spirit, Deathslinger, Trickster, etc. so on and so forth. His ability would also do a great job of referring to the plot progression of the Halloween movies (and many slashers in general) the threat of a creepy stalking serial killer is established in the beginning, the threat escalates throughout the middle of the film as he begins to maim, injure, and kill people, until finally climaxing when the menacing presence of the masked figure bears down on the protagonist.
Freddy had the most significant overhaul to his power to date that was very much a complete success in its entirety, and still stayed true to the concepts of the original films. Referencing multiple different scenes and moments of the films and the character of Freddy Krueger within his kit: the oversaturation and exaggerated use of blood in the films comes across clearly in every part of his power, generators which spurt blood, pools of blood which operate as snares, illusionary pallets which explode in a shower of blood.
The dream projection is an accurate way to represent Freddy's omnipresence within the dream world, the illusionary pallets of the misleading nature of dreams and nightmares. His blinking in and out of visibility at greater distances a reference to his overall surreal nature and being invisible while carrying another survivor (using Pill Bottle Add-on) is a direct reference to the moments in the films when Freddy invisibly drags characters who seem to levitate up the walls and across the ceiling in gruesome deaths, that would be Tina Grey's death in the original film, Julie's death in Wes Craven's New Nightmare, and Kris' death in the 2010 remake. The blood pools themselves are references to the stairways which turn to mush beneath nancy's feet in the original nightmare, the blood hallway in the 2010 remake, and the chest of souls in Nightmare 4 (the implication is that the blood pools contain the trapped souls of Freddy's victims).
The short of it is there is a LOT more thought and effort that went into Freddy's kit that people give the devs credit for.
And I could go on and on like this for many of the other licensed characters but frankly I burned myself out writing about Freddy, and I'm sure you get what I mean by now.
Licensed characters are not as limited as you'd think and just because we're familiar with them and can more easily predict what their powers are likely to be doesn't necessarily make them any less creative or unique within the context of the game itself.
There's a lot lot more to say about your comment but I've burned myself out on it at least for the moment and I'd like to respond to a few others.
Uhhhhh, the Aliens from A Quiet Place? The Blind Man from Don't Breathe? Wait- Stranger Things, I would say Stranger Things is iconic- a little bit.
It's an interesting question- but the point is that Dead By Daylight is more or less a tribute to the slasher genre most popular from the 70's to the 90's, and similar horror that grew out of that environment in those decades. It's why I and many others want to see characters that came from that place in time, there's a culture about it that is more memorable, authentic, and original. Not to say that culture was any better or worse then, just to say that slasher horror specifically was at its peak around this time.
It's also that many of these characters never got the proper opportunity to be revitalized in the interactive and immersive medium that is video games- on a level that films cannot achieve (again, not to say films are any better or worse in general- just to say that interactivity is the most successful purpose and aspect of games today). This isn't true for every character on the list- The Predator, Jason, the Xenomorph have all found their way into video games in some form or another (the quality of said games however, is entirely debatable) but Pennywise? Candyman? Pinhead? The Thing?? Chucky??? Not that I know of personally, although their legacies may have influenced future video games (The Thing - Deceit). But the characters themselves are what I'd like to I'd like to see translated into video games to be interacted with in a fundamentally brand new way that they never have before.
That's personally the reason why I value the presence of those characters more than other licenses- for example if Nemesis never came to Dead By Daylight- that's okay because I could still play RE3 remake and experience The Nemesis through that title. A better example might be Mr. X from RE2 remake, since he's not even in DBD and again that's okay too. Obviously this extends to other licenses like Fnaf, Slenderman, etc.
In the original post I never used the word slasher icon, since Dead By Daylight has kind of broadened its horizons from humble beginnings to encompass the horror thematic in a much more general overall sense. However, I'd like to point out that in order to qualify as a slasher you just have to use a slashing (cutting) instrument, ex: hag has claws which still "Slash" even if its not your traditional knife or machete or whatever. And indeed likewise, many of the characters listed have access to slashing instruments: Predator has his wristblades, Chucky himself most iconically uses a generic knife (he's seen holding one on some of the most recognizable cover art for Child's Play), Candyman has a literal hook in place of his cut off hand, Pinhead levitates hooks attached to chains, The Xenomorph has sharp claws, teeth, and a tail whip, and Pennywise iconically turns his innocently harmless white gloved hand into werewolf claws.
