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Are You Happy with New Dead Hard?
It's been a long time since patch. And we had good time to use it or play against it.
So what are you thinking now? How Dead Hard is feels now? I am asking for both roles btw. Is it still good to use in trials as survivor? How it feels to play against DH users as killer?
Comments
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I used to feel cheated out of chases so much. Now when people use an exhaustion perk against me (including dead hard) it feels fair.
On survivor, although I don't use dead hard now, I feel liberated. I don't feel I have to use an exhaustion perk at all. Before, Dead Hard was cemented into one of my perk slots for every survivor, because if you didn't use it, you are putting yourself at a huge disadvantage.
A great change, and I don't care what people say, I LOVE the animation!
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It requires a bit more skill to use but is also stronger than before.
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But now killer actually has counter for it. Old version was so busted.
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I'm definitely happy with it.
I never used it before and I'm not about to start now, but from the killer side I can definitely see that it's still a decent perk that can still give pretty decent value, while requiring a lot more skill and timing to use. I'm never mad if I swing into a Dead Hard now, because I know some skill went into it and I know it can't be used purely for distance.
It's far healthier now, I definitely approve. There may be room for buffing it slightly later in the future, but for now it's in a good spot.
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The perk is STILL very useful but less frustrating for the killers. The new DH finally requires skill and even gives you a speed boost if timed right. At first I thought it was trash. The first few days after the patch, I didn't see many people playing with it. Now I see it regularly again. Good survivors taught me how to use it properly, so I'm playing it again - and yes, it works well.
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I think the new version is mostly weaker than the old one since I often am chasing a survivor, get a hit, and think to myself “if that player had the old Dead Hard they would have reached the vault/pallet” but it’s still quite a good perk. (The only way the new version is stronger is if you block you get a bit of extra distance compared to the old version since it’s a short sprint burst instead of a flat 2-4 meter straight line lunge. But it’s definitely weaker or even totally ineffective in a lot of places the old version was strong.)
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No game with such dollar store servers and console players should have a perk with an activation window of half a second.
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I use it religiously now. I don’t mind it One bit killer Side or survivor side.
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I'm happy with it,except the animation since it looks really silly.
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This pretty much says it all!
Before DH robbed you of so many downs when the survivor, finally, had committed a mistake and DH still covered for it. The sentiment of it seemed to be "if you outplayed them, but they used DH to get away, did you really outplay them?" and I died a little bit inside each and every time I got "outplayed" by DH or they used it to get uncounterable distance to some vault or palette and extent an already way too long chase by another 20s.
When the big, bad patch dropped it became crystal clear to everyone that DH wasn't just "lul, it's just a perk. Git gud", but when survivor gameplay crumbled and fold under itself and a whole lot of survivors got the wool ripped from their eyes and they had to realize how they got boosted and carried by that perk.
1 1/2 days the survivor community lay in shocked paralysis until it sorta recovered and people (re) learned how to loop without it.
But that's water under the bridge, now.
Nowadays we face much more diverse builds and all kinds of exhaustion perks. DH still is used by a lot of survivors, and many have adapted surprisingly well to its new rules. But when it's used correctly now, I don't feel cheated and the flare of anger is very short lifted and soon replaced by a nod of respect.
I am surprised, but BHVR pulled it off: they nerfed this perk without depowering it. People had prophesied that it got nuked from orbit and nerfed into oblivion, but that didn't happen and it became both: useful AND healthy with meaningful counterplay and sorta mind games from both sides.
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Sometimes I feel like thanks to latency the duration is not even 0,5 sec but even shorter than that. Nurse after blink just waits it out and smash me anyway at the end of duration.
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I like it. I can't complain when it's used against me and I feel pretty satisfied when I pull it off.
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I miss the i-frames. DHing static blasts,seeing missed swings instead of successfull attack cooldowns,easier holing,flopping,getting there JUST in time for that beamer save.
