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Dead Hard is Overrated and Overhated
Comments
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that it's overrated, like i said lol
When my friend and I first picked up the game in 2018 he used to run No Mither (lol) and Dead Hard just because he heard that it can extend the chase by a long time.
Needless to say it did jackshit for him.
I think Dead Hard is an overrated and inconsistent, but good perk.
As killer, I'd pick 4 Dead Hards over 4 Sprint Bursts any day of the week (except Wednesday, we get a little crazy on those days).
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It's only inconsistent if you use it incorrectly. (to dodge attacks)
If you use it to gain distance in a loop, it always works and is very powerful.
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Dead Hard is one of those perks that really don't annoy me as a killer.
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Both are valid ways to use Dead Hard because both are its intended use.
Both are inconsistent dependent on the killer (instadown), positioning (deadzones), latency, and map RNG.
Dead Hard is inconsistent.
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average killer after waiting 0.87345 seconds for a dead hard
average dead hard enjoyer getting exhausted on the ground anyways
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My issue with Dead Hard is just against killer powers a lot of killers are punished HEAVILY for missing their power and Dead Hard can really screw with a huge number of powers.
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As someone who played thausends of hours as survivor and using Dead Hard 90% of the time: Its one of the best perks in the game, a bit overpowered and especially way to crutch that is should even excist.
I understand all the hate and i am fine with a nerf, but i can not think off a possible change that would not completly ruin it and make it more fair.
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I find it really bizarre that you're claiming it is inconsistent, despite so many survivors consistently picking it each game - If the perk, when used properly, was as inconsistent as you claim, it would not be as popular or useful as it is.
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Really the only time it's inconsistent for me is when i desperately need to dodge a hit in the middle of a dead zone.
I do remember a lot of times when I was exhausted on the ground. But that is an exception to the rule. You use Dead Hard for distance, the I-Frames basically helps secure you getting there.
Again, the very fact this perk exists changes how Killers play. I don't understand why OP thinks it's overrated if it changes how the game is played by the very existence of it. Like DS and BT.
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exhausted on the ground is a meme at this point
why are you acting like i'm the first person to claim that dead hard is inconsistent?
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The strongest perk in the game isn't "overrated" you just aren't using it correctly.
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Because I... never said that it doesn't change how the game is played. I acknowledged that. I claimed it was overrated in the fact that I think Sprint Burst and Lithe are bigger time wasters and that people overstate how much Dead Hard can extend a chase, along with listing its many drawbacks, which I think limit it from being the best exhaustion perk.
These are all things you can find in the original post. What point are you missing?
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I'm curious, how in the heck does Dead Hard change the way a killer plays? Does it have a passive effect we don't know about? lol
I literally tilt my head upward when playing killer when I'm right up their behind to bait out Dead Hard, meanwhile I see the baby Meg pauses for a second when she is about to go down only to sprint away.
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I don't use Dead Hard because Sprint Burst is better.
Try again buster.
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Without dead hard's existance, there would be less room for clever plays. Because killers dont lunge when a survivor has a chance to DH to gain distance, it's possible to hide around a corner quickly and bamboozle them. Without DH, killers would just lunge and there would be nothing clever you could one.
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What would you do if Dead Hard wasn't a thing? You'd immediately hit the Survivor no questions asked. Just the moment an opening is there, you'd lunge forward and whack the Survivor.
It's something you always have to keep in mind even if Dead Hard wasn't in play. You have to waste a second or two to bait the Dead Hard, and I don't think I need to tell you that a second is a lot more impactful than you think when it comes to a chase. It could be a second to reach a window, to reach a pallet, to escape in a safe zone.
Not to mention that it gives you distance which can further elongate a chase that could be 10-15 seconds long to over 40 if they get into a good tile. Dead Hard allows you to be GREEDY. It allows you to take risks while mitigating it. It changes how the Killer plays by giving the Survivor a second's grace period which can be crucial with dodging a hit.
Tell me, even with how inconsistent Dead Hard can be, how many times as a ranged Killer have you been screwed over by Dead Hard? Because I've personally been screwed by someone pressing E from a distance multiple times.
When you see someone have Sprint Burst, you can just leave them be or catch them again when they don't have it. Sprint Burst literally is signalling to the Killer that you can be downed immediately without hesitation. They know for certain you can't just Press E to get I-Frames and go for distance.