The only character on the list that doesn't have conventional slashing instruments is The Thing, but that's just too spectacularly well crafted of an iconic horror movie to not consider for Dead By Daylight. Also it'd fit the role of the requested shapeshifter killer the community has been requesting since 2016 (if the devs can just put the thought and energy into making it work- even if its a secondary power that isn't the sole focus of the kit) which is why people want to see The Thing.
Also also and more importantly, "iconic" is used very loosely in DBD simply for the fact that Horror itself as an entire genre (meaning everything, Slashers, Paranormal horror, Thrillers, everything) is in itself, a niche genre. Understandably, not everybody is into being scared (insert some whiney guy saying "dBd iSnT EvEn HoRrOr") and the target audience for horror is much smaller than say action or comedy films. So iconic is used more loosely, just because there are frankly many, many, many more people that don't watch horror than people who do. I could show pictures of Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees to my parents who were both born in the late 60's and they probably wouldn't be able to tell you who the characters were except that they looked familiar but didn't know their names and are just "those creepy serial killer guys", just because they never watched those films and got into that kind of thing.
Also also also and even more importantly: Ghostface's position on that list is entirely well deserved and cemented as an iconic figure of horror- The Scream Films singlehandedly revitalized slashers through smart films that both parodied and immersed themselves within the well known conventions and tropes of a slasher film.
Mathieu Cote, game director put it perfectly in the Behind The Scenes video for Chapter XII - Ghostface uploaded to Youtube:
"If you take any random people out there and you ask what's their list of the top ten killers in the world of horror- Ghostface is gonna be somewhere in there."
And Creative Director Dave Richard said in much more blatant terms:
"Ghostface is a character that's been requested so often by the community, and we're so stoked that we finally have him in game. Ghostface is- is a legend."
Post edited by Seiko300 on0 -
I’d hope BHVR wouldn’t be that dumb. The internet would burn them to the ground. (For those unfamiliar, the filmmaker behind “Jeepers Creepers” is a convicted child molester.)
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Don't go outside, its quite hot 🙄
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Hopefully they add Alien or Creeper. Two standout horror icons.
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Hmm...
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So random thing about The Thing is that they do have a shape-shifting killer in the game files and have had it for a while. I forget the reason it's not in the game
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Nah, it's actually quite chilly. :)
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Me too.
He's gotta come, he's just as important
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Can you explain what it is that's so fascinating about him? He's really popular amoung posters on here but I think he's completely bland and thats he's juat a poor mans doctor. What do people see that I don't?
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Unless I've been in a coma for several months, he hasn't even been added to DbD. How can he be a "poor man's Doctor"?
Personally, I liked his backstory, his motivation, and Tony Todd's voice just gives him that extra "oomph" to really stand out. The first time he appears and speaks just sticks with you, as do the brutal kills.
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Well..
He's a slasher, but different in a nice and refreshing way.
Let's compare him to the other more famous slashers people love. Those people are:
Michael Myers
Jason Voorhees
Ghost Face
Leatherface.
You may have noticed that they all share a similarity. They're quiet mindless murderers who Kill because of these rules.
Evil
Fame
Family
Revenge
Candyman fills Fame and Revenge, but as all good tragedies. He wasn't like this in the past.
He was brutally murdered for being in love with a woman. A white woman. Racial prejudice killed him and he vowed to be with his love. Killing all those who get in his way of his eternal love.
Sure that sounds pretty generic and it is, but when he becomes introduced, that's where it gets good. This haunting murdererous spector arrives, but... you don't feel fear. The sensual call, not a taunt, not a way to drop your guard, but a call as if you were familiar with them. You don't get hit with the Jumpscare "oooga booga" stuff, but just a new take. It feels so nice. I like a Jumpscare here and there, but Candyman's introduction is such a memorable scene that outshines all others besides Leatherface.
