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Here's to hoping that Survivors will use more variety/fun builds now
To bring little positivity into the discussion about upcoming changes, in the Dead Hard/Iron Will/DS/BT meta pretty much everyone used the same perks, which is fine because those perks are the best, however with 3 out of those nuked and 5 sec BT being base kit, maybe people can relax and actually have fun and also win chases in a different way
Lithe/Dance With Me/Quick and Quiet, Sprint Burst/Fixated, Smash Hit/Parental Guidance (I love this combo so much), we might also see even more quick and quiet/head-on plays than before
I adore Balanced Landing, to me there is nothing more fun than BL on maps like Midwitch, Eyre, RPD where you can use this perk in so many good spots to just drop and escape
Also, people might realize that you actually can have long chases without DH if you just equip windows of opportunity (literally the best chase perk ever)
With COH, Adrenaline, and Unbreakable and healing meta in general being untouched as well I do think people who are good at survivor can still have fun even though I said in one of the other threads, and I am saying it now again, people who were not good and relied on DH/IW too much in chases will have to kinda learn to actually loop, I do think people who are causal survivors will have a harder time with all the killer Buffs esp in Solo where you lack coordination and people are just bad in general but I think the veterans might remember that this game can be fun even with stupid ######### like Blast Mine/Repressed or flip flop/power struggle
The only bad thing I am 100% convinced will happen on survivor end is more tunneling, but even a 3 second DS stun in the right place can still save you (if you were downed near a window or a pallet).
If after the upcoming patch devs become satisfied with the kill rates then maybe we will finally get some solo queue buffs and the game can be in a much better place
PS: stop asking for Nurse nerfs
Comments
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I think this fully depend on killers. If they continue to camp and tunnel even through the basekit counter (which realistically isn't enough) then i will still use the same perks that help against that.
Also can we expect killers to use different builds? This can't just he on survivors
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If anything I will use more meta perks for survivor now, not less, because camping and tunneling were not adequately addressed and camping was made better. 5 seconds endurance is a joke and they buffed camping by increasing gen times and not compensating for it.
Currently, I frequently run off-meta builds as survivor, but I’m not going to continue doing that if camping and tunneling gets worse than it is now. I never use DH and IW and I still won’t use them (IW just wasn’t my kind of perk and I hate DH too much as killer to justify running it) but I’ll still use BT as much as I did before if not more, and in builds where I ran DS I’ll replace it with OTR.
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I suspect the survivor meta will be something like Adrenaline/Sprint Burst/Prove/DS with very little healing going on.
The killer meta is still going to be forever builds, and 90 second gens are only going to exacerbate that. I'm kind of surprised 90 second gens made it through PTB.
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Both sides want fun matches, most people do not like to tunnel if they do not have to in order to get like 1k, with gens speed increased and some other qol changes I think people will end chases quicker than before and in time hopefully realise they can pressure more people which will improve gameplay for both sides. I am sure most people who play mostly survivor just want to have fun back and forth match and do not care about dying, and would rather die than hold m1 against a camping bubba and then exit to the gate
People will always tunnel and camp, it's the most effective way to win esp for people who are not good at chases and macro gameplay and majority of people are not good (same with survivors - most people are causals and do not know how to connect tiles), but all of that was happening with all these powerful perks and was effective and will be effective again.
At least people who are bad at killer cannot use the dead hard excuse anymore
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Still gonna use full meta because solo survivor will be most likely be unplayable next patch
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BT was meta before and it's way better now. I don't expect THAT much of a shake-up.
Maybe one person per team brings Saboteur, just to hard-counter any scourge hook build.
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I mean, I already do. I rarely use DH, if I even run an exhaustion at all it'll be Lithe or Head On. The only meta perk I currently run routinely is BT so I don't screw over another player when I unhook them, but now that won't be an issue with basekit endurance.
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I predict whatever a survivors favorite streamer runs will be the meta. Heaven forbid they try something on their own to determine its value.
