Can a dev explain why Blastmine was nerfed?
This isn't feedback, it's a genuine question - why? It was already nerfed with the increase in gen times making it take longer to get to 60% progress of a gen. What is the reason to nerf a perk that is already easily counterable? It doesn't prevent or cancel a killer from being able to use their gen regression perks, only delays them for several seconds. So what was the reason behind the devs decision to nerf Blastmine?
Comments
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They're probably going to move it because they don't have an answer on why they nerfed it, and probably because they could care less on everybody's rage on this ridiculous nerf. They just make random changes whenever they feel like it.
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Seriously, this. I want to hear why this was justified. Blast Mine was already a meme perk. It's like fixing MoM back to slightly usable status required some form of karmic balance in the form of relentlessly destroying a different silly perk.
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I feel like the community in general could do with remembering that nerfs don't always happen because a thing is "too strong", at least if we're defining nerfs as "anything that makes something even slightly weaker".
I'd imagine this change is more to bring it in line with the way it's intended to be working, not a reaction to it potentially being too strong.
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Without buffing it along the way? I doubt they realize how much of a nerf they gave it, if used and not activated when the killer kicks it, that's another 66% of generator progress the survivor has to do. That's too overkill, they should revert the change.
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Well I am glad I just finished all the challenges, because this was one of the best ways to get stun and blind challenges. RIP Blast mine you had a somewhat existence before being taken out back and shot.
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Blast Mine is my "I'm bored" perk and it barely gets use as it is. The perk is pretty useless as is but they evidently wanted to really make sure it was super useless I guess...
Like...if it took 10% of a gen to get it back that would make sense but it takes forever to get one damn charge and now you lose it no matter what :(
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Then they should explain why Blast Mine was meant to be near-on unusable and should only get value (value which barely does anything to the killer's momentum) once every few games.
Regardless of the impetus, this change does not check out in terms of realistic gameplay and I think it's fair to ask that an answer is provided.
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I get "value" from Blast Mine in 1 out of 5 games. At least I could use to highlight the gen to my teammates. Now not anymore.
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I think that's a pretty dramatic reaction considering very few people have actually gotten to play with it yet.
If it's too much, I'll criticise it as being too much. I just don't think this change is that stupid on its face- if this is how the perk functioned on release, I know I wouldn't have identified this aspect as clearly being a problem to be fixed, because it makes sense.
If it is too much, though, I'd probably wanna see it buffed elsewhere. Make the requirement lower, that'd be a good buff.
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Usually if a perk isn't "working as intended" it sees the fix and then a buff to bring it back in line to where it was before. Not this, this is just killing an already barely used perk.
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Same. I've run it since it was released and gone entire play sessions with 0 value. Most times killer looks at the gen, sees the Blastmine on top smoking and either walks away or just goes on to chase me if they see me.
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I have played it already. I played Jill during the PTB, with Blast Mine as a part of her build, and it was like this. I reported it as a bug because it was terrible. I might have gotten a pop with Blast Mine once. In almost all cases, the gen went un-kicked and it took another few minutes to get it back, to the same effect.
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If i had to guess. Wire tap is probably functionally the same in terms of the code it uses behind the scenes to apply itself, and be on a gen, and they thought that wire tap would be OP if it worked that way, so they changed it. And then later realized that blast mine would behave this way too.
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Killers cannot see the flashbang on top of the generator, only survivors.
Edit: On the topic of the blast mine change, I am assuming that it was because the new perk piggybacked off of the original Blast mine/flashbang perks and because of the spaghetti status of the code, blast mine got the the same deactivation statement as the new perk and they could not bother fixing it.
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Fair enough, my other points stand.
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A perfect example of "No one had an issue with how the perk operates currently -- let's change it for no real reason whatsoever!". :rollseyes:
I was using it, as I suspect most people do, more as a "meme" perk than anything else. It was a go-to to get the blind challenges done, as I can't use a flashlight to save my life. Since PR is such a popular perk, a lot of killers (including myself) don't kick gens, so getting Blast Mine to go off still took a lot of tries to see it actually happen.
