We need to do surveys to know what is wrong and why you are leaving
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DS used offensively - annoying.
Also a general waste of time for the survivors, so not something to complain about.
'Tunneling' isn't 'playing dirty'. There is no rule against it.
Tunneling itself is totally fine - it's not the killer's responsibility to distribute damage evenly.
And this is why the game won't move away from the super sweaty gameplay.
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28K points. I see nothing wrong.
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It's absolutely not a waste of time. Time it right and you can bodyblock without fear, then hop into a locker forcing the killer to eat a DS.
So...what? You want to make a rule against tunneling or something? Make it so that a killer has to 2 hook everyone before killing someone? Make it so that you have to ignore people even if they run directly into you?
That's going to get silly fast.
You cannot make a rule about something when nobody can even agree with what it is, for starters.
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....uh huh...sure
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better.
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It's absolutely not a waste of time. Time it right and you can bodyblock without fear, then hop into a locker forcing the killer to eat a DS.
How? How are you going to -force- the killer to make the active decision to chase you down after hitting you and then open the locker? What if the killer sees your obvious DS bait and goes /ignore on your behind and just resumes what he was doing before you slowed him down by 3 seconds?
And keep in mind that this requires 8-16 seconds of investment from another survivor on top of your own time sunk in order to heal up. Effort which is immediately wasted because you don't give the killer a chase, but a bodyblock.
Also keep in mind that after moving away so the killer doesn't interrupt your heal, then healing 8-16 seconds, then finding the killer again, you will have spent probably upwards of half your DS timer, so a smart killer might just sit out the other half and take the free, chase-less hook on you. Which is going to be your second hook at best.
A DS bait can only work if the killer lets it. I've been hit with it before, when I was just starting out, and it was very frustrating, but it was -very- obviously -my- fault for falling for it.
So...what? You want to make a rule against tunneling or something? Make it so that a killer has to 2 hook everyone before killing someone? Make it so that you have to ignore people even if they run directly into you?
No need to make a rule about it. We've got the band-aid solution to kneecap DS. Problem is, it takes up a perk slot.
DS should just be moved to baseline to weaken tunnelling. It can be tweaked from there (Giving killers a HUD indicator for which survivor was unhooked last so they can more easily keep track between four identical Claudettes, randomising duration so it can't be timed as easily, increasing/decreasing stun duration, adding a short burst of untraceable) if it needs to be made stronger or weaker, but it gives a baseline system to prevent killers from just hard focusing one target out ASAP.
A similar sort of mechanical change could be used to weaken camping, pushing for more of a chase oriented gameplay style and taking away the motivation for gens going as fast as they do.
Ultimately, we can't just let killers keep super sweaty, overpowered tactics while balancing the game around killer players that refuse to do everything they can. As long as people respond to tunnelling/camping complaints with 'it's a valid strategy', it's valid for any survivor to demand that killers sweat harder if they want their win, and to disregard any 'survivors OP' complaint coming from people who 'don't want to tunnel/camp'.
And that is the cesspool that is current day DBD.
Given enough time, players will optimise the fun out of a game. And that is exactly what happened here.
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Lol it is not, i have been a survivor main for years.
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They are just better at hockey then you, that's all 😜😂
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Well given that a former lead dev basically said kindred base kit would be too overwhelming for new players really shows how they think how intelligent we are. Like I don't know what they think is so hard to grasp about "multiple yellow auras = friendly and single big pinkish aura = big bad killer" but it must not be much.
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DS isn't needed to avoid tunneling, you could just play better and not get downed
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Survivor fun is not a Killer responsibility.
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But what if you get sandbagged? DS is a great back up. Never trust your useless teammates.
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Otz would never win a single game against a good SWF playing optimally, not a single one.
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ayaoo
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He wouldn't deserve to. If survivors play optimally, why should they lose?
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If a killer plays optimally why should he/she lose ?
Fact is killer playing optimally vs swf playing optimally will result in a win for the survivors 100% of the time on any map. That is the main problem. The game is not balance and favor heavily the survivors.
