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My Take on the Nurse complaints/suggestions.
While I understand the standpoint, I don't get why NOW we are talking about this? With a meta change around the corner and plenty of changes with that (ye even the off the record) would it not be wiser to focus on THAT rather than divert the developers attention to something else? It just seems to be scattering the focus all over the place instead of being consistent. She'll be changed like the others eventually but we have to keep the focus on the present changes on the way first. Again, this is MY point of view, I want to make that clear, I rather the developers do things correctly and take their time on the present than randomly "oh god oh god fix Nurse for us right now!" all of a sudden. No, I'm not a killer main nor am I survivor main, I play Billy and enjoy a good bit casual swf with my pals over the week.
Please keep it civil with responses as I won't reply to nasty ######### if its posted.
Comments
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Every single change that buffs killers buffs Nurse disproportionally.
Killers are getting a quite big buff this patch, while solo queue, an already struggling large portion of the player base will seemingly have to continue being dunked on by Nurse players who will have to put in even less effort they do now to "win".
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False, the pallet breaking, gen kicking, and weapon swiping buffs do not buff Nurse, so no, the devs have displayed that they can buff killers in several ways without buffing nurse.
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That's a very good point! I did watch Choi's video on this, I was very much informed by what the viewpoints on why people are being more vocal about it. Part of me want's her to be looked at (In a NON Billy way, Jesus they killed that poor dude.) and with how you described this, it seems the new changes are making her stronger somehow? I'm trying to wrap my head around that, she avoids pallets and such, maybe its the sprint burst hits being less powerful hence easier for her to blink to? Again, im just trying to link the two subjects together to see how it all fits from other peoples point of view.
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How does those changes not buff nurse?
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Sigh...longer gen times, decisive strike destroyed - might as well not even use it against Nurse now, less distance gained by a survivor after a hit which is a HUGE, HUGE nurse buff, more so than any other killer. This one change is in my opinion better than all the other changes for other killers.
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Due to the upcoming changes, Nurse now starts recharging her blinks 0.2s faster, survivors will make 1.2m less distance on her after getting hit, and she will have 50s extra worth of gen time to operate with.
That's not even considering things like Lethal Pursuer which will make her start the game off ready to start being aggressive immediately and make any other aura reading perk on her (like I'm All Ears or Floods of Rage) even more effective.
Meanwhile now everyone knows that her blink range add-ons not only increase her blink range (duh) but also her blink travel speed (which was confirmed as intended by the devs btw), which makes whatever little counterplay she had before nearly nonexistent as she is nearly unreactable to.
This is on top of the fact that, despite most of her add-ons being garbage, she still has a few other VERY strong ones, namely blink recharge speed, and 1 extra blink.
TL;DR: Nurse, the strongest killer by miles: ignores the normal mechanics survivors have to fight back against the killer; has some add-ons that make her even (some might say unfairly) stronger; is getting basekit buffs; and is getting buffs to some of her most effective perks.
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Yea but that 5 sec stun destroys non mobile killers I think making the base after animation should be 3 secs but not a base 3
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Nurse is such a strange case. I doubt my opinion is very educated since I haven't played much of her but, from my POV, she exists outside the usual mechanics of the game. She's largely unaffected by pallets and vaults and big maps aren't as much of an issue for her. So you have this killer that's hard to nerf without making her hellish to play and usually gets even stronger to any buffs given to base-design killers. Design-wise, she's a disaster.
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The Nurse is a killer. Killers are getting buffs next chapter that are improving the following things:
● Generator Kicking
● Pallet Breaking
● Attack Cooldowns
Since Killers are going to receive a change this patch that makes them more efficient at these things, they are going to be stronger, hence why it's called a buff.
And since the Nurse is a killer, these changes apply to her also.
So in short, she's getting a buff.
Do you need a more detailed explanation as to why the changes apply and buff her also or what?
Post edited by versacefeng on9 -
Nurse on release:
- 3 blinks by default
- Up to 7 blinks with addons
- Moved faster than survivors
- Had ######### auto-aim
Nurse was nerfed shortly after to
- 2 blinks by default
- Up to 5 blinks with addons
- Moves slower than survivors
- Had addon combinations that extended her blink distance without penalty at the same charge rate (2s) and increased distance for all blinks not just the 1st.
- Had addon combinations that allowed 4 blinks without penalty
- Had addon combinations that sped up the blink speed without penalty
- Had addon combinations that greatly reduced fatigue time. (The only cooldown between blinking)
- Was able to blink 2-5 times immediately after coming out of blink
And yet with all this bullshit, survivor were still able to escape Nurse and actually could put up fight.
