Visit the Kill Switch Master List for more information on these and other current known issues: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/299-kill-switch-master-list
We encourage you to be as honest as possible in letting us know how you feel about the game. The information and answers provided are anonymous, not shared with any third-party, and will not be used for purposes other than survey analysis.
Access the survey HERE!
Built to last with a strong toolbox is just broken right now
Ran it 3 games in a row....Prove thyself, Built to Last, Street Smart and Dead hard.
Every game I did 3 gens by myself in little to no time...
Built to Last was 100% overbuffed, it's kinda questionable that they even buffed it tbh, it was already decent.
Comments
-
It's extremely strong. The argument of getting into lockers and waiting making it slower than staying on the gen assumes you're always an, e to stay on any given gen until it's completed. In reality there are numerous opportunities to jump in a locker for 12 seconds that have little impact on your ability to pressure gens. Example standing in a locker instead of behind a rock while the killer checks the gen.
4 -
You also have to realize that survivors have to go out of their way to replenish their items. It takes time to go to a locker.
15 -
Its not the perk is strong, its the items. A brown Toolbox or Medkit arent big deal. A Commodius + double charge addon, A ranger medkit with 16charge addon & speedup. Are
Items should be nerfed.
7 -
commodius 2gud ye
if you think about it if you could idle in a locker and slowly build up a +% gen speed for yourself everyone would do it and snipe one of the last three gens in 40 seconds (if it capped at +100%)
that's why toolbox btl works, but i think it's still more potent with kits/keys/crystal bead map/flashlight if and only if you're against hag/wraith
0 -
It def didn't take any time for me to pump out 3 gens
0 -
Build to last players vs iron maiden enjoyers
Same with inner stength
and flashbang
and head on
0 -
It's not like it wastes more than those 12 seconds. You don't leave gen for it, you get into locker on your way to next gen and you almost always have some lockers nearby.
It's not really worth going for those 33%, that can be maybe used for sabo, but 99% and 66% is worth it.
5 -
Does it really matter tho? I still haven't seen much of this perk so I don't fully understand how it works. But if a survivor can do this throughout the match with an already beefy toolbox with btl, streetwise, and charge addons I can assume it doesn't matter if they spend 10 seconds in a locker.
2 -
Some people forgot the old toolboxes and its charges with add ons. Probably they're 2021 killers. You'll learn.
4 -
People already did the math on it and its not as good as you "feel" it.
1 -
Built to Last is fine.
Toolboxes are the problem. They need a rework to prevent regression instead. Something like this that I saw someone suggested (modified slightly)
Normal Toolboxes no longer speed up the speed of a generator. Instead they create a 'shield' that must be eaten through before the gen starts to regress. This makes toolboxes more useful in end game, and against Ruin, but less useful for getting that first generator done fast.
BNP's when installed prevent regression past the point it's installed altogether. (This would be pretty strong, but you'd have to use it at the most opportune moment) But still get used upon use.
Med-Kits should have their healing speed reduced a bit. (Not quite to self-care levels) Keys and Flashlights are mostly fine (Flashlights shouldn't be able to blind you from super weird angles). Maps could use a slight buff, and make them more common. Maybe add a Brown Map.
1 -
Is it really? They need to spend a lot of time in a locker that they could just spend clicking gens. 4~ of travel between gen and locker + 12 secs of build to last. The best toolbox with the best addons (discounting BNP that doesn't have synergy with the perk) saves about 18 seconds of progression, if you take in account the time you spend in a locker in the best of cases it built to last it saves you 2 seconds of gen progression. This doesn't seem op to me at all, build to last is for medkits and flashies.
3 -
It shaves 30 seconds off a gen solo, and you can do this twice, and then slightly slower each time after. Imagine how fast it is when there are 2 people on that gen. Imagine how it is when there is 2 people on that gen with Prove Thyself. Imagine how fast it is when there is 2 people on the gen with Prove Thyself, and both running Built to Last.
Post edited by Kurri on1 -
You just pulled this out of your ass because i don't know where you see those 30 seconds that you shave off from. The best toolkit combo (excluding BNP) shaves 18 seconds so the first use it would save 18 seconds righ? No, you need to spend 12 seconds inside a locker plus some extra seconds traveling between locker and gen. The extra times are just a net loss in time.
3 -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGqNgK1GSBk
Tested it myself, and so did - almost all the popular streamers.
A gen normally takes 80 seconds, for example Coco here was soloing gens in 50 seconds.
80-50=30 . 12 seconds in a locker literally means nothing. When you take 30 seconds out of a generator, and that's even faster with other survivors.
Killers have faced teams who are finishing gens in just over 2min's before the 3min mark. It's even happened to me.