Yes, you can 99 them. I've said this before in the thread. But 99ing an Exhaustion Perk is never as viable or consistent as keeping your Dead Hard. You cannot keep them 99ed when doing a gen, you cannot keep them 99ed when positioning yourself to go for a flashlight/pallet save. You HAVE to use it at that moment. But you can do the same thing with Dead Hard, but without all of that hassle weighing you down.
Dead Hard doesn't carry bad survivors. Bad survivors will ALWAYS struggle even with all the meta perks carrying them. But Dead Hard on a good survivor can extend a chase way more than you need. A good survivor can keep a chase going even while injured. A better survivor can do it without getting injured.
I get that you think it's overrated because you can just "bait out the Dead Hard", but there's a reason that everyone runs this perk and why it performs leagues above the rest. That isn't a coincidence. People gravitate towards the options that gives them the biggest advantages. And Dead Hard is one of them.
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Being exhausted on ground doesn't really factor into the optimal/most consistent way that competent players (in terms of Dead Hard usage) choose to use it.
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I mean, the same thing can be said about Lithe, SB and BL.... "Oh there is a window there, I just remembered they had Lithe", "Working on a gen injured, Oh yeah they have SB, so they are going to commit".... etc etc. None of the exhaustion perks fall outside of that question you just asked, none. The only thing you are changing is the scenario in which they happen at.
You mention ranged killers, which the same rules apply. You can dodge a Nurse hit with DH, just as much as you can with SB. In fact, with SB is far worse (for nurse) because you can do it through 2 blinks.
You are never going to 100% know if someone has SB or not. Like the example above, this perk doesn't require positioning, because you can be in a very dead area and get to a safe area before the killer is close enough to get a hit. Something which DH doesn't have.
I also don't understand the notion that DH is "too" good on good survivors, but if the survivor has more experience with that exhaustion perk, that would....make sense? Some people despise being chased, so they hide well and they opt to have SB instead. Some people like to be chased more so they choose DH over any other perk. The logistics for exhaustion perks are very different IMO. So we can sit here and chat about scenario A/B/C/D/E and which one would be a better option. What I am not going to do is fault someone for being "too good" for a perk. Not when perks on the opposite side exist that would also be deemed too good on a more experienced killer.
The reason many people run Dead Hard (contrary to popular belief) is because many people like to engage in a chase. Because that is where they find fun in this game. They don't want to be the player holding M1 and hiding all the time. It is the only perk that efficiently works while looping, because if there were more I can guarantee you they'd be used as well.
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The reason many people run Dead Hard is that it is the best exhaustion perk in the game that provides the best chance for survival when used at the proper/optimal times.
There's nothing wrong with this - It's ok to use whatever you want.
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The fact you think SB is better shows you have no idea what you are talking about.
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OP’s point only applies when boosted survivors are using it.
Good survivors will use Dead Hard to make looping a nightmare for killers.
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Something being "dependant" on latency isn't an argument for balance. At all. If that was the case we could call Nurse balanced because she requires good latency or her blinks stagger her. It's use is not used for dodging a swing. At all. Being useless in a dead zone just means it has a weakness, a scenario where SB trumps it. However, it's completely irrelevant if you're not injured anyway and the benefit of DH comes from a hit.
Objectively speaking SB is better. Realistically? Realistically it counters some of the best killers in the game. Nurse perfect blinks, 5 Blight bounces, fatigue into them both.
Mess up at a loop? Dead Hard. Get outplayed? Just push E. Want to play greedy and get another loop? Press E again. It seems weird to me that people want to pretend that DH isn't totally busted, the same as Sprint Burst. SB prevents that hit and chase from ever happening, but DH? DH makes what would have otherwise been a down and turns it into a pallet, a vault, and a massive amount of time depending on the loop and what you can get to next. I think it's pretty ridiculous a perk can let you sit in perfect safety as the killer walks right up to you, for you to just be 100% safe and SB to a loop. Again, all Exhaustion perks are busted, unfair, and will never be changed.
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SB does the same thing, but better. I really hope DH gets nerfed so you guys can play against SB every single game, lol. That's gonna be fun to watch 😂
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It's hated because it makes killers feel robbed for mindgaming correctly or capitalizing on a mistake all for that to be taken right back from them. Multiply that times 4 survivors who may or may not be good at looping to begin with, and it just takes too long to down survivors before all their resources are gone/all the gens are done.
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I guess I am just screwed then if I am playing myers, pig, trapper, legion, plague, ghostface, hag, or twins since they can't feign an m1
but yeah case closed just play clown to bait out dead hard
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I doubt it's as common as you allege.
