Do you still get upset about tunneling under the current conditions of Killer?
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As a killer main I normally dont tunnel, but actually play by your survivors playbook and behave like I have Devour Hope, even if I dont run it. BUT I might change gear when I play my jolly game and then three gens finish back to back during the first unhook. Thats the sign that the kids glove are off and I go all in. Oddly enough slamming gens isnt something that survivors acknowledge, but they will 2/3 cases throw salt in the after game chat and call me the worst killer ever for camping and tunneling. Geeze, then dont bring BNP and slam gens like there is no tomorrow. What do you want, a game that lasted 3.5min?
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bruh you played yourself you are no better if you do that
plus you get no points and the killer gets extra so you lit are promoting it
you give them extra points by letting them camp and rage quitting so they realize they can do that and make people dc so they continue
take my advice or continue doing what you do and become less happy with the game because if you let the game kill you atleast you get a few bp if you dc you embarrass yourself and cause you're team to lose because they lose a player quicker and give the killer more time to do stuff. you also set bad examples and make your team angrier at you then you are at the killer because of a selfish play
just be the better person :D
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I felt this too but when people realise after sometime playing killer they have to do it the gens and efficiency is to much to handle
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Real pain 😣
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It is annoying as player.
But i can totally understand it - if u get one out early it is a big benefit.
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I play killer under certain conditions no, but mostly yes. Especially if we're talking about ACTUAL tunneling.
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I love when this happens not only do I get all my hooks and sacrifice points but you played all that and go 0 BP. Smart move really taught me. Lol
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Free hits aren't even as close to as valuable as a down especially with CoH. Sometimes a player just as to go. If I'm in one Chase and gens are done I'm tunneling that person out. Having 4 survivors alive at 1 gen is almost impossible to win and its super sweaty and stressful. Survivors complain about tunneling but 3 gens in 2 minutes means the survivors have set the tone of the match and I have to match that if i want to win.
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I understand tunneling when it's done at 1-2 gens left. I'm more talking about 3-4 gens left and a killer that refuses to chase or attack anyone else until the first person they find is dead.
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You do realize though that could be 3 minutes into a match with only one chase.
I feel like CoH has alot to do with this lately. I think most killers just figure that there's at least one CoH in the match and if you let that survivor go they will just got heal quickly and remove all that work you did.
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I'm definitely not arguing that CoH is busted, but I'm just answering the thread. Whenever a killer does something that I'd find understandable in my gameplay as killer, I'm cool with it. If someone does something I really wouldn't do, and it seems unnecessary for the situation and overly mean-spirited, then I might get pissed over it (though pissed enough to complain in chat, probably not.) I don't think that's a super inconsistent stance to take.
I get tunneling most of the time, but I get irritated when the killer's playbook seems to be to singlemindedly delete the first player they find and ignore every attempt to draw aggro. I get tunneling at 2 gens, I don't buy its necessity at 4 gens even when I recognize its utility.
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Being tunnelled (or "targetted", I prefer, since "tunnelling" is normally usedas a derrogatory term, when it can be the only sensible option) can be frustrating. But it can be the only good move the killer should do, so I understand. I'm certainly not the type to throw my toys out of the pram and send offensive comments because of something so infintesimally tiny in the grand scope of my life.
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I feel like you're better off not watching their stream, since that benefits them in real life.
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theyre a partner that averages over 5k viewers last time i checked, i doubt me watching w/ adblock and incognito is particularly useful.
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jeez, nevermind.
I figured they were a pretty unknown c-list streamer based on your description of their level of play.
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You can be mad thats your right as long as your not messaging them talking ish it's all good. I get frustrated every once and a while playing survivor so I does happen.
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no, the community just feeds off of their toxicity. it's where it festers best, encouraged by their ring leader, who's also a nonce which makes matters 30x better.
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bleh.
that is thoroughly unfortunate.
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Sometimes tired of it. But I just skip(not spectate) and wait another que.
