Wait people are actually upset over Nurse being reinabled?
Like what you want to lose content forever? I thought it was a meme when people say she should be disabled forever. I despise haddonfield and its a terrible designed map but I still want it back ASAP because well I don't like the removal of content. I'm so shocked that there is several posts saying Nurse should of stayed disabled.
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There are a shocking number of players who think she "ignores game mechanics" as if she doesn't have her own unique set of mechanics. And if you try to explain Nurse counterplay to people, they'll move the goal posts and say "...but a *good* Nurse". Half of it is literally running away sooner and not greeding a 40% gen against a killer who can cover 20 meters
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I mean what is nurses counterplay apart from stealth (which nobody seems to do anymore), breaking LOS, doubling back or "mindgaming"?
I'm not asking out of bad faith I want to know what you personally think it is because not everyone can agree.
You can't really use windows, because you get animation locked. You can't really use pallets because she can go right through them and stunning a nurse out of blink isn't as rewarding anymore since she can blink straight afterwards. Supposedly it was a bug where she had the stun and the fatigue but I can't deny it felt more rewarding to pull off. Also DH, Should ppl really feel like DH is the only perk that helps against this killer?
Again, I wanna also mention something I see Nurse and Blight players do a lot which I find a bit hypocritical which is burning map offerings that favour them. Survivors do it too, of course but it's still unfair.
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I seriously hate the "...but a *good* Nurse"." arguement because if you are also a good survivor you would know how to play against Nurse. Saying "oh but good players beat me" is the stupidest arguement ever and means you want the game to be objectively less skillful because you think players of a higher skill than you should be able to beat you.
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your not suppose to have an unlimited ways to counter a killer that's why over half the killer roster isn't played.
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Some people just want easier games.
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Stealth is debatable but lockers, breaking LOS, running early, doubling back or "mindgaming". I dont know why people act like 4 forms of counterplay isn't a lot its more that some other killers.
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This
In almost 3k hours, i´ve met exactly 1 tournament tier nurse. Yes, they exist. Yes, they are powerful. But also so rare, that you should probably play the lottery once you´ve seen one.
Most of the nurses i´ve played against are okayish and can be run for a very long time IF you don´t try to run them like a normal killer. Means lose the line of sight as often as possible. Erratic movements and a pebble work wonders against her.
@OP yeah, many mains don´t even want to try to lean playing against her and just want her gone. Nurse takes a huge amount of time to learn. If survivors would take just a fraktion of time, to learn to play against her. Then no one would complain about her.
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That isn't what I said at all, I don't know if you're projecting or what
The person I'm responding to said that people move the goalposts when people try to explain Nurse's counterplay, so I wanna know what they think it is bc outside of what I wrote down in my post I can't think of much else
Lockers? Mind elaborating a bit more on that one because I've never seen anyone use lockers against a Nurse and not go down 2 seconds later
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ok it didn't really sound like that's what you where saying. the new killer is a perfect example she is a very loop able killer and survivor's are just starting to w key when i play her its another point of counterplay that she cant deal with.
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She’s the best-designed and best-balanced killer in the game.
That IS counterplay. If anything, that’s the MOST SKILLFUL counterplay for any killer. Nurse cannot land hits without her power without something to boost her movespeed/survivor misplaying drastically. Everything she can do can be mindgamed. Mindgame is skill vs skill. It’s not “map RNG/other stuff out of the players’ control favors one side regardless of skill”. It’s “whoever made the better mindgame read or bait wins the trade instance”.
Pallets and windows can be used. It’s just harder, cause you have to mindgame a lot better. It’s a lot more skillful to win a trade (landing or dodging a hit) when it’s 100% reliant on skill vs skill, rather than eg, auto winning/losing a chase vs an M1 because the tile setup is drastically in your favor or against your favor. Same with winning because it’s even moderately in your favor. Stuff like that is out of either side’s control, and has no bearing on skill. Even dead zones can be mindgamed against Nurse cause she can’t just walk up to you. But even otherwise unbalanced tile setups can be mindgamed too. That’s WHY it’s the most skill intensive.
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to get rid of thing i don't like right?
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Pretty much what it says on the tin since she can't open lockers after blinking. If you are about to get hit and are near a locker wait for her to blink to you, jump in, wait for fatigue, jump out and continue the chase.
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Disagree, def not the best balanced killer in the game. Not even close. Most rewarding and skill reliant killer? Sure.
That said I don't think she needs to be changed or anything like that, I'm just trying to better understand what tactics one is supposed to use when going against Nurse players who are competent. Not perfect, 'competent' because newer, less experienced nurse players are very different to ones who know how to play her. Not 'god tier' or whatever exaggeration people make.
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Tbf it's not just nurse.
Any killer that requires a bit of extra effort to counter gets complained about.
