Camping must never be removed and is part of the basic framework
yo,
Every day there are posts here where players complain about camping. Well....
even if it seems nerdy, camping is a mechanic that should never be revised or removed. That would simply be too much of an intrusion into the role of the killer game.
Yes, it can be frustrating. But there are many situations where you just don't have a choice, and it doesn't matter if it's a semi-camp or not. That's the way I look at it.
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Camping is necessary to regain pressure.
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Many killer powers already deactivate when near the hook. For example the Dredge cannot teleport to lockers near hooked survivors. Or do you mean that base mechanic cannot be changed, in which case, I hate to break it to you but BT was made basekit specifically to help with camping situations. And if BHVR finds other ways to reduce camping they can and will.
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It's a core issue, I don't think they will be able to fix unless they completely revamp the design of their game.
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thats not..... a core issue
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I think you have not understood. Camping is NOT a CORE problem. It is simply a part of the Game and many players forget that.
BT is good as it is. I'm simply talking about the basic mechanics.
exacly
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It is impossible to remove camping.
That doesn't mean that we couldn't (and shouldn't) make it less effective.
Ideally, no Killer should ever feel the need to camp anyone out (ignoring certain nieche scenarios such as an open exit gate right next to the hook ofc). Camping should not be the best strategy available - that means we need to both make it less effective while simultaneously making other strategies more effective.
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That is absolutely right and I agree with that.
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I agree. It would be really bad if BHVR would even try to remove it.
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The only problem i have with camping is Bubba, because he is the only killer in the game where it is almost objectively impossible to prevent someone from getting downed when going for the save
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it is frustrating i know but, what do you want to change? Do you want to take away his chainsaw while camping? ....That would just be too much of a good thing. You know what I mean?
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Camping is one of those things that if the devs were to ever seriously try to make it impossible to camp, survivors would just have an abuseable form of immunity. And that's far worse for the game than camping.
Unfornately this also means that facecamping which I think should be dealt with compared to zone defense around a hook is hard to adjust. Since any changes to make facecamping less viable hurts normal killer gameplay around a hook.
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Id just say make hook progress take longer when within 4m of a hooked survivor
Punishes camping more, but still allows you to do it if you really want/need to
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That would be an idea, but would it change anything?
that´s true
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Camping nurse is so op
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Yeah its so good we have plain out frustating game flaws. Dont let them be fixed to have some fun in a videogame. Yikes.
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Flashlight clicking and tbagging msut never be removed, its part of the basic framework.
Every day i see posts complaining about tbagging or flashlight clicking. Well ...
Even if it seems nerdy, tbagging and flashlight clicking is a mechanic that should never be revised or removed. That would simply be too much of an intrusion into the role of the survivor game.
Yes, it can be frustrating. But there are many situations where you just don't have a choice, and it doesn't matter if it's a semi-clicking or not. That's the way I look at it.
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I think what people forget is that non-participation is part of survivor play. i.e. being slugged, hanging on hook.
Killers can chose to leverage it by defending a hook and it gets a lot of hate because people feel like they can't contribute, but again non-participation is part of survivor play.
Of course BHVR are going to introduce mechanics that can help you avoid non participation as a survivor. However they are not indicative of camping being a problem they are just more tools in the survivor arsenal, no different from a pallet being used to extend a chase.
Does the addition of pallets mean that killers shouldn't chase survivors no... just as BT being base kit doesn't mean killers shouldn't camp and tunnel if it calls for it, its just a tool that helps defend against it.
I've never understood people queuing up to play a game where non-participation and elimination are the primary threats but then get all angry when they can't fully participate or get eliminated.
If you want a role that gets to have full license all game and not suffer from non-participation that role is killer... play killer.
That's what makes DBD so good and so true to theme, there is a genuine zero sum cost to getting caught by the killer. You can be taken out of the game temporarily or permanently.
Just like the slasher flicks the game is trying emulate, its visceral and terminal and its great... I hope it never changes or every game will just be a dull BP farm.
