Where's the meta changes?
I play both killer and survivor, but full disclosure i play survivor in higher ranks than killer, so i don't know about high ranks experience from the killer perspective.
Following the news, i'm wondering, where's the meta changes?
Survivor meta got nerfed, that's for sure. But killer meta? The only two perks I think won't be used anymore are BBQ, which will be switched for better aura reading perks, and Hex: Ruin that got nerfed a bit hard and will be replaced by an other slow down perk. But overall, slow down builds are going to be even more effective now, and camping got buffed as well, I don't think the killer meta is going to be changed at all, honestly i think it just got buffed.
If more experienced killers could tell me their point of view about this i'd appreciate it, do yall actually think the slowdown builds aren't going to be worth running anymore? Mostly when camping is going to be more rewarding bc gens take longer to complete?
Comments
-
All I know is that Plague with new thana and pentimento will make me cry irl
7 -
I'm genuinely shocked anyone was even running Ruin when it gets cleansed 20-30 seconds into the match to begin with. Unless you also ran undying in which case it would maybe last for 40-50 seconds.
I think the Killer meta will change only slightly towards even more camping and tunneling since they are stronger now. Oh and folks might replace BBQ with NOED since it didn't get nerfed in the end, it's still an equip to win the game perk. Plus more Nurses. Yay.
10 -
fr I don't know why killers would stop running slowdown perks when they could be so strong with them
5 -
People run Ruin for the same reason they run other short-lived perks that do very little for them like Corrupt. Streamers told them they're good and they don't like thinking for themselves. If you get into a chase early, Corrupt does essentially nothing, all the 'nerf' does is make that more visible.
1 -
I think the problem is the core meta for survivor is always the same 6 perks
DS, DH, BT, Unbreakable, Iron Will, spine chill (ish). So nurfing those will drasticly change the survivor meta
When you think about killer each killer has its own meta.
High mobility killers use tinkerer pop ruin but those don't work so well on something like clown or trapper.
I myself as a killer main run BBQ, Lethal, Franklins and Devour and if i roll on the devour and it doesnt get clensed it usually ends in the survivors having no chance.
The problem with killer meta is there is no one true meta everyone is running every match but instead it just depends on your MMR level and the killer you go against.
FYI i don't agree with Carrow on the whole NOED is a equip to win the game perk. NOED has always been so easy to counter....do bones.
0 -
Well tbf they nerfed the most used perks. Now they encourage more interactive gameplay with kicking gens and chasing survivors with faster pallet breaks.
I can see what they up to, however if community wont change the playstyle and still go for camp/tunnel and stacked slowdown anyway, then we will need more changes.
I think their idea of making gens longer is to address the fact many killers camp and tunnel cause they feel game goes too fast...but what if you play like that, even though you dont need it anymore?
1 -
Basically every single nerfed killer perk is dead. I really don't see any of them not becoming niche, even Pain Resonance (it often is unoptimal/impossible to reach a scourge hook so why even bother if you're not even going to get a single information out of it and can't combo with DMS anymore).
3 -
I agree that Survivors were hit much harder overall, however I think Dead Hard actually got BUFFED
1 -
PR + DMS had become very meta, and this kills that dead. Ruin was already fading, and this will really push it further from the meta.
1 -
Honestly i've literally used dead hard three times in my life (1 for the adept, 2 for tome challenges), so i don't know how it's going to be affected but to me it sounds that the effect will still be strong but will be much harder to use, so we'll have to see in the PTB ig.
That's probably it tbh, some builds are op on some killers but balanced on others so it's surely more difficult to decide which ones to nerf / buff... but i can't forgive that bloodlust buff lol
0 -
The Survivor Meta change I dont know what will be, of the Meta perks all but DH and BT got demolished, most of them are unusable, like Red Herring level of unusable.
The supposed buffed perks to spice up the meta only Off The Record and Lightweight got buffed, the rest are not enough to be useful or are direct nerfs.
- Calm Spirit got nerfed masively, it was bad before now its an active hindrance to your team, you want hexes cleansed ASAP and nobody cleanses with the Killer around because odds are he will be able to see you anyway.
