General Discussions
General Discussions
Wait is DMS+PR back?
Does the interaction work again? I missed the stream but saw a mention.
Comments
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Yes but only 30s
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Only 30 seconds???
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Yes but it doesn’t really matter, if you can get quick down you can proc it again anyways.
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It’s back, but Dead Man’s Switch is being nerfed to 30 seconds.
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It will be after next hotfix, yes.
But it will be nerfed. Since PR does not give you a notification anymore, the killer does not know which gen got affected, when the survivors play it smart (aka letting go of gen before the hooking). So apart from artist, that can just send crows, the killer has to guess if / where a gen may be worked on right now (artist can faciliate DMS alone with her crows as well, so thats not an issue with the combo, imo). And DMS will only hold for 30s.
Personally I think thats fair. I really liked the counterplay from the survivor side, and I'm glad thats back. The combo will be less oppressive now, which is also good.
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It means it can get pain ressed and then pop goes the weasled though, lol.
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Thats amazing. I love that combo <3
30 seems fair. Did they say anything about its cd?
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Old CD was the whole duration. We can assume it’s going to be the new duration (30s).
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It was a pretty big surprise for all of us, but here we go.
BTW, try DMS on Oni for a fun romp. Just get your power and zoom around the map and see those gens get engulfed by The Entity. Its magical.
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Pretty good, that means getting fast downs will be pretty punishing for survivors since you can chain them easier
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Im thinking PR/DMS/Starstruck/floods nurse
Nah too boring PR/DMS/Lethal/floods on nurse
Easy and strong automatic gen defense coupled with pretty strong aura reading and very fast starts.
I usually go for 12 hooks and usually get at least 6-8 even when i lose. So coupling that with 43 seconds of gen defense per hook seems .... nice <3
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While the Artist used PR+DMS well, I believe Doctor uses it best
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Lets leave PR out of that, since it's not interacting with the killers powers here, thats DMS alone.
For me, it's not so clear to decide who utilizes it better:
Doc:
- + Blast hits multiple gens
- - but "only" in TR
- + Blast always interrupts
- - Blast has a lengthy cooldown
Artist:
- / Crows hit all generators in a line (normaly no more then two)
- + Crows have unlimited range
- - Crows struggle with elevated gens / uneven terrain
- - Crows do not interrupt, so a nearly finished gen can still be finished
- + Crows can injure if a survivor risks to power through a gen instead of dissolving crows, activating DMS after the hit
- + Crows have a very short cooldown
I would say it depends on the map / layout. If you have a compact map or nice 3-gen scenario, doctors blast is prob. stronger. But on a large, even map with spread out gens, artist can proc DMS from great distance, where Doc might not be able to blast multiple gens at all.
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Yes, only 30 seconds.
It's short.
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Oh yeah, SIMPLY get a quick down.
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With Blight / Nurse it’s not that hard. For the rest, they are trash killers are ignored by the devs anyways.
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If killers are hooking people THAT fast, it doesn't even matter what perk they use.
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It really isn’t.
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It's back. It's a great combo that is also counterable, making this quite welcome in my eyes.
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I think pain res,DMS,Surveilance,Jolt can be a fun combo on M1s. Also jolt hits blocked gens with the 8% but only starts regressing after DMS is over and the gen even when blocked turns white so i know it got hit through DMS.
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Pretty sure if it was blocked in the first place Jolt doesnt do anything.
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Which begs the question, why do people keep wanting to balance around Nurse and Blight? "X perk is too strong!" Why? "Because it's oppressive on Nurse!" We saw this with Spirit and Freddy as well. With Pinhead, you literally had people wanting to nerf Hoarder. Why can't we just be fine with certain perks having synergy with certain killers?
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It was, originally, not supposed to apply the 7% regression (or whatever it is) if the gens were blocked, but it would apply the "regressing" status to the gen so that as soon as it came unblocked, it would start regressing automatically like with Ruin. I've seen no reason why it shouldn't still work like that.
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It actually is, no matter how you believe it's not.
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Devs made DMS literally useless without PR on most of killers. And even with PR, DMS is easy to counter and only for 30 seconds. Maybe can work against solos but pretty mediocre combo against survivors who have a brain.
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Because it don’t be certain perks with certain killers. As killer you will use always some perks in some killers
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It's back, but only against bad Survivors, like always
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My Artist is happy haha, seeing how DMS is now the same effective cooldown as eruption, i may as well bring them both to combo with Pain res / Agitation / DMS / Eruption for added survivor annoyance :D
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Oh okay thank you for correcting me on that part!
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The thing I can't understand is that they didn't want survivors screaming alerting the killer to which generator blew up, but if it gets protected because of dead man's switch, then they're going to know exactly which generator blew up! So why take away the scream?
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Nop, if they let go and get back to gen you still dont know which gen popped. It always had counter play, its now just less punishing if survivors arent good enough to let go off gens but at least its back <3
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True, but to be fair most matches (at least for me) never played out that way. Having survivors consistently hopping off generators so that DMS didn't proc was few and far between. Again not saying that was everyone's experience, but it was definitely mine.
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Sure, same.
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95% of killers play on these trash killers so you think is good idea to ignore them. Game should be balanced around to that not for that 5% and still probably half those nurses and blight are probably bad who can't get fast downs so in fact balancing around 2% of killer players is not good idea.
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Maybe if it only activates on a single gen per game, it's short, sure.
You only need to block four gens for two minutes of total gen blocking per match, which is equal to old Corrupt - that was meta for a reason. You could, pair it with Deadlock and end up forcing gens to be blocked for at least 4 minutes of every match just by getting four hooks and forcing four people off gens.
