Legion is a failure of a design.
Comments
-
@RSB said:
Nice to see angry survivors in their best form defending trash killer, just because they think "weak killer = easy wins".No, not easy wins. No one will play Legion, because they will play your beloved Nurse instead.
So if you want diversity - you should vote for fair and balanced changes for the weakest killers with Legion on the front line.
it's an astounding level of cognitive dissonance
3 -
I am getting sick of supporing these devs. I pay $7.99 for DLC, every sngle release and all I am doing is buying perks (that i still have to facken grind for). This game is a love hate thing. And i am done supporting them just to be disapointed time after time.
4 -
@RSB said:
Nice to see angry survivors in their best form defending trash killer, just because they think "weak killer = easy wins".No, not easy wins. No one will play Legion, because they will play your beloved Nurse instead.
So if you want diversity - you should vote for fair and balanced changes for the weakest killers with Legion on the front line.
Not on Console
0 -
@yeet said:
@RSB said:
Nice to see angry survivors in their best form defending trash killer, just because they think "weak killer = easy wins".No, not easy wins. No one will play Legion, because they will play your beloved Nurse instead.
So if you want diversity - you should vote for fair and balanced changes for the weakest killers with Legion on the front line.
it's an astounding level of cognitive dissonance
That moment when every angry survivor kid searches Google for "cognitive dissonance".
2 -
@ReneAensland said:
@RSB said:
Nice to see angry survivors in their best form defending trash killer, just because they think "weak killer = easy wins".No, not easy wins. No one will play Legion, because they will play your beloved Nurse instead.
So if you want diversity - you should vote for fair and balanced changes for the weakest killers with Legion on the front line.
Not on Console
i'm sorry for your loss
0 -
@RSB said:
@yeet said:
@RSB said:
Nice to see angry survivors in their best form defending trash killer, just because they think "weak killer = easy wins".No, not easy wins. No one will play Legion, because they will play your beloved Nurse instead.
So if you want diversity - you should vote for fair and balanced changes for the weakest killers with Legion on the front line.
it's an astounding level of cognitive dissonance
That moment when every angry survivor kid searches Google for "cognitive dissonance".
My kingdom for a "LOL" button!
0 -
This post is actually really sad. Like it's totally fine if you don't like the killer. While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.
But calling people that defend and actually like the new killer pathetic, now that's pathetic. Never heard of the word opinion? If they like Legion, that's up to them. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.0 -
@ad19970 said:
This post is actually really sad. Like it's totally fine if you don't like the killer. While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.
But calling people that defend and actually like the new killer pathetic, now that's pathetic. Never heard of the word opinion? If they like Legion, that's up to them. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.when people's "opinion" is born solely from wanting a free win whenever the killer is picked, is pathetic.
1 -
Well he definitily needs a buff that is for sure.
But he is not that bad as all main killers tell.1 -
@yeet said:
@ad19970 said:
This post is actually really sad. Like it's totally fine if you don't like the killer. While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.
But calling people that defend and actually like the new killer pathetic, now that's pathetic. Never heard of the word opinion? If they like Legion, that's up to them. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.when people's "opinion" is born solely from wanting a free win whenever the killer is picked, is pathetic.
Sure but I'm pretty sure most people who like this killer don't just like him because they can get a free win against him.
1 -
2018 year of the L’s. L for killer. LMAO.1
-
@ad19970 said:
@yeet said:
@ad19970 said:
This post is actually really sad. Like it's totally fine if you don't like the killer. While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.
But calling people that defend and actually like the new killer pathetic, now that's pathetic. Never heard of the word opinion? If they like Legion, that's up to them. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.when people's "opinion" is born solely from wanting a free win whenever the killer is picked, is pathetic.
Sure but I'm pretty sure most people who like this killer don't just like him because they can get a free win against him.
you overestimate this community
1 -
@yeet said:
@ad19970 said:
@yeet said:
@ad19970 said:
This post is actually really sad. Like it's totally fine if you don't like the killer. While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.
But calling people that defend and actually like the new killer pathetic, now that's pathetic. Never heard of the word opinion? If they like Legion, that's up to them. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion.when people's "opinion" is born solely from wanting a free win whenever the killer is picked, is pathetic.