The actress did an amazing job with this scene, but hypnosis may have gone too far.
I'm sorry, it's hard to explain... I love Candyman because it's different from being a normal slasher, but it still has the elements of pure terror here and there, but you feel the love story as well.
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Especially with the "forbidden" love between two races, it makes it such a good memorable film.
Personally, I think Helen united with Candyman in the end. I know there's little evidence to support this, but just her announcing her love to him and her being a spector as well makes me think this
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I don't think she did. I think he wanted her to be with him, but failed and just turned her into something like him.
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That's fair, that's genuinely fair.
I always took it to "I'll be with you, but I refuse to let you take innocent people with you."
But, the next best thing about the movie is that it's actually subjective and you're not wrong about having a specific view on it... I kinda wanna watch it again now.
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DbD is a slasher game based on the slasher genre and slasher tropes, the gameplay itself is supposed to revolve around it which is why looping is being phased out. That means the Devs aren't obliged to anything but slasher icons. And an icon is just the most recognisable symbol or example of a thing, so that basically translates to "show some random in the street and see who they recognise because horror nerds will recognise everything and render the test pointless".
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First off- looping isn't being phased out, it's the main gameplay loop for survivors and killers, it's the entire reason why maps are designed the way they are, and in short DbD just wouldn't be the same game without this core central facet of gameplay. If you're referring to BHVR constantly releasing new killers with strong chase powers but little map control or other utility, then I would say even that is experiencing some pushback- it's not particularly new information to say that people don't enjoy going against chase killers because of how oppressive they are in 1 v 1s and how they kind of disregard the skill of their opponents entirely when it comes to looping or map knowledge because their power allows them to circumvent loops partly if not entirely.
Such that content creators are releasing videos like OhTofu's "Are New Killer Designs Destroying the Fun of DbD?
So it's not like the community is embracing this new trend either.
Secondly, you kind of ignored two things that I said so they still stand: I used arguably the two most iconic horror characters (Myers and Jason) in my example to then say that if I showed them to people that don't watch horror, they wouldn't know who they were. Unlike characters like say- The Avengers, people who don't watch or don't even like comicbook movies probably know who Iron Man, Thor, Captain America are (Captain America specifically is apparently super popular abroad which is somewhat surprising). I would argue that this is nowhere near the same for horror characters- again because they target a much smaller audience (typically teens / young[er] adults) who enjoy the "thrill" that the horror medium provides. To my previous example again, Action and Comedy and other genres in general are simply much more emotionally accessible genres than Horror is.
So if the most iconic characters (Michael Myers and Jason Voorhees) aren't even all that iconic- what does that mean for all the other characters that are being mentioned on this thread? For Pennywise, Chucky, Candyman?
Secondly Part Two, I literally told you that 7/8 killers mentioned on the list I provided ARE slasher characters to one extent or another because they all share the same identifying trait all slasher villains have in common- a slashing instrument. And y'know what, I'll take this a step further and say that The Thing does have their own slashing instrument because it frequently transforms its body to have all manner of sharp teeth and claws which it uses to kill victims in the film, like the scene where The Thing literally snaps off Dr. Copper's hands and then proceeds to bite into Windows' head in the next scene. So 8/8 of the listed killers are slasher killers.
So I don't understand what you gain out of the insistence that "DbD is only for Slasher Villains!" when everybody we're talking about here are classic characters of the slasher heyday in the 70's 80's and 90's. Y'know what isn't a slasher character? Springtrap. Slenderman. Yet these are requested every day by a minor but very vocal part of the playerbase, and I have no doubt that at some point in the future we likely will see these characters come into the game to appease that part of the community whether you agree with those additions or not. (Again, I'm not making it a secret that I prefer the slasher villains of the decades over those two, but it is what it is).
