Survivor buffs
Well, now that Killers have a bit of spotlight I would suggest some small buffs for survivors. These should aim to remove some unhealthy gameplay and interaction while not buffing SWF in any way.
- Remove hook-grabs on healthy survivor. - These are a pain and even as a Killer I do not see why they exist. On injured survivors they are good but on healthy survivors they are not needed and only enhance camping.
- Add a promt when another survivor is chased - A bit of baseline information. We already have this with the obsession but it would be great to get it for every survivor. This would help to see if maybe somebody else has to go for the rescue.
- Increase the range of Reassurance so that you can reassure somebody in the basement. Kill basement camping.
- Increase the hast effect of the baseline endurance and hast after a hook from 7-10%. The Endurance is fine but survivors should get a bigger incentive to just run.
- Various small Killer changes: Make Nurses attack after a blink a special attack, nerf Blights add-ons, rework the Shapes Tombstone Piece and nerf the Masterminds Iridecent Uruboros Vial.
- Make the "Map" item for survivors more meaningful and add brown and yellow map. Give the survivors more maps to work with and add an incentive for new players to use them. Brown maps start with 1 generator tracked, yellow with 2 and you can slap some very good add-ons to them. With the "marker"-addons this also adds base-communication.
- Buff Key. Keys are right now pretty much a useless item. They require add-ons to have any meaning beside opening the hatch. Add a baseline ability to reveal your teammate that burns through its "energy" and add-ons that allow one mate (and only one, maybe the obsession) to see the others while you are on the hook.
So...my wishlist is once again done. Lets see what we get.
So fare BHVR did good stuff and I enjoy the game. The last patches were nice and the event is fun. Only SoloQ is miserable and should get help right now.
Comments
-
1 to 4: Okay.
5 : No, the nurse is "forced" to use her power because her base speed is horrible.
The only solution would be to increase the nurse's base speed to 4.6 and give her a single teleport.
6 and 7: Ok (I think)
0 -
4.6 on nurse. Well. There would be nothing anyone can do anything against her. She is already broken OP as is with 1 saving grace - there are still people that don't know how to play her so you can win some games against literal noobs (I don't mean the term offensively). By making her 4.6, you basically remove the only possibility for a match where you have a chance as a survivor.
As of right now I would not be against removing the killer from the game entirely. Or reworking her to something different. Or at least add massive CD to remove her mobility - to make her equal to 4.4 killer (she would still be quicker, because she would not need to go around any obstacles) and maybe 4.6/4.8 if using 1 or 2 of range/recharge addons. I mean I used to main the killer (but I liked to bring both brown and yellow meme addons). But after 5.5 patch she is no longer any fun. She is so bonkers, that missed M1 is more punishing then getting stunned (insanely hard to this killer BTW).
But everyone knows she is way too OP. It does not matter. BHVR for some reasons would rather buff her even more (patches 5.5 and general killer buffs on 6.1)
0 -
thye won't buff survivors. they've been completely destroying survivor the last 3/4 years. killer still complain. solo Q is in shambles.
3 -
IKR? They went so far as incentives are now 98% of a time on survivor side. You can now even rename them into survivor incentives. And yet this forum is still mostly full of buff X killer power or do Y for that killer interaction. And the most-requested things from survivor's perspective (camp/tunnel/soloQ) are just straight-up ignored -.- Sad thing
1 -
it is sad, but not unsurprising. they're milking out the community for the last few years this game has. the latest flashlight change is just another example of how to make survivor less and less fun. they don't add new exciting gameplay, they only take away gameplay. it's the sad truth
1 -
TL;DR... My change to nurse and explaining how Maps and Keys work... also how I would've changed the Hatch
1-4 I can get behind
5 I do have an issue with... what's the problem with Nurse (people have said that it's her being able to Blink through walls... some people say it's the Range addons... while others say it's her recharge)
So here's my change to Nurse.... Make her have two Blinks base kit and make it work like (that one addon that makes her be unable to Blink through walls), add more downsides onto her Range Addons by having a longer Fatigue and longer recharge... and make the opposite a thing as well decrease her Range but give her faster Fatigue and recharge, and make the Blink through walls an addon that will increase Fatigue and recharge for going through walls while also making the 2nd Blink Attacks Special cause if we make all Blinks Special Attacks then change more perks to activate on Special Attacks... also can you imagine a 1 Blink Nurse STBFL will see use on Nurse
Blight.... I forgot what those two addons do (so I can't comment on that)
Wesker... IDK what that Addon does (so I can't comment) but I will say why are we complaining about an Iri addon (it's supposed to be strong)
