I think this is a popular opinion as of now but
I think survivors would play a lot better if bond and kindred was basekit.
I think the biggest problem most survivors are is the lack of communication and information.
If these perks we're basekit and BHVR also added a way for soloq survivors to communicate with each other,there would be no difference betwen soloq and swf if survivors also played well enough,
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Please define what you mean with basekit kindred, because the aura reveal of the killer shouldn’t be basekit
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Counterargument: that SoloQ Ace I got matched with yesterday running both Kindred and Bond. Guess what he did? Always ran the killers to the others regardless what they were doing (on gens/on hook/on way to unhook).
i think the concept they talked about kn January (action icons) would be a great step in the right direction already..
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I run bond every game, it is a necessity for me. You can make better decisions running it. I recommend you remove your exhaustion and put bond as you will get better at the game. Not taking any shots, just a statement.
I don't think they should be base kit, but you should get some information when someone is on a hook.
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Why not?I think survivors should know if the killer is camping,and a survivor to let their teammates of that as well.
Post edited by Adaez on3 -
basekit killer reveal shouldn’t be a thing
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That isn't information all groups have. That's information that voice communication groups have. Bridging the gap between solo and SWF just means making it easier to find a stable group of people to be in your group.
BHVR also said the game isn't balanced around voice communication, and BHVR said that game never should be balanced around voice communication.
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Well swf will never be restricted from talking to each other so..
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Solo q shouldn't get buffs just because some people are using voice communications to gain extra advantages. Voice communication is a problem, not a solution.
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I main killer and I'd love for solos to have voice comms. They won't hear me coming because they'll be too busy loudly complaining about each other. 😂
Seriously, if there's one community that shouldn't have voice comms, it's this one.
I think a ping system strikes the right balance. I still see players abusing that to be annoying to their teammates, but people on the Internet will find ways to be annoying with any tool they are given.
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I doubt it, they would play slightly better but not a lot better.
Nothing can fix blendette crouching at the edge of maps.
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Kindred definitely, just seeing your team when someone is hooked is really basic, you can even remove killer's aura not sure why they think it's too much. Bond should stay a perk imo
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Only people would be punished by killer aura reveal are campers. Maybe don't camp and you wont show up on it.
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That’s not necessarily true. It also provides information which direction the killer is headed after a hook if they do decide to leave - especially when coupled with Open Handed. I’m also of the opinion the killer aura reveal is what should stay a part of Kindred. While also boosting teammate action speeds while hooked and the killer stays too close nearby.
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Open handed would have to be reworked, and I wouldnt mind if the aura reading was reduced, but 100& gone? no.
Also make so insidious is still shown on it.
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That's not entirely true. I like to run kindred with open handed sometimes where you can loop a killer at a tile reasonably far from the hook but just within range to see their aura at all times. It's a strong enough effect that it should take two perks, not just one. The survivor to survivor aura reading should be base though.
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Hopefully once the stuff on the current roadmap is mostly done the devs will finish the new HUD icons they announced were in early development in January. Those would give some of the information to solo survivors you’re talking about (who’s on a gen, in a chase, etc)
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No, they wont.
I had situations like another Survivor who had Kindred running to the Unhook, despite me being much closer to it.
Or: I am on the Hook. Survivor A (the Obsession) is being chased and just got injured. Survivor B and C are on a Gen together. And I still reach second stage. They got all the information needed and still...
Information will also not prevent the Claudette from Self-Caring in a Corner. Or the Feng going for Dull Totems. Or the Mikaela booning another Totem instead of doing the last Gen.
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I think it sure but only if the killer is really facecamping close like he could give the survivor a kiss on the hook that to close.
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Probably ... but here is the kicker: you can just run Bond and Kindred and instantly play better! No need to turn it basekit and handing out 2 free slots. Its like people who insist on carrying an extra weapon instead of some protective item and then ask for a base armor increase because they take too much damage. The solution in this situation is not to increase basearmor, but to just pick up a shield.
I preach it like gospel, but apparently no one wants to hear it: my most successful soloQ build is Bond+Kindred+Open Handed+BT. The constant info at extended range is awesome and allows you to make pretty informed decisions of all kinds, and the wallhack of Kindred+OpenHanded is just insane. Its nearly half the map and the killer just can't mindgame you; heck its so useful that you might be tempted to let someone hanging :D
But here is the kicker: I use this build even when playing SWF, because people will tell you that SWF basically get this perks for free, but this people are sleeping on the fact that there is a big difference in hearing "the killer is chasing me, I am running towards shack!" and actually seeing every movement of it through walls and everything. This is so huge and you can't communicate that much via Discord to come close to this flow of information. Of course, other builds will offer vastly different abilities and more "fun" or "flashy" stuff, but I ask you to just try this simple build out for a couple of games and see for yourself that seeing is much more then hearing. And this aren't some obscure builds, every new player who invests like 50k BP into Dwight can combo Bond+Kindred.