You know who also isn't a slasher killer? NEMESIS. Who is actually in the game. Or Mr. X for that matter, who were the top two picks for Resident Evil killers to make it in Dead By Daylight, neither of them use slashing instruments opting to overpower their victims with the sheer brute force of their fists. So unless you're trying to tell me that Nemesis inadvertently cuts his victims to death with his fingernails when he punches them- this kinda sinks your entire theory about Dead By Daylight being only for Slasher villains doesn't it? Clearly the devs have some other ideas about what their game is meant to be.
I personally admire the slasher genre, I'm very much fascinated by it. And I love that Dead By Daylight's origins and for most all of its history for five full years centered around slasher figures. But I can also accept, and even appreciate when the game and its developers decide to depart from their humble beginnings and pay homage to a few other figures of horror like Nemesis and beyond.
Though I am saying, I would very much love if characters like Pinhead, Candyman, Pennywise, Chucky, The Thing, and of course definitely The Xenomorph, The Predator, and Jason Voorhees would find their home in DBD, since it's been a long time since one of their kind has joined the game. The difference is I don't want to be controlling and voice an opinion that would stranglehold the games growth, hindering it, and prevent it from being likable and accessible to other audiences. I'm not saying flat out "no" to other licenses, I'm saying "later".
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Wow, you pretty much explained everything well. Why all horror should be welcomed.
I will be honest, I will miss "slashers" only idea I had when I first got into this game. It seemed so unique and lovely.
But, Pyramid Head joined and that feeling I had just died down, but for the better. Horror ICONS should be welcomed into dbd, not just slashers. If that was the case, more interesting concepts would never be reborn. These examples are: Scissor Man, The Keeper, IT, etc.
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Why is everyone forgetting Tallman from Phantasm!!!
It makes me so sad.
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DBD was originally a slasher sim.Well after Myers and the others came along but still.
Also lets not forget that all of this doesnt matter because the more content they add the worse the code will get which will make the game unfixable.
DBD is a bomb with a countdown at this point.
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This a late reply, I'm sorry.
.... that's a good question. But, there are horror movie slashers that are popular, but absolutely do not have a cult following like Halloween, Texas, and Nightmare on Elm Street.
These are Hatchet, the new Netflix movie movie train: Fear Street, and happy death day.
But, those fail in comparison. They're good movies, but two of them focuses on a supernatural gimmick more than the ideal character.
Hatchet is the exception, while the character is amazing, the story is pretty bland. Gotta have an amazing first movie to properly have a cult following.
Yet, those other two I put up are kinda different. While the characters are good, they're only really side characters for the story's main plot. They're not the center of the attention.
Fear Street focuses on the Witch (yes I watched all the movies. But this is the first movie as an example.) Whom possesses individual people, these people aren't special, it's the witch, but we never see her do anything else that would be truly captivating. The people are, but they're not focused on too much anymore, they're side characters.
Happy Death Day also follows this as well, but they actually do differ slightly away though. While there is a killer that's actually pretty iconic and not a side character, the main character is affected with a supernatural gimmick that makes the story much more interesting and engaging. That's it, especially towards the ending. The Killer is just a person, they don't have any disabilities, tragic backstory, possession, a sick motive, or anything special. But, what's even worse, is the fact that in the end. It didn't even matter.
Let's compare them to Ghost Face (first movie) to Happy Death Day.
They have the same exact motive. Revenge.
Ghost Face is more iconic however because they don't jokingly ask you "who's the killer? Don't worry, no one is actually gone forever, so it's just for fun"
In Happy Death Day, there is literally no consequence to guessing wrong in the plot. "Oh, is it my best friend? Oh no! They're dead! But, it's okay! I'll die!"
In scream, you saw the psychological torment the main character got from not only suspecting someone they absolutely hold dear, but became heart broken when they're wrong.
But, to answer your question?
No. These modern slasher movies are following an unfortunate trend and until they break that cycle, we'll tap out all the creative slasher characters concepts, but ruin them execution.
Sex, drugs, dumbass kids, or super natural experience that is hard to understand.
Friday is somehow the miracle child to not suffer through this until much later in the series. I think it's because they were the first to truly follow this trend and since you started it first, it's hard to be called out on something you created.
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