Boon totems vs hex totems
Boon totems in the PTB allow survivors to continuously keep igniting boon totems so long as there are dull totems but killer cant do that with hex totems. These boon totems are also in situational regards (like the we'll make it boon for self heals) SIGNIFICANTLY better than hex totems so why do surv get to continuously boon totems but killer cannot continuously hex totems?
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BHVR likes survivors better. This is observable just in the way they write their updates.
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Any way we can @ the devs to see this and balance things or do they do nothing but boost and handhold survs with 0 input taken from killer player?
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They do not. This is brought up by a lot of streamers. A good example is saying that they nerfed Spirit to 'increase the skill required to play as and against' her. But here is the thing; they decreased the skill required to play against her by making her easier to detect. Making it easier is inherently not increasing the skill required to play against her. And as for playing as her, the things they are adding are not things that can be concealed or manipulated, so there is no skill being added. It's just restraining her.
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That and now boon totems get RID of hex totems completely if they boon your hex totem and survivors can re-boon or boon a different totem if you get rid of it. DEVS ######### IS THIS
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I honestly dont se the logic behind what they are tinking aside from catering to survivors and screwing over killers.
I got the game not to long ago but theres a bit of a vias for suvivor players over killers and it shows
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Its because the devs mostly play survivor. I remember at one time when people complained abt how bad hag was when she was released and the dev said "you just arent using her right". He was invited to play against a twitch team live as hag and was COMPLETELY humiliated. after this hag mysteriously got a buff and flashlights got reworked. I think the problem is the DEVS dont play equally so they dont see or care abt both sides, they just care about the side they play most. Which is survivor
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wich in turn will if not already, create a problem, killers might be "less" when it comes to the player base, but they are just as important as the survivors...both sides should be cared and catered to their needs to create a fun enviroment...but so far seems its always about the survivors fun and anything else left to the killers
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As someone who plays both sides i dont think theres an issue with boon totems because if a survivor boons my hex totem its the same thing as if they find and cleanse my totem anyways so doesnt matter, and boon totems only work within its radius whereas hex totems have much stronger effects and being in its radius does not matter, I can also push survivors off my hex totems but they can't really disrupt me from cleansing a boon totem I mean what are they gonna do, plus as of now boon totems only provide healing and just hiding scratch marks i dont think they are op and its also too early to say if it will be broken or not
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If someday they buff Hex, before that happens nerf Devour Hope hex. It will be Op tier. Like make it loose stacks if it gets destroyed.
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Scott literally made a video of being unable to down a survivor because they healed faster than the hit animation. You're right though, much too early to say if they'd be broken or not. And I've watched people play whole matches where their entire build was countered by the Shadow boon because it also affects aura reading. And the survivors would literally just reapply it at the next totem. I've also watched matches where they were running 4 boons, meaning the killer had no totems, and it affected almost the entire map. And they removed the only ability that let killers know that a survivor was interacting with a totem.
I play both sides as well, survivor quite a lot, it's busted AF. You're pretty much giving another perk to your entire team. Wanna know what killers have that's just as strong? Nothing. The only counter play is cleansing their boons, which they can just set back up at the cost of a few seconds.
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Survs get a self heal as powerful al we'll make it with boons and if 4 survs boon hex totems they can cover 60% of the map with the ranges. I think there is an issue because survs dont lose their boon totems and can pick and choose where to put them, even on totems already hexed
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The Boon seems too strong to be reset infinetely. Imagine a 3gen with one or two totems closeby. Killer is able to defend the gens normally, But the Boon makes the running survivors invisible. An indoor map without scratchmarks seems way too strong.
Now the killer destroys the totem and starts a chase and before the killer can even catch up, another survivor reblesses the totem and the chased one becomes invisible.
It kinda feels like if the killer had infinite Pop the Weasels without needing hooks.
So maybe either
-Add a requirements for blessing, like you need to clease on totem in order to be able to bless, then you need to strategize which to boon and which to cleasen and which to leave for later. Or at least gen progress, etc. or
-Get rid of the dull totem completely if the killer destroys it for a second time.
-Or killers need stronger gen regression as base kit if they're going to have a massive secondary task, like a build in weaker pop, and survivors should not be able to stop the regression by tapping the gen for a fraction of a second. Let's say a survivor repairing a regressing generator will give it regular progress, however regression will only stop if the survivor continuesly repair it for 3 seconds.
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I think blessing a Hex totem should be something you activate by pressing the action button and adding the blessing time to the cleansing time, instead of doing both at once. Also, the ability to choose their location is kinda what makes it strong. I get into a game and see my totem spawn and immediately have an idea of how long it is going to last. Being able to pick the hard to find ones is bigger than people are giving it.
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yea the devs should allow killers to choose where the hex perks spawn i think that would make it better
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Boon totems also take time to set up, way less time to destroy, innately help the opponent find them, and only affect their immediate vicinity.
They're both totem based perks, but people really need to stop clamouring that boons should get all the Hex drawbacks without recognising the benefits Hexes have over boons.
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If by immediate vicinity you mean half of the map, then yes.
Giving all survivors four additional and infinite stronger versions of perks is really way too strong. (infinite off the record, stronger botany knowledge, self care, infinite lucky break) At what exact drawback? The killer being able to temporarily disable it and survivors being able to rebless it infinitely before the killer can catch up to different survivor?