DMS, Pain Res, Deadlock and Pop could very well be an absolute pain to deal with.
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Doctor, Freddy, Artist are the three main killers this Combo works pretty well (Blast, Fake-Teleport/Teleport, Crows)
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Not always. You can always mix it up depending on how you personally play. Some people always run STBFL on Pig and Trapper. I don't, because I prefer Sloppy. Maybe BBQ + Floods Of Rage is information overkill, so you want to switch one out for another slowdown perk. Meta perks are generally different from killer to killer.
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the screaming was the most healthy part about the perk, tbh. Incentivizing the killer the leave the hook is good for the game's health.
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the reason corrupt was meta was because it weakened survivors from their strongest time in the game (early match) with preemptive damage control. They're completely different usage applications. It is more comparible to deadlock, but its the active version rather than the passive one that BHVR hates so much. Its also always important to remember that blocking a gen doesn't regress it, and even prevents the killer from doing so while its blocked, so it is nowhere near as bad. If you're afraid the killer is going to wait for the block to expire or camp out the area and then kick it, thats a good 30 seconds you could have been working on another gen to still come out as a net positive anyway. And thats not even talking about how abysmally gen blocking and gen regressing tend to synergize, with stuff like pop being both worse and still running into issues because of it.
Just... don't try to make sense of anything they do. It's the most frustrating thing in the game by a longshot.
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i never used dms because i just switched to pc in like may and with huntress and good hook placement i have downed repeatedly. you go for a save and youre guaranteed down if you are close to me and if i get you in a bad spot. like pain res on killers who can get fast downs is down right dirty and should have a cooldown
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You make fair points, but for your two negatives for doctor, I have counter arguments
1) "But only in his Terror Radius". True, but doctor has the potential for the undisputed biggest terror radius in the game with add ons and perks. And if your not using those add ons and/or perks while also using DMS, then he shouldn't be using DMS
2) "Blast has a lengthy cool down" True but so does DMS. and while the two cooldowns aren't equal enough that its more then possible to get multiple DMS activations on the same gen.
I understand your opinion that DMS is better on Artist. I just disagree
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Man, this is just another thing I Do Not Get about the perk updates. To me, killing DMS/PR was the only good thing about the Pain Resonance nerf, since that was an annoyingly strong strat that was noticeably more powerful against solos than comms and had some fairly busted applications on Artist - meanwhile I was annoyed the perk lost its information aspect. They just gave that back... but only if you're running PR's most problematic combo, which is also back in the meta. And now DMS is weaker on its own and I doubt it's worth running with anything but Pain Res, so... so much for variety or letting less-dominant combos flourish.
Buff Pain Res, nerf Mettle of Man, I guess.
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1.) Fair enough. Still even with both addons and Distressing, you still cannot cover all of the biggest maps like red forrest. But you should easily be covering 4-5 gens, thats for sure.
2.) DMS is now down to 30s, I'm not sure but I think Blast is more like a minute. If you hold on to it until you hook someone, you can proc DMS instantly, sure, but I'm usually not that patient, but will blast whenever I'm relatively sure to hit more than one person. So there's a good chance (at least for me), that my blast is not ready after a hook ^^.
I have played neither Artist nor Doc with DMS recently, I guess I'll have to check it out again (not sure if I EVER played Doc with it, now I think of it). Let's just conclude, that both can utilize it pretty well. And who's better at it than the other is really not that important :).
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Agreed. Good chat. Nice and polite, as all good discussions should be :-)
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what did Hoarder do for Pinhead?
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the box counts as an item for hoarder.
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Yes.
Side-note do they synergise with Deadlock? 🤔
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ah ok.
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Basically allowed him to find the box whenever a survivor did, usually down them before they could finish it, and then activate Chain Hunt.
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It let him see where the box was picked up, since it counted as an item. That gave him a greater chance to interrupt the box solving and keep the chain hunt going. But what people don't understand is that Hoarder was only like 1/3 of the build. You could either do the version with Franklin's Demise and Larry's Remains but no Engineer's Fang, the version with Engineer's Fang and Larry's Remains where you cut out Franklin's.
Having Franklin's with Engineer's Fang was redundant, because if you had Engineer's Fang, they'd always be injured when you finally hit them and downed them. Downing them normally, without Franklin's, automatically let Pinhead pick up the box and start a new chain hunt. If you downed someone with Franklin's, they dropped the box and you had to manually pick up the box and use it. That's wasted time. The only time you'd run the Franklin's/no Engineer's Fang version was if you didn't want to have to down people to keep the chain hunt going, and maybe that would help spread the damage. Sometimes that was more beneficial, because survivors can run Pinhead a long time, even while being affected by chains while carrying the box. Remember, you HAD to get that box from that survivor somehow, because them simply holding the box disabled everyone else's chain hunt, which meant you had zero slowdown.
And then for Larry's Remains, it just gave you a more generous window to interrupt the box solver with your possessed chain, because it extended the time it took to solve the box.
It's all of those things working together that stopped the box MAYBE. If someone got in a lucky spot where you couldn't hit them with your possessed chain, or you simply missed your possessed chain, game over. Everything hinges on keeping the chain hunt going, so once you lost that you pretty much lost the whole game. It was a build that pushed Pinhead to a top 3 or top 4 killer, almost making him viable like Nurse or Blight. But what happened was, at the same time the BS Wraith and Deathslinger nerfs happened, Pinhead got a BS nerf. Any add-ons that sped up the chain hunt recharge, any add-ons that increased the time to solve the box, as well as Engineer's Fang, all got nerfed. That absolutely destroyed the chain hunt build and Pinhead in general. It's sad, because that was one of the most fun, unique, and skill intensive killer builds we've ever seen.
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