Honestly I am fine if nobody's using a hack/cheat program.
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I never hard tunnel as killer but if j see the injured survivor mid chase im going to switch target to them as it can get a down.
Face camping is more frustrating than tunneling imo.
To be fair i play survivor mostly, it is frustrating playing as killer though so i get why its used as a strategy. Its sad when games are over in 5 mins .
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I used to care to try to be fair and decent. You get a squad you can guarantee you'll do bad and be taunted for your effort. I understand the dark side now. 1st person caught must be taken out ASAP at all costs. Then the second.
The perks for second chances when someone is at high risk are consistently abused and healing is so fast a swarm can effectively keep you from being able to punish the person using them in a way they weren't intended.
I'll suck up the BT and eat the DS. I find you then you are all I care about until you are gone. I'm tired of the expectation that a killer has to consider how much fun others are having when they don't offer the same consideration despite clearly trying to spread the hooks among the group.
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yes and no... When i get farmed and then tunneled i get pretty pissed off mainly at my teammates but i do understand why someone would want to tunnel... But when they run cross map just searching for you and tunneling like that ignoring people not even hitting people body blocking i find it pretty boring, but never really mad unless they talk ######### at the end
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My opinion doesn't imply how others are supposed to play.
I'm not trying so hard to win if I play against better players. I may not be as competitive as the players who choose to play in a certain way.
And yes, I'm a survivor main and there are a lot of things I agree with Killer mains. But not when it comes to tunneling and camping.
Fun for both sides comes first for me.
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Of course tunneling upsets me
I want to play with different strategies and builds
But when I hung the surv on the first hook, I moved 5 meters away from it and 3 generators flashed...
There's nothing left for me
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I have never had an issue with tunneling because it's a legit tactic and sometimes it is the best move the killer can make. I'm not going to get mad at my opponent for not babying me and letting me win. Getting mad at tunneling is the sign of a survivor-only player. Killers who don't tunnel regardless of circumstances are just bad killers.
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I mean, killers never have needed to tunnel. The only reason to tunnel is when you are in an MMR scenario that's much higher than you. I have seen many, many killers lose games BECAUSE they tunnel.
There are only 2 places where I accept people tunneling: The highest and lowest ends of MMR. At the highest ends, it's absolutely necessary since its the only way to somewhat gain an advantage early in the game, in the lowest ends, killers are too scared to leave their hook and since no one else is injured, they are not confident enough.
Anywhere else, unnecessary. Killers have been in quite a healthy state. Maps are a lot less game deciding(haddonfield still kinda is, but only kinda). And other than 3-4 totem spots spread out in the entire game, boons havent been really impacting games as much as people claim they have(again, highest and lowest ends of mmr are exceptions to the rule here).
Could killers be better? There is only 1 aspect what I would change about killers currently: adding Fire-Up as a basekit mechanic and reworking the perk.
The rest of issues are almost all map related, and those issues are different for every killer. Yeah, maybe one killer isnt really good at playing on Dead Dawg Saloon compared to all other killers, maybe Blight and Huntress both suck on RPD compared to other killers. But there are plenty of builds, plenty of abilities and plenty of in-game mechanics that a killer can use to not lose the match when facing a team of equal MMR.
"B-b-b-but its 1v4" So? Survivors cannot directly harm the killer. It all needs to be done indirectly by doing gens, removing hooks and bodyblocking, and even then they can lose.
"B-b-b-but the game isnt perfectly balanced" Yeah, I agree, which is why the killer MMR on the best Myers isnt gonna be as high as the killer MMR on the best Nurse. This game is a party game, not a competitive one. It could do with a dedicated comp-mode tho.
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So you say it's ok to tunnel because you will get anyway good games without tunnelers or campers later? That sound so false lol. In this case all matches should be with tunneling. Why not? Survivors will still count on nice players to get fun matches.