The problem is just the stubborn resistance of people to actually play this combo. The promised action icons for everyone will be a step in the right direction, helping soloQ to play much more efficient and not waste all this time "guessing" if they should run to an unhooking, only to find out that two others had the same idea. But handing out powerful perks for free isn't the solution.
On a tangential note: WHY has this game no communication wheel and emotes? It is literally the only multiplayer game, one that heaviliy depends on team work btw, that doesn't even allow communication in its most basic form. And cute emotes would also sell like sliced bread in the shop, so everyone would be happy. THIS is something that is literally unexcusable. Give us a damn communications wheel with just the 5 basics like "follow me", "do gens", "thanks", "hide" and lets everayone do a cute dance or something. Yikes ...
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They totally should try to bridge the gap between Solos and SWF.
But it just wont happen. The advantage of SWF is not communication, it is filtering out Potatoes.
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they never going to do anything about swf talking with each other but Solo should be EZ match for killer either.
all this update did was push more to swf anyways
so bond and kindred being basekit not going to matter soon
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meh people play builds like yours with 3 info perks but then get tunneled hard some matches and they go back to OTR, DS , exhaustion perks etc.. basekit kindred is not that much we need all 4 perk slots in solo Q not 2, that's why DS nerf is stupid too players don't run DS for fun it's a necessity
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I made a mockup of what a potential "Action Icon" SoloQ system would look like the other day when I was struck with a revelation. The main issue with SoloQ is that survivors cannot quickly and efficiently coordinate unhooks like people in a voice chat can. Making sure folks stay on generators as well is important, however the action of "I'm going for the unhook guys!" is going to be the hardest to convey I feel.
To show that you're on a generator, the icon could be the objective score category icon, or the generator icon, heck, make it the Lightbringer icon! For heals you can do the Altruism score icon, or the Altruism Emblem Icon. For chases they could add a red stain to the actual HUD. So if Leon is chased in this example, and he wasn't the obsession, we would observe a red glow highlighting his portrait to show that the killer favorite's him, and the color of the glow could be customizable for color-blind support. For totems we would need 3 icons, one for cleansing, one for blessing, and then one to showcase if the totem is a lit totem or a dull one. My main concern is that doing an unhook is not an instant action, you have to run to the hook to perform the save. So if I see 2 survivors on generators via icons and then I start to run to the hook, it's easy, I'm going for the save so since I am not doing any other action, I have no other action icon. However, this doesn't always work. If 1 person is doing a repair and 1 person is just idle walking around "immersed" I could see the other idle person lacking an icon, assume they're going for the save while someone else is chased, then repair a gen, only to have the hooked survivor progress a stage. Until a good solution to the unhook issue is solved, I will have my doubts about the update for SoloQ.
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There is a huge difference between camping and being near the hook because a survivor is forcing you to or you're just traveling the map. Have you ever seen how much of "the game", is covered if a survivor is hooked in the middle with kindred and open handed? Everyone basically has old OOO
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This! Kindred + Open Handed on such a cramped map is basically free wallhacks for everyone. Its sick!
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I've already said it before if we make Kindred basekit all others aura reading perks such as Aftercare Empathy Bond are going to be useless and obsolete which is not the way we should go if we want to have variety in survivor builds.
Give us the possibility to see our teammates's perks before the match starts this will help improve SoloQ I am literally going against group of survivors with 3 Prove Thyself each they're wasting a perk slot for nothing.
This will also allow coordinated plays(if you have good teammates of course)and having more variety in perks.
Imagine you're playing Zarina and you have For the People you remember that in the lobby while seeing your teammates's perks Cheryl has Soul Guard and shes getting slugged on the ground by the Killer at 1 gen left hes waiting out 60 seconds for her DS,you go in sneaky and use FTR on her she has Soul guard so she get hit and get a speed boost she makes it to a safe pallets while you open the exit and then come to bodyblock for her.
Another scenario where there's like 2 generators left Leon is getting camped but he got Camaraderie/Kinship which will buy you precious time to do the last 2 generators while the killer is camping,by having this information in the lobby you know that you should let Leon stay on hook beceause of Kinship and just do gens with your others teammates.
You don't even need to remember ALL your teammates's perks just remember the game changing ones such as Unbreakable Deliverance Camaraderie/Kinship.
If you give the ability to survivors to see their teammates perks trust me this will be a huge improvement to SoloQ now of course we also needs the MMR and matchmaking issues to get fixed for better quality of games.
I really want this to go live in the game being able to see your teammates's perks before the game starts will be a good addition.
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Why not though? that´s what they get with SWF and Discord. Among other things.