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One has nothing to do with the other, and instead of reacting superficially, you should try to write something constructive about it and not just twist my sentences. Thank you
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I don’t think there’s any good way to completely remove it, but it can (and should) absolutely be nerfed and made far less effective than it is now.
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It's not impossible to remove camping. BHVR already gathered a lot of experience in doing exactly that in Deathgarden.
The thing is that removing camping from DBD means a lot of things would have to be changed and re-balanced. And while a lot of people claim that they like to "shake the meta" and that they like to see new stuff evolve in DBD (including: removing camping), most people probably wouldn't put their money where their mouth is.
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Get rid of hook grabs and stop Bubba from being able to rev his chainsaw when he's near a hooked survivor for too long. There. Face camping is fixed.
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So there is someone on hook and I'm being chased by the killer and I run to the hook and just unhook in the middle of a chase because no hook grabs. Its not a great fix.
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Killer could still whack you twice, the new attack cooldowns would easily allow for that, but it would at least guarantee a hook trade instead of two free hooks. That benefits everyone, the killer gets another hook score event and one step closer to elimination another survivor, while the survivors as a team reset the hook timer, alleviating the immediate pressure.
The killer could then choose to either hook you, or leave you slugged and go after the unhooked survivor.
I think removing hook grabs could be a fair compromise. Similarly to old hatch standoffs, you often see unhook standoffs, they add nothing of value to the game.
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fair point, but I like trying to bait the hook grab/hit its fun.
Still results in a hook exchange most times but it's a higher stakes game of bluff, and I'm ok with that.
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There are easy fixes but sure. Imagine if there were no crows in the game and I said "hiding can never be fixed, survivors can just hide in same spot forever and is a part of the game".
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I mainly play killer, but when I play survivor with some friends who mainly play surv, they complain a lot about camping. They don't realize that usually first down it's 1-2 gens done in best scenarios. If you do a 3-4 gen chase the killer needs to pressure you to move out the gen and save your teammate.
I'ts boring to just stare at someone at the hook, but sometimes it's necessary.
Also if I see the classical flashy guy around me while I'm hooking a survivor and I can't find him, I'm not going too far and give that free unhook. That's stupid and somehow some people still think that's how it should be.
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Nobody is removing camping, it should just be made extremely inconvenient for the killer to do so
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We all know camping isn't the problem (and legitimate in situations).. people who play face camping bubba at 5gens is :/ and those who say, just do gens, easier said than done in solo-q where people want to try and help and the game just snowballs :( those bubba's probably move up mmr quickly, but then get stomped by better prepared teams/players, only to come back down and do it to less experienced players all over again. The endless cycle of bubba.
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It is very well possible to remove camping and tunneling though... just remove hooks!
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the new attack cooldown is not instantly gone, thats not good enough to hit them twice. Who wouldnt rather just grab survivors from hook?
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yea, Those are the people who just want dbd to be survivor sided.
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Camping needs to be less rewarding, and one such way we can achieve this is by making it so a healthy survivor can't be grabbed during a rescue. This encourages trades and makes the game more interactive for survivors who are being camped.
At the end of the day, camping is a valid strategy that isn't going anywhere. Rather than trying to remove it, changes should be made that encourage interaction rather than just sitting there waiting for survivors to be altruistic.
Changes that should be avoided are ones that would make it even more boring for the survivor being camped. Extending or pausing the hook timer is an example of this.
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Camping is the best.
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That sounds great actually. Get rid of the hooks and allow killers to insta mori a survivor at his first down.
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Problem is camping when it makes 100% sense to by people who rarely camp is ruined by people who just camp all of the time. The entire goal of this game is to put people on a hook, so there is no logical way you can do anything about camping where your goal is to kill someone.
Some people have very drastic suggestions for it that end up punishing your average killer, and that I just can't get behind. You can't even really discourage it because if someone wants to camp they're going to camp, even if it isn't a good idea to do so.
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Oh, god NO! I don't want more hook loopers!
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