Dead hard is a problem??
First of all, I'm a killer main. I do play survivor, but mainly killer, and fair spread of them.
I see all the time people complaining about dead hard, and the most common complaint I see is that "it gives an extra health state"
But like.. so does every exhaustion perk?? Just in different scenarios. Sure dead hard is probably the most common, and most available and easiest to get off. But every exhaustion perk is potentially an extra health state the same way DH is.
Personally I use SB with fixated, I can walk away as a killer is coming and with good timing force a whiff while activating SB to make it to whatever structure or loop is around. That's pretty much the same as using DH to do the same thing, the only difference is that I'm not injured first.
Lithe gives you a free sprint after jumping a window, if you time this correctly you can can (maybe not nearly as often but still potentially) force a whiff and a free escape to the next loop/structure.
Balanced is the same in the sense that as a killer seeing someone take a long drop usually makes me think "ok, free hit for me" but if they have BL, it's not. It's a free sprint for them to reach the next loop/structure and the same as lithe, potentially a whiff f the killer prematurely swings while falling.
Smash hit requires a pallet slam sure, but in the sense of it being a free sprint to the next loop, it's the same. Just without causing a whiff, and instead a stun from the pallet and potentially (depending on the safety level of the pallet) forces a pallet break, although this would likely need to be done anyway, making SH probably the weakest of exhaustion perks, but still.
So can anyone explain what exactly makes DH so much worse than the rest of these? They essentially give the same reward and cause the same time loss for killers.
Again, I am a killer main through and through. And I genuinely do not mind DH any more than any other exhaustion perk, and I don't understand the hate.
Also if it matters to anyone, I have 2k+ hours in the game and have played since there was only 3 killers so it's not a matter of being newer or not understanding how things work.
Comments
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After hit validation? I very much doubt you actually play killer and playing it for like one game would give you your answer. I say that as someone who defended Dead Hard myself prior to this update.
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As you said it is the easiest to use, and not counting sprint burst it is the only none situational one. Sprint burst is also non-situational, but if you run you lose it making it much harder to properly use, easier to bait, and usually acts as a time waster as people walk instead of run to gens.
It is just so brain-dead. I think it would be fine if it didn't give i-frames since then it would be a risk to use it against ranged killers.
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It's literally eating killer powers right now.
IT'S EATING THEM...AND THEN IT'S GONNA EAT ME....
OH MY GODDDDDDDDDDDDD!
(props if you get it)
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So you are fine with a Perk as long as it is bugged? Eh.
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Every single day there's a new topic about DH. How do u think is it fine?
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Weird way to put a negative spotlight on someone without addressing the issue of it eating killer powers, but I can't say I'm surprised.
Eh.
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To be fair, the Killer community is quite sensitive. Way more than the Survivors.
I have not had any issues so far. Let alone that the person I quoted did not mention anything in that regards, only that DH was fine for them before the Bugfix. Which leads to the conclusion that Survivors are allowed to have bugged perks. :)
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I'm sure you have seen this video by now.
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"I see all the time people complaining about dead hard, and the most common complaint I see is that "it gives an extra health state"
But like.. so does every exhaustion perk?? Just in different scenarios."
The thing is , with every other exhastion perk if you mess up, for example run into a wall or do the loop too wide, get stuck on something etc, you will get punished and hit and then you eighter make it to other loop or you die. With dead hard you can mess up pretty much anything and you will still be able to correct yourself or gain extra distance to the other pallet/window. If there is a loop - dead zone - loop , there is no other exhaustion perk that will make you be able to get through the dead zone after being hit besides dead hard and no ther perk will make the same loop doable after being hit. It also works on any map without dissadvantages unlike other exhaustion perks.
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Trolls 2 reference
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Awesome!
Want to eat some of this green stuff?
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"I gotta get more of that green stuff"-Mr Krabs
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I'm fine with a perk that strong working 90% of the time yes.
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Nah, it was linked to me. But I did not watch this guy, I have seen a Tweet where he complained about healing Builds because he did not realize that two Survivors picked up another Survivor, which resulted in the normal healing time.
So either this person way lying or did not understand what was happening. not really a good source for information, so I dont bother to watch a 12 minute video.
But since it seems to be the only source for this kind of stuff, it is probably not reliable anyway.
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Ignorance is bliss.
Eh.
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Nah. But if I see that said Content Creator was already lying in a Tweet OR did not understand basic mechanics of the game, I will not waste my time watching a video of said content creator.
You would not do that either.
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It should work 100% of the time in the proper way.
It keeps the game fair and interesting for both parties.
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If someone presented me with video evidence of X, I'd watch it to see if it contained video evidence of X (unless the person was known for hacking or some other extreme outlier).
Once again, your extreme bias is showing, given that other videos/users have expressed similar concerns.
Eh.