- Sole Survivor still garbage and still promotes letting people die, its only use is for escaping through the gates during EGC but by that point is better to just get Left Behind and aim for Hatch.
- Saboteur minor buff which acomplishes nothing, if you run it now and go for a sabo you are going to sabo the hook where the Killer is going, doesnt matter if its scourge or not, it will be the same, nobody presabos the hooks, they just wait until the Killer is close and breaks them, scourge or no scourge, you want the save the guy not force the Killer towards a regular hook, plus nobody sabos with the perk, sabo builds are done with toolboxes.
- Bothany got buffed but its just a 13% increase, We'll Make It still trounces it.
- Lucky Break got a minor buff, still you are going to run out of use and replenishing it is not going to be easy plus it collides with Lightweight.
- Pharmacy still garbage, who gets their Pharmacy medkit stolen? you dont run Pharmacy if you are bringing another item into the trial, you run it barehanded...
- Distortion got a minor buff, problem with this perk is except BBQ the stuff that consumes charges eats them very fast, Ive been playing with lately and things like Undying or Darkness Revealed can eat your charges before the Killer gets its second hook, having to stay around the Killer out of chase for 30 seconds is too much to make it worthwhile.
- Deja Vu still garbage.
- No One Left Behind still superniche and Solos are going to skidoodle anyway (which is the smart thing tho).
- Dark Sense got changed, its change is... I dont know it looks bad but Ill give it the benefit of the doubt (the Killer entering 24 meters of you and showing its aura its only good if you are in Lerys or The Game, if you are in normal maps you will see him by that time anyway).
- Hope same problem that No One Left Behind.
- Tenacity doesnt work if the Killer doesnt slug and he will notice you have it so he will know you are up to something so you are most definitely getting hooked.
- Overzealous still garbage, if the Killer doesnt bring a Hex you dont get to use it and if you cleanse a regular totem for the effect you are essentially hurting the team which is even worse since now gens are slower, plus one hit and you lose it.
- WGLF it was bad before, it still bad.
8 -
Yeah survivors got nerfed hard and the buffs are for niche situations at best and encourage you to leave your entire team to die so you can escape solo. I'm so baffled that they put calm spirit in the buff section lmao, they actually looked at the 30% speed debuff and thought "yeah, people will definitely use it now".
5 -
My biggest concern is Survivor got nerfed super hard and Killer base mechanics got buffed super hard while they didnt fix anything about camping, they even made it worse with the new Monstrous Shrine and the extra 10 seconds per gen, the whole 5 seconds free BT and 7% increased speed while unhooked wont do anything, someone did the math, it gives you 1,7 extra meters...
I wouldnt mind all these perk changes if camping and tunneling where gone for good but alas, they are still on the menu and now are the cheff specialty...
4 -
Yep, it's my first time in my years of DBD i'm actually scared of an update tbh. If all these changes feel as bad as they sound when they go live I might actually stop playing. I don't have nearly as fun playing as killer as I do survivor so if there's no fun there anymore i'll just find something else to enjoy while waiting an other couple years for a new meta change lmao.
3 -
I fear it'll be the same for me. I'll wait and try the changes myself, only one thing that is set in stone already: solo queue is 100% dead for me. What I fear is that I'll quit the killer role as well. I have most fun on both roles with a fair and balanced experience and the Developer Update explicitly stated they want killers to be on an unstoppable power trip and I'm not sure if that's appealing to me to stomp most survivors match after match unless it's some of the top x% players. I also don't want to fear the killer, or be feared as the killer, I want to play a fun action game with four other people and not hide and seek.
3 -
A lot of the survivor perk buffs are useless in solo, but exploitable in swf. same as it ever was.
3 -
You forgot the big nerf to Corrupt Intervention, it’s currently one of the most used perks but the new version will definitely be less popular since it goes away on the first down. (It will still see use but not as much.) Also Tinker is a highly popular meta perk but the nerf that it only works once per generator will probably make it see less use too.