The only way to make it fairer would be to remove some windows and at least 30 to 40% of the pallets (70% on the game map). Then we would get a 50/50% chance of winning for both sides but many survivors would cry as most of them rely on broken perks abuse and many strong loops to win.
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Borrowed Time? Decisive Strike? Unbreakable? You mean the tools to help combat camping, tunneling, and slugging?
I know the answer, but how many perk slots does the killer need to use up in order to be near a hook, target the same survivor, or leave the survivor on the ground?
Okay, and what happens if the killer does not camp, tunnel, or slug? The survivor is playing ith 1 perk.
If flashlights bother you so much, run Lightborn. Killers are fine making survivors use up (and potentially waste) three perk slots to counter the ways they can play, but won't bother using one of their own perk slots to counter flashlights.
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The bigger issue is gen speeds, moreover, the lack of interesting objectives for survivors. Sitting still and holding a singular button for 100 seconds isn't fun for most. For that reason, the devs will not increase gen repair times; especially because that can stack with existing slowdown perks. (Much like addon passes, where changes to basekit require nerfing the related addons to prevent stacking them from getting out of hand, the devs would have to revisit every single slowdown/regression perk IF they wanted to affect gen repair speed basekit.)
Maybe with the addition of the new "item not taking up an item slot" mechanic from the Sadako Rising chapter, the devs could add a new scavenger hunt mechanic as a prerequisite to repairing gens.
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As far as surveys, players who have left the game are not likely reinstalling it to fill out surveys when they come up. Surveys asking people "which of these 5 or 6 things contribute the most to you not wanting to continue playing" would be a better approach. Unless the devs added an exit survey that asks players why they chose to uninstall when they do, which I never see game companies do. (Possibly against consumer ethics/laws?)
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So leaving the game as it is where survivors can do all gens + open the doors under 7 minutes is okay for you ?
Then don't cry when your queue times will be 30 minutes cause it is what will happen in a few months. Hope you will use that time wisely to make your mind on the state of the game with objective facts.
If the devs remove the soft cap mechanic from SBMM, i.e 3000 SBMM survivors won't be matched against a 2000 SBMM killers, their queue times would be infinite and personally i have enough to face unbeatable SWF and i do not want the matchmaking to pair me against them as it is not fair and it is pointless to play as i cannot win.
Fact that most killers need to use 3 to 4 slow down perks to have a fairer match (but still favoring the survivor) is a joke. Killers cannot use perks that help them, they are forced to use corrupt/pop/No way out... it leaves 1 free slot, awesome.
Pop should be build in the break gen mechanic.
Corrupt should be built in the trial.
So BHVR, leave those toxic selfish survivor mains thinking the game is perfectly okay as it is and abusing broken things, play against killers of their SBMM level, i do not care if their queue times is 2 hours and none of the players that play killers or 50/50 care.
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If a killer plays optimally why should he/she lose ?
That's where the 2K comes in. Maybe a 3-hook and EGC camp one match, or a double camp kill, or whatever the case may be. Yes, it probably won't be a 10-hook match, but since no one wants to give up camping or tunnelling, the game has to be balanced towards camping and tunnelling being employed literally all the time.
So leaving the game as it is where survivors can do all gens + open the doors under 7 minutes is okay for you ?
People aren't okay with this, but it's a necessity because killer players don't want to let go of the methods THEY use to put these kinds of time constraints out.
You say people camp and tunnel because gens go so fast, but conversely, gens go that fast -because people can camp and tunnel-.
Fact that most killers need to use 3 to 4 slow down perks to have a fairer match (but still favoring the survivor) is a joke. Killers cannot use perks that help them, they are forced to use corrupt/pop/No way out... it leaves 1 free slot, awesome.
Do you not see the irony of complaining about this after highlighting DS, BT AND UB in the survivor loadouts? Your opening screenshot alone shows you with only one of the perks you say you need, but shows 3 out of 4 survivors with at least 2 of the band-aid perks.