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It isn't false to say actually, considering that not every Killer uses this tactic to win. I've had matches where I have been tunneled and others where Killer's chase others and allow people to earn points.
To pretend that every Killer plays the same way is cringe.
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Never pretended that's the point. What would you say if all players would play like this? Not fun anymore I guess. This game is boring and maybe annoying without that kind of nice players that won't tunnel, camp. These things are not fun even if we accept them. Btw, they are not appreciated. Sad.
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Some games you kinda have to tunnel in order to win.
Circle of Healing means you always have to go after the injured person; spreading out injuries is pointless nowadays because if you leave a survivor for a few seconds they heal up, it's crazy.
Add onto that, the fact that so many second chance perks can mean chases just go on for so long that you can't really afford to go and start another one with a healthy survivor since usually three gens are done by the time you've gotten a single hook. Without an 'Early Game Slowdown' mechanic, gens are just done too quickly early on.
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It upsets me that this community has been stockholm syndromed into believing camping & tunneling is a necessary evil.
Camping & tunneling doesn't need to exist. Regardless of its viability, it victimizes opponents and creates animosity within the community. BHVR has the power to render camping & tunneling obsolete, and provide killers with a better means to apply pressure and win the game.
Instead, here we are for the nth time, discussing the morality of camping & tunneling when we could be demanding BHVR find a better solution.
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To be fair, I think discussing the morality of camping & tunneling is assisting in the demand for better solutions. It is in a very indirect way but debating within our community on why it is not fun to face but necessary to do can give the dev insight on what necessary changes can be implemented if they decide to read.
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Fair point. I suppose I just disagree with the approach.
Deathslinger was given a half-baked nerfed because he was "unfun to play against," and the backlash was fully deserved.
They experimented with anti-camping mechanics years ago, but never compensated the killer's by providing them with any other means to apply pressure.
At this point, I don't trust BHVR to fix the problem correctly if all they are hearing is "its not fun."
They need to fundamentally change the win-condition for killer, so that camping wont kill a survivor and tunneling won't immediately advance their objective (i.e. 9+ hooks permanently blocks the gates & traps survivors in the trial. A survivor being hooked twice in a row does not progress the hook meter).
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ah yes, one survivor becoming untouchable because no matter what the killer does to them it's merely a waste of their time too. Want to do the gens in the Killer's face? Want to be the one who does stuff like Pinhead's box? Mr. Reckless Flashlight? Bodyblock Bob? Sure, go ahead, the worst you can suffer is ~wasting the Killer's time~.
I swear, this hard anti-tunnelling crusade is powered by an inability to consider any consequences.
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I swear, this hard anti-tunneling crusade is powered by an inability to consider any consequences.
This mentality is exactly why the game is so fundamentally flawed.
You sound bitter that I'm even attempting to propose a better solution--like I personally attacked you for wanting the game to improve, when I didn't even claim to have given much thought to a solution.
This is how design works, bud
Its not my job to fix the game. I'm not going to waste my time coming up with a better system.
But if I cut through your snide remarks and blatant sarcasm, I can see that you've addressed a flaw with my off-handed proposal. That's a great start, that is how design works. If you were less of a [BAD WORD] about it, maybe I'd take you and your feedback seriously, then come back with a better proposal. As it stands, I can't be bothered to entertain someone who doesn't want a solution. And its no wonder BHVR feels the same.
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Survivor mains aren't very good at self awareness in my experience.
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Tunneling, Camping and Slugging is just a thing as doing gens or using dead hard. I dont get it how ppl cry about it, its just childish.
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It does upset me a little, but then I usually think "I would probably do the same thing" and I quickly let it go.
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Because they see it as a personal insult. They feel the killer is doing it specifically to ruin their day and get under their skin. Rather than just, you know, trying to win the game as is the point of playing. Meanwhile tbagging at the gates does absolutely nothing to help you win, since you have already won, and it's considered "not a bad thing" and "you need to get over it."