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Nurse is balanced when against people of actually even skill match ups. It wouldn’t be reasonable to blame Nurse for winning uneven skill match ups.
If you’re curious, it’s very worth watching tournament VODs. They’re all available online on YouTube and/or Twitch. Yeah, it’s competitive which is drastically different from non-competitive, as a whole. BUT, they also still have chases, just like non-competitive, and people can learn from how they play and apply that to non-competitive.
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She's definitely not fun once you faced like 100 times and you just have to repeat the same Lose line of sight Mindgames over and over again (obviously not repeating the same pattern of Mindgames). But she is definitely not like OP or anything.. is just the fact that she ignores looping and chase base mechanics (ignoring one of the more fun parts of playing survivor)
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Makes sense, although like I said from my experience most ppl who try to use lockers against Nurse either get grabbed from it or go down 2 seconds later anyway.
I suppose if you're gonna go down anyway wasting some extra time is the best option so I can see the utility. Not exactly the most consistant though I don't think
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I don't enjoy "comp" dbd, I find it very silly and unrepresenative of how the game is actually played
I get what you're saying though
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Most players don't break LOS enough or they panic and don't sell their fakes well enough. If you break LOS around a corner, you have to break LOS again. She has two blinks. It's not enough to just run around a corner, because if she blinks to that corner, then she has an easy follow up blink on you out in the open. Break LOS, and break LOS again on the assumption that she'll corner blink.
Regarding holding W vs doubling back, you can make that decision on the fly. A lot of survivors pre-determine it, which makes it very easy to read and predict. If you round a corner, move your camera and watch where the Nurse is aiming as she charges if possible. If she's aiming at the corner, keep going and break LOS. If she's following your trajectory, wait a beat to sell her on the fake, then double back as she releases the blink.
Survivors also tend to not use the whole map. They tend to hug tiles when they have a ton of space and LOS breakers at the edges of the map. Nurse takes away some things, but she makes other things useful.
Pallets are playable. You need to bait out the initial blink on the near side of the pallet, then cross to the other side as she's in the air. She either takes a lunge or charges her second blink. This gives you a window to double back across the pallet and stun, or bait out a bad lunge. I like to run towards her to force her to release the blink early on the desired side of the pallet. Pallets are a mindgame vs Nurse instead of a mechanical loop.
I definitely understand the argument that Nurse takes too much practice to play against, and that's due to her unique kit.
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Yeah if you are getting grab quite literally the solution is dont ######### up the timing. And from my experience people go down to nurse in 2 seconds anyway. Lockers do counter Nurse WHEN YOU KNOW HOW TO USE THEM. If you just keep going into the locker ofc you are going to die because the main counter of nurse is being unpredictable. I agree some people act like complete fuckwits when they try to use lockers but if you know how to use them they are a viable way to extend chases VS her.
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Nurse’s chase is more skill-reliant both as and against her than almost any other killer. She makes all chases a 50/50 more or less based off pure skill. Other killers make certain areas significantly more in their favor, and map RNG generations make certain areas significantly against them. Having to play a chase starting off advantaged or disadvantaged is hardly as skill intensive as something with an equally fair chance for both.
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Yeah I think I basically agree with everything you've said here. Thanks for taking the time to write up your thoughts
I find I try to 'kite' nurses in straight lines far away from my teammates, while also mixing up doubling back and stuff like that. I do enjoy it, even if because it's solo Q the matches are typically over really quickly bc it's a stomp/nobody can do gens fast enough.
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No killer is fun after 100 games. Dont try to gimme some BS like billy is fun to go against or X/Y killer is fun. In 14 years time when you have finally found your 100th billy you will be bored of him. Any other killer this applies to too except you wont need to wait 14 years to find 100 of them.
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I find it fun to watch but I do agree comp is incredibly unrepresentative of the game because of the sheer amount of rules they enforce to try to balance the game.
Comp DBD is good and EXTREMELY overhated
Using Comp as an excuse for ######### balance ideas is just dumb.
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I wouldn't even waste time with that guy at this point, all he does is bring up tournament players where most chases are about wasting as much time pf the nurse as possible while knowing you will go down in a matter of seconds. And when I say that I mean that most of the chases you'll see will be about running towards the edges of the map and towards corners where you know you'll go down, but the killer will waste a lot of time hooking you, while you KNOW your other team mates will be kissing gens on the opposite side e of the map. Huge counterplay, best balance right? What's even the point of playing the game if that's what you're expected to do to get that "high level average 2k".
Taking tournament games as an example is as flawed as taking public kill rate statistics to call for killer buffs or nerfs, because you can't expect people to play like that in public games, not even the famous "uncounterable tryhard swfs" play like that for goodness sake, because let's be real, who wants to play a game where all you do is run to a corner to get downed as soon as you're found?