1 -
Oh my gosh yes, when they nerfed toolboxes I was so glad (and I mostly play Survivor). Built to Last with toolboxes isn't nearly as bad as old toolboxes were, thankfully. I do have to say that the commodious with Built to Last is a little crazy though, but with how many Killers take Ruin it's not even worth it to leave your gen to refill your toolbox.
0 -
Convinently ignoring the time spent on lockers, and the extra Streetwise perk.
1 -
Literally no one ignored that at all.
0 -
He doesn't ignore that time. In the video he addresses it. Killers don't patrol lockers, they patrol gens. If you hop in a locker while the killer is nearby, refill your toolbox and slam out the gen as soon as they're gone, you've lost no time at all.
0 -
yes it takes us time to go to a locker
but it's worth it because are build is built to last, flashbang, inner strength, red herring -Dwight
0 -
What is the BTL Buff?
0 -
remember the old brand new part back in 2017 it instantly did a gen upon use
1 -
I'd like to see 4 people running meta perks and bnp vs 4 people running those gen repairing build perks and see how much faster is one over the other.
1 -
that was back when shack has 2 windows and survivors always fast vaulted their was no medium vault. it also had 1 doorway with the pallet and also windows didn't block. that was also the days when selfcare healed at the speed that boon circle of healing does but whenever, saboteur was great cuz hooks didn't respawn, sprint burst was good because exhaustion came back while running, and spine chill increased action speeds including vaulting by an insane amount (i think 20%). and the maps were way darker so p3 claudettes were even more invisible. oh and did i forget to mention that you could blind a killer or stun them mid pickup animation and as soon as it ended they would drop them so you could blind them early and then run and they will drop them anyway. also 360ing was a thing back then (It still is but it was easier and more effective back then) pallets could spawn next to each other. and all the killer perks were trash. and btw if you think killers ran noed. guess what totems didn't exits so you needed purple rarity noed for it to do anything useful. the only good thing was how broken iron grasp was. it made the survivors basically never able to wiggle off.
the good old days of dbd were kinda unbalanced
1 -
Not really locker are everywhere so its on your way to the next gen. Built to last and toolbox are strong you can do 2 gen alone for 104 sec lets add the 12 sec in a locker and its going to take you 116 sec to do 2 gen. Imagine if 2 survivor do that its 4 gen done in 116 sec that insanely fast
0 -
Built to last was buffed so now when an item loses its charges and you hop in a locker, this happens:
First time - Item recieves 99 percent of its charges
Second time - Item recieved 66 Percent of charges
Third Time - Item recieved 33 percent of charges.
0 -
WHAAAAAAAA????
Frankies Every Game from here on out
0 -
You're shaving off 28 seconds of a gen with a green toolbox + charge addons. If you use Built to Last once (12 seconds), that's more 28 seconds saved. 28 + 28 - 12 = 44 seconds of gen time saved, that's huge value. You can even get the 66% again with more 12 seconds, but imo it's overkill at that point. Streetwise does help, but without it you still save more than 30 seconds using BTL twice.
0 -
... You can... It's literally everywhere right now.
Are you living under a rock? 😐️
0 -
Strong anything is broken right now
Before Hatch nerf... Keys were broken
Before BNP nerf... It was Toolboxes
Before Ruin nerf... it was Ruin (oh wait... that perk is still strong)
Before Huntress Lullaby nerf... Huntress Lullaby was strong
Before anyone knew the BBQ counters... BBQ was strong
0 -
I said this would happen. I have no clue why Built to Last had to be buffed, especially to this degree.
0 -
Math:
A Commodious with Spool and Scraps is 52 charges worth of +50% increased repair speed. On its own, that means you get to repair one generator in 52 / 1.5 = 34.6 + 28 = 62.6 seconds - you save ~17 seconds.
If you use Built To Last once with this toolbox, you get another 51.48 charges out of it, for a total of 103.48 charges. This lets you repair one entire generator in 53.3 seconds, saving 26.6s, as well as 7.8 seconds on a secondary generator repair with the charges left over. A total time saving in generator repairs of 34.4 seconds. Since you already save 17s with the toolbox itself however, and spend 12 seconds in a locker for BTL, the actual on-paper time saving here is only 5.4 seconds, and that's of course not even accounting for the time spent going to and from the locker as well as going in and out of it.
If you use BTL another time, you go up to a total of 137.8 charges. That is again one entire generator in 53.3 seconds, and then a second one in 60.7s, saving a total of 45.9s. Again, you save 17s at base, and this time you have spent 24s in lockers. The on-paper saving is now only 4.9 seconds, again not accounting for now twice the time spent travelled to and from and in and out of lockers.
And using BTL a third time comes out to 154.96 charges, a time saving on two gens of 51.6s. At this point, you have spent 36s in lockers, which added to the 17s base time saving of the Commodious means now you have actually wasted 2 seconds using BTL even just on paper.