Sure but I'm pretty sure most people who like this killer don't just like him because they can get a free win against him.
you overestimate this community
Maybe. I see all the complaints about toxic survivors but personally I still don't think this community is that bad. There are some idiots that are part of the community, no doubt. But most people I've played against in my last three months have been nice or at least weren't toxic at all.
0 -
Let me guess.. Rank 10 and above are impossible or nearly impossible for killers.. There's 1 viable killer at rank 15 or above.. All survivors are toxic.
Amirite?
1 -
Don't feed the troll! ^^
Amirite?
0 -
@ad19970 said:
While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.I agree, it can happen that you end up with a design thats bad where you may not immediately realize this, but when you do, you should get back to the drawing board instead of proceeding with releasing it. They were fully aware of the design and balance issues before release and they had EVERY opportunity to postpone the release, and quite frankly I'd rather they do that than they release something thats quite obviously a blatant rehashed reuse of the spirits power (a ripoff), with a few additions and alterations, but not only that, it's very poorly executed and has so many balance issues that makes it even worse than Freddy. And it's not like they weren't told how to actually fix it, because the majority of the people who participated in the PTB provided tons of feedback along with suggestions on how to specifically fix both the legion and the deep wound mechanic. But what do they do? They release the killer with a few minor tweaks that doesn't accomplish anything in regards to the issues, they're still very much there and it's the same way people deal with them. The only thing I'm hoping for is the BHVR begins to realize exactly how important it is to listen to the community and not take everything said with "a grain of salt", and not twist things around but instead use whats being suggested more as is, and the same with the mindset that killers don't need to be viable just fun - that certainly needs to change too, because competitive viability is extremely important in a competitive game, because otherwise high rank play will remain incredibly stale and boring because most killers aren't designed to be viable in high rank play. But as I said, BHVR were fully aware that this design was bad and yet they released it - which also says something about BHVR.
0 -
@Incarnate said:
@ad19970 said:
While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.I agree, it can happen that you end up with a design thats bad where you may not immediately realize this, but when you do, you should get back to the drawing board instead of proceeding with releasing it. They were fully aware of the design and balance issues before release and they had EVERY opportunity to postpone the release, and quite frankly I'd rather they do that than they release something thats quite obviously a blatant rehashed reuse of the spirits power (a ripoff), with a few additions and alterations, but not only that, it's very poorly executed and has so many balance issues that makes it even worse than Freddy. And it's not like they weren't told how to actually fix it, because the majority of the people who participated in the PTB provided tons of feedback along with suggestions on how to specifically fix both the legion and the deep wound mechanic. But what do they do? They release the killer with a few minor tweaks that doesn't accomplish anything in regards to the issues, they're still very much there and it's the same way people deal with them. The only thing I'm hoping for is the BHVR begins to realize exactly how important it is to listen to the community and not take everything said with "a grain of salt", and not twist things around but instead use whats being suggested more as is, and the same with the mindset that killers don't need to be viable just fun - that certainly needs to change too, because competitive viability is extremely important in a competitive game, because otherwise high rank play will remain incredibly stale and boring because most killers aren't designed to be viable in high rank play. But as I said, BHVR were fully aware that this design was bad and yet they released it - which also says something about BHVR.
I'm sorry but most suggestions I read on the forums were terrible. They would just overbuff him and make him the by far most hated killer. Then he'd just be the killer to reduce the amount of survivor players even more. They would have to redesign his whole Frenzy ability before they could make him viable.
Also I can imagine that they didn't realise his big balancing problems before they released him on PTB. Designing a fun killer isn't that easy, I'm pretty sure. And after the ptb release they wouldn't have had enough time to totally redesign his entire ability before the official release. I'm guessing they've also already started to work on the next killer, since they are trying to follow their roadmap.0 -
i find it a bit hard to use effectively but survivors as i dont know exactly how to use it, survivors don't know how to react to it, so i am averaging 2 hooks minimum per match, somehow.
still looking for the right combo and playstyle.
i think is refreshing: forces me to think differently, like when you use trapper.
