How To Fix 'Hook Ragequitting'
If ragequitting is against the rules, so should offing yourself on 1st hook. It literally a way around the DC punishment and it screws over the other players all the same.
How to fix 'Hook-Ragequitting':
- Change the punishment for attempting to get free:
Instead of losing meter, it makes it take longer to be unhooked each time you try.
Or maybe unhooking someone should have a Very Easy skillcheck. Missing it makes noise and stops the unhook attempt. Basically, you failed to unhook them properly. This skillcheck gets slightly harder for each attempt a player made to unhook themselves.
- When in Phase 2; there is no missing skillchecks:
This is a stupid punishment anyways. It does not punish bad play. It just gives Survivors a way to force themselves out of the game ASAP. Basically, it's a 'legal DC'. Remove it.
Boom; no more 'hook ragequits'. Players can either man up and play a match through to the end or get reported for unsportsmanlike conduct if they afk or run at the Killer.
Comments
-
You can't force people to stay in the game. Folks that give up on hook aren't suddenly going to not because their actions affect someone else.
0 -
People who want to leavea game will leave the game - one way or the other. There is no rule against failing a skillcheck or fast vaulting something and being just very bad at chase. Or insisting on healing right below hook. - The result is the exact same.
The one thing where the whole unsportsmanlike thing when it comes to throwing and removing oneself from the game is coming short is that in any sport you have the option to throw in the towel; to give up, say you lose and move on.
The way for a killer to do that is just go afk in front of a gate, wait until gens pop, open gate - or just go afk in a corner.
The way for survivors to do that is to try to unhook themselves and then fail the two skillchecks.
1 -
Yes you can.
Don't play a multiplayer game if you:
- Don't have the time to stay all match or
- Don't have the mental maturity to tough it out when you're losing.
But a punishment already exists. I'm just changing it so toddlers can't use the hook as a way to DC without the DC penalty.
4 -
None of the stuff you said is a refutation of my point that you can't force people to stay in the game. It's just bland attitude affirmation. Your idea doesn't do anything to the person actually on the hook being problematic. It just punishes unhookers. The person trying to leave doesn't care whether or not they're harder to unhook; They probably welcome it.
It's ok to have a bad idea and it's a brave thing to express yourself on a public forum. But a bad idea is still a bad idea
1 -
None of the stuff you said is a refutation of my point that you can't force people to stay in the game. It's just bland attitude affirmation.How come I don't hear this bunk in other PvP games? No one ragequits in Overwatch and then says 'Well! You can't FORCE people to play in a match they don't like!'
Imagine if that worked in the NFL: "Well, Bob, the Dolphins have decided to pack up and leave early, since they were down 15 points going into the second quarter! Guess everyone can go home! No one can FORCE them to play if they're not having fun!"
It's like the DBD community is uniquely entitled enough to think "I should be able to bail on any match I hate, and screw my teammates!"
My idea PREVENTS Hook-ragequits. Because they are a problem. Which, by the way, you have not refuted yourself. All you said is 'Well, you can't MAKE people stay in a match!'
Yes you can; Toughing out a match you 'don't like; called 'Being a good sport' and 'Thinking about your fellow players'. There, I refuted your non-argument.
2 -
I stated why I'm not a fan of removing skill checks for the second stage. Not a fan of your suggestion for first hook either. How does that "punish" the one on hook?Fine, remove it all together. But that would lead to every Survivor trying to escape 4 times no matter what.
The problem is that the current mechanic allows Survivors to DC without eating a DC penalty. It's literally abusing a mechanic to get the same, exact effect as DCing, but without the punishment for DCing.
So it needs to change. I'm SICK of watching the first Survivor I find hook-DC & ruining the match for me and the other 3 Survivors. it's stupid, outdated, useless mechanic.
1 -
... You do realise that this in no way addresses the underlying problem though, right? - It doesn't even change the match outcome in the slightest. - It just prolongs what's gonna happen anyway.
They're on hook, they get unhooked, they head straight to the closest gen/totem/chest/whatever or want to demonstrate their chasing skills, a few seconds later they get downed and get hooked again - repeat. Then they're dead. It just takes a minute longer. A minute during which everyone is aware this ain't gonna lead anywhere.
