So Scott Jund also thinks that Hillbilly is hardest killer in game
I consider his statement way more valuable than just some random guy from dbd forum, what's you justification now, nurse defenders that think that nurse hard so she should be strong, what about hillbilly?
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What's your question?
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I wish people stopped listening to streamers and had their own opinion.
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This is just an opinion, no?
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The point of this thread to show all nurse defenders that says she is hardest killer in game and should be strong, that billy is harder
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His opinion matches with mine, wdym?
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So does a lot of other people on the forums, so why is his opinion more valuable?
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Just read threads where this question pop ups, too much people thinks that nurse is harder
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because he have audience and way more experience in game than most of the people on forums simply because he is playing way more then them
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Seriously… I’m so sick of people bringing up streamers as if they’re the ones with the best opinions.
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So what if he plays more than “most” players??? You do understand most of us don’t have time to play DBD for 8 hours a day. Our opinions are just as important as streamers.
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"I consider his statement way more valuable than just some random guy from dbd forum"
And that is a pretty bad thing to think. The only difference between content creators and other people is that they have a camera on their face
Even if they are very good at the game doesn't mean they know everything about it. They are just as human as the rest of us.
Scott also thought Overcome would be one of the best exhaustion perks and it's horrible
Otz who also is a very good player/content creator was completely wrong about how the slowdown of thrill worked
The mindset of "content creators know best" is very dangerous. You'd be surprised about how many things the community is just wrong about once you objectivilly look at things instead of just believing whatever someone says.
Scott's oppinion is 100% valid. It is not worth more then anyone elses. Not by a long shot
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Are you serious?
You questioned my opinion a couple of times and always asked me to stream my gameplay... because reasons. But when someone actually provides a stream its suddenly not a valid opinion?
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While hillbilly is surely harder than nurse, I still dislike scott a lot
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Not sure why it would matter what one player thinks. It's a subjective thing and you're really splitting hairs in that debate between Nurse, Billy, Blight, and Huntress. They're all relatively specialized in terms of their power function and it's ridiculous to downplay the difficulty of any of them. Anyone who says Nurse isn't difficult at a high level hasn't played against good players that really know how to counter her. They're about as rare as a good Nurse.
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Hillbilly is only harder if you are only going for chainsaws. M1 Billy is easy as pie.
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This is truth.
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This is also truth.
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Thing is thats not really hard to do, its just hard to learn. Once youve picked up that muscle memory Nurse becomes WAY more easy, theres just that initial barrier that makes her difficult since shes so different compared to the rest of the cast
Billy on the other hand, requires perfect precision to get use out of his power in the majority of loops as well as managing overheat. Learning what tiles can and cant be curved also takes way more time to learn considering just how many there are on all maps, and all their variations. You also get punished WAY harder for making mistakes.
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Good on Scott. I don't think jack-of-all-trades killer mains like me needed anyone to spell that out for them. As for your appeal to authority, maybe you should try to look at evidence collectively and then form your own opinion, instead of blindly relying on someone else's.
Regarding Nurse. She's got a higher skill floor than Billy. But Billy has a higher skill ceiling (not to be confused with effectiveness). I.e. there's a a lot more depth to managing his power that sets apart the various degrees of mastery. Nurse has her fair share of skill requirement, but she becomes more straightforward past the entry barrier. But she will always be the more effective one, no matter how skilled the Billy player is.
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Who cares. I stopped listening to Jund when he said that Spirit was unfair and needed to be nerfed because the survivor "didn't know what she was doing" while simultaneously talking about how fun and cool Iron Will is because the killer doesn't know what the survivor is doing
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https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-authority
Not saying he is wrong, but not saying he is right either.
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Content creator thinks thing you would've already known if you cared.
More at 11.