Conclusion:
BTL is not worth it in terms of pure time efficiency. Even if we ignore the time it takes to go to lockers and back to generators and the animation time of entering and exiting them (considerable time investments), the BTL Commodious combo at best saves 5.4 seconds if you use BTL once, while at worst actually costing you 2 seconds if you use it three times.
If we add Streetwise into the mix the numbers do improve, but they still don't improve enough to make up even for just the enter and exit locker animation times, let alone the time spent traversing the map to and from lockers. Not only that, but the time saving here would only matter if you actually do get to repair at least 2 generators from 0 to 100%, which is of course not at all a given. You are also spending 2 perk slots as well as an item on this, forgoing other strong perks and items the "time saving" impact of which cannot be easily quantified (think of how much generator time a Decsivie Strike or flashlight save can translate into for instance, because rather than being able to push other survivors off of gens while having one on a hook, now they have to chase that survivor).
I don't think the BTL toolbox combo is an issue, and Streetwise is if anything necessary to make this combo at all worthwhile in a solo scenario. What I do however think is an issue is a coordinated team abusing this combo, with multiple toolboxes and multiple Streetwise, not least because Streetwise stacks with other instances of itself. If you have a group with 4 toolboxes, 4 Streetwise and 4 Built To Last, that promises to be ridiculous. Throw in some Prove Thyselfs and perhaps Brand New Parts and you actually get something that deserves to be complained about as a "gen rush". That is one of various reasons why I think there should be perk and item limitations for SWF groups. Any perk and item should only be able to be equipped once in a given SWF group.
2 -
I don't think so.
After Toolbox changes (charges depleting fast, can't early sabotage), I don't think Toolboxes are problematic.
People might think it is either OP or nerf needed, but using lots of perks only for generator should compensate somehow.
Also considering recharge time to spend in locker, I think doing generator all along seems right imo.
0 -
The time argument doesn't make sense. If your on a gen, you keep working until finished or pushed off. There are plenty of opportunities to use a locker while moving to the next or avoiding the killer. The time requirement is about the length of a killer searching near a gen.
0 -
I haven't experienced built to last for myself yet, but I feel like it's so strong on medkits.
0 -
Try it yourself, it's absolutely broken. Go to a Gen with a strong toolbox, streetwise and Built to Last and see how fast you do the Gen....Then pop in a locker for a few seconds and do it all again.
The 12 seconds in a locker is hardly wasted time when it helps you absolutely smash a gen before the killer can even hope to get you off of it.
Prove thyself is optional but if you run it and have people with you that gens gone so fast it's comical
0 -
If you run this combo with prove thyself in a swf it is broken. You can finish all the gens in less than 2 minutes
0 -
Gens overall are busted. Far too many games start with me seeing a Discordance immediately after the game starts, me heading over and having the gen pop before I arrive, and losing 2 more before I even see a survivor.
0 -
Commodious Toolbox
+
Brand New Part
+
Wire Spool
+
Built To Last
+
Streetwise
🤗
0 -
Why are you running prove thyself if you do gens by yourself?...
0 -
Because the one Guy with prove can stay near the Gen and the other survivor can earn the 15+ speed buff to avoid the Penalty.
0 -
Killers say all the time it is OK for things to compliment one another. Take a look at Monitor and Abuse on Michael Myers. There is many killer addons that drastically improve the killer's power and their effects are greatly boosted with perks. Save the Best For Last can get nutty on some killers, especially on Demogorgon making it impossible to do saves.
Lets not completely forget what killers have. Built for Last is fine. You are actually sacrificing a perk slot to get a little more oomph out of an item. I'm glad it was buffed because the old version was so trash.
1 -
It’s a little broken with medkits IMO.
1 -
If you are healing, the killer lost the chase. Even if it was infinite recharges that seems fair to me. A perk is being sacrificed for it.
1 -
Don't forget that streetwise now stacks
0 -
It's sluzzy, don't give it attention
0 -
Because I play solo que and I never know when someone is actually going to help me on a Gen or not.
Bad survivors love to hop on gens and 2-3 man gens so I usually run Prove Thyself for those cases, that and it can be clutch during a 3 gen situation.
0 -
Personally I believe the change to built to last is the precursor to a generator overhaul. Having the tools in place before hand is probably a good idea, it just doesn't really change how terrible it feels at the moment.
0 -
I feel like a lot of people use built to last incorrectly. You're not supposed to use it all up on a single generator, you spread it out. Use your green toolbox on one gen, once that's done you hop into a closet and you basically got an almost full green toolbox ready to go on the next generator. If you spread the charges out that you can save a hell of a lot of time.
0 -
I try to save my charges for the last gen, if i'm not running BTL.
0