As a killer,I defo raged a few too many times about DH but it wasnt the thing that like,destroyed my life. Most of the times I lost it wasnt because of EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE for distance but because I mad a bunch of misplays because I'm not that great at killer,still.
Kinda miss it. Kinda.
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As Survivor, I only ever used it for Challenges or Dailies on the vein of "Be chased by the Killer for 120+ seconds" because it made it absurdly easy. Now, it may take me a bit longer or a couple of matches to achieve those challenges, but I am willing to live with that than keeping the busted perk.
As Killer, I hated it to no end because I constantly got robbed of down and chases extended for far too long. Now, if someone actually uses it properly, I find myself appreciating a good play on it. It remains a very strong perk when/if used properly, but it doesn't automatically overextends chases just by existing.
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The "just wait it out" counter?
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No, thats the tricky part of it. Old version, survivor would get a small push, to reach a pallet. While this isn´t possible anymore, the new version allows a hit survivor to gain much more distance than what was possible with the old version.
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It is only 0,5 second. It should not be hard right? Because it is not hard for me.
But i think it is imposible to make you happy. They will nerf survivors more, kill rates will up 99% and probably you will ask why survivors have 1% escape rate.
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didn't use it before the patch but now i just can't stop using it. it's so fun now and i've gotten some insane plays done because of it.
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Right, I just said the extra distance on the hit is the one aspect where it’s better. But that doesn’t quite make up for all the other ways its worse.
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New DH has been great. Seeing survivors go down just before making it to a pallet is cathartic in a way. DH definitely needed the change.
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You quote often see survivors who either quickly rewerd and run into you or "surprisingly" run a loop wrong and bumping into you. Of course they always trigger DH and I learned to subdue my urge to swing after an embarrassing series of falling for this.
But now I nearly always see it coming and down my overtly cheeky survivor cuties.
The other way survivors use it is GbR legitimate way, i.e. activating it when you are breathing down their and are ready to swing at them.
If you lunge it's pretty well telegraphed, but if you make a regular attack then its a sort of mind game
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But in fact now it's really third health state if used right.
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Only thing where its worse is that its useless against Trappers traps. Since he isn´t exactly A tier, thats just an inconvenience.
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Nerf the perk to ground and make it useless against all killers. Is that your point?
Because DH is feels weaker than old version right now. Old DH was reason playing killer was unfun. Click E and make loop longer. This does not exists anymore. They need to time it very well. Or they will down. Old DH just gave them free distance to vault or pallet.
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To be honest. I was surprised how effective some survivors are with the new DH. I´ve seen some extremely skilled plays on my teammates with it. We´ll see how people adapt to it in the long run.
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It’s worse in lots of other scenarios. The big advantage of the old version was that you could use it prior to the killer even being in range to 100% safely get to a vault that you wouldn’t reach otherwise. The new one isn’t like that, if you trigger it and the killer doesn’t swing then you gain no distance, lose your ability and are locked out of vaulting or dropping pallets while you “dab”. It’s a lot less safe in that regard. And even if you do block a hit, if you don’t have a straight away path from the killer to take advantage of the distance it still won’t give you more extra distance than the old version gave you when you dodged a hit with it.
Also on a minor note you forgot Deathslinger, the old version could dodge the spear but the new one can’t. (Technically it’s also true for Doctor and Plague but those are even more minor.)
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I'm ok. Never used it, didn't even try new one (probably will someday).
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Thats not what i said. But nice hyperbole.
To put it into comparison. Pop is a useless perk now. DH is still meta and extremely powerful, with just a minor downside in comparison to its previous version.
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Pop nerfed so much, i can agree on that. I think it should be 20% of total.
But no, DH is not that strong anymore. It is good but not op. It needs very good timing and skill. Old DH was braindead and anyone would get value from it. And killer had no counter.
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The perk itself: absolutely YES.
Good survivors like myself LOL can use it, but its not as broken as before, so we see a lot of different perks, which is absolutely nice. Lithe, Overcome, Sprint Burst, yea, even Smash Hit is selected...