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Eh, Nurse just doesn't have to utilize her skill cap against 99% of players whereas Billy might. If a survivor really knows how to run a Nurse at a high level, you're going to be blinking blind a lot on your second blink, disguising your aim with flicks, etc. But most survivors run to a pallet out in the open and make it as easy as they possibly can.
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he's got a point, Hillbilly def needs a lot of buffs to compensate his difficulty.
Although then he'd stop being so difficult, so that's a vicious circle
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Remove overheat as it only serves to hurt very bad billys or good ones who use their power for its intended purpose? Its never been very welcome in this game since its inception.
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Also what.
I don't remember ever hearing him say anything about how fun and cool Iron Will was for removing stimulus.
In fact, I remember him saying, very often, that it was his most hated perk for doing exactly that.
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Also the funniest offense is when they say "you have to try to overheat your saw" but then make a purple that only works when your overheated. Actively forcing you to overheat for enduring and brutal strength basically.
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he never explains what about billy is harder than nurse? he is saying that on basic-level, billy is harder than nurse. On basic-level, billy moves at 115% and against most of the player-base, he doesn't need a power because most of casual player-base are bad at looping 115% m/s killers. the basic level of his ability is going from point A to point B and backrev chainsaws in dead zones. so in term of doing well as billy, the skill-floor is not very high. this is like 85% of billy's gameplay
Nurse's moves at 96% and is required to use her ability in a chase. her basic-level is just landing blinks in open field. this skill alone is harder than any other killer in the game. we'll just say this is base-level for nurse and you could say this is like 85% of nurse gameplay. its pretty obvious for what is harder.
what about last 15% for both killers, what is there supposed skill-ceiling? In order to make Nurse's blink harder for the killer, survivors utilize various techniques in order to make nurse's blinks harder. @brokensoul names few of them, double backing, using breaking Los, using levitation which prevent nurse from stopping her blink if she over-blinks and so on.
For billy, the highest skill-ceiling for him is curving. the simple explanation to curving is doing a 90 degree turn on first 1 second of start of his chainsaw sprint. this is all that curving is, nothing more, nothing less.
the reason why billy's skill-ceiling is not impressive is because if the survivor run/hug loops well enough, they can prevent curving and largely make it ineffective by turning corners before billy can finish charging his chainsaw sprint. The chainsaw slows his movement speed during rev and it has 2.5 second charge, which is very slow and predictable. Also curving tends to only work on loops that are straight and many loops in DBD are jagged with same safe pallet design that most m1 killers experience. you can turn billy into an m1 killer if your good enough as survivor.
Nurse on other hand can counter-play/outplay the survivors tricks by anticipating the survivor's movement. survivor's window looping skills and pallet looping skills do not affect nurse's ability to blink. By suppressing the survivor's looping skill and replacing it with nurse's blink skills, nurse's skill expression trumps the survivor's skill expression.
DBD unlike other games, DBD is not symmetrical game. in other games, like FPS games, both players can use same Assault rifle and the one that has better aim usually comes out on top. in DBD, killer have killer powers and survivors have pallets & windows. generally speaking, the pallets and windows are generally stronger than killer powers(e.g billy) and the survivor looping skill trumps the killer ability. so skill-ceiling in DBD is not just how mechanically complex the killer is, it is also how much control the killer has over the survivor gameplay and this unique to DBD.
This is also why many players consider blight to have 2nd highest skill-ceiling because he can utilize hug tech on tilesets and his blighted corruption can be used to dominate the survivor's gameplay loop when looking at his skill-ceiling.
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they could start with reverting overheat nerf or making it dissolve after successful chainsaw hit.
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If you watch the video Scott is saying Billy’s skill floor of doing M1 Billy isn’t that high but truly mastering Billy so you can precisely consistently get chainsaw hits when they’re possible is extremely difficult. So overall he’s saying that Nurse has the highest skill floor, as in she’s the toughest character to get the basics down and do ok with in an average setting because she’s so punishing of mistakes and plays so differently from every other killer. But once you’re past those basics and above that floor then her skill ceiling isn’t as high as Blight or Hillbilly.