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Oh I forgot about saboteur, I def think I will actually run sabo/breakout more now
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Both sides have fun winning. So no people are still gonna bring the strongest perks
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I’m using adrenaline coh bt and Blastmine rn. It’s a fun build and it’s pretty good also
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What I can say for certain is I think Adrenaline and Prove Thyself will be super meta. Add an exhaustion perk. Then finally a perk of choice, perhaps a neat chase/stealth perk like you mentioned, perhaps CoH, Windows, etc. Maybe more people will bring CoH now that Self Care is trash? Sure hope not.
Almost forgot, BT will be meta. 15 seconds + 7% speedboost the whole time is ridiculous. Basically a free escape lategame.
So Adrenanline/Prove/BT/Exhaustion will be meta. Sprinkle in CoH, Unbreakable, Windows, chase perks like Quick and Quiet, Dance with Me, Lucky Break.
I'm looking forward to it honestly. Especially no more second chances other than BT after gates are powered.
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DS will turn into OTR, that'll be the only change.
Survivor meta mostly consisted of perks that weren't strong, they were just the only option against three extremely powerful killer strategies that disable survivor play. None of the underlying issues have been addressed, so OTR, BT, UB, those'll still be extremely prevalent. Only Dead Hard is lined up to be swapped.
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Off the record plus three random perks is technically an improvement, I guess?
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Windows is way overpowered. It gives any potato the ability to run the killer for multiple gens by predropping and holding w
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If devs nerf camping and tunneling you would see a ton of perk combinations. But again this easy strategies to win will make survs use the same perks
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How can survivors relax with tunneling and camping being buffed?
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Every time I run a meme build killers take it like I'm insulting their mother and camp and tunnel me harder than usual lol.
this was me memeing around before hawkins went away.
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”you have a meme build? I’m gonna camp and tunnel you out because it’s easier”
”omg why are people bringing the same perks. I want more variety”
lmao
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Prove it still good, unbreakable was untouched, BT was made even better, DS will still be used because it combos well with new OTR. All this "shake up" did was make sure spine chill, iron will and dead hard will no longer be used as much. The perks they did buff were nice (except calm spirit and botany), but I doubt you'll still see people running sole survivor. I don't think anybody on the PTB ran sole survivor.
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Eh for people worried about the META I'd say don't bother you're probably not good enough at the game for META changes to matter anyway. Myself included.
I'm also hoping for more varied gameplay, the perk changes are a good start.
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Solo survivors run what they need to run to make up for their teammates. BHVR kinda made survivors a team role and kinda didn't, so I basically have to go into every match assuming I'm on my own and pack accordingly. Changing it up as solo survivor just equals a faster death.
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Killers: I hope survivors use different loadouts. It's appreciated.
Their loadout: Blight, Alchemist Ring, Compound 33, Ruin, Undying, Tinkerer, Bbq
People tend to use what works. Maybe if more perks and addons we're viable, people would use different loadouts
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No survivor nerfs will change a killers behavior on tunnelling or camping. It's quite an optimistic take that killers are going to change their strategies due to longer gen times and the meta being butchered.
And I say this as a guy that rarely used dead hard or DS. So it's not like I'm so sad about those being changed. I just don't suspect killers will all of a sudden take it easy on survivors.
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I mean ironically the perks that help solo the most are the ones people are never willing to use, Windows/Kindred/Empathy. They give you tremendous amounts of information you can use to make decisions as if you had the knowledge of an SWF. Instead they double down on crutch second chances and cry its necessary.
The only meta perks i've been using for ages are spine chill and dead hard, and only as a matter of preference. they've always been the first two i switch off for any challenges that require other perks or playstyles. BT was never necessary if you were able to lead the killer away from the hook in chases instead of trying to unhook right in front of their faces. and if they ignored you? you should be pumping out gens to punish their decision. Leading a killer away from a hook or potential 3gen is incredibly strong at resetting their pressure, but people dont want to bother learning things like that when they can get BT at basekit and get the perk itself buffed to boot.