1 -
You can already report people for running AT the Killer in an attempt to be downed, or multi-vaulting windows or popping gens to draw the Killer's attention.
What my fix does is make it so those are their ONLY options to get out without DCing, leading to more poor sports being reported for poor sportsmanship and banned. Then they stop polluting the game for the real players.
1 -
Rage quitting isn't technically against the rules. It's disconnecting from the match that is against the rules. Letting yourself die on hook has always been allowed. And ultimately the devs can't really punish players who die on hook, because sometimes your teammates just don't save you.
0 -
In Overwatch people simply jump off the map or run into the enemy team when they don't want to play a match for whatever reason. It they really want to avoid a report they go Lucio or whatever and just go for boops. The Dota equivalent is just running down mid. I'm not sure whether you're trying to gaslight me or yourself by pretending equivalent behaviors don't happen in other games but the assertion is laughable.
I'll say it simply, one last time. Listen. You cannot force people to stay in a game they do not want to be in. They will just sabotage gameplay by other means. Better to get it over with than stretch out an unwinnable scenario.
2 -
I think you might have some misconceptions about reporting bad sportsmanship. - Maybe they're just bad at skillchecks, maybe they didn't see the killer - maybe they needed chase. Who knows. - These things are in effect pretty much unreportable simply because you can't tell from the outside if the player is playing normally and just really bad at it - or wants to get downed. The vault spamming aside, maybe.
And no, it will not change anything about the matchoutcome - or the match quality, for that matter. While there are petty people who DC for literally no reason, the vast majority of people does have a reason and will continue to take the fastest route out of the match because that reason is still there - just the fastest route has become one minute longer.
I mean, what is your actual goal? I assume it's to have more successful matches ....?
1 -
And ultimately the devs can't really punish players who die on hook, because sometimes your teammates just don't save you.I'm not asking for dying on hook to be punished. I'm creating a way to remove using first-hook to ragequit while dodging a DC penalty.
Sure. I'll try to remember that when I get another 5 matches where I find someone, and they hook-DC as quick as possible because they hated the map. Or my Killer. Or my perks. Or they were found first. Or they hated my keychain-things.
Well just let them continue to ruin matches instead of fixing the exploits they use to get around DC penalties.
1 -
Someone can die on their first hook, because their teammates never rescued them.
1 -
Maybe they're just bad at skillchecksNO ONE is so bad that they pop gens repeatedly. It's evident they are trying to draw the killer.
the vast majority of people does have a reason and will continue to take the fastest route out of the matchAnd what reason is there to ragequit at first hook? I mean, VALID reason.
I mean, what is your actual goal? I assume it's to have more successful matches ....?My goal is to remove ragequitting on first hook, since it ruins matches. People should just not play if they're going to flip the table like a toddler for petty reasons.
1 -
And that has literally nothing to do with my idea or hook-DCing.
Because I'm talking about people deliberately killing themselves on hook as fast as possible by trying to get off, then purposefully failing every stage 2 skillcheck to die ASAP.
And my idea removes those attempts.
So...what does your comment have to do with that?
2 -
There are people. - Quite a few people who really want to hit those greats end up missing multiple times ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ There's nothing evident about it.
For me, personally, I opt out of a match if I have Kindred and watch my team do zero useful things. Me staying won't stop them from crouching edgemap or running in circles and won't improve the match quality in any way. --- Especially from a killers perspective these things are things you're not able to identify, I give you that.
But what good does removing ragequitting for the sake of removing ragequitting even do if it doesn't actually translate in a better match quality?
0 -
Missing several skillchecks is not at all unusual if you're trying to go for those greats.
And I keep wondering what your goal is: removing ragequitting for the sake of removing ragequitting doesn't actually change anything/leads to nothing constructive.
Post edited by EQWashu on1 -
My goal is to remove 'legal ragequitting' so the only alternatives are methods that can be reported.
Ragequitting is against the rules, so a method by which people can get the same result without the punishment should be fixed.
Post edited by EQWashu on1 -
. . . that won't lead to any game health or match quality improvements though.
1 -
Except it will, because people who can now only ragequit though reportable means will eventually stop playing, and matches will only have people who know good sportsmanship.