0 -
@ad19970 said:
@Incarnate said:
@ad19970 said:
While I like the idea of a killer having abilities of survivors, I too think that this killer isn't very well designed. Things like that can happen though, let's just hope the next killer is better designed.I agree, it can happen that you end up with a design thats bad where you may not immediately realize this, but when you do, you should get back to the drawing board instead of proceeding with releasing it. They were fully aware of the design and balance issues before release and they had EVERY opportunity to postpone the release, and quite frankly I'd rather they do that than they release something thats quite obviously a blatant rehashed reuse of the spirits power (a ripoff), with a few additions and alterations, but not only that, it's very poorly executed and has so many balance issues that makes it even worse than Freddy. And it's not like they weren't told how to actually fix it, because the majority of the people who participated in the PTB provided tons of feedback along with suggestions on how to specifically fix both the legion and the deep wound mechanic. But what do they do? They release the killer with a few minor tweaks that doesn't accomplish anything in regards to the issues, they're still very much there and it's the same way people deal with them. The only thing I'm hoping for is the BHVR begins to realize exactly how important it is to listen to the community and not take everything said with "a grain of salt", and not twist things around but instead use whats being suggested more as is, and the same with the mindset that killers don't need to be viable just fun - that certainly needs to change too, because competitive viability is extremely important in a competitive game, because otherwise high rank play will remain incredibly stale and boring because most killers aren't designed to be viable in high rank play. But as I said, BHVR were fully aware that this design was bad and yet they released it - which also says something about BHVR.
I'm sorry but most suggestions I read on the forums were terrible. They would just overbuff him and make him the by far most hated killer. Then he'd just be the killer to reduce the amount of survivor players even more. They would have to redesign his whole Frenzy ability before they could make him viable.
Also I can imagine that they didn't realise his big balancing problems before they released him on PTB. Designing a fun killer isn't that easy, I'm pretty sure. And after the ptb release they wouldn't have had enough time to totally redesign his entire ability before the official release. I'm guessing they've also already started to work on the next killer, since they are trying to follow their roadmap.There were quite many that didn't focus on "overbuffing" but fixing the issues that was the root of his most glaring weaknesses while still making it balanced for both sides, and some fixes were simpler than others. Also there are two things here that is important to seperate legions power and the deep wound mechanic, where his most obvious weakness was how the deep wound mechanic works and how it's being dealt with. Because as is, people are just taking one or a few feral frenzy hits, then run away or mend right before the killer, then they self-care - and boom all the killers efforts have been undone in regards to this victim. The second most glaring issue is that while being injured and being one hit away from going down, taking the feral frenzy hit won't down you even when being injured, which makes absolutely no sense, which also one the main reasons why the legion struggles to down anyone with it's power. But there were many good suggestions which for the most part were either identical, almost identical or very similar, so the majority of the people were point out how to fix it and the devs took it with "a grain of salt" and put their own twist on it - the result speaks for itself, in a bad way.
They should've made a more unique power than blatantly reuse one thats already in the game, one that was just released a few months ago, because at the core of the power it's just the spirits power.
They nerfed him before the PTB, but it doesn't matter if they were close to release or not, when they realized the balancing issues, they should not release something that is not ready to be released, no matter what has been promised or scheduled, and the impatient ones in the community will have to learn a very important virtue called patience. Also in regards to realizing the balance issues, already within a few hours on day one of PTB release, there were so many who were agreeing on the same issues and the same types of fixes. The devs had more than enough time, to make changes during the PTB, then roll out another PTB update, have players test that, receive feedback and suggestions, and keep on repeating the process until they got the balance issues fixed. But they do that? No! Should they? Most certainly, because that is how the PTB should be used in the first place, not try and demo it so they can attempt to build hype for it. It's better to release something that is ready for release than to release something wrecks all kinds of havoc on the balance in the attempt to release it on time.
0 -
Everybody talks about how survivors defend him but survivors are as unhappy as you are. Just play against him, you will understand it better.
0 -
Ok I've been getting results with him these past few games. Against red ranks too. Hell last game I won was against a swf on haddonfield with greentoolboxes, all the meta perks and an instaheal syringe.
#########?
Don't get me wrong, they can loop this guy until the end of time, but if they stay injured during the game and you know how to mindgame then yeah....you can get some results. Watching all those good streamers has paid off.
