Bully Squads Make Me Genuinely Upset
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I mean eventually, you build up a tolerance to it. If you really think about it, you are getting mad at a videogame character who never missed leg day and has an amazing trigger finger
So when you really don't care about it, they're just putting themselves at a disadvantage and wasting their own time. Hell I find those games to be fun af because there's absolutely 0 down time. Theres always something going on and its funny af watching them screw up occasionally and freaking the ######### out
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Yh matches against bully squads suck. But just keep plugging at it. Inused to have the same issue and eventually you get to learn the signs and can switch perks to counter them as you improve. Try getting hillbilly and legion prestiged, lightborn is amazing to switch to if you see a swf with torch bullies. And without torches they will struggle a lot to bully you. And bodyblocking/sabotaging hooks is risky. You can punish them with iron grip and mad grit.
Plus when you do improve and can take down bully squads it is soo satisfying.
Also try not to let it colour your experience as killer, I'm much more chill in games with nice and skilled survs, usually let one get hatch unless i have a challenge to do. No need to spread the toxicity to those who don't deserve it. But if a surv/ team BMs me then I go all out to punish them 😈
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perhaps the custom bot matches that are supposed to come soon would help you practice.
or if you can find people to practice with in kyf you can do that as well there's a discord server for dbd where you can find people that might help.
if you're using a controller it'd be pretty hard to counter 360s but not impossible.
watching how content creators play will help you a ton as it helped me.
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Apparently you feel personally attacked.
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Yeah, no. Setting out to make someone else feel bad is a lousy thing to do. Don't defend it, or demand that other people excuse it.
This sort of stuff is the main reason I don't play killer more. I have lousy games as survivor too, but they're over quick and I can get into a new lobby. Being stuck in a game with a bully squad just makes me want to DC before I end up tense, angry and actively hating the game.
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Just for some healing and soothing purposes, I will share a game I just had were I 4k-ed against a bully squad and they didn't expect it, because it was my "Late Game Salt"-Mikey build.
They harassed me all game, t-bagged and flashlight clicked me at every opportunity, while playing it as save as possible and looped back to the shack at every chance they got, so I went into EGC with just 3 hooks to my name.
But thats the beauty of this build: Overconcidence is a slow and insidious killer and in quick succession they all fell to my blade. No one expects NOED with Mikey, so it totally catches them by surprise :)
But back to topic: I often get the feeling that a lot of killer mains are actually at least 70/30 split players and that there is really rarely a full "killer main". The players that identify as "killer mains" love playing killer, but that doesn't mean that they won't play survivor. I have actually never encountered any killer main who didn't play a good portion of survivors.
If you turn the thing around, though, it looks quite different. You can't kill with friends, you can only survivor with friends, and as the vast majority of players enjoy playing together, this leads to a very big portion of "survivor only" survivor mains, ie players with next to non experience of the game as the killer.
I am not trying to spin this as a "killers good, survivors bad" thing, we all know that there are horrible persons on both sides, who actively try to ruin others fun, BUT the lack of empathy for the other side is far, far bigger on the survivors playerbase then on the killers. And I strongly believe that this ties in into a lack of playing the other side. Circling back: most killers also play survivors and know the pain of getting tunneled and camped on 1st hook, while a good portion of the survivor population don't really know how tough life of a killer can be and how debilitating a crushing survivor victory feels.
I identify myself as a killer main, but I never, ever felt the same rush of frustration or anger when a killer nods at me and hits on the hook as when I get hit in the face by a palette and then t-bagged and pointed it. Nodding might be the killers version of BMing, but it doesn't even play in the same ballpark of infuriation. Hitting on the hook beyond the first appreciation slap is meanspirited, but even that gives the survivors the satisfaction that they tilted the killer enough to lose their cool and they might even enjoy themselves while dangling on the hook, whereas a killer NEVER gets satisfaction out of a t-bag and thinks "yeah! I chased you so good that you now need to t-bag me". You might get jaded enough that it doesn't get to you anymore, but thats not thanks to this particular survivors gameplay, that just the thousands before them who BMed and t-bagged you.
BMing the killer has been part of the game since the very beginning, and it has never been adressed. So this leaves us with the question: is BHVR actually scared that they might lose players if they can't stick it to the killer anymore? Is the humiliation of the other side and the bully survivor playstyle an integral part of the fun of a big enough portion of the game, that they can't just change this without risking their revenu?
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I like your assertion of truth. I affirm all of this.
However... There are some of the worst BULLY SQUADs who know that killers are hard and do BM knowing that.... That is really worse than BMs done by ignorant survivors who have no knowledge that killers are hard. They even proudly clip it and upload it to social media... Why can't the world stay peaceful?
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are you guys for real?