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It's not that people don't want to lead the killer away. It's often that the killer just stays close to the hook. Even if you manage to leave them away a little bit, if they don't see an easy hit/down they immediately turn back to the hook.
But yeah, if a killer is actually cool enough not to proxy camp or tether themselves back to the hook than sure, BT isn't necessary.
I mean, obviously the devs disagree with your take or else they wouldn't make BT basekit.
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But I already don't play with the meta perks. Dead Hard is boring af. I would rather not use an endurance perk, if Dead Hard were my only option.
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Same, i hope the meta changes for both sides and multiple builds become viable. But i'm skeptical. My guess is we'll see OTR instead of BT & other exhaust perks over DH on the survivor side. For killer side gen regression is nearly dead so those builds will have COB or just gen blocking perks like dead man switch and grim embrace.
We'll see, i'm hopeful the game will be better with this update.
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That is a self fulfiling scenario. I lead killers away from hooks constantly, and im not even a great looper. I just understand map pressure and do what I can to help with it. Does it work every single time? of course not, some killers can and will camp regardless. But i also use that information to make myself theoretically invincible knowing they refuse to come after me when it would cost them their own pressure.
I guarantee I succeed at it more frequently than survivors unhooking in the killers face and basically encouraging them to camp and tunnel.
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Nope, if anything I'm just gonna play sweatier. Might even incorporate a god tier toolbox as part of my regular build.
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Been playing survivor more frequently last few months.
Breakout + mettle of man + flashlight + bt/ kindred has been my go to build.
It's fun when it works in my favor though I've never been one to just use meta builds. Gets boring after a while
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Generally speaking killers see no mither as a easy tunnel
this is why you loop them to hell and make them embarrassed
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I am expecting to see OTR on 4 survivors every game. Also, I predict that CoH and Prove Thyself will also be on every game.
The exhaustion perk will start to change though. While we will still see Dead Hard, It won't be nearly as common. I see Sprint Burst, Lithe and Overcome having a lot more usage.
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L O L.
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Not for long. Metas always emerge and we be back to the same builds again.
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It's gonna be gen rush meta
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I for one am less likely to use Q&Q because the loss of Iron Will makes it a lot more situational, sadly. I liked locker builds and now they won't work if I'm injured. But aside from swapping BT for OTR, my builds aren't going to change much.
We'll see a greater variety of exhaustion perks (mostly Lithe/SB/Overcome, though, the others are all unreliable in some way), and one or two perk slots have been freed up between Iron Will going kaput and DS/BT being replaced by OTR. But you'll only get actual build variety when survivors don't feel pressured to bring perks to avoid being camped/tunneled/slugged, and the basekit changes did essentially nothing to address this, so we're just going to get a somewhat altered meta in the old one's place.
Oh, 100% this. That's how it's always been, and it's a part of how BHVR failed to address why second chance perks are mandatory in the survivor loadout. If you don't have them, you're a softer target than everyone else who does, and the killer will take advantage of it when they need someone out of the game.
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Fun build? Nah, I think to play even sweatier due to this meta change, maybe with a good-sized toolbox + last to build as well
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Fun Build ≠ winnable build
Most fun builds will never let you win a game
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I may if killers camp and tunnel more after this patch. I'd rather be shamed for using a meta build than be tunneled for being the only person without one. At least with the former I get to play.
And no, I will NOT stop asking for Nurse nerfs >:(
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New players are gonna still use Self Care even in its nerfed state. Prepare yourselves, everyone.
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This isn't true. The vast majority of killers camp and tunnel because it's an extremely easy and effective strategy against non-sweaty SWFs. This strategy is being super buffed in this next patch, and you think that they're going to stop? lol. BHVR continually releases perks as bandaids to base design issues with the game. Tunneling and camping are huge issues. You can talk about how they're legitimate strategies all you want, but the fact of the matter is that it simply isn't fun for 4/5ths of the playerbase, and it actively discourages people from continuing to play the game. DS, BT, etc. were created to address this issue, making them staples in the survivor meta. The same thing can be said for perks like Corrupt Intervention, as it feels pretty bad to have a gen(s) pop before you can even find your first survivor. I would love to run other fun perks, but I'm stuck running builds that simply allow me to actually play the game a bit longer. If you want to see more varied builds, these base game design issues need to be addressed at the base game level, and a worthless 5 second BT isn't even remotely sufficient.