The animation: no, but devs already said that they will replace it.
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In other words, it requires more skill than the old version. But gives more distance if triggered in the right moment.
Mendslinger also isn´t A tier. If a meta perk is weaker against C tier killers. Then thats a welcome change, don´t you think?
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Which, as i said in my first post: it requires more skill but is stronger now.
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It is not stronger and that's what i am saying. Before you would use it to pallet and make chase a minute longer. Now you can not do this. At least for me. I am seeing some people are bringing this perk but they usually have not any value from it. Because it is not hard to counter perk for me.
It was good change. The effect is maybe stronger but it is really so hard to get value from it. Which makes it balanced.
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I like it as both survivor and as killer. I like that i feel more rewarded when i actually manage to do a nice play with DH now and not just mindlessly press E and win. As a killer i like that my chases arent prolonged another 20-30 seconds just with 1 perk, unless i screw up and that is my own fault.
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I never stopped using it. Immediately tried to make it work after the patch despite so many people saying it was dead.
Its still very strong. Highly situational and can be predictable but can also extend chases. The only difference now is it takes skill & more awareness to use. I'd still rate this perk up in the A or S tier in terms of strength.
As killer, I have no problem with it. Sometimes I swing into the DH but most of the time, after I realized you have DH, I will try to bait it out or catch you off guard and go for a quick swing. Also realized most of the time, the people running DH tended to be the better survivors.
Still a very solid perk and I think the nerf was justified. Its still strong but its not a guaranteed chase extender and actually requires some thought/awareness on the survivor's part.
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When did I say the perk being weaker or requiring more skill was bad?
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I wouldn't want dead hard to be as good as it was. Overall dead hard now better counter the stronger killers, your huntress, tricksters, blights etc. But makes a lot of normal m1 killers much harder to counter.
Dead hard is in a good spot now. I have concerns that it may just have made better player's even better but as long as it is nowhere as pronounced as before i consider the changes to be a success.
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On survivor it’s my new favorite perk now feels rewarding, requires skill, can give huge value, and doesn’t feel unfair to face as killer now. They actually reworked it perfectly actually not as devastating against M1s still hugely valuable against top tier killers and now can have actual value in the open unlike old Dead Hard.
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I agree, I think the new version of Dead Hard is in a much better spot than the old one.
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Phenomenal, I absolutely love it in every aspect
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I'm really happy how Dead Hard is now. I always hated it to play it but now I really like it. Also, when I play killer it amazes me how cheeky some survivors can be with their dead hard, which is awesome and shows real skill. 10/10 change imo
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I dont use it but I do play Killer and I think that DH is an endgame perk you use to get through the door. Killer will be gnashing at the bit to get you downed and if they know you have DH from using it earlier in the game it's no good, they will wait it out but if they've gone the entire game without seeing you use it they won't think you have it. THATS when you pull that little beauty out of your pocket and go screaming through the gates.
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Still decent and I think it's fine. Good loopers are trying to adapt, time it perfectly with possibility of failure.
And old DH (for distance) shouldn't have been a thing at all.
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It’s stronger if the survivor has the reaction time to reliably use dead hard on reaction to a killer lunge, or on reaction to whatever power the current killer is using. It's weaker if the survivor doesn't have this reaction time, or if the survivor is against an M1 killer.
The new version is stronger against Blight and Nurse than the old version, so people are still using it. And it still feels like "Press E to erase a mistake" when I'm playing Blight or Nurse.
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I am good for that tho. Blight and Nurse can handle this.
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🦀🦀🦀 Dead Hard is gone!!! 🦀🦀🦀
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Yep im happy
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I think dead hard is perfectly balanced now.
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New DH is amazing, when I'm a killer I don't feel robbed, and when I'm a survivor it's satisfying to use correctly
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Absolutely, it feels fair now.
It actually takes a bit of skill/awareness to use, and any noob just rolling in off the street can't just yeet themselves to a pallet/window whenever they get outplayed.
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