6... why make more Items that Survivor have to deal with... but I also think that people forget how the map works, So the Map works with static things (gens, Totems, Chests)... and you can mark certain things (and I think places) and have the other Survivors see the mark)... what else can you think of the maker Maps better
7... Keys are good enough for those players whom don't want to run Aura Reading Perks (Bond, Kindred, Dark Sense, Alert) cause that's what it does with the right addons except that it's just a press of a button away... Just because it's not used to open the hatch and let everyone go when there's 1 Gen left doesn't mean it's less useful... TBF (To Be Fair) I would've cut down the BP gained from escaping through the hatch (basically making it like a Give Up option the Survivors have) and giving the Killer bonus BP for having the Survivors take the Hatch rather then finishing out the match (seems they want to do that kind of punishment on Camping why not test it out on the Survivor side
And adding an animation to opening the hatch along with like 2.5-5 second opening timer... depending on how strong the Key is (pink keys will open the hatch in 2.5 seconds and the purple key will open the hatch in 5 seconds)
0 -
Well I am all for nerfing nurse. Because she REALLY needs it. But your nerf would swing her to the other side. It's way too much :D
For keys - how often do you see anybody ever using them? They are really bad. Even aura reading stuff would need huge buff to be worth while (at least make it's usage time instant). AFAIK people don't tend to use them even for challenges that require you to exit via hatch. It's better option to not take it and instead take left behind. Because no killer will let you live as last person if he sees anyone carrying this item. With left behind you have MUCH higher chance to actually get it.
0 -
The only viable idea I've seen you submit for the nurse is the inability to walk through walls.
I will take your idea and include it in my rework
Besides, I posted a rework of Pig : https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/351428/rework-the-pig
Don't hesitate to comment, I feel alone...
0 -
LOL... Ok I'll check it out
And what do you mean "The only viable idea you've seen me submit" you don't like the other things I've changed about the Addons?
0 -
@Gandor (seems that I can't use the quote button)
Did I make her weak and unfun??? cause it seems that's what people wanted to happen
Yea I haven't seen a Key in a while... But that has to do with people thinking that the only use for them is to open the Hatch... So I changed how the Hatch works (not really but put penalties on Survivors whom want to use the Hatch for a "free escape")
0 -
Not going to happen since they want 60% kill rate, which becomes fair with 10% games of hook suicides that means 60% is 50-50. Last chart showed that they are pretty close to that a few killers needs a small buff and Wesker will get lower kill rate once he is not new anymore.
0 -
I really wish nurse got nerfed. But not nerfed into oblivion. I mean I am survivor main. But when I played killer, it used to be almost always nurse. But I don't enjoy her after patch 5.5. And I sure would not enjoy her after your nerfs.
Like if you only made her not being able to blink over obstacles. That would be such a nerf, that her chasing power will immediatelly drop her to D tier. This alone would mean she would require compensation buff (and giving her 3rd blink would absolutely not be crazy idea)
0 -
Why... she can't Blink through walls -something complained about-... Her Range does stay the same but if you use the Range Addons they will add more onto her Fatigue and Recharge -something else complained about-... she still is the same at base but with a difference coming from which Addons you use
So I don't think I ruined her... I'll be honest that's about all I can think of when it comes to the Nurse
She would then have an Addon that allows her to Blink through walls
0 -
5 could also be kinda resolved if only the first blink counted as a basic attack, so Nurse players would get rewarded for hitting prfect blinks instead of readjusting blinks.
0 -
I do not see it that way. I play mostly duo-que with a friend of mine and our games are fine.
We mostly play fun or thematic build, we go for archives and we still get a pretty good escape rate or at least a very close game. Our main problem are camping and hook suicides/DCs.
Camping is a problem but hard to address. So far my main issue here is the "hook grab" which is straight up dumb and allows too many Killers to just camp for free. I have little issue with camping if it makes sense for the Killer: Endgame, a hooked survivor in a three-gen or teammate introduced camping. However dumb face-camping is mostly bound to Cannibal and the "hook grab". Hence I want the grab removed.
Tunneling is not an issue for us after base Borrow Time, real Borrow Time, Off the Record, Decisive Strike, Sprint Burst and Med-Kits. Right now Off the Record is enough to give a tunneling Killer hell if we want, because the silence while injured is very useful.
I get that you want "exciting gameplay" for the survivor side. However there is a problem: Once you add a side-objective somebody is complaining. Boons led to Killers complaining like hell, when in reality it was only Cycle of Healing that was out of line while all other Boons are too weak, and Killers with secondary objectives are "too complicated for soloQ" and lead to whining here.