I really think that anyone who justifies some aspects of nurse is either delusional or just plays comp therefore having an extremely distorted idea of the game
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Even with that, it’s still worth looking to learn how chases happen. That knowledge is applicable to both comp and not-comp. The only reason people bring up comp is to show she is even at the highest levels of play when there’s a ton of rules, more for survivors than the Nurse. When all rules are removed, she has a negative kill average. (As if it was just a non comp game)
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Do you need someone to teach mindgaming to you?
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"billy is fun to go against" take that!!! XD ...yeah but hes depressing to play thats for sure..but to be fair am playing since 2017 soo nah I still like a lot billy , sadly he is to weak..right now.
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The people complaining about nurse are players who have most likely never played as her so they dont understand her counterplay. Sure she ignores a lot but she is hampered by her fatigue state and as long as you somewhat count her blinks and time your rushes right you can escape and avoid her. Its just practice and shes a blast to play against I hope we get more nurse players now that shes back
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This goes for both sides
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For me it's an honour to die against a nurse.
There are nurses out there that have floored me and 3 other teammates within 2 minutes and I don't find it as frustrating as when other killers do it.
I don't know why. I think it's because she's hard to master, I just accept that this player spend who knows how many hours perfectioning it, that I just bow down and take my losses.
It's also rewarding when I see teammates go down fast and she finds me and I get a decent chase out of it, I don't know how to explain it.
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I guess it's boring with the same triple stacked slowdown build. Shame she got fixed, and she's one of the few killers I've actually maxed out on too.
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I definitely notice matchmaking issues when I play as and against Nurse. There's almost always going to be one or two players that go down in 15 seconds every chase. It's a skill gap and matchmaking is doing a poor job of matching teammates of equal skill with each other.
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Nurse is the only Killer who can ignore Infinite Loops and God Palets so yeah alot Survivor Mains want to See Nurse gone 4 ever they cant be OP against her
The Reason Why alot Survivors hate Bubba because is because he is the best 1 shot Killer who can ignore there beloved Dead Hard
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Infinites don't exist anymore I'm pretty sure
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Sometimes it is good the Devs don´t listen to every complaint.
Nurse would be gone, Spirit, Blight, Bubba... RPD, Midwich, Coldwind... because all "not fun". But there would also be no game left.
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I am completely against removing anything but I think reworks are good ideas ESPECIALLY FOR CERTAIN MAPS **COUGH COUGH** RPD **COUGH**
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I knew this would come up. Some tweaks are ok but RPD is fine and cool. Also was Hawkins.
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I miss Hawkins but god I despise everything about RPD except its visuals/atmosphere. Every loop in that map is annoying and confusing, its way too big, its so claustrophobic.
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I like it. Had good games and bad games on RPD.
I also don´t see that the very often played outdoor maps are so much better. They are open and you can see better but i also like the indoor maps too.
We always need new maps. Some variety is good.
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nobody claimed the contrary
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Personally its just the confusing layout an claustrophobia of it all. Split it to two maps and widen the corridors and doorways and generally make it feel more open.
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Here.
And you are right - we need more content not less.
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The people who complain about Nurse being re=enabled are probably the same people who want stretch rez back. They just want things to be easy for them.
When I play nurse the majority of survivors I run into just do things wrong. It's like they never played against a nurse before. They try to loop a pallet, they vault a window, they try to flashlight blind me. Then there's the survivors that know what to do when facing a nurse. Block los, forcing me to guess where they are going. Did they double back or did they keep going? If I see a survivor loop the outside of the shack I know it's going to be a challenge. They use stairs to mess up my blinks. I charge a blink on silent hills map, the survivor runs towards me, I aim downwards and I go through the floor -.- A lot of survivors dont understand it's very punishing and frustrating to play nurse and screw up a blink. Your slower than survivors so therefore your power is all your have. Your not going to switch to nurse and suddenly get 4ks every game. It takes a lot of hours to get consistent with blinks.
I dont want easier games but I want games where I feel like it was a good game. 3 gens popping by the time I down 1 person is not "fair" IMO. By the time I did 1/12 my objective they were able to do 3/5s theirs. I want to have fun too. I dont want to be there just so 4 other people can bully me.
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It's not so much the layout itself that makes the layout confusing its that so many corridors look so simalar and have 0 refrence so you cannot tell where in the layout you are.
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When that map first came out. I was in a 3 man swf. One friend got hooked in the basement. I was nearby and the killer left immediately. By the time I found the damn stairs he went to tier 2 on the hook.
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On release I felt like throwing a heavy book at every person who said "layouts not hard lol just play RE3".
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Ive played RE2 and 3. The reboots and the originals and I still had difficulty finding everything.
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Yea it is confusing - but is this really bad?
I think not - you get used to it if you play it more often. I am still a bit confused sometimes even if i know where i am.
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I mean there is the issue aside from it being confusing of like, blight, billy, huntress, trickster, oni and depending on the spawns, trapper and hag.
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