Out of all the perks in the game that could use a hard look for either getting a nerf or a buff, a dev somewhere wasted their time changing THIS one? :sigh:
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There's a DBD dev that posts on twitter (or I think it's a dev).
Basically, Wiretap and Blast Mine use the same/similar code path. Blast Mine was intended to deactivate when the timer ran out, but that was bugged and never fixed. When Wiretap was done, the code path needed to be rewritten. This caused Blast Mine to be "fixed" too.
I'm not a fan of this, but it's likely not because they said, "Blast Mine is too strong." It's they fixed a bug, figured it wasn't a big deal, and it went live that way. Since the work itself wasn't an intentional, "We're going to fix Blast Mine," but it was, "We need to implement Wiretap," it missed the patch notes for the PTB because they forgot to include it.
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I personally think, even though Blast Mine is not overpowered, that it should be set to something in the range of 75 to 90 % if it expires, always thought it was a bit funny being able to spam it on the generator with no downtime just in case the killer comes.
While losing all of the charge is too much considering how it depends on the killer actually kicking the generator or not, compared to Wiretap which has its effect until the killer kicks the generator.
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And how is it intended to be working? I'd say a survivor sinks 60 secs (or whatever it works out to) fixing generators EARNING the Blastmine. The Blastmine is set, and it triggers if the gen is kicked. Survivors have earned the damn thing twice over; bringing it and using the perk slot to begin with, and sinking the time in to activate it. If triggered, we would have to spend another 60 seconds working on gens to activate it again. That is more than fair. If anything, it's a very steep requirement for perk usage.
At the very most, you would get two charges per match. At the MOST. Some matches not at all. Some Killers don't kick gens. It's been this way now for over a year with nary a complaint even by the Killer mains in this forum. Idk, to me, it seems like it's been working exactly as intended since day 1.
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"Intended to function" may be the wrong phrasing. My point is, it seems pretty abundantly obvious - because of the things you brought up, in fact - that there's a reason this was changed that wasn't an intent to "nerf" something too strong.
Based on other's posts, it seems like it's the way the perk interacted with Wiretap on a coding level, so that clears that up.
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Maybe the devs decided to play killer for once and realized how annoying this perk is. It's so annoying getting DSed over and over in a trial just trying to get a whopping 2.5% regression and an overcharge proc
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over and over? That's a whole lot of 66%s then. Either you're stacking Slowdown for days, or you're playing against a team of Blast Miners. In either case, I don't see where the issue is?
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DS involves losing a down. Blast Mine is just a stun, and a completely avoidable one at that. It is by no means a strong perk. It's slightly annoying at best.
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I'm suspicious about that too. But that's a terrible reason to entirely kill a perk. They should just be transparent, say it's bugged and work on sorting their spaghetti code. Not just re-write the perk description and pretend it was intentional.
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I wonder if they thought players were really going to be using Blast Mine and Wiretap en masse.
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Dude, so you kick the gen twice. Blast mine doesn't prevent you from getting your OC.
I mean I find it annoying to be hit by a Huntress Iri hatchet from across a corn field, through a shed and around a corner, but I just have to live with it.
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You're underselling how annoying it is. It's an old DS stun where you can't move or do anything and sometimes you lose your Pop Goes the Weasel because of it. You also can't see the mine itself. It's only avoidable if you just don't run any gen kicking perks or don't kick gens at all.
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People used to complain about old DS causing them to lose games all the time because of the stun length. Blast Mine is the same length and can easily happen to you 3 to 4 times in a match
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You'll agree that the conclusion we've reached here is an extremely different criticism to the one in the OP, though.
"Why did you nerf this"/"This didn't need a nerf" is not even close to the same criticism as "this was a poor solution", or "more should have been changed to compensate".
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And there's a plethora of popular slowdown/regression perks that don't involve physically kicking the gen, as well as gen kicking often being a pointless exercise unless you can confirm there are no survivors in the area waiting for you to leave. Also, Pop is nearly dead at this point, and you'd only lose it if you were down to the wire and were playing fast and loose with your perks anyway. What's your point?