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Because I shouldn't have to point out the problem with proposals like this; it's already part of the game. Every single anti-tunnelling or anti-camping ability gets used to either try to do things in the Killer's face or take hits for the other Survivors. Consequently, all proposals that aim to make it literally impossible shouldn't need snarky commentary to remind them how this won't be used as intended the instant it's put in.
That's not even considering the less dire consequences like how returning to where you know someone was just unhooked and following the signs of a survivor is a 50/50 shot of being a total waste of time and letting the entire team reset if you're not allowed to hit the wrong person.
Personally, I find it aggravating how 90% of attempts to remove tunnelling come at it from the direction of "how do we stop the Killer from getting away with this", whether by trying to amplify the effects of DS and BT and make them universal, or outright making it pointless. Why not come at it from another angle? Make it so that tunnelling isn't a faster way to win if it happens, or provide stronger incentives to hook multiple people (things like Scourge Hook: Gift of Pain sort of do this, but the problem is that the "penalty" it applies is temporary and niche) before trying to prohibit tunnelling. Shared hookstates is one idea--it could be, e.g., combined with an increasing slowdown to actions as those hooks are used up, and now it doesn't matter who gets hooked.
Will people still be focused down? Sure, they would, sometimes. Maybe they particularly annoyed the Killer. Maybe the rest of their team is being jerks and sacrificing them. Maybe they're just the weak link and the others aren't doing enough to save them and draw aggro.
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Why do I somehow get the feeling your talking about cm winter?
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I don't think CM winter averages over 5k viewers. Honestly the only DBD streamer I know of who has that is Otz. Unless it's one of the non-English speaking streamers.
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Ik that but I can't think of a single streamer besides cm that primarily plays pig? Most people play pig for 2-3 games and then switch he's the only streamer ik of that plays her consistently
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I've started doing it more with Coh around alot, wounded survs have little value with the free healing avaliable. Even worse with multiple CoH and little counter play other than to tunnel.
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Behavior can take something out of the game just as easily as they put it in. That is my point here.
People want to make the case that tunneling & camping are inevitables when they most certainly are not.
As far as anyone knows, BHVR could have already gone down the rabbit hole and explored versions of DBD where tunneling and camping are not viable strategies. Its entirely possible they drew conclusions that they don't know how to make it work while preserving DBD's identity. Or perhaps they've just received pushback from investors or lead designers to take that risk and make such radical changes to a game that is doing well enough.
Regardless, I don't think we (the community) should be complacent about tunneling & camping in its current state.
This couldn't be further from the truth.
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What I said was objectively true, sorry. It's in this thread as well as others. Feel free to go read it. On the first page there is a post implying tunneling is toxic. The steam forums are constantly filled with people implying or stating tunneling is "toxic behavior"
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They have tried to do anti-camping before, IIRC. I believe it wound up being weaponised against Killers by having them get looped around hooks. And then we have the current farcical state of some powers, which aren't allowed to be used near a hook but you can still shoot them at the unhookee, which is far more useful.
And the problem with the discussion on camping and tunnelling isn't one of complacency or inevitability, it's that far too many people automatically come at it from the position of "I don't like this because it's not fun for me, therefore it's bad, therefore the other person is playing the game wrong and they should be forcefully stopped from doing this!"
Apart from being tiresome, this sort of starting point is: A) excessively confrontational, and B) focuses on punishing people rather than making the other approaches more appealing.
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Just want to remind some of you that we can keep it civil without attacking each other.
I am legitimately curious to see if anyone has had a change of heart about tunneling & genuinely don't want the thread to be closed because people are in a deep disagreement.
Thanks community 💜
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Nah I don't get mad about being tunneled or camped I find it's more entertaining actually than sitting on a gen and holding M1.
At least with Tunneling I'm being chased which is more fun and camping I just humor it and pretend I'm having a chat with the killer.
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I can neither confirm nor deny who I'm talking about due to forum rules unfortunately
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