2 -
The simple answer is to make a hook suicide count as a dc , with the following conditions not counting as hook suicides.
If you have been hooked twice. Lets you still leave if being tunneled or hook farmed.
Hooked once with 60 seconds of time on hook, add an individual timer for each survivor so they can moniter and make the descision based on why they havent been unhooked in that time and makes sure your not punishing players who just get left on hook to die.
If there are 2 or less active survivors (not downed, dead, or on hook), to make for still being able to give hatch to teammate.
This would still let people do it but apply the dc penalty to them.
It can still be worked around so players arent "forced to play" but I dont think requiring 2 hook states or at least 60 sec of total hook time when there are 3 players still standing is too much to ask.
A big part of the tunnelling problem as well is having to rush the hook immediately and unhook before the killer leaves, just so they dont kill themselves on hook.
I have also had mnay times where someone hook suicides on first hook and 5 seconds after they do we pop 2 or 3 gens, having the 60 second requirment might make some people change their mind.
0 -
No. People who want to "ragequit" will opt for the method that takes one minute longer - e.g. going to the closest gen holding M1 until the killers grabs them off of it. Which means a miserable match will be miserable for one more minute for everyone involved while the overall outcome or quality has not changed whatsoever.
1 -
Those who don't want to play the game will just go AFK, still wont play with the killer and will ruin their teammates.
1 -
And that is reportable.
Ok. And that's somehow worse than letting them DC on hook at will?
It's like this community wants to ruin matches for everyone else. Y'all fight back against suggestions to make DCing harder.
2 -
Do ppl report AFK players? Do those reports do anything? Legit question.
0 -
I'm simply questioning if energy should be put into a change that has no tangible impact on how matches play out. i say no.
Making DCing harder will also not solve anything in a constructive manner, imo.
Personally, I hold the opinion that the root cause of a majority of DCs/suicides on hook are due to mechanic and/or balance issue in the game and the frustration about this just adds up until people snap. And while killers can turn to tunneling and camping as a response in that very match survivors don't have that option so they tend to just go next asap - one way or the other.
0 -
Personally, I hold the opinion that the root cause of a majority of DCs/suicides on hook are due to mechanic and/or balance issue in the gameI wish they were, but people will DC for any reason they can justify. Hence the list above. I've SEEN people admit they DC 'If I go against Nurse/Clown/Freedy. Because why should I be in a match I don't enjoy?'
Or 'I DC if it's [insert map they don't like]'
Or 'I DC if the Killer is using NoED, or [insert any perk they can call 'tryhard' here]'
Or the people who DC when they are first downed because 'Why should I wait in a match I'm not enjoying?'
Those aren't mechanic or balance issues; They are attitude issues. They are Survivors (Though it happens with Killers, too) who think 'Muh fun is more important' and 'Why should I care about my teammates? They aren't me.'
You can't FIX those. You can only make it as hard as possible for them to ruin the match for others.
2 -
Hard disagree on that one. All of the things you mention boil down to a mix of balance/game design and matchmaking issues.
But. I think we've reached a point where we either go in circles or off topic. - Maybe agree to disagree is the best option here.
1 -
I'm glad DC enthusiasts are happy to out themselves.
1 -
It is standard for multiplayer games to have a penalty for quitting or giving up before the match is over. It is also standard to not have a loophole to bypass said penalty. DBD should not be an exception.
AFKing is reportable and the game can be made so it automatically kicks AFK players and give them the DC penalty anyways. Sandbagging is also reportable, and it boils down to one of two potential results.
- The person is too obvious about throwing, and they get banned.
- They play enough to be a bad player (on purpose) but still play. Which still achieves the intended result of forcing them to play out the game they queued for, which is perfect. And to be frank, it’ll probably be average DBD player level anyways.
Want to DC? Then accept your penalty for ruining a match with your selfishness.
0 -
The game isn't balanced, I will never stop hook suiciding while in a bad game until that changes.
It doesn't even appear that the developers care to try, many people have made good suggestions, they implement or even test NONE OF THEM, so I won't care to try either.
0 -
I don't want self unhook gone I want suicide gone
0