I've never found Blast Mine to be a quarter of the problem you're building it up to be. Occasionally I kick a gen and get memed on. I typically don't kick gens mid-chase, so it's only got an effect on my immediate pressure if there's another gen I needed to kick in rapid succession.
As survivor, I mostly used it for stun/blind challenges, or as part of meme builds.
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We have a hypothesis but nothing definitive. It would be nice to know if it's true or not. I for one, regularly use Blast Mine. So the perk being trashed into uselessness is pretty irritating. I found it pretty useful in Solo Q.
I have no issue with the wording of the OP. He/she want's to know why it happened. I'm not sure what you're taking issue with here.
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As a solo q survivor, this information is important. It lets the others know where Im at as to not run the killer that direction. If someone else is running it, I avoid running the direction so they can finish the gen. How is that a bad thing for Solo q survivors to have and share information that a SWF has just by being in communication with each other the entire match
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Killers don't see it at all, only the survivors do
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Almo probably thought it was OP.
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BHVR: Release a new Resident Evil chapter.
Also BHVR: Nerf meme perk from previous Resident Evil chapter on the exact same day, because.
Post edited by GoshJosh on4 -
My guess would be it caused some kind of issue with Wire tap
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As other have said, I'd say it's because of Ada's new perk overlapping on it and the game not being made for that.
Although what I would've done is make BM activate auto when you leave a gen, and if it doesn't blow, it doesn't deplete.
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Yeah I do not understand it either. If they had it like how it used to work but made it able to be placed after only 30 or hell 25% gen progress it would not even be close to broken. It's sometimes helpful for escaping a gen you were kind of camping near but really it's a tiny TINY time waster most of the time. Doesn't do much else, that tiny time waste isn't super helpful. The way I see it is it's just kind of a funny novel thing to do to the killer, as opposed to something even worth a full perk slot. So nerfing a perk I would refer to as a "nearly useless, just for fun joke perk" is really odd.
Not only do I HATE this nerf, it's pointless. Even if you could recharge it every 25% on a gen it would not majorly effect if the killer wins or loses that match. So making fizzled out mines require you to charge it again means you'll realistically only have 1 or 2 chances at blinding the killer. And those are just CHANCES. Because you have to charge it again the killer could just wait it out or the gen gets finished and there is no value to be gained.
In fact the whole reason this is dumb is I rarely get more than one use out of blast mine per game using the old way it worked. And that once use in 80% of situations is functionally just a brief annoyance for the killer and nothing more. This change makes it harder to get value out of it, which is already basically impossible before this change because hardly anything it does could even be described as "value".
I will likely never run it again if they don't at least revert the nerf but honestly it should probably get a BUFF. Possibly in the form you only needing to do 45% of the gen to gain access to the mine and maybe the blindness/stun lasts another full second. This wouldn't extend the situations in which it would actually be useful to any significant degree, just make it so that in those situations it's slightly better and since getting it is faster opportunities for those situations are slightly more plentiful.
Nerfs should mainly be done around the meta, with a few here and there for stuff that just isn't fun to fight against. But you know in those 2nd cases the nerf should actually make them more fun/more tolerable to fight against as opposed to just more tedious to use. That's what they did with the Deathslinger base kit nerf in some areas. He's not any worse, nor any more fun to play against. He's just more tedious to use. Bad design philosophy all around when it comes to nerfs and buffs. IMO anyway.
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I think I agree with the consensus that it wasn't a "nerf" exactly and more like fixing a bug they left alone up until now. That said I think it working the way it was "intended" is pretty horrid and if they aren't going to revert it they should at least buff the thing. Maybe maybe it take only half as long to get (30% or so gen progress). Or leave it at the 60% and just make the stun last an extra 20 MINUTES (I kid, maybe 3-5 seconds). It should be at least buffed back to it being usable AS a meme perk. It'd be nice if it was buffed to being usable in general, but I'll take what I can get.
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