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As beautiful and truthful and as hard as you try to make these killers realize dead hard isnt as op as they think especially if your not on pc/ps5/xbox one series and and is on some lower consoles they will never listen and understand just how crappy it can be. They will find boons/dead hard broken if you dont use those and use DS/BT/Iron will its a problem. Flash lights is a problem(even thought I dont use them) everything to killers about survivors is a problem. Mean while am enjoying spring burst+ new vigil+spine chill , it just makes myers and ghosty so much easier when they trying to stalk lol and after a few stooping during a loop/chase just sprint burst the heck out there again.
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Dead hard is as fair as if Noed and Rancor combined and it was no longer a hex perk.
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Regardless of your feelings on the perk, it should still function as intended, first and foremost.
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My bias is showing because I wont watch Content Creators which I dislike because they are either lying or not experienced enough? Ok I guess.
If it is like you said, it should be fixed. But as I have stated, I have not experienced it in my games (but I have only seen two validated Dead Hards so far when I was playing Killer, most DHs used against me were for distance).
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Most DH are definitely used for distance, I'll agree.
It's also possible that your killer choice would render you immune, too.
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Plague and Trickster lols at dead hard, you may dodge a few blades with it but the rest sure as hell wont be.
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Plague especially - Even if it 'eats' 1 projectile, there's like 20 more coming @_@
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I think people are focusing on wrong things. While dead hard is strong so is countless other perks.
Map size, number of pallets and crazy loops/setups are the main problems imo. And not everything is rng either.
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am playing trickster atm and the amount of dead hard am punishing left and right and am ps5 just got him to prestige 2 now whoohoo, death bound is pretty strong and am not even facing boon totems lol
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And another large content creator suggested bringing small game against trapper months after the trap aspect was removed. Doesn't make his observations, data, or tests invalid just because he was wrong about one other thing. You can literally SEE the tentacle hit in the video get eaten when the survivor dead hards at the pallet. This never happened before. You would hit the survivor or the pallet. That is the intent of the killers power. You can't just go "He's wrong because he said this wrong thing before" when we can SEE IT HAPPENING.
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Thank you OP.
There is a few of us that play killer that have bigger problems with Sprint Burst. Only thing is SB isn't great during a chase, so it is less talked about. Let SB become more frequent and I can 100% bet you they would complain about that one too.
Some players on here just get annoyed by exhaustion perks, period. Mostly because they don't know how to play around them.
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I see all the time people complaining about dead hard, and the most common complaint I see is that "it gives an extra health state"
But like.. so does every exhaustion perk??
there is one huge difference:
literally every Exhaustion Perk in this game either has a downside to it (Sprint Burst not allowing the Survivor to run across the map without wasting it) or a clear activation requirement the Survivor has to plan around or get out of their way to earn (Lithe requires them to fastvault something, Balanced Landing to drop from a great height, etc.) - excluding Dead Hard.
Dead Hard is just always there and can be used at any point in time without the Survivor having to do anything special for it.
that is the problematic part of this perk - its not necessary that it gives them the extra hit, its that they get it entirely for free without having to do anything to earn it prior.
so Dead Hard either needs to have its activation requirement changed into something that Survivors have to earn, or get a downside added to it that makes it so Survivors have a harder time whenever they are not actively using the Perk.
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If the devs listened to the killer mains here and on twitch, survivors would have no items or perks to play with anymore. Some people are taking this game way too seriously. This isn’t a competitive game like csgo
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Right, you're gonna tell me you've never ever even once in your entire time of playing DBD or watching videos or streams, seen someone DH into a wall and die 2 secs later? ######### happens all the time my dude, your argument is not a valid one
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The activation required is being injured. Do me a favor and count how many possible ways someone can be instant downed, completely negating any chance at DH, then get back to me.
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Well I explained exactly why I think it's fine in my post so your question really isn't a valid question as it's already been answered. But maybe you could try to add something to the discussion, maybe explain why you think it's not ok instead of just saying it's not.
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yeah a good 90% of the available insta downs in this game are extremely situational (Haunted Grounds, Make Your Choice, Iron Maiden, etc.) and the other 10% are bound to specific characters (Evil Within, Chainsaws, Demon Strike, etc.) - which not only invalidates this argument for any character that doesnt have access to such an ability (e.g. Wraith or Spirit), but in all but one case these oneshot characters are also rather unviable in high MMR (the sole exception here being Oni).
with other words, there is no reliable way to counter this "requirement" for the Killer other than dumb luck.
and lets not forget that Exposed can counter Dead Hard exactly once a trial - after getting oneshot downed and hooked the Survivor starts out injured after all, meaning they have DH up for the remainder of the trial, as long as they dont heal and just jump back on gens immediately - an action that already is very strong, but can be further buffed by perk choices such as Resilience.
so no, neither Exposed nor oneshot abilities are an actual counter to this Perk - they dont even get close to that.