Ever tried to run up to a gen as Legion in frenzy and then be unable to find where anyone went without being able to see the scratch marks, especially on an indoor map? Seeing no scratch marks on half (or all) of Lery's is gonna be miserable and frustrating.
You do realize that the "counterplay" to not being able to find survivors/survivors being extremely stealthy is tunneling and camping, right?
It's just likely to cause a bad and boring experience on both sides. They need to be limited by a token system or require totems to be cleansed in order to bless some of the remaining ones and/or not overwrite hexes. Like hexes needing to be cleansed or it would take 28 seconds to bless at the risk of being interrupted.
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Then take the range down a peg, but limited opportunities to put them into play will make them go straight into the bin. Survivors can't afford to take that kind of gamble on perks that aren't worth the risk. I'm already unsure if these perks will see any use a week into their deployment, but if they get a limited number of blessings, they're probably not going to see use before the end of their first week.
Cut their range by 25% and give the survivor a 60 second cooldown when the killer snuffs their boon, how's that sound?
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Cooldown seems like a good idea, something that makes it worth the killer's time to snuff it out. Maybe like Freddy's waking up, the more you wake others up, the longer it takes, at least on the same totem.
Ideally the timer would be on the totem, although I am not sure how to implement it. Basically to make sure that the survivors don't take turns reblessing the same totem, let's say in the middle of a 3gen, or on a dead part of the map where they keep running of to heal. So basically the same totem cannot be reblessed for X seconds regardless of whose boon it was. I'm not sure how to indicate it with a timer. Perhaps the entity could just block it similar to Hex:Plaything.
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like being destroyed when a boon is placed on them? or the fact that when they are destroyed they are destroyed permanently unlike boons that get to be relit? or the fact that survivors all get up to 5 perks a game if a boon is up and they are nearby?
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Sounds amazing but still thats stronger than a killer hex still. imagine a killer being able to re-light devour hope? even with a 60 second cd thats insane, same with boons my friend.
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Yes, those are Hex disadvantages over Boons. Now think about the advantages hexes have over boons.
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I was initially thinking the cooldown would be on the survivor that placed the boon, but I think you're right, and it would be better if it was on the totem. Or ideally, both.
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I'm not sure about advantages. The ones that come to mind would be that they don't need 14 seconds to set up (although 14 seconds of survivor time isn't really much, they spend longer t-bagging on average). So the advantage is the killer hex spawing right next to a generator and being permanently disabled 20 seconds into the match, I suppose.
Their effect is map wide, however two well placed boons would cover the whole map, or at least the areas that matter. And perhaps that their effect is not revealed until triggered (although the killer also does not know the effect of the boon, only that one as been set up)
You can hear hex totems, although not quite as prominent as boons.
But jokes aside.
Pros of hexes:
- no setup required
- map wide effect
- not as loud as boons, however often very visible or directly next to a survivor objective
- it takes longer to cleanse than to snuff
Pros of boons:
- can be setup wherever the survivos want
- can be setup infinitely
- the two perks that are in the PTB right now provide FOUR additional and stronger versions of perks to ALL survivors (infinite distortion, infinite lucky break, self care, we'll make it without the requirement to unhook/stronger botany knowledge) in a fairly huge area, as depicted above, it'would be no scratch marks on half of the map, and it's even stronger on indoor maps, especially something like the Game or Midwitch where the effect would span over multiple floors.
- These 4 additional perks are available in the PTB right now, so a survivor could have the usual 4 meta perks and 4 additional perks on top of that through the boon. And it would only get worse with more boon perks bein added in the future, which would result in at least 6 additional perks for all survivors, provided they grant just one additional perk and not two like the current ones and as a stronger version than their counterpart to boot.
- Let's say there is a 3gen scenario. The killer simply cannot afford to go to a dead area of the map to snuff out a boon, where the survivors keep running off to to heal. If the killer went there, the killer would lose the last gen. Survivors however can easily stealth around until they find and cleanse a hex and will not lose any progressif they don't get caught and once the hex is gone, it's gone forever.
- TL;DR the killer loses progress seeking out boons, the survivors don't lose hook stages if the killer can't find them while they look for a hex.
- No risk of losing perks permanently.
- Further and greatly strengthens organized SWF who are already the dominant side at high skill levels
And I disagree that survivors absolutely need perks. I did the power moves achievement and it was fine. Sure it would have been nice to get more BP with WGLF or have Detectives Hunch or BT or be able to reset unbroken pallets or have Lithe, but it was perfectly fine without them. (for all it's worth, I was rank1 on both roles, currently Iri 1, which doesn't mean anything for matchmaking of course, but I'd like to think that I'm matched against competent killers)
Post edited by whereismykebab on2 -
After extensive testing, I think that boon totems really need a change. The biggest problem in my opinion is that it is infinitely renewable and it doesn't work with tokens or as one-time use. All other perks that hide scratchmarks have tokens or can only be used under certain conditions.
The healing totem is also just an infinite speed self heal perk for the 3 other survivors.
Even as survivor I dont like them, the sound is annoying after a while and the entire area is flooded with light which takes away a lot of ambience. It doesn't feel good either when you escape and a boon totem was involved.
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