Bully squads are actually fun to go against because they will get in your face so there's some interaction between the sides, of course if you are bad and does not know how to counter some basic stuff then yeah it's painful but anyone with some experience can deal with them pretty easily
the thing you should be scared of is a 4 man swf that will split up on gens and have 5 gens done under 5 minutes after they comp pre-drop everything
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lol nice job, you exposed yourself as extremely insecure. relax man, everyone else is here for good vibes. have some empathy bro, no one'll judge you.
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Insecure about what?
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My first experience with a bully squad is what prompted me to write my own thread/discussion about the issue (here is you want to read it https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/347588/i-hate-flashlights/p1)
But to save you the click, I was pretty much bullied by a swf with flashlights. Chain blinded to oblivion, told to uninstall and that I was "bad' in the post-game. Bodyblocked and denied pickups/hooks. At one point I was in a standoff at shack, I had downed a survivor as they attempted to vault through the window. As I climbed through to pick them up, the other three members of their team surrounded me. One was behind me at the window, one was in front and the other was to my left. I literally could not go for pick up because if I did, I'd just get blinded, if I tried to leave the downed survivor slugged to chase, one of the survs on "stand-by" would just run in with their medkit and heal the slug. if I tried to vault back behind me I'd just get blinded. I just didn't know what to do, I was so flustered and annoyed. They couldn't have been more obvious that they were on Discord or some other voice chat app, their movements were just too coordinated.
Anyway, until that point, I had dealt with cocky survivors but I've always managed and had been able to let it go and move on to the next game. But something about the way they played just broke me a little, like they were playing as if they didn't want to play the game, but torment me, the killer instead. Like I was just some silly AI Bot to abuse, there for their own amusement and nothing else. I know that a more skilled player would have been able to deal with them, but I'm still a baby/new killer and don't have much experience with those kinds of players.
My best advice and I know it's not overly helpful until the actual culture around DbD changes and people remember that they are indeed versing people and not inhuman AI. Is to just step away, make yourself a coffee or a cup of tea and take deep breaths. Let them make fools of themselves and let them think that they're "l33t" because they can play a video game.
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With the added toxicity of player entitlement experienced in League of Legends on top. XO This is the reason why I'm glad the game doesn't have an inbuilt VC or chat function in-game because people would just be so disgusting to solos coupled with the usual CoD toxicity and sexism and all that loveliness.
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I felt the same way when I started. Outside the whole "4 people taunting 1 guy" thing, thing, there are 3 main aspects that make it stressful/unfun that you have control over.
- You're not good enough to punish it, or don't have the right killer/build.
- You're trying your best and it feels humiliating to be taunted and lose despite this.
- You're afraid of or care what they'll say in chat to rub it in, or getting taunted at gates.
It irks me to play against such squads, but not as much as before. Some tips:
Decide preemptively if you want to engage in post game chat or not, as well as if you want to go to gates. There's no shame in keeping chat closed and just pressing continue. Unless you wanna check perks or something. Just like you should feel free to open gates and AFK, if you have no chance of catching anyone.
Practice and get better. If you're better at the game, bully squads, especially those that hang around for saves tend to be easy to deal with. Alternatively, bring lightborn if you see multiple flashlights. Take note of if your character can easily trade for a 1k in the late game and manage your expectations.
Finally, drop the ego for a bit and accept that the match will be hard once you notice multiple players BMing and running well. Mindset matters a lot. A lot of stress is because you expect survivors to play normally, but they don't. Expect to get taunted alot, don't take it personal, drop chases you can't seem to end. Take a step back. It's okay if you lose, and you have nothing to prove.
Not sure if you'll read all this but stick to it, take breaks when needed. This game can be frustrating.
I personally keep chat closed most of the time and just move onto the next game myself even after becoming decent at killer. I rarely get anything positive out of it.
Hope this helps you, or anyone really.
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Knock on wood and hope that Behavior doesn't get any bright ideas about adding such a feature. 😬
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I'm pretty sure, (read: hoping) they won't because it goes against the original idea behind DbD, in that the survivors aren't meant to be able to communicate but figure out how to survive on their own.
Like something needs to be done to help soloQ, like better matchmaking or something, but VC certainly isn't the answer.
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Well unfortunately swfs communicate on comms, so they already flaunt an unfair advantage that the devs can't prevent.
Now, what I think would be a reasonable option for both swfs and solo queues would be if the devs added proximity chat. That actually makes sense for the game. Survivors can communicate, but only if they're actually near one another. They wouldn't be able to communicate across the map and give real time intel on the killer's position, chests, totems, etc. I would have no issue with that.
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I don't think that would even help, because a swf would just switch back to Discord/comms once they're outside of the proxy-chat range. It'd be a leg up to solo for sure and maybe even killer if they could hear but not interact with the survivors, but the swf would still have the advantage.