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The ''META'' exists for a reason, BT is popular and meta because most killers camp, DS is popular because a lot of killers tunnel, what decides if a perk will be used or not is mostly based on the killers behavior, there was a time when toolboxes were more used than med kits and flaslights, why? because killers could mori you on first hook and having a med kit or flaslight with you at that time would not save you from a mori so the popular and META strategy back then was to rush generators hoping you will make it before the killer could camp the first hooked survivor hoping for someone else to unhook to mori the unhooked survivor early in the game (sometimes a survivor would get killed before the first generator was powered leaving you with a scenario were 3 survivors had to power up 5 generators) one good looper was the diference between 3 survivors having to power up 5 gens (because 1 survivor was morie'd early in the game) or just having to power up 1 or 2 before the first survivor was killed leaving you at an extreme disadvantage
I don't see that killers behavior has changed...we still see killers tunneling and camping so I don't think the meta will change, the only thing that has changed now is that we are gonna use off the record to make sure we don't get tunneled (instead of decisive strike) so the only thing it changed was the name of the perk LOL.
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I'll be using the same perk set I always use because I don't use "meta" perks. They improved my favorite perk. It will be interesting to see a different set of complaints now.
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I've been having a blast with Blast Mine (heh), Quick and Quiet and Head-On. 4th perk right now is Iron Will before the nerf, but traditionally I would run Sprint Burst or Adrenaline. The 75% to grunts of pain nerf to Iron Will doesn't bother me, since going in a locker will still most likely have you completely silent for the most part.
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No, every time I do that even now the killers play sweaty AF. So there's no point really.
It's going to be playing with sweaty SWF's only.
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please tell me what times you play solo queue so that i can queue up with you and get you as a partner. because this is 100% NOT self-fulfilling scenario, this is reality at least half the time. even when i play killer, i can confirm that survivors play like this quite often:
a survivor will be hooked right outside kill shack, so a teammate will come in for the save before i've had a chance to leave. and instead of running away, he's looping at shack because it's a powerful loop. because im not a good killer and i suck at chase, im stuck running shack for a while. but since i'm still at shack, and i'm in chase which means i'm not actually camping, the hooked survivor's timer is running out. eventually, i see that. so i stand by the hook and wait 5 more seconds for them to hit 2nd stage. what do i lose here? even if the other 2 are doing gens, there are 2 right in front of me that are not. all because potato decided it was a good idea to run a loop right next to the hook, and then accuse me of camping despite giving me no reason to leave
it doesnt have to be kill shack. it can be a TL wall with a hook in the middle. it can be cowshed with a hook in the corner. i have lost count how many times a teammate has tried to stealth their way to unhook me, only to get caught last second, and because they dont have BT, instead of trading, they run a loop right next to me.
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Yeah survivors looping near the hook is one of my biggest peeves, they refuse to leave because they want the unhook points and they want to try to make some crazy play but they just end up forcing the killer to camp and end up hook trading anyway 99% of the time. Its stupid but its also why everyone thinks BT and DS are mandatory. All they need to do is play smarter. Sadly, you can't pick your teammates if your solo, nor opponents as killer, so you just gotta either adapt and go do gens or something as survivor, or take the free pressure as killer.
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OTR+Prove Thyself+CoH+Sprint Burst/Lithe is my new build.Maybe Unbreakable sometimes.
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Again this wont happen if soloq stays that way.Cause last 5 months I regret every game I removed my meta build on soloq.
Either cause I didnt have DH and noone took a hit for me at the exit gate.
Or because camping and tunneling.
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