And I agree with that assessment personally. I can do ok with M1 Billy but I couldn’t win really high levek competitive matches that way, I’d need to be able to consistently get chainsaw hits against survivors who know how to juke well and run loops tightly, and that is I think really, really hard to do. Whereas if I were a Nurse a lot of the obstacles that make hitting with Billy’s saw difficult aren’t factors.
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I mean this is already common knowledge, Billy is the hardest killer in the game, its just a fact. U need to know every collision to be able to get precise curves, u need to know the timing, where to position yourself, have the right sense that works for u, avoid overheating, know how to steer thru areas filled with obstacles to travel around the map, etc.
Nurse has an infinity skill cap, but that does not make her the hardest killer in the game
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Yeah, nurse takes a little time to get good with, but going from good to awesome nurse takes much less effort than going from a good to awesome Billy.
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I think most of the community was against BHVR nerfing Billy, Billy is still strong but just a shadow of his former self in my opinion, I'm a nurse main but I believe Billy is harder only because of what BHVR did there was no outcry for a Billy nerf it came out of left field after it was suggested insta saw get a rework
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Scott Jund? Never heard of her. I know it sounds crazy but try them and form your own opinion.
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Yes I will question your "opinion" when you say your solo q escape rate is 80%+.
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I think we're not allowed to have our own opinions unless we become big streamers ourselves :3
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Could you quote me on that? Cause i never claimed to have a 80% escape rate.
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You've said a lot of things implying that solo q is fine.
The reason I asked you to stream your solo q games is because I want to see you play so we can all be pros in solo q like you, not because streamer's opinions are more important than people who dont stream
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Yeh.
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Scott come crawling back from Elden Ring? So what if he is the hardest. Being really good with Hillbilly doesn't take you as far as it used to. Pick up Leatherface and turn off your brain and you can do just as much with half the effort.
Also, you Nurse haters need to do some reflection. It's getting pathetic and sad.
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The hero we don’t deserve
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This is not the call to action you think it is.
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Gonna say i dislike nurse respectfully but i agree the lengths people go to bash eachother over her is insane. My dislike of her is just moreso you learn this game to use pallets loop and vault windows to outlast the killer. Then why have one whos just like "so you know all you've learned? Out the window against me". She doesn't play dead by daylight. Obviously you are free to rebuttal my conclusion if you want. And the only other thing i could also say is the bottleneck for good perks when nurse is thrown into the equation. And if you wanna buff killers as a whole. She's a special case definitely.
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They just have to remove his overheat imo and maybe some addon tweaks.
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The pallet loop system was an argument before anti loop killers started releasing like hotcakes. Besides Nurse was the forth killer release. Not like pallet looping was much of a thing back then. Infinites were. Looping became popular once infinites started being removed. Then it was double pallet loop.
But I guess Nurse was the reason they removed those right?
The whole, she is holding back perks and other killers is unfounded and directly stated by the Devs not to be the case. The fact Starstruct exists should be enough to disprove this. Another being Ruin as it wasn't because of Nurse that Ruin got trashed.
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While yes I agree defending Nurse is very ridiculous, but can you not base your opinion off a big streamer?
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"So Scott Jund also thinks that Hillbilly is hardest killer in game"
Good for him.
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Nice catch! Back from DEZEMBER. You sure did some digging there. Extra points for the effort. This is also a comment from the very same thread you pointed out. My comment makes a little more sense with this added piece.
I´ll also link the thread, in case someone else doesn´t want to scroll 15 minutes through my comments.
@deKlaw_04 not so fast. That screenshot was taken out of context. As a direct response to a 90-95% nurse kill rate.
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Why is this forum Scott Jund Subscription feed?
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What's the problem with it being from December if the one you linked is from November? it's even older.
And I don't think it's out of context when your post history does show you believe solo q is more than fine
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