It also wouldn't stop the potential for toxicity, like being salty and bad-mouthing/abusing misplays or builds, being sexist/ist/phobic knobs to other players.
Like I can see the potential, but it'd be hard to get it to work.
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If it were me, I would allow proximity chat strictly for survivors, and killers would not be able to hear it. Within the fiction of the game, one would assume that the survivors would be whispering, so as not to be heard and discovered. Yes, it could enable toxicity among the members of the solo queue, but there isn't a whole lot that can be done about it. As it is, there's already post-game chats and DMs where the less desirable members can spew their venom. Those dedicated to spreading hate and making others miserable will always find a way to disseminate their poison. However, it might actually curb some of that toxicity. You could have Behaviour employees randomly monitor proximity chat for offensive speech. Or enable a way to record and or store the audio from matches for a brief period of time (say, seven days). It would give the devs concrete evidence of wrongdoing, making banning of such undesirables easier and more likely. 🤷♂️
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Someday I hope to find this mythical citation from the developers that EVER claimed this was a "party game".
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Well, it ain't Modern Warfare, either.
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This post made me so sad. That is top notch toxicity. It’s zero fun and it’s unnecessary. But I think you nailed it…a lot of survivors do treat killers with no regard that they’re actual humans.
The BMing is so disgusting. For me, I can take a loss…but I don’t want to be tbagged and clicked at over and over and over w it. I rarely take mercy on survivors anymore, because why…so even when I’ve let them go, they can tbag at the gate?
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No, it isn't.
I just want to know where this "It's a party game!" rhetoric started. Because people wield that phrase like it's a design intention, and I can find literally nothing to prove that. Not one forum post, not one dev stream, not one tweet. Nothing.
It's almost like it's a load of bull that people completely made up. Funny.
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I don’t play in “bully squads”; so no, I don’t.
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It's not a matter of them being hard, they're honestly about the same difficulty level of baby dwights. The problem is to me, they're absolutely boring and feel like a chore to go against. Maybe it's fun, but I find hitting people 2000 times with no looping involved extremely boring.
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I honestly don't even think its fun to play with bully squads and I don't think whether or not I could deal with it has any bearing on my enjoyment. Therefore, I don't like the "it's a matter of skill" advice in discussions about bully squads.
Because they don't aim to clear the game, they aim to collectively bully someone on the internet, and they do all the frustrations, including BM's.
Of course it is possible to play DbD just to succeed in clicking and T-BAGGING, spamming noise, and 4 consecutive Head on's. ...... It's a little too much. I'm not convinced that it's not a stressful element of the game's progression, but rather that it's played just to intentionally stress you out.
And even if you achieve 100% kills on such bully squads, there is no fun in it. There is only tiredness, sadness and frustration.
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Actually it's not a load of bull. "Party game" is a blanket term for any game consisting of multiple participants played solely for the fun and enjoyment of everyone involved.
Dead by Daylight is survival horror. Survival horror has never been a competitive genre. People play survival horror for the purpose of experiencing the scares and the tension horror creates within a safe setting. In other words, we play them for FUN.
You know what you will not find anywhere in Dead by Daylight? Leaderboards. No updates from Behaviour to display the Best Killer Main and Survivor Main of the Week on our main menu. No list of the Top Ten Highest-Scoring Swfs. You know why?
Because: It's. Not. A. Competition.
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When I go against a bully squad (which didn't happen in a long time) I start trolling. There is no reason for me to play seriously. Why even would I?
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It was pretty bad, like I just dont see the point in playing the way they did and then how they gloated about it in the post game as if they had some amazing clutch victory against a high MMR player. With the added cherry of telling me to uninstall, that I was bad at Trickster (who I was playing), missing 80% of my knives etc was pretty goddamn ######### disgusting. Like no wonder DbD is slowly dying, because people like them make playing killer or survivor into almost physical and psychological torture.
Like you, I can take a loss or a match where I get 0-1k. My average when I get put into a match of my own MMR is 2-3K, I'm average at best given that I'm still new to the game. But like many, I just can't stand the BMing in this game. Why should I go to the exit gate to watch a 4-man swf tbag, nod and clicky-click me just because they ran me in circles the entire game and I know they want my attention because they start to rapidly vault windows and drop pallets near the exit gate that's open, heck sometimes they'll even go and open the other gate just to try and spite me more.
Like, I play League of Legends on the regular, so you'd think I've seen all that internet toxicity has to offer. But clearly, I have not, I haven't even scratched the surface.
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Only one way to deal with it, practice.
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""Party game" is a blanket term for any game consisting of multiple participants played solely for the fun and enjoyment of everyone involved."
Source?
Cause again, this sounds like a bullscrap term made up by players, not developers.
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Party game
A multiplayer game, usually consisting of a series of short minigames, that can be easily played in a social setting.