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Ok, and DH should only really cause you a problem once per survivor per game. If they use it once, you know they have it and you can simply bait it, no matter who you're playing as. If you get hit by a DH twice off one person, that's your own fault. The only exception to that is if they use it for distance to a window, in which case you should know that's what their plan is and mind game it accordingly. If you can't do that, you're not as good a player as you want to believe you are. Fact is, it has plenty of counter play, y'all just want it to be easier than it is.
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Dead hard is a perk that needs to have a change like DS had. Period
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Ok, care to explain what kind of change? Give me your thoughts on what it should be changed to
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It just flat out shouldn't be able to make you immune from dmg and be able to run back into the killer into a pallet, restart chases and make them 2-3 times longer for one hook. Killers time is too valuable for all these things PLUs boons now to be going on for a 1 v 4
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Ok, but what is your suggested change. You can sit there and explain why you don't like the perk all day, but unless you suggest an actual fix, we aren't getting anywhere.
Are you saying the I frames should simply be dropped? Like they still get the distance and everything but if used poorly they can still be hit while dashing? Otherwise I'm not understanding what you're trying to say
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ah yes, "just bait out the Dead Hard"...
do i really need to explain to you why this is not a valid argument?
also, please enlighten me oh master of the DbD Killer side - how exactly are you reliably mindgaming the Dead Hard for distance?
after all, you make it sound like there is a super easy counter to that - one that everyone - except for you - is just too bad at the game at to have ever figured out.
So please, the stage is yours. do explain.
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Well, for one, don't lunge and swing right away. That's pretty damn simple. Get close enough that you could get a hit, and just wait. Chances are, they're gonna use DH and it's then wasted. As for distance, mind game the same way you would as if they didn't have DH and we're just further away from you. Don't just rush directly at the window, play the mindgame of potentially cutting it off from the other side. It's really pretty simple my dude you just gotta use your head for a moment
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When you use Dead hard, you dash and are immune to dmg...i said take the immunity part out, It's a short activate but not having that immune part would give you that option for safe distance, unlike sprint burst that doesn't give you the option only when you run. This takes away that big forgiving power that it gives on so many survivor mistakes, it also contributes to why survivors feel safety in dead zones and commit to gens so hard. They can just stand there or zoom and be fine and get away even if you threw a hatchet right at them
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Let me give you an example.
Scenario 1
Survivor is running towards a shack window. They are 15 meters ahead of you. They DONT have DH. In this situation, you wouldn't just run to the window and vault it to chase them (as a regular m1 killer) right? You would attempt to mind game the shack.
Scenario 2
Survivor is running towards the shack window. They are 10 meters ahead of you. They DO have dead hard. Knowing this, you again don't just go the window and vault it after they have DH to it and vaulted it themselves, instead you attempt to mind game it.
It's really not a hard concept to understand my dude. You can use those scenarios in literally any situation
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i dont want to sound rude or anything, but are you sure you're playing in high MMR?
cause none of the things you just said are going to work in high MMR matches. in fact, high level DbD players dont even try to mindgame - they hold W and play as safe around pallets and windows as they can while their team bangs through gens.
not to mention that your scenario is incredibly unspecific and entirely based on the assumption that the Killer even IS in a position to mindgame, lets say, a longwall window from - which in 90% of the cases they are not going to be.
so i will repeat my question, but this time i'll be a bit more specific:
you are chasing someone around a long wall jungle gym. you're about to catch up and they just ran through the pallet - but instead of dropping it, they just Dead Hard for distance to the window - how do you mindgame this? after all, this is a pretty realistic scenario.
or maybe a different one: you are chasing a Survivor who is holding W accross the map, they now Dead Hard for distance to reach an upcomming pallet - how do you mindgame this?
i mean, i guess Nurse can just teleport through the obstacle and immediately approach them from the other side... but for consistencies sake, please make it unspecific to certain Killers, so that i can apply this tactic even when playing someone like Legion, thanks!
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okay so your definition of "mindgame" is to just accept you're not getting the hit?
thats... thats not a mindgame. sorry.
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Alrighty my guy. Were just gonna have to agree to disagree. You do you, and keep losing to DH players, I'll do me and take my easy mindgames. Have a good one bro
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Mind games are not a guaranteed hit my dude. But you believe whatever you'd like to believe and keep losing to DH. That's ok. Everyone's got their own style to play. Have a good day my dude
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but... you're not mindgaming anything in that scenario!
you just do what literally everyone does.
difference is, that you just accept it the way it is and think its perfectly fine that they just get to activate their "get out of jail for free card", while others, like me, acknowledge it as the problem that it is.
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Ok my guy. You do you, and keep losing to DH. You payed for the game just like everyone else, and you have every right to lose however you'd like to.
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