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Trickster isn't op
He is extremely RNG if you get a good map for trickster possible win bad map high chance at a loss. His blades feel more hard hitting but he is not friendly to newer plays with the blade reduction.
So stop complaining
Comments
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No.
He's not overpowered.
But he is extremely unhealthy in the EXACT same way that Old Legion was.
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He’s no where near op but right now he’s just huntress but missing every design aspect that made huntress fun and healthy
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Laceration removal should be a mending-like process. The timers suck for killer and six blades is too few for survivors.
His ultimate is very bleh and he didn't come with a new zone or even a map.
Bhvr is far more focused on cosmetics lately than game design.
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He kinda has nemesis design issues but he's just more efficient. He has some stupid facecamp capabilities with initial throw rate+extra knifes addons and if he by any chance charges his main event before the unhook you're so #########. He's on an okay spot but he still feels like ######### to play as and against.
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he is also not even remotely fun to play anymore due to having almost no breathing room for knives and the laceration being gone almost instantly
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What makes him like old Legion?
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I do understand he promotes unhealthy gameplay. But many things also promote unhealthy.
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Can you explain that further?
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No one said he’s OP, but I agree with everyone else that he’s in an unhealthy spot right now.
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He offers no counterplay during a chase. You cannot outplay him in a meaningful or punishing way. However, he continues to lose games despite being extremely oppressive in chases.
He cannot receive any buffs, lest we send him into real old Legion territory. That's why Legion himself hasn't received any changes despite being the weakest Killer at high levels.
Basically, in layman's terms, his design is bad and leaves him in a precarious state where he cannot be buffed and will remain unfun.
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All of which can apply to killers that aren't the punching bag of the forums like Nurse. Heck, the only times Trickster really lacks counterplay is low wall loops, where Huntress also lacks counterplay. In fact, his power is less applicable than Huntress. For instance, shack is borderline unplayable against Huntress, but can be used to run Trickster for a longer time than typical for a killer. This alone means that the Legion comparison is a massive exaggeration. Legion literally follows the survivor no matter where they go faster than the survivors. This is hardly comparable to Trickster.
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No, not current Legion, Old Legion.
And with Huntress, you can outplay her hatchets. You can juke them and make distance. You can punish a bad Huntress.
You can't really punish a bad Trickster. He's got enough knives that he doesn't need to be accurate.
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To quote everyone that complains about Deathslinger. In the circumstances I've listed, you can't outplay Huntress. She just misses. You also don't make distance when you juke a hatchet. I've notices that when I miss my hatchets, survivors typically loose distance because of how far off they had to veer.
There's no way in hell the Tricksters you face have outright bad accuracy and you go down, particularly now that laceration decay is more strict.
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"He offers no counterplay during a chase. You cannot outplay him in a meaningful or punishing way."
Is this based on his power in practice, or are you just basing this off of the theory of how his power works?
I've found that the new laceration decay has given him more than enough meaningful counterplay (can feel like more than before, at times), as breaking LOS and making distance is extremely effective with lacerations decaying extremely fast in seconds, wasting a ton of his time. I haven't had any problem against new Trickster as long as I'm not in the open. Yet to see a godly uncounterable Trickster, but maybe I'll change my mind once I do.
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I've played him quite a bit today.
T-L's result in easy downs.
Jungle gyms are harder but still downs.
I-walls are free downs.
Shack is pretty easy.
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He's never been OP.
He's one of the weakest killers IMO. He is strong in a very niche set of circumstances -- basically getting caught in an open area with no cover. So he's annoying to fight in maps like Autowreckers, Rotten Fields or maybe even Ormond.
Other than that he's relatively easy to verse compared to other killers.
Now is the buff live already? I don't pay attention to patch notes. I just escaped a match with him, 2 people died but that was because he was camping the basement hook. That we even got people out of the basement when he was hardcamping it tells you a lot.
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Then you've played against trash survivors. It is way more difficult and longer to get any health state in those situations than it is by playing Huntress. Yes, I unironically compared Trickster and Huntress in matches. Huntress is not only more effective, but easier.
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Sort of. Except unlike Old Legion, survivors can prolong the chase.