Maybe we see this a bit different but for me each Killer is interesting new gameplay. Learning how to outplay Wesker is fun for me and it always puts a smile on my face, when I know the Weskers power better than he does. This is why it pains me when I only see certain Killers. I want a mixed back to keep the game fresh and interesting. Every Killer with <1,5% pickrate is bad news for me.
SoloQ is the biggest issue and here are adjustments needed. As you can see with me and my friend, duos, trios and full SWFs have little problems. We do not need further "buffs", but we would like "better teammates". This includes a bit more information for them AND less suicides and/or DCs.
1 -
Her being able to go thru walls is her main chasing power and basic identity. If you remove it, you get wesker without slowdown from infection, with fatigue mechanics and much lower mobility. And on top of it you want to also nerf range+recharge...
From my perspective all that is required for nurse to be ok again is increase recharge time for her blinks. The idea is, that missing both of her blinks (so missing twice) should be more punishing then just 6s time waste. Also this would allow for survivors to gain some more distance - so nurse does not have to hit survivors from like ~6m for next try. Also stun timer should not go in paralel with fatigue time. Right now missing m1 is more punishing then getting stunned which is quite stupid.
0 -
I do not get why people want to nerf her into the ground. Nurse overall is a concept I like to face, I only think her attack should be a special attack. Everything else is fine for me.
Personally I think that Nurse synergy with perks like No one escapes Death and especially Starstruck is too good and makes her too easy. This is because normally you need two hits to down a survivor, have to land two blinks. Reducing this to 1 means that even I can get downs and kills as a Nurse (and I am pretty bad).
However the suggestion to make her second Blink a special attack is better than mine. This still allows good Nurses (not me) to use Starstruck and other perks while gatekeeping "bad Nurses" out.
Nurse is supposed to be the best Killer for those who invest time and skill to master her. I do not want to change that and nerf her into the ground. However right now Nurse hinders certain perks to be implemented (Awakened Awareness was the most recent perk to hit the wall...) and that should be addressed.
0 -
Personally I think that making her blink attacks special is not enough. At minimum I would add on top of this making stuns really punishing (full stun duration, then 1s free to "move"/look around (no blinking) and then fatigue. Possibly remove all her remaining ability charges on top of that. This would make pallets at least mildly useful against nurses.
And I am pretty sure that even if these 2 things were implemented, nurse would still be #1 killer in game (still much better then blight or spirit). That's why I say it is bare minimum that needs to be implemented. But still I would rather have her recharge time go to 6s per charge instead of 3s
0 -
Ok... fair enough
But I was thinking of her Addons (cause they were complained about)... anyway fair enough
1 -
Cant wait till windows, pallets, and hook states are removed and survivor speed is decreased
1 -
I do not know how my suggestions lead to this conclusion or how anything BHVR did made you think that.
They did plenty for survivors during the last updates. Boon: Cycle of Healing is "better Selfcare", Off the Record is a good anti-tunneling perk, baseline borrow time is great when you do not try to bodyblock with it (and even better when stacked with real BT), Reassurance is great to detere camping, various regression perks got nerfed...
Sure they did things for Killers as well, as they have to take care of both sides. But acting like they only care about Killers and want to grind survivors into the dust just ignores all positive changes for survivors they did.
0 -
CoH is very time consuming. I do use it now, but only because they nerfed SC. If I was able to trade deleting CoH for getting old version of SC, I would do that 100%. People don't realize all the risks involved (and there are MANY) with CoH and the fact that it is very unreliable. The only thing why killers don't like the perk is, that sometimes it can help teammates. Other times it's huge time sync + risk of moving on a map injured and sole reason why your team failed to survive.
OTR useless against real camping tunnelers because BT hit disables it. On the other hand DS is now useless - so we are in a worse situation then before.
BT basekit - yes. This one is one of real huge helps that we got. Same for reinsurance - which would not be so sorely needed if gen times didn't go to 90s (making camping hook much more rewarding).
Overall I see something done for survivor is always compensated with something horrible (OTR for DS, phramacy and calm spirit on it's own, reinsurence for 90s gens) and then some clear nerfs (0.5s DH with those inconsistent killer timing = hard usage, stun recovery (this one is my #1 nerf that hit me the most), quicker pallet breaks, shorter after hit run time (so dead zones are deadlier), repeating missing pallets on maps (e.g. temple of purgation stonehanges can now contain 0 pallets), new TERRIBLE loops being introduced (like trash window and trash pallets and several pillars is supposed to help me extend the chase? Any M1 killer can get me there within at most 10s).