Nurse nowadays
- 2 blinks default
- 3 blinks with addons
- Each blink requires 3s ( 4.5 with Iri addon ) recharge time. (Shift-W being extremely effective at wasting time)
- The extra distance addons requires a constant amount of extra charge time (3s max) and only affects the 1st blink.
- Fatigue addons mean nothing because of recharge time.
- Most of her addons became memes and bp generators.
Survivors with with all of this? Still cry like babies.
You know what, I'm tired of seeing it. Bring back OG Nurse and let the crying actually mean something because these fools will never be satisfied.
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because we always need to complain about something
Nurse is just one of the hot topics now
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But the DS nerf benefits Nurse way more than every other killer.
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Yes but we're talking about nuse.
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My mistake
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People do realize the only reason that ds had a 5 second stun was because enduring effected the stun. It was originally 3 seconds and was effected by enduring so the devs buffed ds to 5 second. They then made it so enduring didn't effect ds but then left ds the same.
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Except that's not what you said. You said, and I quote:
"Every single change that buffs killers buffs Nurse disproportionally."
You. Are. Wrong.
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Benefits tons of killers, Plague, Blight, PH, Trickster, Deathslinger, and Huntress to extreme degrees. The DS nerf can be considered ridiculous, but to argue that Nurse benefits disproportionately from every change is just disingenuous.
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Would you agree that the reverse is true
Any survivor nerf buffs Nurse a lot more compared to most?
DS 3s stun time, as an example.
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I already responded to someone who brought it up.
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You've proven that you don't know how to read in previous threads, that remains true in this thread.
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my bad
thread is very long i wasn't caught up
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All good. I just get flak for even responding on these threads so I gotta keep that post count low because, you know, whiners.
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- And yet with all this bullshit, survivor were still able to escape Nurse and actually could put up fight.
My man, if you had 5 blinks back then and survivors escaped that was entirely on you.
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Wow. Okay. I'll add "basically" to the start of what I said.
Now I assume you will continue to ignore the jist of the argument, what everyone is really talking about - that the strongest, most OP killer in the game, Nurse, benefits the most from these changes.
Why even mention word choice? It is such an irrelevancy when everyone else in the thread is talking about something different.
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Feel free to highlight the changes that benefit her disproportionately, now that you have agreed that not every buff to killers is even a buff to her.
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Already mentioned above.
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I already addressed Decisive Strike, the reduced haste after being hit equates to 0.8 meters - You're telling me that's disproportionately advantageous to Nurse? Edit: I'm going to go ahead and remove the rhetorical question here, the correct answer is that's disproportionately advantageous for killers that can actually use STBFL. Bonus points if they can use it in conjunction with their power, like Deathslinger.
Longer gen times? Very easy to argue that thana Legion and Plague builds benefit WAY more from that. And there's already a litany of threads complaining about those two killers with that perk.
Anything else?
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Nurse closes the distance after a DS the quickest. She doesn't even need 2 blinks. Watch Otz's DS video to see. You'll see that only in very special circumstances (a plague with her power up) will a select few killers be able to match a normal nurse.
Same concept for distance gained by survivors after being hit. Nurse is now able to completely close the distance after a single blink, making getting the down on the second blink trivial.
Longer gen times absolutely benefit the strongest killer (nurse) the most. That's not even something you can argue against...
It is absurd to what lengths you will go to defend an absolutely broken character.
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I addressed DS, again. In the Otzdarva video you are conveniently ignoring how he demonstrated MULTIPLE killers trashing the new DS. If you don't like DS, run OTR. BHVR wanted to gut DS, that's not a Nurse problem that's an every survivor problem versus every killer.
0.8 meters is not the difference between Nurse making the distance in one blink or not. Stop harping on this.
I literally just provided examples of killers that benefit more from the longer gen times, Nurse struggles to use kick perks to begin with, SH: PR has been nerfed, which is one of her most common regression perks. So has Ruin, which is another one she uses very well. Overcharge/Brine is another perk combo that again is going to benefit killers that kick gens. Edit: Oh yeah she's never going to run corrupt again either, as it's been retooled for setup killers.
It is absurd to what lengths you will stretch an argument to attack a single character.
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Those cool down, break pallet doesnt affected on Nurse, her attack cooldown on fatigue, not M1. She doesnt need to kick pallets or wall.
50 extra sec however.
But at least, the Meta Endurance will help alot vs her.
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Nurse is given two free chances with her blinks after a decisive Strike. Other killers don't get that.
It is the biggest killer buff this patch to the already strongest killer.
"nurse struggles to use kick perks"... Lol.
The best killer, a killer many people rightfully believe is too powerful and never would have been released today, is getting more powerful. That's undeniable...
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Your arguments are getting more and more vague.