I've got crud perks so I'm taking Beast of pray. Maybe thats why? People that should be playing better but they're often walking into me.
Of course if its a loop that cant be mindgamed then you're screwed.
0 -
Exactly. And legion isnt #########. Soooo....yeet said:@PhantomMask20763 said:
yeet said:@PhantomMask20763 said:
I cant wait to run some more tracking perks instead of Aura perks, then survivors running that one Aura reading block perk will be useless to them. Same with Iron maiden, I'm a little excited to unlock the perks on my other killers. Legion doesn't seem THAT bad. He has trouble downing sure but nothing a few buffs can fix. I'm sure BHVR will realise he needs a few more tweaks before he can be good
a killer who has trouble downing people is not a killer that wins many games
And I understand that, I'm just saying maybe we're underestimating him and with a few more buffs/tweaks he can be much better. He doesn't need a complete rework, just a few tweaks
this game is not very mechanically complex, and legion is a pretty simple killer
it isn't difficult to tell when ######### stinks0 -
I cannot believe two members of The Legion are paywalled.
I really, really can't.
1 -
You can't believe they got paywalled? In 2018?
1 -
Poor boiyeet said:@ReneAensland said:
Give him a week. He'll most likely get buffed.looks at freddy
0 -
Playing mostly survivor we just bullied many legionsWolff_Bringer said:Well he definitily needs a buff that is for sure.
But he is not that bad as all main killers tell.
Even if I play solo my team can loop her around as well as me, for the entire match. He hit me? Good, sb away to a loop or make him waste his second hit and get stunned for free when I use lithe
When I face Freddy I'm more concerned since at least he's so rare to see that some people get caught by him cutting off our map pressure. With legion you don't have this inconvenience, he just run slightly faster and get stunned after a while.. with 110% speed1 -
Do you want my meme? You can use it for these types of people!yeet said:@Carpemortum said:
yeet said:Let's be completely honest, everything about this killer is miserable.
His power is incredibly poor, one of the worst in the game in fact.
His perks are mediocre at best, and uninspired in design.
His design is uninspired, and his backstory incoherent, and his power doesn't match his theme.
He is not fun to play as, or against, the play experience as him is miserable, and playing against him is so trivial it's boring.
I really cannot understand how we come off of a killer like the spirit, into whatever abomination we have here.
And the people trying to defend it are even more pathetic.
😁 [1] LOL!
what an eloquent and well thought out argument
0 -
@Dwight_Confusion said:
I view this as another millennial post without much substance.Basically... because the OP doesn't "like" the new killer... therefore it is "weak" and "bad". Typical millennial thinking.
Be objective.
I personally think the killer is in a good place. I think some of the add ons could get checked on, but overall I like the very humanistic look, the perks are fantastic on both sides, and it really forces people to chance the meta.
I'll be seeing a lot less SC, DS, Adren, BT builds now.
I think he's mid tier maybe? I don't know. It's hard to say right now. He just came out.
"just came out"
lets ignore the entire PTB that screamed his issues then.
lmfao
0 -
@Vancold said:
Let me guess.. Rank 10 and above are impossible or nearly impossible for killers.. There's 1 viable killer at rank 15 or above.. All survivors are toxic.Amirite?
No.
At the REAL rank 1 the following killers are "viable" in that, they can get you a PIP most of the time without a crazy optimal game:
- Nurse
- Billy
- Spirit
- Clown ( requires some addons )
- Myers
- Huntress
- Hag
- Leatherface ( addon dependant )
- Wraith ( somewhat addon dependant )
- Pig ( requires mind gaming lunge otherwise a trapper without "traps" )
######### killers at rank 1, especially vs good players:
- Legion
- Freddy
- Trapper
- Doctor
The biggest issue on the bad killers is that they have NO power during a chase.
Legion: Requires idiots to forget about mending
Freddy: Requires idiots to not be aware of their surroundings or have self care
Trapper: Requires idiots to ignore traps or trap locations to disarm
Doctor: Requires idiots to not manage madness level, but honestly it doesn't even matter anymore since snap out of it isn't on NC anymore.
1