Corrupt/Pop/No Way Out are all perks that also help the killer, that are part of their core power set, whereas the survivor perks are things that simply hinder the killer but do literally zero for survivors unless the killer plays into them. (Again, with the exception of the BT bodyblock which needs to be removed)
The survivor meta is far more set-in-stone than that of killers. Hoarder is meta on Pinhead. Agitation + Iron Grasp makes Basement Bubba. Distressing is a serious option for the Doctor. Stridor is a good pick for Nurse.
Yes, most killers will gravitate towards slowdown or gen defence perks, but even within that, there is variety. Pop, Corrupt, Ruin, Call of Brine are four perks that are all directed to the same process but do it in different ways.
Flipside: DS is the ONLY anti-tunnel perk.
Both sides are treated like trash by the game right now. The cut-throat, competitive attitude that SBMM introduced screwed up the game's core premise and brought all of its worst problems boiling to the surface. But until we can reach a consensus that is more than just 'survivors should just get shafted while killers get to keep their sweatlord-isms as a back-up plan in case they happen to lose', nothing is going to change.
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Gamer, a yellow flashlight and a hook offering are not that bad.
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This week numbers are really alarming.
End of march we have already seen a huge decrease of the playerbase. This week it is crazy, ppl are leaving massively... I dunno if you understand what is happening... Those numbers are as low as the 2018 numbers, they are even lower...
Everything started with the SBMM release (September 2021).
Shareholders might be really really unhappy about this, i'm wondering how long it will last till we hear that DbD will have the same fate than Anthem.
I believe that we have reached a non-return point, even if many good decisions are made in the near future, most of the players that have left will never return.
Post edited by JeanCharpentier on1 -
I think it is very worthwhile filling out surveys so you can be brutally honest with the devs. If many people feel the same (and I am sure they do) the results will be very hard for the devs to ignore.
I hear you too, while I won the vast majority of my killer games, I found I was not having fun at all in the process. So while win rates do provide raw data it most definitely doesn't tell the full story. Contributing to surveys is far more effective
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Also use the "Did you have fun?" rating thing above the scoreboard.
🦆🦂
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True and I do use this myself but not every match, which I should change as it is another form of feedback for them
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Why do i never see you comment something like that when its on reversed sides?
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Honestly yes, i left the game and didn't return after buying Sadako and seeing how powerless she was, it was the last time i used money to buy a killer that can barely do anything, it was the last time i wasted my time playing this game, struggling my ass to kill at least two survivor, while escaping as survivor without beaking a sweat on my first match
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That's not true. He played against tournament teams and won. He even played in tournaments and destroyed teams there. Of course you can say "well they didnt play optimally" but who does ever play optimally and makes no mistakes? No one can beat a football team which plays optimally.
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Funny that you think Iron Will is not a problem, in fact it's one of the most annoying perks out there imo. I don't mind the second chance perks like UB or DS too much, the combination of both is annoying but i think DH is much more of a problem right now.
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2 years ago 😂
While today he can't even have a 20 trials win streak in the normal matchmaking.
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If those numbers do not include people who are playing on the Public Test Build, then there will be a noticeable dip when PTB's happen.
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I think it includes PTB players. Haven't seen such a deep in years.
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Every single person that I used to play with quit because of SBMM. They hate it, I don't know how it's still in the game when it's obviously killing the game.
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I will drop this here.
When you look at the devs stream, you understand that they have way too much confidence.
And then, with 30k ppl voting :
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The absurd discrepancy between player playtimes is what makes me always stop the game for a while. I have 500 hours of play. And my teammates often have less (a hundred) while the killer has a lot more (thousands).
A recent example: a teammate had 23 miserable hours while the killer had 2,300 hours. I suspect that the game is looking for me a game as soon as possible, but if it's to make me have such bad times, I still prefer to wait 5 minutes.
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4 dead hards
3 iridescent, because MMR exsists
everyone telling u are bad, well this is just your typical dbd game
Do yourself a favor, when u realize everyone has dead hard, just go full toxic
if they wanna ruin your fun, ruins theirs, and tbh i think u should have replaced the agitation with lightborn, assuming they didn't do that thing where they switch in the last 10 seconds to the most toxic stuff u will see
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This can be explained because many new killers are stopping to play. At start they might get easy trials, like the 10 first trials and then, ranking up, they start to face average survivors and are completely destroyed, after a few trials they stop to play.