0 -
Yeah reading the notes for a 3rd time now and it does seem like survivors drew the short straw this update. The killer perks are nerfed but essentially not to the extent the surviovr perks were (besides BT which got a big buff).
That being said, almost no one will run Ruin or BBQ now, and the rest of the meta killer perks will definitely see less use. I wager Thanataphobia might become the top killer perk
1 -
Can you explain how Camping got buffed?
"Moving forward, Survivors will receive a 5 second Endurance effect after being unhooked. This gives the unhooked Survivor an opportunity to reach a nearby window or pallet, or for another Survivor to position themselves for a Protection Hit.
Additionally, the unhooked Survivor will receive a 7% Haste effect for 5 seconds. This will make them harder to catch and encourage Killers to shift focus to the unhooking Survivor." which then also turns off if you do certain actions which if you're being camped and tunneled you wouldn't be doing.
This to me sounds like a nerf to camping and tunneling.
BT also seems to have been buffed despite them calling it a nerf right? Once again a nerf to camping (I am not sure why they think giving a mini bt will decrease BT's usage if it ends up making it better than it is now)
Personally, it sounds like a nerf to camping and tunneling. Mostly tunneling, but camping will also take some level of a hit.
0 -
Corrupt isnt really THAT nerfed, its a nerf, that I agree but its not that harsh as Tinkerer or PGTW (which are mostly useless now) because either you get your first down ASAP which then it may lose a lot of power or you get it around 60/80 seconds into the game, by that time any Survivor who wasnt the person you were chasing is working on one of the 4 unblocked gens, they are not going to stop working on them and go back to one of the now unblocked ones in the middle of nowhere, actually that would be even a benefit for you because now you can regress wathever they fixed and CI has a tendency to not block the central gens, which are the ones Survivors want fixed first, if they were to abandon them you would maintain those (obviusly they wont unless they suck).
In the first case if you get a first down that fast you probably have half the game in the bag anyway, if you get it at 60/80 its not going to change where the Survivors are working.
2 -
I agree that Corrupt is still a good perk. I’m also sure it will see less use now though because there are definitely people who will perceive it being turned off on the first down as too damaging. Plus with the slower gen speeds and some of the other perk buffs killer players may feel freer to use other perks instead now.
0 -
Yeah, its probably going to see a decrease in numbers, at least on the gotta-go-fast Killers which it was a bit overkill and are the ones who are going to get hit by it deactivating after your first down, after all, how many times do you get a down with Trapper in the first 40 seconds of a match?
2 -
Did you not see the 10 second increase to complete generators?
Hello?
2 -
I don't see the meta changes. The gen speed decrease, and other changes are good, but now gen-speed perks are much more robust, so I don't anticipate many changes in this area. 5s version of BT seems too minimal, and the DS nerf is excessive and favors The Killer too much. Where's the balance for DS? It should work twice at the very least. Now The Killer has a greater incentive to down a newly rescued Survivor and not have to worry about DS during EGC. There aren't enough effective changes from the Survivor perspective that is getting tunneled and camped to be meaningful. The issues remain, and the remedial perks are worse off.
3 -
BT helps with tunneling, not camping. It's not going to stop killers from getting a hit on you before the unhook and after the unhook to trade. It's not going to stop one shot down killers from getting multiple downs. Because generators now take longer to complete, camping will be much more effecient because survivors won't have time to "just do gens and leave". As long as the killer has someone on the hook they're good to go tbh, mostly if the equip slowdowns perks on top of that.
Also 5s BT is pretty useless (hence why BT was buffed to be longer than that), and bloodlust being buffed too means catching up to a survivor really won't be a waste of time if you want to tunnel them (even less if you're a high mobility killer). Sounds like BT will still be meta to me tbh.
3 -
you're afraid of a 2% buff meanwhile survivor gets a 3rd health state for 80 seconds?
0 -
80 seconds of survivors doing nothing but running behind the killer hoping to get a protection hit or literally hiding in a corner sounds like a killer buff to me.