And then we have map reworks. So we take strong survivor map and butcher it (headonfield and RPD) but we keep midwitch & shelter woods exactly as they were.
Sorry but the evidence is overwhelming. I am really curious when will the devs decide it's time to nerf survivor running speed because 39% (instead of 50%) is way too much.
0 -
Wow.. that went right over your head, didnt it? Lol
0 -
The flashlight change DID bring in vault faking. Too bad they removed that. It was a fun mechanic...
0 -
Your evidence is quit selective and strongly depends on the time frame.
I just looked through all of the patch notes once more to get a better picture here. Killers and survivor had almost the same number of changes. We can now argue back and forth about how useful or helpful change xy was and will come to no end. On some we can agree with ease that they should be reversed (Decisive Strike back to 5 seconds, no problem).
I for one welcome the change to Dead Hard. That perk was stupid and Dead Hard for distance was so easy that even I was able to use it. Right now the perk got stronger once you learn how to handle it (speed boost) and weaker when you just spam it. I guess we need to agree to disagree on this point. I was also always more of a Sprint Burst player because the extra distance was always more useful for me.
Some of the things you say however are clearly bugs. Like the change of spawning no pallets is an issue with the game counting wrong. This is not intended and should be fixed soon (I hope).
The map reworks of the strongest survivor maps shows a bit of bias in my opinion. RPD is still very survivor sided. It has many safe pallets and strong windows, the exit gates are very far from each other and many hiding spots for survivors exist. The only thing ruining this for survivors is the chance to spawn 2 generators in the main room (an atrocity that should just be deleted).
Haddonfield is still a very strong map when you know how to use the buildings. The windows here are very good and the tall bushes allow for hiding. Some loops can be used without a pallet for a long time. The weak point of the map is a the middle where survivors are in the open, however with the ability to hide within a building or reach one even with the shorter speedboost I think Haddonfield is balanced right now. It has strong and weak points for both sides.
Midwich and Shelter Woods are killer sided. However you took effort not to mention Garden of Joy, Badham, Red Forest, Cowshed (THE reworked Cowshed) and Aery of Crows. Aery and Garden are especially relevant because they are some of the newer maps and they are quit survivor sided.
Garden of Joy offer many very strong windows and generous generators for survivors. The main building is very good and can be used almost to an infinite without even using the pallet. Exit gates are fare from each other and generators rarely create a three gen.
Aery of Crows offers a big and bright map where you can see the Killer from far away. The main building is strong and offers good windows on the bottom, a strong pallet on top and even a good window on top. There are plenty of safe loops and the generators are very spread out. This map also is quit survivor sided.
For me the evidence points towards the view that both sides get their cookies. Right now it would be the survivors time go get another one which is why I point towards survivor buffs aimed at SoloQ.
You are however painting this a bit to grime. I think a big part of the issue is communication which is where changes should be made. Many of my survivor games are not lost because of bad perks or bad maps but because of bad coordination (2 people running for Cenobites box etc.) or because survivors make stupid moves (grouping up against Legion, setting up Cycle of Healing against Plague etc.) or because they are just bad (letting me die on the first hook with Kindred + Open Handed against a Doctor that was clearly chasing on the other side of the map).
Please elaborate, this short statement had little to no meaning for me like this.
What is your point?
0 -
You can take whole history of DBD. Looping got reduced a lot many times. No more infinites, no more vaulting single window, pallets work much worse then they used to, introduction of bloodlust, keys, fast vaults requirements (yes there was also mori system and stuff killers had - but survivors got nerfed way more).... I mean a lot of changes make sense. Survivor used to be easy mode and it was unfair to killers. But now devs decided it's good idea to aim for 60% (they got 61%) killrate also for 5% of best players (and games with DC are not counted - meaning if you play survivor now, odds are you will probably loose). So they WANT killers to win 3 out of 5 games instead of 1 out of 2.
For DH - I never really used the ping. I am from EU and Russians join some of my games - meaning the ping can be absolute bonkers sometimes and you just never know. Meaning you can't time DH right, because if you find the exact correct moment when to push the button - it will still not work sometimes - because killer's ping (and no - you will possibly not get even a warning about it with icon indicator. Sometimes killers have unstable ping - not necessarily bad one all the time).
As for the clear bugs - well this happens slowly on all maps. Just yesterday I went thru crows in front of the main. The map is supposed to be packed full of pallets between the small structures that are present. Unfortunatelly I went over 7 such double-structures. Found exactly 0 pallets. When the map came out I would be able to find 4 or 5 of them. And no - if they were used already, I would find debrys of them. All the maps are being slowly nerfed.