That's why there are not many low hours killers.
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And they likely also realize how absolutely awful the grind is to get even a semi-decent perk loadout.
🦆🦂
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I was just trying a build, not my main build on Billy 😊
Around 5 to 6 millions BP once you have unlocked all the meta perks... yes it's huge. Someone starting to play today would need 500 hours to unlock all the perks he/she needs to play some killers. It's crazy.
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BHVR doesn't care about the surveys. They just want $$$. If everyone was miserable playing DBD and they were making record profits they wouldn't change a thing. $$$ is the only thing they have ever cared about.
It took them 5 years to add colorblind support and that only occurred after negative media coverage. They even lied and said "ITS BEEN IN DEVELOPMENT FOR MONTHS!!" but they only had a few screenshots to show. It still took them months after their announcement.
The surveys are intended to make players feel good. That's it. If they wanted to act on the surveys they would have released the results on the previous surveys and mentioned design decisions they were making with explanations as the result of the survey. They don't do this.
If they wanted to they could release full stats on the game or just provide an API the community could use to datamine information. Kind of like popular games like League of Legends or Smite. They don't this.
They know that people keep playing because of the skinner box mentality of the grind. That's why it's gotten so huge over time. Their comments about fixing the grind and wanting to do it "right" to not waste effort are ridiculous. They just want the oxytocin to be released in our little brains everytime we RNG a perk we want and hope that we keep playing and buying MTX.
Look at BHVRs track record. They got lucky with this game.
Warhammer Eternal Crusade - dropped after a failed release.
West World - killed by lawsuit after copying and pasting code from work they did for Bethesda.
Deathgarden - dropped after a failed release.
Deathgarden was actually a fun game that was marred by bugs and balance issues but it could have been sorted out. They just didn't have the talent to do so and it wasn't making enough $$$ so they shuttered it.
If DBD goes through a rough patch I don't think they'll tough it out. They'll close the game and move back to contract work.
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They should sell the license to a studio that want to do something great with DbD.
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I rarely see so much crying from Survivors...
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There are less and less killers playing, what will you do when there won't be any killer left ? And do not say it won't happen cause it is already happening.
PPL with a mindset like you just contribute to kill DbD. You do not want fair matches, you want ez wins and to be able to troll the killer.
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Yeah, thats me, the big Killer-Troller. Have you seen my Youtube-Videos? Have some sick 90°-Montages since I cannot do 360s.
And nah, Killers just like to play the victim-role. They do this A LOT. Playing Killer is not as bad as they claim it to be. If even I can manage somehow, people who actually main Killer and do not play Survivor at all should be even better.
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Now lets be honest here, and i don't expect you to agree with me but;
If they listened to peoples reactions this game would be in the same state if not worse, but in the reverse. You only have to look at the general consensus on this forum to see that. Killers Powers and Mechanics would be buffed across the board, they'd all still stack their slowdowns, and Survivor would be the miserable role to play where you'd probably be lucky to get 1 or 2 gens done before everyone's dead (cos one popular opinion is gens need to take longer)
Now i've been against plenty of killer players that already win like that, and that's without the buffs the masses still come to this forum to beg for. BHVR have mad some questionable changes but i'm glad they're not making snap decisions based on what people post here because i don't think you guys realize the effects until they'd actually implement it and the game doesn't become the perfect balanced state we all think it needs.
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I agree with you, they should not totally listen to the players but when ppl are complaining massively, they should listen.
I mean, SBMM has been criticized a lot by most of the community, why is it still here ? No one wants it, it should have been removed 2 months after release. Today they are looking to tweak the matchmaking still based on the SBMM score although we all know it will never work as it is a kills/escapes BMM.
We want the old system back.
Then they can focus on balancing the game, especially maps, we don't care about their killers'/perks' buffs/nerfs, it is useless. The core of the unbalance is the maps.
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and that's bad? no one should have a 20 trial win streak LOL what do killer mains expect? that's ridiculous
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A good SWF can have hundreds of trials win streak, all good right ?
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