It's more unhealthy in the sense of Deathslinger or PH, imo. You've got one thing and one thing only that you can do to prolong the chase, although with Trickster it's running around a wall and not running away in a straight line.
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When, I dodge several Huntress hatchets, she is being punished.
When Trickter misses three blades, he throws ten more.
I like the concept but, application is bad. There is not much punishment for missing.
Now with less knives, maybe there is a little punishment for spamming. Maybe you got the injured but, you spammed too much and will need to reload.
I think this is a step in the right direction considering the drop of 6 as opposed to 8, a bit of trade off.
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I've had virtually no individual experience with Trickster, be it as playing him or playing against him, but the odds are stacked against you mate. The truth is clear: he is a toxic, unhealthy character. Reminds me of how the Legion and, at one point, the Clown used to be... extremely annoying to play against.
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Maybe.
But at this point in my career, I'd say they were average.
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That's literally untrue. You can easily land 4 knives on someone if they go for the window, more if they fake it. You can easily damage people if you predict the pallet throw too.
Also, how dare I happen to share an opinion with someone?
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I can’t do him on controller though. I’m so sucky with (old) I could exhaust all 60 knives without a single down. That recoil and response curve is abysmal.
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Bruh what? You might want to talk to your avatar about that then.
As for Trickster, I can't speak to how he feels to play (I don't own him). I can say that he is no fun to face off against.
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If you're going against averages, I mean, you can make literally any killer look unloopable. I've been perfoming really well at tall wall loops and large obstructions against him, and some of the Tricksters I've gone against have been pretty good shots with up to a few thousand hours (and some still won, but that was on bad gen pressure). The bad ones typically tend to be the ones running his teachables or controller players who struggle more with aiming shots. Either way, I'm telling you, the back and forth with the VERY quick laceration decay is not something to gloss over, as it's extremely useful in prolonging chases and sometimes shaking him off completely.
I think it's really easy to think Trickster is completely dumb when you're going against my teammates who're the players you're talking about right now. Loop structures extremely predictably giving free knife hits, get themselves caught in the open for no reason at all, no juking, no necessary prethrowing, no distance making, sticking by short wall loops (literally useless against him) instead of running to a safer structure, go down in 2 seconds, unhook in Trickster's face, unhooker gets downed, unhooked gets downed. I really just wanna avoid making excuses for people who aren't even trying.
For now, I say give it time - to myself too. I have yet to see a literal god with him, so I could change my mind. People have no ######### clue what they're doing against him, and I really do not wanna call Trickster a bullshit killer when the actual issue could very well be bad players (as it usually is).
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This. Every Trickster I've faced lately just camps and tunnels with him and it's super effective. Then of course they say after the match: "I have to camp and tunnel because he's a bad killer".
It feels like Twins all over again. Incredibly awful design for Killer resulting in unhealthy play style and of course BHVR can't seem to balance him properly.
I genuinely dislike Trickster now, not because he is op or anything but because everyone who plays him is just maximum scummy and then absolutely rude in the end game chat just like all the toxic Twins I dealt with a month or two after their release.
Just more gasoline on the cycle of toxicity and it's gross.
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What? He's not like old legion.
He still has trouble at L shaped walls; whether TL, killshack, or jungle gym. The problem at those walls is that running past the window hurts Trickster so much more than going through the window.
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If you lose to Trickster, you are bad at the game.
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Very helpful and mature input.
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Those survivors were idiots if you find the shack easy as Trickster.
In fact I think the hardest killer for facing the shack is Trickster, the other 4.4 killers have some kind of help in the shack.
- Hag can put traps for denying the shack.
- Deathslinger can shot before the survivor take the corner, through the window or along the room..
- Huntress the same as Deathslinger.
- Spirit, ok, no comments needed.
The Trickster can do the same as Huntress and Deathslinger but he need more than one shot for reducing a survivor health state, the only chance of Trickster in the Shack is shooting multiple shots in a slow or mid window vault and it doesn't guarantee a health state reduction and it happen at expense of a survivor mistake.