RPD too - there are no more really strong windows. The map used to have some (like library or east office) very strong loops where you could stay for a moment to waste killer's time. Those loops got opened so you can't use them any more the way that you used to. Nowadays you need to move thru map and use pallets or maybe use single window once to shorten the distance for you (meaning once pallet is broken, you have nothing - or better yet - it's nemesis or another anti-pallet killer and you just enjoy your misery). As for main 2 gens. Those are almost a rule - they almost (not always mind you) spawn there. You have also almost certain chance to get another gen really close by (first room to the east on upper floor - meaning the closest room once you go up the stairs, or the hallway next to this room, or library, or "waiting room") and if all this fails, it's still possible to check the guaranteed gen that's outside between main entrance and fire escape stairs (this one is little bit more tricky, but still not insanely hard). And you mentioned that gates are far from each other - well they are VERY easy to patrol. You need to move like 6 meters to see from one gate to another - so even this will not help you.
Haddonfield is clearly much worse for survivor then it used to. You also have guaranteed 3 gen with 1 gen at main (where there is basement), 1 gen right outside the main touching the corner of it and one last gen in the open, but not far from the gen on the corner of the main - so even if there indeed are insanely strong loops in 2 of the houses, the killer does not need to go there ever. You just accept that the map contain 5 gens instead of 7 and the map is suddenly very killer sided with very strong guaranteed 3gen.
Badham and red forest are old maps - there is no change there. Sure it's stronger survivor maps, but the tendency to remove strong things for survivors is clear. It will be nerfed with all the other maps when new unloopable tiles (hallo to a, few pillars, 1 trash window and 1 trash pallet b, 2 windows with short-ish walls facing each other at 90 degrees and nothing more to slow down killer - making LT look like a god loop) arrive also to these 2 realms.
With Garden I have to agree - something strong-ish for survivors. I give you that.
Crows map - I already mentioned pallet nerfs. What good does it do that you can see killer from distance, when there is nothing to loop him on? Main is not as strong as you mention it, because e.g. top window can be used 0 times if killer knows his stuff. He will just break it instead of chasing you when you go that way. If you use it, you will get hit (because killer will get sound Q when he runs at you to return) so there is 0 reason to use the window and hit you while you stagger. You can still go up there for the pallet - but with the tendency of removing pallets from the maps all the time, it's just a matter of time until you find yourself trapped by expecting to find one.
Cowshed - I know this one is supposed to be survivor sided, but I never found out why. The map is large - that's true. But it does not contain many structures. It's rather easy to give up on half the map and play on the other one only and still getting downs and wins. Maybe I don't know how to play it, but there is just too few things to use in here (I mean it's still better then midwitch of shelter woonds, but still).
I don't view your viewpoint, because I see and listen to what devs say. They want to have 60% killrate instead of making fair 50%. And they will nerf survivors so long until they are able to find something. Like as far as we know MMR is based for +10 if you win and -10 if you loose. So getting sustained 60% killrate means killer needs to be climbing ranks all the time. Meaning more noob killers need to be able to win against best survivors out there to sustain those 60%. And if you are able to watch hours of players, you will see the trend of 200hrs killers being able to win against 1000hrs survivor team already. There will be more nerfs (I am looking forward to new loop that will contain just window without any walls - making Z wall look OP) until people get fully fed up with this and start to leave the game. No multiplayer game should cater to one side only. That was true in the past (where survivors were OP and killers begged to have a fair game and Q times showed as much) and this is also true now.
0 -
I'm saying the joke went over your head, you missed it pretty badly there
0 -
But is it? Have you seen new loops? LT-s look like god loops in comparison.
0 -
No, not the post I mean what I had said
You took it as if I was serious, thats what I'm referring to
0 -
LMAOO in what earth do you live??
1 -
Planet earth. Playing this game. You obviously live somewhere else. Talk in this discussion once you see dead by daylight
0 -
K survivor main
1 -
at least I play both sides. Not exclusive killer main like you with very skewed sense of which side is actually OP.
Or forget that. Let's have developers talk who is actually winning:
or if we want to include stats for everyone:
So "Ok killer main"
0 -
It seems very accurate indeed, nurse is the weakest and sadako strongest. Poor delusional guy, maybe your mmr is so low that you live in another reality, see some high level ytber and stop talking nonsense.
0 -
So you say devs are lying to us? 😁
0 -
Why does it matter what "skill" range one finds themselves
There are issues with it anyway
0
