6.1.0 represents an utter failure of community-moderation design philosophy
So the update is live and... it's really fun. Really refreshing not going up against the same perks every match. Killer especially feels amazing - the little bit of extra gen time and faster pallet breaking speed is nice enough, but just not having to wait 10 seconds for dead hard Every Single Hit feels sooooo good.
Killer feels so much better now that in games where before you'd have to camp or tunnel to have any chance at all - you just don't need to. Haven't felt the need to camp or tunnel a single time since the update.
But of course, the vast majority of killers are still staying 30 meters at most from hook whether you wait 10 seconds or 50, and going straight after whoever was just pulled off of it. They don't NEED to camp or tunnel any more - but they still do.
6.1.0 is a lesson that giving people a positive reason not to play this way does not have an effect. Yes, it's a game and they can "play how they want" yada yada, but being camped and tunneled isn't fun, and as the people who argue for doing those things are so fond of saying - it's a game. So, you know... it should be fun. For all 5 players.
So... I love the update. It made playing killer way more fun. It made playing survivor... a tiny bit more fun? Maybe, if I squint really hard? Just because I like variety? But next time, please be way bolder BHVR. Killers can't just be asked nicely not to camp and tunnel - they need a hard, in-game reason why doing so is a losing decision, because camping and tunneling makes the game feel awful to play. If you're worried that putting harsh measures in place to really stop these things being effective strategies, go wild and double down on the general killer QoL improvements in other areas! I'd rather lose twice as many survivor games as I do now but have fun interactions than win more but have either myself or a teammate just not really get to play because they just got pistoned on and off the hook like a fleshlight.
Disclaimer: In all cases I'm talking about people who camp and tunnel from the very start of the game. I have 0 problem with people doing that in the end-game.
If anyone wants to pidgeon-hole me as killer-main or survivor-main, I have 1500 hours in DBD and spent the first 1k of those as a killer main, before transitioning almost entirely to survivor because killer just stopped being fun against hyper efficient survivors who all ran dead hard every single game - even on 4k games, it wasn't enjoyable. I've been loving killer again since the update hit and currently I am playing / planning to play a 50/50 split.
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imo this update was way waaaay too hard on survivors.
i played 6 hours of survivor, not a single escape through the gates. I didnt escape, nor did my teammates (i spectated them just to see if someone made it)
not a single game did all 5 gens get done.
also not 1 single game where the first guy didnt get tunneled to death because base kit bt does not protect against tunneling, it protects against farming from your teammates.
not a single change in the patch notes has addressed the core 3 issues i had with the game since launch.
- survivors can suicide themselves on hook
- camping and tunneling ruining the fun for 1 survivor
- swf being 1 billion times stronger than soloQ
with 1.3k hours i d say i m fairly experienced at playing both roles so no, it is not being a noob that lead to nobody escaping.
I wish they would ve just deleted dead hard and only increase gen time to 90 seconds while NOT buffing regression perks at all (surge buff is kinda lit though so maybe let that stay)
gradual approach is always better than dropping a bombshell because now the game is imo very killer favored and an m1 simulator for survivors
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I think killers need more information basekit, like getting a loud noise notification upon hooking for the gen with the most progress, or getting a good speed boost after hooking that stops once you get into chase so you can more quickly go from chase to hook to chase and minimize downtime. Currently as is, if you don't have enough information, killers will tend to linger around since they're gambling a survivor most likely coming for the save versus potentially wasting a minute and 2 gens trying to find a new one that might be running a stealth build.
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Camping and tunneling complaints are simply caused by the game having player elimination midmatch, and player elimination generally leads to issues of people getting upset because they get booted from play while everybody else gets to continue. The only sure fire way to eliminate people complaining about being “tunneled or camped” would be make it so killers don’t kill survivors midmatch (e.g. they get ritual tokens every time they hook and for every 60 seconds a survivor is in the dying state and win if they collect 8-12 tokens). But that’s obviously never going to happen, it would have to have been in the design from the beginning.
Basically tunneling is essentially just downing someone twice in a row. And “proxy camping” is just zone defense. They could MAYBE make actual face camping more difficult by, say, moving the hook after you hook a survivor similar to how Pyramid Head’s cages work, but I suspect they actually thought about that already when they implemented the Cages and decided against doing anything similar with hooks.
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All I know is that this update isn't the be all, end all thing that quite a few people are making it out to be. It's literally been a day and people are saying the game is ruined though that's also not ignoring the positive feedback as well.
Behavior is seeking to more updates like this one, finally catching up with other pvp games that frequently update things to make the game feel fresh. Camping and tunneling WILL be better addressed in the future along with solo Q, among other issues. This is just the first step in the process because out of both sides, killers were under performing. Just gotta hold out and look forward to the future
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The problem with moving hooks compared to moving cages is that a killer has to pick up a survivor and put them on a hook of their choice. This leads to survivors having opportunities to deny the hook. With cages no such interaction is possible. For the effort and possibility of losing a hook, the killer has the ability to place a survivor in a high pressure zone (such as between 3 gens).
Not to mention the main issue that caused bhvr to implement cage moves was that PH could actually body block saves due to saving a caged survivor could only be done in one position. Where as saving a hooked survivor can't be blocked due to survivors being able to unhook in a semi-circle around the hook.
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Right, I’m sure either that or something else is why they didn’t try anything similar with hooks. I’m just saying I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they did experiment with it.
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They didn't buff regression perks. They nerfed them considerably except jolt.
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They don't NEED to camp or tunnel any more - but they still do.
6.1.0 is a lesson that giving people a positive reason not to play this way does not have an effect.
We didn't need 6.1.0 to tell us so.
Bhvr literally had a gigantic reminder of that. It's called Deathgarden. And they still went ahead and chose to ignore it.
Players will always default to the path of least resistance to victory, regardless of incentives to deviate. If you want them to deviate, you have to put resistance in that path, not make it more viable and hope that magically they decide to accomodate some imaginary empathic system of kindness.
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