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I disagree. In my opinion, DH is the only perk in the entire game that needs a nerf.
The fact that it completely saves you from a situation where you clearly deserve to go down is already bad enough.
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If that’s the only thing you can do to support your weak argument, you already lost lol.
I think I know what I’m talking about. :)
My point about the latency wasn’t an argument about it’s balance. In fact— the thread wasn’t actually about balance in the first place. My point was that it being latency dependent, along with it’s other issues make it overrated in my eyes.
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The evidence is anecdotal but doesn’t deny my initial point, regardless of how common it is on a grand scale.
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"Every single killer should have basekit counterplay"
This has never been the case with anything ever
If your chosen killer doesn't counter it, just equip an instadown perk
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You even named 3 killers that counter it with their base kit genius LOL
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There are better perks to use than something like MYC or devour hope.
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That's your problem, the game isn't obligated to hand you a free counter
If you're unwilling to sacrifice one of your 4 meta perks, then you can deal with dead hard
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I never said it was, and no you still can't deal with it when it is used to gain distance, you just have to suck it up and keep chasing. It feels pretty bad to do so especially when it is all you can do against an already good survivor.
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"The survivor dashed 4 feet and made it to a pallet? OP NERF NERF NERF NERF NERF"
-Entitled killer that refuses to pick one of the dozen counters that shut down this perk
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Overrated? Absolutely not. Overhated? Definitely.
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Please name the perks you think "counter" dead hard.
None of the ones that inflict the exposed status effect tho, those are pretty situational and only really work if the survivors heal or you are playing a specific build with a certain killer.
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Watch coconutrts. He put out a video where he was losing multiple games until he put on an exhaustion addon on his huntress. It carries survivors hard.
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To get a mid chase sb means you couldn't do gens to hold it at 99 or were just lucky the killer found you when it was almost charged. Unless there us some method i am unaware of where you can do gens and hold it at 99%.
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"List perks that counter dead hard"
"Not the perks that directly counter dead hard tho"
What more could I expect from the guy that couldn't figure out how Ghostface counters DH?
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It’s true Dead Hard loses effectiveness when the Killer witnesses it the first time.
But it’s secondary feature is to reach spots a little quicker, at will.
Which is why it’s considered incredibly strong, unless your in a dead zone then it’s useless.
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Ugh, attempt to be reasonable.
Coup de grace is the only perk I can think of that can possibly mitigate this, and blood echo I guess. However even with its extended lunge cannot deal with dead hard due to dead hard and the lframes and lagged hitbox survivors have when moving at high speeds. It also costs you a generator to get this effect.
As for the insta downing killers or perks I say it does not fully mitigate it because once the survivor is unhooked they will be injured and most likely just get back on gens instead of healing. What then?
You might work around DH once or twice, but it will still be used at least 3 times per survivor depending on their level of skill. And I am not saying that it should never be used btw.
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The arrogant always think they know what they are talking about. And you didn't "win" anything, you stuck your head into the sand, ingored everything people who contradicted said then claimed self said victory in an online forum? Okay man.
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Survivors choosing not to heal is a win-win for the killer
You're either bypassing DH if they heal, or you're skipping a health state. If you put as much effort into the game as you put into whining, you wouldn't be so concerned with DH. You'd rather complain than change a fraction of your meta build.
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How am I skipping a health state exactly? They still have dead hard, that is pretty much a free health state. Also you are being unreasonably rude for no reason too.
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If he does this for an excessive amount of time (like 100 games without and 100 games with Exhaustion Add On), I might change my mind. I dont change my mind on a few random games, those can be complete coincidence.
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I hate dead hard with a passion. The other exhaustion perks have fair and acceptable trade offs to me. They’re strong but they can be dealt with.
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Dead Hard or not, an injured survivor is one health state less than you would normally have to deal with. Not healing isn't counterplay to instadowns, it's a catch 22 for the survivors
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Strongest survivor perk in the game is overrated. Ok
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I have more trouble dealing with SB/Lithe than DH, the distance survivors gain from waiting til the last second to run from you is insane it's barely even worth committing to them once it happens. Whereas with DH I dunno whether it's coz Charlotte's walking speed is pretty fast but I tend to just stay inside the survivor's butt until they panic and do a pointless dead hard that doesn't even help them and then immediately smack them down lol. Or if I have a Coup token I can start my lunge, they dead hard, but I hit them right at the end of it. Very satisfying
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