Fr tho, it's good against tunneling but it's definitely not op lmao it goes away the second the survivor does literally anything. And bc a bunch of ppl are already crying about it it'll probably be nerfed back to being useless anyway.
2 -
Have you never heard of Breakout? You only need to tank 3 hits and the killer wouldn't be able to hook a single person. Meanwhile, thanatophobia requires four survivors to be injured at the same time, which if you're playing with a competent team, they will not be sitting around doing gens, but instead heal before returning to gens. What are you talking about?
0 -
lmao what does breakout have to do with the off the record buff (or thana?) ? You're just going to complain about every single viable survivor perk bc someone said new thanatophobia would be strong on Plague? Also if your team tanks 3 hits so the 4th survivor wiggle out then they'd all be injured wouldn't they :p
0 -
2% buff to generators taking 10seconds longer. From current 100 seconds to complete the gen with 4 Thana stacks, it'll become to 115 seconds. Which is quite massive
0 -
Change does not necessarily nerf, though in most circumstances perks did get nerfed: Noed, Pain res, Tinkerer, Corrupt Intervention, Pop are all meta perks and they all received nerfs. Considering the basekit buffs killers will get, it only makes sense that they did it as well. Slowdown perks are less meaningful now because
A) Their effects aren't as strong as before
B) The basekit changes allow for more creative builds
In other words: the meta will change.
There were some buffs too like Overcharge which will probably become more prevalent in the meta but we'll see. Either way, the statement "the killer meta won't change" is probably going to be wrong in my opinion, but only time will tell.
0 -
If a survivor twiddles their thumbs for the full 80 seconds, when they arent even being chased, then they could possibly cost the team the game. OTR deactives the moment you start doing an objective, and I would expect any decent survivor to immediately jump on a gen or something useful if the killer isn't tunnelling them.
0 -
Where'd you get 115 sec? You mean 22.6 per survivor? It isn't 115 seconds per person, it's 102.6 per generation. which just increases an incremental amount of 1.6 sec per survivor. how is that a buff?
0 -
??
New generator time is 90 seconds. New Thana will give 5.5% action speed slowdown per stack. At 4 stacks it's 22%
Action speed is 1 c/s -0.22 = 0.78
90/0.78 = 115.38 seconds
I really don't understand where you got your numbers from
1 -
which they can do TWICE per game, not to mention you can add a Breakout, Flashbang/Flashlights and they can be toxic for as long as they want without consequences and they can prevent killers from hooking.
0 -
112.5 - 115.4 which is just a 2.9 sec buff, but hardly effective cause 4 survivors wouldn't do gens injured or infected unless you're in Low MMR SoloQ, i didn't see the 90 sec generator buff earlier.
0 -
It got buffed regardless, counting the fact that gen time are getting upped too, so buffing it was arguably unnecessary. And 3 seconds make the difference a lot of times
0 -
Honestly if your needing bloodlust 2 to catch survivors you aint winning anyways. The time spend chasing survivors to bloodlust 2 or 3 is still a long time per hit. Don't forget bloodlust 1 hasn't been changed and most killers will get a hit either pre bloodlust or right after bloodlust 1. I think that bl2 and bl3 will only be used if survivors are chaining god teir setups in which case yeah we need help because of near infinite loops.
0 -
Honestly i can't wait for this off the record buff i hope they keep it exactly as this. I'm a killer main and there is nothing i love more currently than a BT survivor to run at me for no reason but to take a hit for no one. It gives so much pressure to a killer and the fact that killers have had there swing cooldown reduced on successful swings means hitting the survivor who has endurance is only going to hurt the survivor.
Also ongoing this is a legitimate reason to tunnel a survivor if they are going to be obnoxious with off the record as if they are hunting the killer to take a free hit clearly they want to be re-chased despite them being just unhooked right :)
Off the record is less an anti tunnel more a please tunnel me perk purely because instead of using it defencively like its supposed to be used for its going to be used offensively which isnt what the perk is for and killers will punish survivors who do that
0 -
You know, I can agree with that. There's a reason why I call it 'forever legion'
Man those games are nasty for my mental health
0
