It's up to the devs to fix camping and tunneling

MrPenguin

https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/3100007#Comment_3100007

I also play both sides js. Not that that matters at all but it makes people feel better I guess. I also agree that camping is a problem, its just finding a solution that's difficult and complicated. Also for the record, I don't camp or tunnel myself as I don't enjoy those playstyles.

Not coming for you, but nothing you brought up is new, these are the same "solutions" we see brought up, with the same problems that never get solved. The patch didn't change anything in that regard, all the problems are still there.

The chase buffs don't change the survivors forcing the killer into a situation where they have to defend, but if they do they get punished.

The base gen time changes only added ~ 20 seconds. 3 survs on the first 3 gens, +10, 2 on the last 2, +10, end result 20. Its actually less if survivors stack at all on the last 2.

There wasn't some massive buff to camping this patch. Not to say camping isn't an issue, but people are overreacting and treating the patch like it was doomsday and made everything horrible and killers OP. Camping still falls apart if the survivors stick their nose to gens like they should. Especially with the NoED nerf, since NoED was also a big factor in camping scenarios for getting an extra kill.

However, survivors play into camping way too much. That's a huge reason why its still happening. Because survivors feed into it. Thats not new, that has been true for a long time.

For the "survivor in range" point/addition, the question that never has a solution is "what range?". The only way for that type of system to potentially work is to make the survivor radius significantly larger than the killer radius. A killer can easily camp from ~ TR range, so that's already 32 meters, how big do we make the survivor range? Because anything significantly bigger tends to cut of an entire section of the map, making the whole system ineffective if anyone is on a gen or anything else on that entire side of the map. So then if you want to actually have the system stop the hook timer, the survivors need to 3 gen themselves. No matter what we choose its either too small, and the killer can still camp, or too big and entire sections of the map get closed off for the survivors.

Upping hook time will give survivors more time on gens before they have to worry about the unhook. We already discussed that being an issue and hurting those that don't camp as well. You can try to only compensate for the added gen time, but dividing the ~20 seconds added by the base gen change by 12 hook states, you're only adding ~ 2 seconds per hook state. Not really going to help.

Moving the survivor to the furthest hook also presents the problem that PH has where survivors get the save really really quickly if they're spread out, which good survivors will be, because someone will be nearby. Obviously the killer can't contest from across the map, so they just get a free save. Additionally the survivor can also just run away from their teammates to force their spawn near them when they do go down.

"There should also be something for tunneling but I don't know how to make that fair and fun for everyone."

Exactly, that's the problem for camping and tunneling. No one can come up with a good solution without something drastic like overhauling the entire hook system, which the devs would never go for. It is unfun I agree, but having a realistic solution seems neigh impossible without screwing over killers, being abusable, or having some caveat that makes the system ineffective.

You could effectively ban the killer form the hook like a lot of these changes purpose, but then you'd have to significantly increase gen times to be 12 hooks with instant saves viable. But survivors don't want that either because gens are also unfun.

Again, just to be clear, I want camping changed/gone, but we'd need an entire rework of the hook/kill system to fix it imo, which I'd be all for, I even have a potential idea. But that's not happening.

As long as the killer objective is tied to killing specific people one by one, they need to be able to protect their kills/hooks unless you want gens to take ages to compensate. Without changing that, these type of solutions fundamentally can't work.

There just aren't any good solutions at this time. The very foundation of the gameplay makes it pretty much impossible without massive drawbacks on either, if not both, sides to the point it does more harm than good. Asking for that foundation to change is very likely not happening. Thus the dilemma.

I really wish the situation were different. We can toss all the hook system reworks we want, but at the end it doesn't matter if its too much change that it wont even be considered. Working with the system we currently have however, seems to cause a problem no matter what we do.