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Yeah, I agree going for the unhook is hard to tell/realize in soloq.
though at least you would know who is in chase and can’t go and who is on gens etc, so even if not a perfect solution, this would already help so much!
could also make a prompt for this that can be activated like gestures (on controllers I think you can use the left/right dpad for this as they aren’t used for anything else currently)
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If you want to bridge the gap between solo and voice comm SWFs, then say so. But don't say you want to bridge the gap between solo and SWF, and then recommend things that only voice comm SWFs have.
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Indeed. Apparently tunneling and camping is THE problem of the day and it needs to be adressed somehow. But I don't think that any more perks as basekit are the solution, more something like the carrot and the stick method, ie make it more worth the killers while to leave the hook and chase someone then to stay and camp.
At one point in the past BHVR experimented with slowing down hook progression when the killer was too close to the hooked person, but appartently this would be abused by the survivors.
But that was in the past under the old systems, now with the killers being buffed all around this system could work? Maybe this slowdown could be paused when a survivor was actually chased around the hook, and on the same vein, give the killer some incentive to leave it. Like show the killer the most distant survivor for 3s and give them a 10s speed boost when out of chase to get over there. We all want fun games and fun chases, so everyone needs to get something out of playing this way and the stick isn't always the best method, the carrot is much more fun.
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Kindred should be basekit for sure. It wouldn't help as much as people think, but it's better than nothing. If you've ever run kindred you've seen the dumb stuff people do even with that information, but there are some decent players who could make use of it.
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The one reason I ever left hook when playing killers who cannot properly face camp was BBQ. And they gutted it to make the grind worse for new players, or something. No idea what the goal was, there. Either way, I never use it anymore and therefore I now camp even when playing "chill" games where I am only after a quick challenge and let the survivors go to speed up the process a bit.
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I feel you, oh kindred soul, I feel you. The update was pretty well received by me, but without knowing it, it ripped a giant BBQ shaped whole into my heart, through which my soul is constantly leaking ... and I am not being dramatic here, this is exactly whats happening.
When I now had a fun match and hooked everyone got some 29k points ... my payoff is 29k BP! This just feels wrong and lets The Entity consume my hope, my soul, my will-to-kill at an alarming rate. I fear for the worst.
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not understand what you just said wow
how would you i mean info the only thing solo need
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Because they are completely different goals. Bridging the gap between solo and SWF would be things like adding guilds, or some official game communities to find players to group up with. Or to allow people to flag themselves as wanting to find stable group members. Or some official way to message people (even if they are cross platform) so people can ask other people if they want to play more than one game. Or maybe some sort of honor system, so people that DC or give up often, get grouped up with other people that DC or give up often. Or it could mean having a button for survivors to group up with the same people during the next game, and all the survivors that hit this button will be auto grouped together for the next game.
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Part of the difficulty in the game is not knowing where the other survivors are and where the killer is, and to that end this is a horrible idea.
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It doesn't just tell you the killer is camping. It also tells you the direction the killer is headed. That's extremely valuable information. Kindred never leaves my build for that alone. Add in the other info it gives you and it would be nutty as basekit.
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If they added voice chat I'd quit that day. I'm not dealing with a bunch of prepubescent squeakers.
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True enough. Information does nothing if people aren't smart enough to use it.
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Basekit Kindred would not make Bond obsolete.
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Icons showing what other are doing is enough, it will not affect aura perks at all. It doesnt have to be aura reading basekit.
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I agree that Kindreds teammate reveal should be basekit, but the Killer reveal should not.
Having a reverse BBQ effect on the Killer is a huge deal, one that should be bought with a Perk slot.
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so in other just kill solo ( tho it already dead or at least dying) then there should be voice chat in game but whatever dude
Bridging the gap between solo and SWF would be things like adding guilds, or some official game communities to find playersto group up withbtw they already have something like that call deadbydaylight discord page where you can find player no matter the platform to play with.
when people talk about Bridging the gap between solo and SWF they talking about something in game to help solo who don't want to chat with others like bond or Kindred.
but your idea already happening not helping solo.
so I'm done with you because your not going to understand.
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because they don't want to really lessen the grind for some reson I never understand
I don't think dev understand either
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thing is tho SWF already doing it with out perks so with swf they can't nerf killers to much but with solo they can't buff them to much either see how it is game a mess.
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i'm ok with this
it help a little.
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When people talk about bridging the gap between solo and SWF, they don't want to have the responsibilities and expectations of being in a SWF, but they still want the extra information that voice communication SWFs get.
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well duh
why aura reading perks wont be basekit but are best bet be Icons showing what other are doing.
solo need something.
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Maybe instead of giving a real-time Aura update, just have something light up when the killer is within a certain radius of the hook. That way, we can tell when it's safe to go for an unhook vs. stay on gens because they're camping
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Only seeing survivors could be basekit.
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