Source: wiktionary.org
A game that is designed for large groups of people and emphasizes social interaction, creativity, and/or volubility.
Source: boardgamegeek.com
Party games focus on play sessions with a group of players. Party games are focused more on social interaction. Party games usually have simple controls and allow for easy drop-in and out so that everyone can enjoy them.
Source: mobygames.com
Note that none of these three definitions mention competitive play as a vital characteristic. Now you will be good enough to cite your source stating that Dead by Daylight was designed and developed specifically for competitive play, won't you? There's a good boy.
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It's just never gonna sit right with me, 360ing. The fact that skilled players get caught off guard by it on a regular basis speaks volumes. Why should we have to learn to counter a survivor spinning in front of us? It's beyond stupid. Maybe the game should have more generous survivor hitboxes, or not have aim dressing, or have better killer fov.
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Holy crap literally none of those apply to Dead By Daylight.
#1: Dead By Daylight is not a series of "minigames", regardless of your opinion of skill checks.
#2: Four is not "large".
#3: This game is not "focused on social interaction".
Dead By Daylight is competitive because you literally have four plays COMPETING against another player. You just want the word "competitive" to mean "tournament level". A junior high baseball game is "competitive", and it doesn't stop being that way because it doesn't have a leaderboard.
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Still waiting on your source citations, good sir. 😉
Also, I thought I'd posted a copy of the above video to this thread, but I don't see it here now, so I'm putting it up again. Consider it proof of concept. Watch and learn.
Oh, and technically speaking, you could consider each match as a minigame, since they tend to be short in duration and there is no long-term campaign to play out.
Post edited by Superbeasto1974 on0 -
No, mini-games are games inside the game. Trials of Dead By Daylight are the core game.
Also, you don't get to cite "hard evidence" by just linking a random video without context and expecting someone to sit through an unknown number of minutes to reach a point.
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I much rather have a bully squad than survivors who just hold w and can't even loop properly making the game feels like I'm hunting bots down and ending a game with a pointless bland taste in my mouth.
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I do love how this thread has devolved into a debate about if DbD is considered a party game or not. :-/ Can we please get back to the thread topic?
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How to handle them is play nurse or blight. At a high enough skill level that is the only solution.
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Would you like to join me in proposing a casual mode?
In casual mode, you can play hand in hand with bully squads, just like at a party. However, the map is always badam.
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What if I suck with nurse and blight?
Asking...for a friend
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Essentially you can play the next tier down with one of about 8 killers: Pyramid Head, Plague, LF, Nemesis, Huntress, etc.
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The best advice I can give is to not take what survivors do personally, it's like fighting games people like to get inside your head and tilt you to get the upper hand. As soon as you let them do so, you're more prone to falling for what they are baiting you to do.
Your wellbeing is the most important thing, so don't hesitate to leave the match or, take a break to give yourself some breathing room!
I'm pretty worried at this point everything is going to be deemed toxic and this game is going to be so linear and boring. lol
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Some are, and some definitely are not. For me, I'm not fussed, but I can see how their behaviour could upset others.
But also there are many swf teams: some brats, some very decent, some even happy to lose for the giggles! They make a decent percentage of players in the game, and although I'd prefer swf not to be a thing (purely for immersion purposes), I understand how important that playerbase is.
And there are a lot of nice ones who can make games very fun, but those who cause issues to upset others are a real disease amongst the playerbase.
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It's a vicious cycle friends play together to bully the killer, for that killer play to bully the next group of survivors in that match.
Just for those survivors to join other bully groups to bully more killer players, and for more killer players to camp to show their dominance.
Nothing is going to change no one is going to change the way they play.
All you can do is move on to your next match.
Or take a break and play something else😀
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I don't disagree, but at least you can learn to counter 360ing in DBD to some degree. In VHS, trying to spin with the survivor and backing up while hitting don't work. 360ing is the main reason I haven't been playing that game.
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Yeah mine is less about waiting out their spin or backing up, and more about spinning my camera to hit them. My survivors' 360s are weird, like they're going behind me or through me yet sometimes don't get hit, so I started doing that.
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Oh I know how exactly how you feel. I know I may be repeating what others say but I get really frustrated and tried of facing and dealing with those people. I mean I tried to ignore and even report them for their bad behavior. I mean I know ignoring them is the better solution to deal with them.
But from my personal experience, it’s really hard not the deal with them. I mean seriously why do survivors feel the need to gloat and messed with people. They don’t always messed with killers. I have survivors still messed with me even when I’m playing survivor.
I just feel that bullies in general need to leave others like their fellow survivors and killer players again alone.
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I think that's the main issue, is that they're ruin others fun just for the sake of their own.
Most people can brush off a troll or two, especially if they're spread out over a few games. But a full bully squad several games in a row, it can break people.
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Well getting slugged and bleed out annoys me so the circle of ######### goes on
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