We've discussed DS before, haven't we? If you're answer is going to be "Well she's OP because she has two blinks and I still really want to run DS even though it's been gutted against all killers." Well, then I have no clue what to tell you. You've set a very low bar for evaluating Nurse objectively. Read as: No bar at all.
Also, again, that Otz video you provided showed SEVERAL killers tooling on DS, just as ridiculously as Nurse. Nurse tooling on DS .2 seconds faster than other killers isn't exactly the end all, be all, when now half the roster absolutely tools on DS. Do you not understand this? Run Off The Record.
You believing Nurse is too powerful, and sharing that sentiment with others, is a personal problem. I'll be here if you feel like putting up any more examples.
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I'm trying to reserve any opinions for the endurance meta until I see it play out. I suspect a lot of teams will not be coordinated enough to make good use of endurance, against a lot of the killer roster :(
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I'd rather say "up to" 50 seconds IF gens are being worked on one after another.
The 3 gens for a hook scenario, while not as applicable to nurse as weaker killers, can still reduce that additional time to ~20s.
Im not trying to dismiss concerns here, but my scenario does happen often enough to become a meme here.
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Apologies for the late response, (had no idea this topic would invite so many people.) but I'm looking at these responses and I'm seeing the same points brought up over and over which begs the question, why not give her the rework that Freddy Kruger received? What I mean is, clearly there is more to Nurse than tweaking numbers and changing perks. The character herself I think is VERY interesting as many people do and requires a fair bit of training to master (Near Billy but not as much as him.)
The game has changed a LOT from 2016, the main mechanics are still the same but people have adapted to a new playstyle which was once hide and do gens (Urban evasion was king back in the day hehe) now it is essentially get in and out as fast as possible which requires a lot of micro management from both sides now, be it Hex totems, boons, gens, doors, pallets, vaults and of course hooking.
I think Nurse in general is brilliant, as her base self if there was a way to maintain that feeling with introducing new trade-offs, be it neither buff nor nerf then I feel we would be going in a great direction. It could be as simple as broadcasting to the survivor much simpler where she is going to blink to and (not as slow as pyramid head, but not as fast as Spirit) letting them have them extra few milliseconds to counter. I personally love playing against her and any killer with 4k hours, and my friends who are more casual BUT I understand the frustrations. I really do think she can be readjusted to be more suited for DBD2022 versus 2016. I'm against nerf or buffing her as I think it's her accessibility to both sides that needs to be looked at, not just numbers.
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Nurse has been a problem since her release she's never been balanced ever. They tried to nerf and rework her slightly but it hasn't done enough. At this point they need to completely change what her power is to ever bring her in line.
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This update was a meta shift, the most meta killer of 5 years was not changed during it simple as
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Thats just a wrong logic. A nurse still kicks gens with Pop or overcharge or whatever. A nurse still kicks some pallets as you cant play them properly due to LoS-Blocker around. And if the cooldown on attack doesnt effect her, you probably didnt test it out to know, right? Its laughable to say she doesnt profit from those changes too.
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People complain because they believe crying hard can remove nurse for some reason, maybe due to the fact they finally heard to killer complaints after all those years.
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They then shortly after said that they felt the 3 second stun wasn't punishing enough, and that's why they kept it at 5 seconds.
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Well, Killers cried enough to nerf Dead Hard didn't they?
The Nurse crying from survivors is about the same really. And rightfully so, I believe she should get a change. Escaping vs a somewhat competent Nurse is pretty much impossible in my games :(
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My take on nurse will always be the same: her basekit is perfectly fine. It's 'nurse mains' that make her unbearable to go against, because they all play in the same way: stack 3-4 slowdowns or starstruck/agi and consider themselves gods when they are basically playing easy mode.
She needs a couple of add-ons nerfed and her post blink attack turned into an M2. Sadly there's not much that can be done about stacked slowdowns, it is what it is
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Usually people bring up her actual power itself being broken, however I want to bring something else up
due to how strong she is, she actually locks certain perks from being buffed and certain perks from being made, it shouldn’t be a main worry to worry if a new perk could possibly make Nurse even stronger, if a perk is reworked how good will it be on particularly nurse, a character shouldn’t be so strong that they dictate if a perk should be changed or not, she literally removes free will out of creating things, thats why I want her to be reworked as she literally takes everything fun out of creating stuff
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wait until you guys find out about the Lethal Pursuer buff hihi
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Why are you guys talking about Nurse, when a huge game changing patch is on its way ? Gitgud before complaining.
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Hey people next time when you wanna talk about something, ask Jago first. Obviously he is boss (?) of forum.
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Thanks.
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I wasn't complimenting.
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Okok thanks anyway.
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Maybe it's not same from developer's perspective.
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