Jungle gyms are a pain and using the knives is pointless against any decent survivor who know how to play a jungle gym, the only thing you can do is to try an M1 (good luck with a 4.4 killer) or wait till a survivor mistake which not always happen and doesn't even gguarantee a health state reduction.
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You are correct, Trickster isn't OP. However, what he is is too much.
I finally got around to playing him tonight and... good lord.
First, I was right that they basically made Trickster a much more intense version of what he already was... for both his strengths and weaknesses.
Second, oh holy crap did they go too far. Waaaaay too far. The only change I'd say was fine was the 30 second window for Main Event. Everything else was way too much. He's too lethal. Too counter-able. Has to reload too often. Too few Main Events. Main Event is ridiculously beyond scary now if used at a good time. Just... everything is too much.
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Lmao. Sprit and Nurse are close to Op. But trickster? Are you serious? He can't do anything during loop.
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Respectfully, did you read the line when I said "He's not overpowered."
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I feel like Trickster still basically plays the same now except his strengths and weaknesses are seriously magnified. Survivors caught out in the open with Trickster are dead men walking but for harder loops like the homes in Haddonfield you'll lose half your lacerations before you even get a good angle to hit them again, it's pretty crazy.
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I agree. Even if some of his addons are nutty.
Eventually he might get some readjustments but it seems people just hate Trickster no matter what power he has and how strong or weak he is.
What do you expect in game which includes Nurse, Spirit, Deathslinger?
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twins and trickster both need completely reworked powers, but the actual chances of that happening are slim to none.
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I’m just sick of the talking points that people spam without any indication of practice. It’s literally just survivors regurgitating the same unproven talking points.
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4 out of the 5 games I played against him today had him just saw through full health survivors downed them and still had enough blades to re-down the hooked survivor. If he stays like this I imagine Borrowed Time will become a staple of everyone's build.
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He is, in a manner of speaking.
They both offer very limited counterplay during a chase. Made a Legion whiff? No worries, he can still swing with zero penalty.
Made a Trickster miss his knives? No worries, he's got plenty more.
It doesn't matter how much better you are than them, you will go down, albeit slowly.
The real difference is that Trickster doesn't have an exploit that boosts him from D-tier to S-tier like Legion did.
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Being killed by a camping and hard tunneling killer doesn't mean a survivor is bad though. Not everyone can run a killer for 5 gens and escape.
But I'm sure you only play one side and could care less about survivors or those who play both sides think. Regardless I'm done paying you any mind after this since you just want to incite others.
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Wrong, I play plenty of survivor too. Survivor shouldn’t be built around an individual being able to loop the killer for eternity, which is clearly what most of the survivor mains on here want. If your team is bad, you deserve to lose.
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You will go down eventually against many killers. Times of M1 killers who can be looped around whole game have long passed. Jungle gyms, Shack, Rock loops, Main building structures, there are a lot of places where good survivor will waste a lot of Tricksters time. Breaking LOS for 10 seconds is not that hard in this game. Yes, they will go down, but they will buy a lot of time for a team that is doing gens.
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I keep hearing "not friendly to newer players" as if Nurse isn't one of the hardest but strongest killers to play.
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Not quite old Legion but definitely not the opposite. Can't see how spamming knives with no real aim or repercussions is that skillful. Also shack isn't good against him any more than it is against a Huntress. Worse, actually, at least with Huntress she would get punished for missing if you baited well.
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How are you finding shack hard? What are the survivors doing to outplay you there?
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Regardless if he's strong or not. He's extremely annoying to play against. I haven't played as him but all these noises like i'm playing Dynasty Warriors getting knives constantly bass boosted hitting me and I don't want to go into his design...the devs really lost me when they added him into the game...there was a big debate about him being horror or not etc...I dont think that matters at this point, it's a Killer that should just be disabled till he actually functions and fits into the game.
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"Just because scott said it doesn't make it true"
His argument after that
:
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Yeah he's not op, he gets ######### by most maps and most loops, he's only really good out in the open if you aren't on controller and can actually aim.
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Sprintboost, Breaking Line of Sight.
Also avoid getting chased by hiding (use stealth cosmetics and maybe iron will).
His biggest weakness are large maps with lots of objects and tiles. He has little to no map preassure. Thats why he loses many matches.
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